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Osem 17-06-2015 21:22
Balls free gratis
 
In stark contrast to his former boss...

Quote:
Ed Balls is to take up a new job in the US, as a Harvard University academic researching financial stability.

The former shadow chancellor, who was the highest profile Labour MP to lose their seat in the general election, has been made senior fellow at the university in Cambridge, Massachusetts.

Balls, who is the husband of Labour leadership candidate Yvette Cooper, will be expected to be on campus for at least three to four weeks each term over the course of his year-long unpaid appointment
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/...mic-researcher

Financial stability? :rofl:

Ignitionnet 17-06-2015 22:15
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Oh look it's another Osem post slagging off Labour. This is both new and exciting.

Did someone from Labour touch you inappropriately as a child or something? Talk about a vendetta.

TheDaddy 18-06-2015 04:23
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ignitionnet (Post 35783623)
Oh look it's another Osem post slagging off Labour. This is both new and exciting.

Did someone from Labour touch you inappropriately as a child or something? Talk about a vendetta.
Given the allegations about lord janner that's not implausible sadly.

ianch99 18-06-2015 08:00
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ignitionnet (Post 35783623)
Oh look it's another Osem post slagging off Labour. This is both new and exciting.

Did someone from Labour touch you inappropriately as a child or something? Talk about a vendetta.
plus a wierd new signature asking people to vote in the Labour leadership election

denphone 18-06-2015 08:09
Re: Balls free gratis
 
He has seen the light.;)

Osem 18-06-2015 08:38
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Hope he's all packed and ready to go.

:waving:

Stuart 18-06-2015 08:52
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Osem (Post 35783618)
In stark contrast to his former boss...



http://www.theguardian.com/politics/...mic-researcher

Financial stability? :rofl:
In fairness, while I agree that Labour was mostly responsible for the current financial problems, Ed Balls was not in power at the time. He was not even in the cabinet until 2007, when he joined as Secretary of State for Children, Schools and Families. He was a minister in the Treasury from 2006-2007, but I see no evidence he actually made policy decisions.

Gordon Brown was in power.

That's not to say the Tories are blameless. They aren't. During the GB years, they seemed to provide a very ineffective opposition, and during the coalition years, I think they took basically the right track to sort the problem (cutting back expenditure) but have stuck to it far to rigidly when they should have been using some of the money to stimulate the economy and thus pay back debt using increased income (through taxes).

Osem 18-06-2015 08:56
Re: Balls free gratis
 
http://www.newstatesman.com/politics...ing-politician

Quote:
During his decade as Gordon Brown’s closest economic adviser, he was regarded in Whitehall as among the most powerful éminences grises in British political history. It was Balls who first advocated Bank of England independence in a 1992 Fabian Society pamphlet, Balls who devised the fiscal rules that established New Labour’s reputation for “prudence” and Balls who drew up the five tests for euro membership in the back of a New York taxi with Brown in 1997.

“Deputy chancellor” was his unofficial title during this period. But in conversations I have had with colleagues past and present, Balls more often emerges as “the real chancellor” (a sobriquet also applied to George Osborne’s chief adviser, Rupert Harrison). Jonathan Powell, Tony Blair’s former chief of staff, has written of how Blair believed that it was Balls, “rather than Gordon”, who was “running” the Treasury. As a non-economist – Brown’s degree, like Osborne’s, was in history – the then chancellor is said by MPs to have been “dependent” on Balls’s expertise. The former Labour cabinet minister Peter Hain told me, “[Balls] is by miles the best economist in parliament: technically, theoretically and in policy terms. Nobody can touch him.”
I think he was far more closely involved in what was going on at no 11 but the irony remains and I wish him well in obtaining a permanent position as far away from here as possible... :D

MetaWraith 18-06-2015 10:50
Re: Balls free gratis
 
When was it we are due to establish a Mars colony? Surely they will need somebody among the colonists to make sure they stay on a firm and prudent financial footing.

