Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

http://informitv.com/2015/11/05/virg...n-subscribers/

Why do people think this is?

Missing channels? Cut price Sky offers? More competition from new operators in the Pay TV market?

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

Virgins TV subscriber base hasn't really grew in nearly 7 years. Every other TV provider seems to be adding more and more TV customers each quarter. I think Virgins real problem is that they're limited by their cable network. All other TV providers services are available pretty much anywhere in the UK whilst many people who would take TV from Virgin don't live in a cabled area.

As a former Virgin TV customer I left because of too many regular price increases, they take too long to add new channels, their 18 month contracts are too long and their retention team made no real effort to keep me

There's just so much choice available now for all budget levels. The competition offer incredible sign up and retention deals. Virgin need to come up with new TV packages at lower prices imo

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

After years of having TV BB and PHONE from VM i got rid of the TV and Phone a mnth or so ago. Tbh i don't miss it in the slightest . the TV or the Tivo ...

Using a Chromecast and a Nexus 7 to stream/cast to the main tv if required ...

The Tv Channels and Tivo had gone stale in my opinion ..

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

They lost me as a TV & phone customer a few years ago. I'm thinking of dropping the BB to the lowest tier too.

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

100% Happy here with the BB though :D Onwards and upwards ;);)

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

One suspects if you take Now TV out of Sky's figures and look closely at other companies figures they have not exactly gained a lot of customers either one suspects as the market is extremely saturated.

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

Why take those figures out they are still paying customers , BT and VM both have lower entry level tv packages. I'm sure at one of Sky's recent financials Darroch announced that 1 in 4 now took multiple passes and that was before the monthly Sports pass launched.

Movies and Entertainment costs £16.98 more than BT's dearest package.

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

Possibly the rise of netlix etc and freeview is pretty good too

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

Oh no! If things continue at that rate, in 250 years time they'll have none left ;)

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

l wonder how customers Sky would lose if it did not subsidise its free broadband?.

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

Because VM don't offer half price and £100 rewards do they ;)

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

A nice range of streaming channels would do the trick, IMHO.

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

I left earlier this year for similar reasons to Chad.

VM kept upping their prices (up to 3 times per year) and it got to the stage where I'd had enough and Sky were offering some great deals to join them. Thought I'd miss the TiVo but to be honest, I haven't looked back as I'm really happy with Sky's TV service.

I kept the broadband and phone with VM as they offered me a good deal and my only alternative is currently ADSL (although BT fibre should be here within the next 12 months).

So got the best of both worlds and paying less than I was by having everything with VM.

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

To me that business model is unsustainable in the long run.

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

Because in my view, they are different.

Sky Satellite and VM Pay TV are 12 month contract commitments, whereas Now TV does not tie you to a long contract, being as it's pay as you go monthly.

Now TV was a smart move by Sky IMHO. It really would be nice to know how Sky's satellite subscriptions, on their own, have been performing over the last few years, as a true comparison.

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

All Sky's key figures were good the exception being ARPU which was flat which as you correctly say will be in part due to cheaper Now TV contracts and discounting. Sky already have product launches lined up such as a mobile service and the announcement on the 18th of this month which should in part help to improve ARPU.

Now TV now offers more passes Entertainment , Movie , Monthly Sports , day sports and week sports it also offers Sky Store rentals and purchases via the Now TV box.

They were also selling telephone , broadband and fibre broadband with Now TV on the Sky site not sure if that's still the case , basically the key for all these providers is getting people to spend more.

Don't forget Now TV whilst generating less in subscription revenue has relatively no setup costs and lower support costs (online only) , new Sky Satellite customers get free install and free equipment which is subsidised by Sky.

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

Very true. SKY offering 50% off to new customers can't be cost effective. Guy at my work joined SKY recently and only took the Original bundle for £10 per month for 12 months. In total he's paying SKY £120 and in return they've gave him a free satellite dish, a 2TB SKY +HD box and free installation. If he was buying a satellite dish, a 2TB SKY +HD box and paying for someone to install them it would cost him around £400! SKY would've been better off if he'd just taken NOW TV :D

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

I think a major problem with VM, they are NOT competing against Sky. They should be. In the challenging world of broadcasters. Sky is still number one in my view.
I would go back to Sky tonight, if l had my way. We have freesat, so its just a question of adding the channels.

VM are adding channels, but these are mostly X1. Or channels that the directors of VM want to shove down out throats.

They will never be big and will continue to lose customers. There must be loads of channels out there, that VM can have. But they wont put them on.

My wife is a great fan of the True channels, and would love to watch them all - but VM don't have them all

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

You think that isn't how Sky work?

VM do add channels yes and can be slow to get them but its because they do their best to get a great deal for customers, rather than rushing in and paying silly money like Sky do. Look at BT sport for example.

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

Yes £24 extra a month on Sky for BT Sport ain't a good deal for the customer that's for sure....

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

No one is disputing the above. The point that Den was making was that Now TV figures bump up the Sky's TV figures and I was pointing out that Now TV is different to both VM TV and satellite TV from Sky.

