HMRC targets Etsy, eBay and Gumtree sellers
 

Re: HMRC targets Etsy, eBay and Gumtree sellers
 

Good ,Ebay,Gumtree etc where originally intended for people selling items they no longer needed, not for people to set up online companies making large tax free profits

Re: HMRC targets Etsy, eBay and Gumtree sellers
 

About time

Re: HMRC targets Etsy, eBay and Gumtree sellers
 

i think the government should have all our Ebay, Gumtree and Bargain Pages account details.
just incase we unknowingly have too much money. and it'll be handy for them to be monitoring us so we don't have to worry about anything.

we should also tax the air.

Re: HMRC targets Etsy, eBay and Gumtree sellers
 

They already do its called the TV tax :D

Re: HMRC targets Etsy, eBay and Gumtree sellers
 

Conservatism 2.0, picking on the little guy

We're still all in this together ? Right?

Re: HMRC targets Etsy, eBay and Gumtree sellers
 

You have no idea how 'little' these people are. Those who evade their tax certainly aren't in this together.

Re: HMRC targets Etsy, eBay and Gumtree sellers
 

Little guy?

Re: HMRC targets Etsy, eBay and Gumtree sellers
 

Also from the article Another article in the Telegraph with a more in-depth explanation (9 point test).

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/p...t-pay-tax.html

Re: HMRC targets Etsy, eBay and Gumtree sellers
 

I suppose this means everything will become more expensive on these sites..

Re: HMRC targets Etsy, eBay and Gumtree sellers
 

It means that there will be less people bothering. and Ebay will put the prices up to make up the profit losses.

---------- Post added at 23:06 ---------- Previous post was at 23:03 ----------

Eveyone's stopping paying that now :D

Now's a good time to bring out the pavement tax.

Re: HMRC targets Etsy, eBay and Gumtree sellers
 

look out for Jumble sale tax

scouts xmas post tax
and church roof fund tax

''''''''''''''''''''''''


The tax man's taken all my dough,
And left me in my stately home,
Lazing on a sunny afternoon.
And I can't sail my yacht,
He's taken everything I've got,
All I've got's this sunny afternoon.

Re: HMRC targets Etsy, eBay and Gumtree sellers
 

The real 'small' guys will have nothing to fear and little (if anything) to pay. Of course if there's a few 'faces' behind numerous small, accounts making lots of money they're not declaring then they might have something to worry about. That's as it should be I'd have thought.

Re: HMRC targets Etsy, eBay and Gumtree sellers
 

Well, considering some of the posts, HMRC could recoup a fortune with a "talking bolleaux" tax*.

HMRC are going after people who run businesses but don't declare this as income, not Joe Public with occasional sales....

(*I would probably be on the Higher Rate....:D)

Re: HMRC targets Etsy, eBay and Gumtree sellers
 

So if l decide to sell some of my prized DVD collection l am fine then Hugh?.

Re: HMRC targets Etsy, eBay and Gumtree sellers
 

Selling your personal goods isn't running a business. Trading buying/selling DVDs would be.

Re: HMRC targets Etsy, eBay and Gumtree sellers
 

From the link I posted earlier So yes, you should be OK.....

Re: HMRC targets Etsy, eBay and Gumtree sellers
 

Thanks for that lads as if he do decide to sell 30/40 of my DVD's at least there is nothing to worry about.

Re: HMRC targets Etsy, eBay and Gumtree sellers
 

The only thing you'll need to worry about is our 'commission'... :D

Re: HMRC targets Etsy, eBay and Gumtree sellers
 

Wondering how this will apply to all those businesses being run through Ebay out of China..:erm:

Re: HMRC targets Etsy, eBay and Gumtree sellers
 

That's going to depend where the business is operating from. China or the UK. If the UK HMRC will be interested. Although you will find that its a bit more complicated than that.:D

Re: HMRC targets Etsy, eBay and Gumtree sellers
 

How long before the DWP get in on it and class it as income/earnings.

they could deduct say 50p in the pound at the end of every financial year.
but as they'll have access to your accounts you don't need to do any adding up. they'll do it for you.

Re: HMRC targets Etsy, eBay and Gumtree sellers
 

I'm a damn site sure than they are not as large as the massive corporations who are avoiding paying their fair share as well as non doms etc.