Will that be far enough away?

Ignitionnet 18-06-2015 12:07
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Balls did a post-grad specialising in economics at Harvard. It's hardly surprising that he's going back there.

I look forward, in the name of balance, to seeing what the threads in this forum run like should the current Chancellor continue on his course to inflate a private credit bubble which pops with all policy tools to absorb the shock having been largely used up and most cash generating assets that could be sold having been sold.

To be honest, actually, there are a whole bunch of parallels between the course this government seems set on and the one the last one did, except we won't end up with the schools and hospitals to show for it, just the bubble, burst, and hideous deficits from the tax base being so brittle and shallow.

Osem 18-06-2015 12:28
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by MetaWraith (Post 35783698)
When was it we are due to establish a Mars colony? Surely they will need somebody among the colonists to make sure they stay on a firm and prudent financial footing.

Will that be far enough away?
No. I think there'd still be a severe risk of inter-planetary financial contagion if he had anything to do with the Martian economy. :D

Ramrod 18-06-2015 12:30
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ignitionnet (Post 35783623)
Oh look it's another Osem post slagging off Labour. This is both new and exciting.

Did someone from Labour touch you inappropriately as a child or something? Talk about a vendetta.
It's probably 'cos labour are deeply, deeply rubbish when it comes to financial stability and prudence and Osem wants everyone to know that. Seems fair enough to me :D

Osem 18-06-2015 12:36
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ramrod (Post 35783715)
It's probably 'cos labour are deeply, deeply rubbish when it comes to financial stability and prudence and Osem wants everyone to know that. Seems fair enough to me :D
:D

Yes it's really not that difficult to understand is it, well not for most normal people anyway... ;)

denphone 18-06-2015 12:49
Re: Balls free gratis
 
For those with a extreme short term memory the Conservatives had their problems in the past from what l rightly remember with the economy and are storing problems up in the future with the chancellors ongoing policies which appear based on winning the next election rather then delivering what is best for this country.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Wednesday

Osem 18-06-2015 12:56
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by denphone (Post 35783721)
For those with a extreme short term memory the Conservatives had their problems in the past from what l rightly remember with the economy and are storing problems up in the future with the chancellors ongoing policies which appear based on winning the next election rather then delivering what is best for this country.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Wednesday
Feel free to start a thread on it. I'm sure it'll be very popular. ;)

When people start voting en masse for more taxation, cuts etc., chancellors might stop lying about their future plans for such things.

heero_yuy 18-06-2015 12:57
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Black wednesday was an absurd attempt to stay in the ERM the prescursor to the Euro when our seconomy was not geared up for it. I also remember that it was Labour who were all for staying in the ERM at any cost.

Osem 18-06-2015 13:01
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by heero_yuy (Post 35783724)
Black wednesday was an absurd attempt to stay in the ERM the prescursor to the Euro when our seconomy was not geared up for it. I also remember that it was Labour who were all for staying in the ERM at any cost.
As such, it could be argued that it was very good value for money... :erm:

;)

denphone 18-06-2015 13:07
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Osem (Post 35783723)
Feel free to start a thread on it. I'm sure it'll be very popular. ;)

When people start voting en masse for more taxation, cuts etc., chancellors might stop lying about their future plans for such things.
Just trying to add a bit of balance to some of these threads as l think you will agree they are quite one sided.;)

Osem 18-06-2015 13:11
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by denphone (Post 35783728)
Just trying to add a bit of balance to some of these threads as l think you will agree they are quite one sided.;)
A thread dedicated to rubbishing one Tory policy or another would be far better at doing that surely. There's plenty of scope so I'm surprised nobody's started one lately. There's still time before the next election though eh? ;)

heero_yuy 18-06-2015 14:00
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by denphone (Post 35783728)
Just trying to add a bit of balance to some of these threads as l think you will agree they are quite one sided.;)
This isn't the BBC old chap. :D

Ignitionnet 18-06-2015 14:29
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ramrod (Post 35783715)
It's probably 'cos labour are deeply, deeply rubbish when it comes to financial stability and prudence and Osem wants everyone to know that. Seems fair enough to me :D
I must've been hallucinating when, under a Conservative government, the UK was forced to drop out of the ERM. :)

Sorry for going off-message with facts and all that.