In the time we're in, where OTT online streaming is becoming more popular, the only real Sky/VM comparison between Sky and VM's yearly contract TV service offerings, is for Sky to publish the Satellite TV figures separately.

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

On that point, to be fair to Sky, BT won't wholesale them the channels.

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

Things are certainly slowing down at the moment. The thing is Virgins TV numbers have stayed relatively the same since around 2007. During the same period BT bucked up their ideas and have added 1.3 million new TV customers. TalkTalk have come along and added 1.3 new TV customers as well. Even before the launch of NOW TV SKY had added about 2 million customers during the same period.

As mentioned previously I think Virgins growth is limited by their network. The other TV providers have a massive advantage in that you don't need a cable running to your house to take their services. As services like Netflix and Amazon Instant Video grow in popularity I'm sure all TV providers will continue to suffer slow uptake of their services.

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

I recently enquired about a connection for Buckingham Palace, the answer was no, but to watch out as "we are expanding our network".

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

Kodi (XMBC) could be another reason for the fall in subscriptions. It comes fully loaded on Android TV boxes like this one on Amazon...

http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B...r_1_11&sr=8-11

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

It's crazy. Amazon refuse to have the official Kodi app for FTV in their store, because of potential piracy concerns, and then stock boxes such as these.

Kodi, for many people, myself included, is just used as a front end for accessing personally owned ripped DVDs.

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

if vm losing thousands of tv customers then obvious then having bt sport is not working and all that money that they spent what waste, better spent on missing channels ! maybe ?
stop listening to directors and start listening to customers who pay directors wages ! Alarm bells should be ringing now with vm loosing tv customers !

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

In all the years that they have been going, I have never come across as many dissatisfied VM TV customers as I have recently.

They need to do something instead of just watching their TV customer base haemorrhage.

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

That's a bit of a exaggeration in saying their TV customer base is haemorrhaging....

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

http://www.seenit.co.uk/why-are-virg...-reverse-this/

---------- Post added at 09:37 ---------- Previous post was at 09:25 ----------

To be fair it seems it's only a matter of time before Sky's prices increase again.

http://www.express.co.uk/life-style/...Jeremy-Darroch

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

I get the impression LG's senior management have been so caught up in mergers and acquisitions that they've taken their eye off the UK television business. They probably thought with having the TiVo that everything was fine - especially compared to the state of the technology of some of the other cable networks they own elsewhere - and anyway it doesn't make as big a profit as broadband.

However, the British TV sector has changed really fast and probably reached the tipping point in the move to Internet services before they anticipated it would. We're also still seeing the effects of the recession and people don't have the money in their pockets they might previously have had so are less willing to spend a large wedge on entertainment. Sky anticipated the Internet shift with Now TV and that also hits a sweeter price point but Virgin have no comparable offer. It hasn't helped with the TiVo performance and user interface issues - especially as people have increasingly seen how they compare against smart TV apps or Internet TV boxes / sticks - and the poor on-demand offering. Quality US comedy and drama are also increasingly found on Netflix, Sky Atlantic and even Amazon rather than channels Virgin carries, so if you're not a sports fan there's not much except the low-budget reality TV and lifestyle shows you can find anywhere.

In this forum you're more likely to find the early adopters so of course there will be more whingeing than among ordinary users, but those I know outside here are starting to question keeping cable TV too. After twenty years as a customer I'm probably going to ditch it myself after the Christmas holiday.

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

The only reason i still have TV from them is for BT Sport, if they didn't have that i'd have chucked that part of the package a long time ago.

If my FTTC cabinet ever eventually gets sorted out then i'll probably be looking at moving everything away from Virgin if it works out cheaper. All i care about nowadays is getting 30mbps+ and champions league football, for everything else i have freeview and kodi.

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

[QUOTE=muppetman11;35807657]http://www.seenit.co.uk/why-are-virg...-reverse-this/[COLOR="Silver"]

What a great article, pretty much sums it up, especially the Tivo grumbles.

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

Does Sports Devil added to Kodi not give you that?

http://www.iwillfolo.com/install-sportsdevil-xbmc/

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

You guys had best get used to figures like this.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cord-cutting

Our market is way closer to the USA's and Canada's than it is most of the rest of Europe, so we're simply following their trend.

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

Great article, with the next round of price increases I will have to drop services to keep the price affordable, TV most likely be the first service to be downgraded,with Netflix and Amazon I won't miss a reduction in channels - don't watch sport

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

It's not just the prices that i've heard customers complain about, although it is "the last straw that broke the camels back" in some cases.

I suspect that you may well be right.

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

One gained TV customer here!

80p extra a month on top of the BB price to get the Big Kahuna TV package added. Will have all the same channels as I was getting on Sky (Entertainment - no sport or movies), plus additional channels (baby/kids ones for impending child to be born and BT Sport for me) that we weren't getting before. It will be a saving of £45 a month if we were to keep them separate.

So Mrs Sugnid is happy with the savings, she keeps her channels while I gain some Sport.

Back on a 12 month contract as well so can survey the situation this time next year.

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

And that is the key to it shop around , many show to much loyalty and pay through the nose.