Shame they don't make as much effort going after them, after all how many successful prosecutions were there in the last parliamentary term ?

The answer by the way, is 1

Re: HMRC targets Etsy, eBay and Gumtree sellers
 

You're not serious are you? I take it you also believe the police should leave muggers and burglars alone in order to concentrate all their efforts on bigger fish eh...

HMG, HMRC and rafts of lawyers have been working very hard to deal with evasion and aggressive avoidance. That's not to say that more can't/shouldn't/won't be done and indeed HMRC has only just announced they're effectively giving up on fines for late returns etc. to concentrate on more important matters. Odd that, when they're only interested in chasing the little guys according to you.

Many large and aggressive avoidance schemes have been closed down and £billions of tax reclaimed so to claim they're doing very little is nonsense. The truth is, however, that by the nature of these complex schemes and companies which base their affairs offshore, for example, is that the rules are incredibly complex and it's extremely difficult to do anything about them without international agreements.

The problem isn't the will to go after these people/schemes etc. it's the complexity of the rules (both UK and internationally) which allow all sorts of means by which to exploit them.

Only days ago this was announced:

http://www.professionaladviser.com/p...n-hmrcs-sights

and there have been numerous other examples of schemes used by the wealthy to unfairly avoid tax.

http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/hmrc-recove...odgers-1474061

Clearly those who've been on the receiving end don't think HMRC is doing nothing:


http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/80219afa-a...#ixzz3bo0sVi5s

http://www.accountancyage.com/aa/new...-gbp24bn-yield

Re: HMRC targets Etsy, eBay and Gumtree sellers
 

They made one successful prosecution in the last parliamentary term. If that's not a fairly nailed on description of the term 'very little' then I'm unsure what is.

So the rules are complex and difficult? Well, change them then? The ones that can be changed that is. (I think this is starting to be done now but it shouldn't have taken as long as it has)

So the late tax fines are scrapped, well whoop dee Mod Edit,please don't swear do Basil. I'm sure that will be of significant value to people as they find the wages aren't meeting their ever expanding costs.


And to be honest, if the police said I'm sorry sir we don't have the resources to investigate the fact you were burgled as we're concentrating on a major murder enquiry I'd be cross as hell but it's understandable.

The very simple fact of this whole entire argument is unfortunately that regardless of which bunch of misfits hold power, they will always serve the needs of big business first rather than the people who entrusted them into office.

Re: HMRC targets Etsy, eBay and Gumtree sellers
 

They have looked at taxing air by fitting us all with a gas mask type device that taxes the volume of this luxury:shocked: :shocked:

Re: HMRC targets Etsy, eBay and Gumtree sellers
 

Nobody's saying enough's been done or that still more couldn't be done. What I'm taking issue with is your original we're all in this together' assertion which was that they always go 'after' the little guys and if only they spent as much time going after big business etc. which doesn't hold water. I didn't claim abolishing the fines was a major thing or on the same scale - just pointed out that it contradicted your claim they always go for the small guys.

HMRC and the govt. don't determine prosecutions or interpret laws, courts do and often in ways which Govts. don't appreciate and cause them plenty of embarrassment. I dare say HMRC would welcome simpler national/international tax rules and stricter laws with harsher penalties but 'changing' them isn't as simple as you seem to think. The fact remains that they're expending a good deal of effort chasing the big fish and to claim otherwise is nonsense.

Re: HMRC targets Etsy, eBay and Gumtree sellers
 

I think you need to re check your facts

http://www.theguardian.com/business/...-increase-hmrc


In 1 year alone there where considerably more successful prosecutions than 1 :rolleyes:

Re: HMRC targets Etsy, eBay and Gumtree sellers
 

I was referring (obviously I thought but hey ho) to large corporate scale tax avoidance that article appears to imply it's targeted small scale / time avoiders I've only quickly scanned the article however so happy to be corrected

Re: HMRC targets Etsy, eBay and Gumtree sellers
 

So far as avoidance goes, I'd have thought prosecutions are always going to be more problematic than just securing the repayment of tax owed because the boundaries between what's acceptable avoidance and what isn't (i.e. what's legal and not) have to be tested before any scheme can be declared illegal. To be successfully prosecuted, I think there'd need to be proof that those involved in schemes which have been judged to be illegal after the event were fully aware of the illegality beforehand.