---------- Post added at 15:28 ---------- Previous post was at 15:27 ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Osem (Post 35783729)
A thread dedicated to rubbishing one Tory policy or another would be far better at doing that surely. There's plenty of scope so I'm surprised nobody's started one lately. There's still time before the next election though eh? ;)
Few people have quite the twisted, bitter hate of the Tories you do of Labour I'm afraid. People aren't that sad and live in bigger worlds :)

---------- Post added at 15:29 ---------- Previous post was at 15:28 ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by denphone (Post 35783721)
For those with a extreme short term memory the Conservatives had their problems in the past from what l rightly remember with the economy and are storing problems up in the future with the chancellors ongoing policies which appear based on winning the next election rather then delivering what is best for this country.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Wednesday
Haha awesome. I hadn't read this when I made my reply.

Of course the Chancellor is more worried about winning the election than running the economy properly. Sadly this is what politicians do now.

As per the previous government it'll be austerity for 3 years, bribes for 2, with some bribery thrown in before where it can be done off balance sheet so as not to affect the deficit figures.

Hugh 18-06-2015 14:32
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ignitionnet (Post 35783744)
I must've been hallucinating when, under a Conservative government, the UK was forced to drop out of the ERM. :)

Sorry for going off-message with facts and all that.

---------- Post added at 15:28 ---------- Previous post was at 15:27 ----------



Few people have quite the twisted, bitter hate of the Tories you do of Labour I'm afraid. People aren't that sad and live in bigger worlds :)

---------- Post added at 15:29 ---------- Previous post was at 15:28 ----------



Haha awesome. I hadn't read this when I made my reply.

Of course the Chancellor is more worried about winning the election than running the economy properly. Sadly this is what politicians do now.

As per the previous government it'll be austerity for 3 years, bribes for 2, with some bribery thrown in before where it can be done off balance sheet so as not to affect the deficit figures.
<cough> Gary L <cough> ;)

Ignitionnet 18-06-2015 15:17
Re: Balls free gratis
 
I did say 'few' not 'none' :p:

Osem 18-06-2015 16:20
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by heero_yuy (Post 35783736)
This isn't the BBC old chap. :D
:D

ianch99 18-06-2015 16:32
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by heero_yuy (Post 35783736)
This isn't the BBC old chap. :D
Glad you admit the BBC adds balance :)

---------- Post added at 17:32 ---------- Previous post was at 17:22 ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ignitionnet (Post 35783710)
Balls did a post-grad specialising in economics at Harvard. It's hardly surprising that he's going back there.

I look forward, in the name of balance, to seeing what the threads in this forum run like should the current Chancellor continue on his course to inflate a private credit bubble which pops with all policy tools to absorb the shock having been largely used up and most cash generating assets that could be sold having been sold.

To be honest, actually, there are a whole bunch of parallels between the course this government seems set on and the one the last one did, except we won't end up with the schools and hospitals to show for it, just the bubble, burst, and hideous deficits from the tax base being so brittle and shallow.
At least Ed Balls has a qualification in Economics. Does Osbourne have one? and if not, are we worried he has control over our economy and is taking the country to a controversial place economically speaking? I am ..