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

When our contract ended 6 months ago we phoned them up to get a better deal and thus we will be doing the same when this contract is up to get a better deal and one suspects we will get another decent deal as l am sure they won't want to lose loyal customers like us and others willy nilly.

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

To be honest, it was only because of our child arriving soon that we decided to take a look at the finances - we've been pretty happy with using both providers.

But when you look at the bottom line of it all - just made financial sense to switch over for the time being. Will give me a chance to see how SkyQ fares over the next 12 months as well.

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

Same with cutting the cord in a way using a vpn you can get Netflix for much cheaper than uk prices for example i pay £3.99p/m for hd + 2 screens as i used a Brazilian vpn, i believe the uk equivelent is £6.99p/m.

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

From the linked article in your OP. OED - You may have been a little over-dramatic in your choice of phrasing... ;)

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

Its called hyperbole and one or two have been doing that lately on this forum.:)

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

Sky are giving away there TV service at the moment, At the beginning of the year i was offered The Family pack for Free,(as i had left end of last year) for 6months then it would be half price for six months. By August i disconnected from Sky TV even though the package would have been half price. Then a month ago they kept phoning and initially offered the Family pack for 5yrs at a third of the price. I had only just sold the Sky STB so i was offered free installation, new box and the Family pack at half price for a year!!

Yes they maybe taking on new customers but the money isn't coming in it will come out in the wash in a couple of years time.

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

I think a problem is that Sky are producing channels for the customers, therefore can justify the price.

Where VM are increasing prices - last year, didn't they put prices up THREE times. Where Sky is once a year.

I called VM the other day to complain about engineers who had been at my mother in law - very poor work.
The assistant said that VM give the best BB/ phone / TV. When l mentioned that they don't control the BB, so they can slow the usage down. what a load of crap.

The work the engineers done was that bad, they were ordered to come back the following day and put it right. And told my mother in law, the fault was with the internal wiring, That they had put in. And that because the cable was getting hot (yes hot) it was interfering with the phone /picture/BB.

They came back and fixed the fault - and the engineer said the fault was caused by the rain.

That's why VM are losing customers.

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

VM loosing customers is down to your mother-in-law having a fault caused by the weather??

You will find that when one provider ups their line rental then the others usually follow shortly after.

Sky's phone prices are going up ion Dec 1

http://www.express.co.uk/finance/per...ions-customers
Plus there was a price rise earlier in the year on Sky

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...ude-sport.html

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

You just beat me to it Hugh.....:D

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

Hugh??:angel:

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

In real terms this is a reduction in the number of customers. If I had a Pay TV company that had remained flat over five years, I would be worried.

Maybe that's why VM sold the company to LG?- not that LG have fared any better thus far.

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

Sorry mate, ......:blush:

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

The UK population has increased by 2.6% in the last five years, so in real terms VM's share has dropped by around that figure.

Please explain to me how a 2.6% decrease in real terms is 'haemmorhaging'?

btw, they're not a Pay TV company, they are a media and telecoms company, so to focus in on only one area would be sub-optimal, as investment in multi-branch organisations tends to be cyclic, as I am sure you know.

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

If you say so, if you say so

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

But Richard you stated that Virgins TV base was 'haemorrhaging' and quite clearly looking at the figures that is not the case.

http://www.cableforum.co.uk/board/35807617-post28.html

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

I do say so, I do say so... :)

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

Feel free to go into the post and change the wording to say stagnating if you like.

The stagnation of VM TV may be about to get worse; Sky have just unveiled a 12 tuner box:

http://www.techradar.com/news/televi...-sky-q-1309224

I wonder when (or if) VM/LG will introduce a 4K box?

I am currently undecided in whether to get a TiVo, but I will require 4k for the UHD TV that I intend buying imminently.

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

Clever Idea with sky, self install multiroom. If virgin catches on then they wont need technicians!

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

Where exactly do you plan on getting 4k? 4k blu rays aren't out till next year and by are the only folk offering a 4k channel right now. Some Netflix stuff and YouTube videos are about the only 4k you could watch.

There is not enough sources of 4k right now to make a tv purchase worth while.

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

tbf, most of the 4K TVs can upscale - not quite true 4K, but better than standard HD.

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

Most of the time though it doesn't look that great.

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

'haemorrhaging', 'stagnating' - you must be a bundle of fun at employee review time.

"Well, most people think you've done a good job, keeping the business steady in a time of recession, but personally, I think you've been stagnating and causing us to haemorrhage customers'... ;)

Some people see a glass half full, some see it half empty - you probably ask who ordered the wrong size of glass... :D

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

The UK hasn't been in recession since the first half of 2009.

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

Typical, still wittering on and trying to be clever by being rude...

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

The latest Virgin Media customer satisfaction survey seems more concerned with the issues people have been talking about here than they usually are. Includes a question on TiVo performance.

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

Don't you just love the profound influence of Cable Forum.;)

Re: Virgin losing thousands of TV customers.
 

I think that VM are getting concerned about this, especially as the migration of customers with older boxes is said to be starting any day now.

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