Re: HMRC targets Etsy, eBay and Gumtree sellers
 

It is impossible to prosecute anyone (including large corporations) for tax avoidance, large scale or otherwise.Once prosecutions become possible then we are talking about evasion and the figures I gave show that HMRC have prosecuted record numbers of people during the last parliament

Re: HMRC targets Etsy, eBay and Gumtree sellers
 

Probably :shocked: :D

---------- Post added at 06:34 ---------- Previous post was at 06:32 ----------

Not that prized then... :monkey:

---------- Post added at 06:36 ---------- Previous post was at 06:34 ----------

Why can't we go after both? Is targeting one group going to be at the expense of another.

---------- Post added at 06:39 ---------- Previous post was at 06:36 ----------

How about we stop giving corporations these cushy little deals that mean they actually pay less than they should've if they'd paid the taxes due, hit them hard imo if they're found to be trying it on aggressively

Re: HMRC targets Etsy, eBay and Gumtree sellers
 

If there are the resources to go after both sets then yes I agree completely but if there was a choice to be made I would rather see the large corporations chased first

Re: HMRC targets Etsy, eBay and Gumtree sellers
 

I guess you also need to take into the account of "prosecution" compared to the amount recovered.

But our laws, by the nature of our legal system, will always be complex. It would be nice to simply say you pay n% of earnings and that's it but there are exceptions with exceptions and folk will always try to pay less by using loop holes and exceptions so these have to be defined very precisely.

Re: HMRC targets Etsy, eBay and Gumtree sellers
 

Well, governments will insist on using tax as a means of incentivising or disincentivising certain behaviours. If they would simply collect a proportion of wealth generated in order to fund essential state services, life would be much easier. But they don't, and a lot of HMRC's time is spent deliberating whether someone is behaving as the system encourages them to, or if they are hiding their tax liability and should therefore be pursued.

As usual where the Internets are concerned, a lot of people seem to think they are entitled to something for nothing, whereas money earned by an online business is just as taxable as money earned by a high street shop.

Re: HMRC targets Etsy, eBay and Gumtree sellers
 

I am a big fan of a single rate of tax for everyone ,including corporations .It would be easier to manage and grey areas would be wiped out at a stroke ,but as Chris says below ,governments tend to use tax rates for a variety of reasons.

Re: HMRC targets Etsy, eBay and Gumtree sellers
 

There is no grey area, certainly not from where I was typing, from what little I've seen it seems to me that HMRC concludes a company is taking the mick, court cases drag on for years, normally being found in HMRC's favour only to then have the cushy little deals kick in, these companies run rings round us and end up paying less than they would've if they'd been paying what was due in the first place, the bare minimum we should expect is that they pay back everything they owe with interest.

---------- Post added at 20:11 ---------- Previous post was at 20:09 ----------

With considerably fewer overheads, they didn't know when they were well of, after decimating the high street they are getting far less than they deserve.

Re: HMRC targets Etsy, eBay and Gumtree sellers
 

Of course there is ,tax law is absolutely awash with grey areas, that's how these tax avoidance schemes come about in the first place,they utilise grey areas to avoid paying tax ,HMRC have to spend an awful lot of time and money trying to decide if a company is taking the mick or acting within the law .Companies have an obligation to minimise there tax liability as long as it's done within the law ,the problem is that sometimes the law is as clear as mud

Re: HMRC targets Etsy, eBay and Gumtree sellers
 

As stated that's not the issue, the issue is even in the most aggressive cases it's in their interest to try it on because the tax man is so wet he'll do a deal with them after court has found in our favour that equates to the company not even paying back the amount that should have been due in the first place. Let alone without interest being added for the years it dragged on.

Re: HMRC targets Etsy, eBay and Gumtree sellers
 

Very true Marty. Exploiting 'grey areas' is a large part of what being a lawyer or an accountant is all about. These rules are not simple or unequivocal so there's always plenty of room for 'interpretation' and only the courts can decide whether something's actually illegal or not. Even when they do rule there are often lengthy appeals and new judgements all of which goes to show just how difficult it is.

Re: HMRC targets Etsy, eBay and Gumtree sellers
 

Can't George Osbourne just take them out for lunch and sort it that way worked so well with big corporation's.