Came across this, made me laugh:
https://www.cableforum.co.uk/images/local/2015/06/5.jpg
It's like going on a road trip with someone who has not passed their driving test :D

Ramrod 18-06-2015 16:33
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ignitionnet (Post 35783744)
I must've been hallucinating when, under a Conservative government, the UK was forced to drop out of the ERM. :)

Sorry for going off-message with facts and all that.
No government will get it right all the time but left wing ones seem to get budgeting and spending wrong most of the time
:D

Osem 18-06-2015 16:40
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ramrod (Post 35783770)
No government will get it right all the time but left wing ones seem to get budgeting and spending wrong most of the time
:D
Yes I noticed that too. :D

Anyway, getting back to the original topic, maybe when Balls has finished all that research into financial stability, he'll return to UK politics armed with the skills to actually deliver it and prove us wrong...

Hugh 18-06-2015 17:02
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ianch99 (Post 35783768)
Glad you admit the BBC adds balance :)

---------- Post added at 17:32 ---------- Previous post was at 17:22 ----------



At least Ed Balls has a qualification in Economics. Does Osbourne have one? and if not, are we worried he has control over our economy and is taking the country to a controversial place economically speaking? I am ..

Came across this, made me laugh:
https://www.cableforum.co.uk/images/local/2015/06/5.jpg
It's like going on a road trip with someone who has not passed their driving test :D
He's as qualified as Gordon Brown and Alastair Darling were..... ;)

Osem 18-06-2015 17:05
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Balls being qualified in Economics and apparently:

Quote:
by miles the best economist in parliament: technically, theoretically and in policy terms. Nobody can touch him.
Didn't do him or our economy much good did it. :D

denphone 18-06-2015 17:13
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hugh (Post 35783779)
He's as qualified as Gordon Brown and Alastair Darling were..... ;)
Which ain't saying much.;)

ianch99 18-06-2015 17:20
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hugh (Post 35783779)
He's as qualified as Gordon Brown and Alastair Darling were..... ;)
Glad you are happy with his economic qualifications :D

Hugh 18-06-2015 17:34
Re: Balls free gratis
 
1 Attachment(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by ianch99 (Post 35783784)
Glad you are happy with his economic qualifications :D
I hold his economic qualifications with the same level of regard as those of Brown and Darling, knowing that the post of Chancellor is a political appointment, which is why they have advisors who are Subject Matter Experts (such as Ed Balls).

I am equally pleased that you think that George Osborne is as qualified as the two previous Labour Chancellors.... ;)

btw, your screenshot is made up (just like most of Labour's economic policies... :D)

This is what you actually get if you google "is George Osborne"...

ianch99 18-06-2015 17:39
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hugh (Post 35783786)
I hold his economic qualifications with the same level of regard as those of Brown and Darling, knowing that the post of Chancellor is a political appointment, which is why they have advisors who are Subject Matter Experts (such as Ed Balls).

I am equally pleased that you think that George Osborne is as qualified as the two previous Labour Chancellors.... ;)
I don't. I am just saying Osbourne is not qualified. So who are these mysterious Subject Matter Experts that are pulling George's strings and giving him the words to say?

Hugh 18-06-2015 17:41
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ianch99 (Post 35783787)
I don't. I am just saying Osbourne is not qualified. So who are these mysterious Subject Matter Experts that are pulling George's strings and giving him the words to say?
So does that mean you were unhappy with Alastair Darling and Gordon Brown as Chancellors, or doesn't their lack of economic qualifications count?

heero_yuy 18-06-2015 17:54
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ianch99 (Post 35783768)
Glad you admit the BBC adds balance :)
Claiming balanced output and ACTUALLY doing it are two completely different things. Whilst the news is not overtly biased the current affairs output is anything but.:(

Ignitionnet 18-06-2015 18:46
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ramrod (Post 35783770)
No government will get it right all the time but left wing ones seem to get budgeting and spending wrong most of the time
:D
Back to https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bR_hfQU-4r0 and this wonderfully prudent Tory Chancellor saying he would not only match but exceed this apparently very excessive Labour spending.

Perhaps it would be more appropriate to call him a 'Tory Chancer'?

Isn't hindsight fantastic?

ianch99 18-06-2015 18:53
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hugh (Post 35783789)
So does that mean you were unhappy with Alastair Darling and Gordon Brown as Chancellors, or doesn't their lack of economic qualifications count?
You keep looking backward into the past. I am more worried about the future!

Chris 18-06-2015 18:56
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Osem (Post 35783618)
In stark contrast to his former boss...



http://www.theguardian.com/politics/...mic-researcher

Financial stability? :rofl:
https://www.cableforum.co.uk/images/local/2015/06/9.gif

Ignitionnet 18-06-2015 18:57
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Well perhaps after previous issues spotting instability some research into the matter would be beneficial to him - and indeed virtually everyone else given hardly anyone cared about the credit bubble popping.

Hugh 18-06-2015 20:13
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ianch99 (Post 35783816)
You keep looking backward into the past. I am more worried about the future!
Those who do not learn from the past, are bound to repeat it.....

Looking to the future, the Shadow Chancellor has a degree in Politics & Parliamentary Studies (With an MA in Industrial & Labour Studies) - are you worried?

Osem 18-06-2015 20:18
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hugh (Post 35783834)
Those who do not learn from the past, are bound to repeat it.....

Looking to the future, the Shadow Chancellor has a degree in Politics & Parliamentary Studies (With an MA in Industrial & Labour Studies) - are you worried?
Well he can't be any worse than his predecessor... or can he?... :erm:

Bring back Denis Healey anyone? :D

Hugh 18-06-2015 21:52
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Well, he read Greats (Classics - Ancient Rome, Ancient Greece, Latin, ancient Greek, and Philosophy) at Balliol, so obviously he wasn't qualified.....:D

Ramrod 19-06-2015 09:23
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ignitionnet (Post 35783815)
Back to https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bR_hfQU-4r0 and this wonderfully prudent Tory Chancellor saying he would not only match but exceed this apparently very excessive Labour spending.

Perhaps it would be more appropriate to call him a 'Tory Chancer'?

Isn't hindsight fantastic?
It's distressing what polititians will say to get votes :(

Ignitionnet 19-06-2015 09:46
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ramrod (Post 35783881)
It's distressing what polititians will say to get votes :(
But good to know that they won't let managing the economy get in the way of political expediency.

He had no more idea than Labour did that the economy was unsustainable at that time. Most people didn't; they ignored the signs and enjoyed the good times.

Osem 19-06-2015 09:49
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ramrod (Post 35783881)
It's distressing what polititians will say to get votes :(
Distressing but inevitable I reckon. We get what we deserve don't we? Many people tend to vote either on the basis of the short term, according to their own interests, or they choose the same party regardless of the situation they find themselves in. The system encourages politicians to make false, equivocal or misleading promises, especially when they're virtually guaranteed a 5 year term in office. The run up to the last election was, more than ever, reduced to politicians rubbishing their opponents and refusing to justify or explain their own policies. God only knows what can be done about it. :shrug:

heero_yuy 19-06-2015 10:04
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Perhaps more organisations like the OBR that can shine a light on what is really going on.

I did like that during the election the PM program referred politicians claims on expenditure, revenues etc to the "more or less" team from R4 for in-depth analysis - most revealing.

Osem 19-06-2015 10:08
Re: Balls free gratis
 
We need someone to tell us because I don't think the public's trust/confidence in our glorious leaders has ever been lower. Has anyone got any 'official' figures for that?

heero_yuy 19-06-2015 10:35
Re: Balls free gratis
 
1 Attachment(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Osem (Post 35783897)
We need someone to tell us because I don't think the public's trust/confidence in our glorious leaders has ever been lower. Has anyone got any 'official' figures for that?
http://www.cableforum.co.uk/board/at...9&d=1434709922

Quote:
These long term trends remind us that the crisis of trust in politicians is nothing new – we were measuring similarly low levels of trust over 30 years ago. But that doesn’t make it any less serious a challenge, particularly as we come up to an election that will be fiercely fought.

This long-running study also shows that trust levels are not fixed, and do shift as the context changes – which is seen particularly in the increasing trust in scientists and civil servants and decreasing trust in the clergy. ”
Ipsos source



Attachment 26169

ianch99 19-06-2015 11:48
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hugh (Post 35783789)
So does that mean you were unhappy with Alastair Darling and Gordon Brown as Chancellors, or doesn't their lack of economic qualifications count?
Why are you fixated with Labour Chancellors? It's the one we have had for the last 5 years that I am worried about

Hugh 19-06-2015 11:54
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ianch99 (Post 35783909)
Why are you fixated with Labour Chancellors? It's the one we have had for the last 5 years that I am worried about
Because you were fixated on the fact that the current Chancellor did not have any economic qualifications....

Quote:
Originally Posted by ianch99 (Post 35783768)
At least Ed Balls has a qualification in Economics. Does Osbourne have one? and if not, are we worried he has control over our economy and is taking the country to a controversial place economically speaking? I am ..

It's like going on a road trip with someone who has not passed their driving test :D
So I asked if you were equally worried about the fact that the last two Labour Chancellors and the current Labour Shadow Chancellor did not have any economic qualifications either, and weren't you worried they took*/were going to take the country to a controversial place economically speaking? ;)

But you appear to think there is one set of requirements for a Conservative Chancellor, and a different set of requirements for Labour Chancellors / Shadow Chancellors...... :dozey:

*(Well, we know the answer to that question, don't we...)

Osem 19-06-2015 12:11
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by heero_yuy (Post 35783900)
Thanks for that.

I'm sure mobile communications and the internet also have something to do with it. It's so much easier for any indiscretions, ill-judged comments, mistakes to be exposed and publicised nationally and internationally. These things always went on but weren't so widely known so reputations that would be destroyed now more often remained untarnished in the past.

ianch99 19-06-2015 12:45
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hugh (Post 35783910)
Because you were fixated on the fact that the current Chancellor did not have any economic qualifications....

So I asked if you were equally worried about the fact that the last two Labour Chancellors and the current Labour Shadow Chancellor did not have any economic qualifications either, and weren't you worried they took*/were going to take the country to a controversial place economically speaking? ;)

But you appear to think there is one set of requirements for a Conservative Chancellor, and a different set of requirements for Labour Chancellors / Shadow Chancellors...... :dozey:

*(Well, we know the answer to that question, don't we...)
Nice to see you ask a question and then answer it yourself. Saves me the trouble. Enjoy your Tory Chancer .. Chancellor ..

Hugh 19-06-2015 15:51
Re: Balls free gratis
 
I will, thanks.....

Ed Balls had all the qualifications for Chance(llo)r except the most important one - being an MP.... :D

Democracy in action...

Osem 19-06-2015 17:06
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Thank the Lord... :D

He could so easily have been Chancellor and now he's researching stability in the US. Phew!

ianch99 19-06-2015 23:15
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hugh (Post 35783929)
I will, thanks.....

Ed Balls had all the qualifications for Chance(llo)r except the most important one - being an MP.... :D

Democracy in action...
Come back in 5 years and then tell me your happy.

24% of the electorate .. Democracy in action!

Hugh 20-06-2015 07:53
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ianch99 (Post 35784012)
Come back in 5 years and then tell me your happy.

24% of the electorate .. Democracy in action!
2 million more votes than Labour, and more votes than Labour gathered when they won in 2001 and 2005 - so yes, democracy in action.

Nice to see sour grapes ares still in season.....:D

ianch99 20-06-2015 08:24
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hugh (Post 35784030)
2 million more votes than Labour, and more votes than Labour gathered when they won in 2001 and 2005 - so yes, democracy in action.

Nice to see sour grapes ares still in season.....:D
Nope the grapes are nice and sweet thanks :D

24% of the electorate gives Dave and George a mandate to take the country into the abyss ..

https://www.cableforum.co.uk/images/local/2015/06/7.png

Hugh 20-06-2015 11:11
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Yes, because there was no previous Labour/Abyss interface scenario.......

Under the election rules that you never complained about until Labour lost, the Conservatives won - you can either suck it up, or keep crying "wah, wah - it's not fair..".

Ramrod 20-06-2015 13:08
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Osem (Post 35783890)
God only knows what can be done about it. :shrug:
What you need is a benevolent dictatorship. Not sure if such a thing has ever existed.

Osem 20-06-2015 15:00
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ramrod (Post 35784093)
What you need is a benevolent dictatorship. Not sure if such a thing has ever existed.
Well I like to think I operate one at home... :erm:


:D

Ramrod 20-06-2015 15:34
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Osem (Post 35784115)
Well I like to think I operate one at home... :erm:
That's not what your wife said :D

Osem 20-06-2015 15:36
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Eh???!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :eeek:

(pm me what she told you matey... ;) )

Ramrod 20-06-2015 16:14
Re: Balls free gratis
 
:rofl:

ianch99 20-06-2015 22:29
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hugh (Post 35784067)
Yes, because there was no previous Labour/Abyss interface scenario.......

Under the election rules that you never complained about until Labour lost, the Conservatives won - you can either suck it up, or keep crying "wah, wah - it's not fair..".
Hugh, why are you fixated by the Labour past? I never voted Labour ..

The electoral result was not right then and it is not right now. You can try and deflect the argument with childish remarks or you can admit that a Government taking the country in a radical, untested economic direction based on 24% of the electorate is not appropriate.

But then you wouldn't because you are a Tory supporter and the current system benefits that party so why would you admit anything needs changing? I don't blame you. You have what you want so of course you would shout down anyone who objects.

Hugh 21-06-2015 09:00
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Actually, I think the voting system should be changed to an AV system.

btw, disagreeing with someone, and putting forward reasons for having a different view, is not, IMHO, "shouting down".

ianch99 21-06-2015 10:17
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hugh (Post 35784214)
Actually, I think the voting system should be changed to an AV system.

btw, disagreeing with someone, and putting forward reasons for having a different view, is not, IMHO, "shouting down".
I'm sorry but comments like "you can either suck it up, or keep crying "wah, wah - it's not fair.." just wind me up.

I am depressed why the majority are happy to put up with the status quo when it is so patently wrong for today's political landscape

Hugh 21-06-2015 11:26
Re: Balls free gratis
 
tbf, misuse of statistics and continuous evasion of questions asked winds me up , so I apologise for snapping at you.

It's just that no-one had huge rallies when Labour (not pointing this at you) won with a smaller percentage of the voting public, and nobody said they didn't have a mandate.

Caroline Lucas tweeted the same stat you used, and it was pointed out that, according to that logic, she had no mandate in her constituency, as less than 30% of eligible voters voted for her....

Osem 21-06-2015 11:36
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Quote:
Caroline Lucas tweeted the same stat you used, and it was pointed out that, according to that logic, she had no mandate in her constituency, as less than 30% of eligible voters voted for her....
Yeah but none of that matters unless it's the evil Tories or lunatic UKIP who are the beneficiaries...

ianch99 21-06-2015 20:16
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hugh (Post 35784228)
tbf, misuse of statistics and continuous evasion of questions asked winds me up , so I apologise for snapping at you.

It's just that no-one had huge rallies when Labour (not pointing this at you) won with a smaller percentage of the voting public, and nobody said they didn't have a mandate.

Caroline Lucas tweeted the same stat you used, and it was pointed out that, according to that logic, she had no mandate in her constituency, as less than 30% of eligible voters voted for her....
No offence taken. The whole concept of a mandate has lost meaning when you look this this election and the Labour wins you mention. You are right, the whole electoral system needs updating to match the changed landscape.

Stop It 22-06-2015 09:20
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Osem (Post 35784229)
Yeah but none of that matters unless it's the evil Tories or lunatic UKIP who are the beneficiaries...
Well, actually UKIP want PR because it would mean they would actually have a proper voice in the Commons, rather than the solo MP they have now.

I do not agree with the politics of UKIP but they are right when they argue for PR. First Past The Post worked when we were a 2 party democracy, that is no longer the case.

Edit: Proper Proportional Representation as used in the EU elections/most of Europe, rather than the shoddy AV rubbish we were asked to vote for a few years ago.

Osem 22-06-2015 11:02
Re: Balls free gratis
 
I was referring to 'people' who are happy to overlook the fact that their preferred party or representative was elected on a very small majority but immediately start protesting about how rotten the system is when, in this case, the Tories (or another detestable party) benefit from the very same rules.

Stop It 22-06-2015 11:54
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Osem (Post 35784400)
I was referring to 'people' who are happy to overlook the fact that their preferred party or representative was elected on a very small majority but immediately start protesting about how rotten the system is when, in this case, the Tories (or another detestable party) benefit from the very same rules.
I cannot stand hypocrites on this issue either, but our electoral system hasn't produced a "representative" government in decades!

The fact is, for too long we have had governments elected, Lab and Con, on election results that in most European countries would result in coalitions. It's not a dirty word after all.

Edit: For clarity, I supported the proposals of the Lib Dems to try to bring in PR for their 2010 campaign and was utterly bemused when that turned into a pitiful vote for AV instead. Still sore on that, really.

denphone 22-06-2015 13:09
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Osem (Post 35784400)
I was referring to 'people' who are happy to overlook the fact that their preferred party or representative was elected on a very small majority but immediately start protesting about how rotten the system is when, in this case, the Tories (or another detestable party) benefit from the very same rules.
l am not complaining about the General Election result as it is what it is but if the elected government think they are going to have a easy ride in this next 5 years then rest assured they ain't going to get that as many will be watching them carefully even those who put their tick by them as a awful lot can change in politics in a short time.

Hugh 22-06-2015 13:20
Re: Balls free gratis
 
With such a small majority, I don't believe they are taking anything for granted....

Osem 22-06-2015 16:59
Re: Balls free gratis
 
I often wonder what the picture would look like if everyone eligible bothered to vote. Maybe the voting system isn't really broken and what needs fixing is public apathy. :shrug:

denphone 22-06-2015 17:10
Re: Balls free gratis
 
The public apathy will be hard to crack given the publics extremely low opinion of politicians who generally talk with forked tongue when speaking to the public thus trust in them has now totally disappeared.

Osem 22-06-2015 17:22
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Whilst voting isn't guaranteed to change anything, not voting is guaranteed not to change anything.

denphone 22-06-2015 18:22
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Osem (Post 35784501)
Whilst voting isn't guaranteed to change anything, not voting is guaranteed not to change anything.
Indeed and that's why l will always vote.

Hugh 22-06-2015 18:51
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Quote:
“If you are part of a society that votes, then do so.

There may be no candidates and no measures you want to vote for…but there are certain to be ones you want to vote against.

In case of doubt, vote against. By this rule you will rarely go wrong.

If this is too blind for your taste, consult some well-meaning fool (there is always one around) and ask his advice.

Then vote the other way.”
-- Robert A. Heinlein

ianch99 23-06-2015 11:07
Re: Balls free gratis
 
Nice :) I like it ..

Interesting reading: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compulsory_voting

I like the North Korea model ;)

Quote:
North Korea - Everyone over age 17 is required to vote. However, only one candidate appears on the ballot. Voting is designed to track who is and isn't in the country. Dissenting votes are possible but lead to repercussions for voters.[25]


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