Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

Hi all, I've moved in to a rented property for my second year at uni and am looking at broadband offers. VM's offer of 50m no landline for £26.50 here seems like the best option for me and my housemates.

Only speedbump we've hit is the installation fee; there's already a virgin media installation here which was working until the modem was returned, so would an installation need to be performed at all?

Has anyone in the past had success haggling down this particular fee?

Cheers.

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

You'd need to call the sales team to see what options you have. I'm not sure if VM would budge on it due to the fact that it's 9 month term.

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

I would ring up and ask for a modem to be posted out to you, that is what they would do if you was an existing customer and upgrading. I know the installation fee sucks but considering how much you are all going to be online all the time doing one thing or another, I personally think it is worth it to make sure everything is up and running properly from the get go and you can get max speed.

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

If a friend recommends you its a free manned install.

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

VM will try to make as much out of you as they can. To save themselves more cost, I reckon you're likely to receive a Superhub 1 (it'll say VMDG 480 on the bottom).

Nothing wrong with it as a modem, but wireless will most likely perform badly unless you are very clever about where you position the device.

The current model is the Superhub 2 which has much better wireless reach. The SH1 is somewhat cheaper than the SH2 and they're only going to get 9 months out of you.

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

Came up against the same problem this week. Rang VM to get a broadband only deal for a student. The area is cabled and was used by the previous occupier. The VM sales team did a check whilst I was on the phone and said all was fine, the fee wouldn't be £49.95 it would be £20 because the superhub would be posted out. I asked about the £20 as we would be doing the 'technical installation' bit i.e. plugging it into the wall. The sales rep said the installation fee would be waived.

The student rang up later to accept after checking with a flatmate and was told the waiver was off.

It seems younger people get treated differently by VM.

As a long time VM customer myself can I nominate the student as a friend and get a free installation for them?

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

I would, as far as VM are concerned it is a new customer they wouldnt have if it wasnt for your recomnendation

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

Well, tried them today but the recommend a friend does not apply to the Broadband only '9 month special deal' for students.

Looks as if it isn't only Shylock that demands a pound of flesh. Come on VM, sort this out.

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

Hardly surprising. Almost all companies charge increased setup/install fees for shorter contracts and only waive them for longer contracts. Has nothing to do with being younger or being a student. A 50 year-old non-student going for the 9-month deal would get exactly the same treatment, as would a 20 year old student going for an 18-month contract.

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

'Almost' all but not ''all' then; so asking VM to review their position is not perhaps a lost cause especially if it means new custom.

Exactly how many times will VM charge for 'installation' in (permanent) student properties that have had installation at least once before? Nice little earner eh?

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

There are no other suppliers offering 9month contracts, Obviously virgin will make the most of it. Many students pay £20 for a quickstart which I think is fair

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

Actual BT does now (although for a while it was only VM that did)

http://www.productsandservices.bt.co...fer/index.html

They also charge a setup fee, and it looks like it costs more for a similar broadband service.

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

You think it's fair for students to pay £20 for plugging a box into a wall?

Never mind what BT are doing Ben, we're discussing VM. So, you support the tactic of charging students for installation even though a property has probably been 'installed' several times over already? Tens of thousands of students might be waiting for your answer :)

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

When other people are being charged £60 to £75 for the same box? Yes. Completely fair.

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

There is a cost to virgin for setting up an account and providing a box, yes I think £20 is fair

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

Yes I do because, there is an inherent risk for a service to be installed in shared occupancy addresses.

Although I'm sure there are lots of students that pay everything on time, there are probably a fair chunk that either don't pay on time, or don't return the kit when they leave at the end of the 9 months. Charging a fee at the beginning means that VM are likely to offset any risk further through the contract.

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

The fact is any short term contract will be more expensive, as the supplier has fewer months to spread the costs over.

And as for being "installed several times over already" there's no guarantee of that being the case.

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

Not sure students will appreciate the character sleight.

As for returning the kit, is the onus upon the user to return the kit or for VM to collect it and does the upfront fee pay for the risks posed by those who don't comply with the rules? That would seem an unfair burden on those who do.

I didn't guarantee it, I said 'probably'. If you don't mind paying the 'same' fee over and over you are either a mug or have an undeclared vested interest.

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

My old student houses always got post for many previous occupants who had either forgotten to cancel a contract or inform a change of address (usually TV licence and the odd mobile) or knowingly skipped out on them. Its the nature of the beast unfortunately.

And as for paying for the installation fee "over and over", its up to the customer(s) to work out what works out cheaper for them (installation charges next term or paying for 3 months usage over the holidays).

When I had a phone line installed at my new home most of the short-term contracts involved a £50/£100 installation charge. Tying myself in to an 18 month contract avoided that, as it meant the costs of activation could be absorbed over the term of the contract.

Telecoms contracts:

Cheap. Short-term. Fast. Pick any two.

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

Well you're right about market forces.

Students take note: Paying for installation is probably paying for something that has already been paid for at least once before. Consider your options carefully unless you feel corporate greed is something you like to support.:D

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

You know non-students get a 12-month contract and have to pay a £50 install fee for broadband only right?

Or are you one of those mugs who just won't be happy till everything's free.

Students take note: Kursk is just blabbering nonsense and the charge has nothing to do with you.

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

You've missed the point. Again :sleep:. This is about a repeated charge for no real 'installation'. I'll leave it to students to decide whether it is a rip off or not. There are tens of thousands of them and their custom is more important to VM than your rantings.

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

Call it in activation fee if it makes you feel better

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

Ok, it's in (sic) activation fee. Happy now?

Now please explain to students the technical wizardry of an activation that is a snip at a mere £49.95 every time activation takes place. Over and over again at the same address.

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

£20*

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

Hrhrhrhr I like that! It isn't the principle of the rip off that bothers you, it's that the rip off is less than £49.95. lol

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

Rip off? Perhaps VM should simply increase the monthly subscription by an additional £2.25 then for 9month contract and ditch the administration / installation fee?

Just because you see a previous occupants BB connection chattering away happily (or just a physical line/wall box) means diddly squat!

You naively expect VM to absorb the administration fee of terminating the previous account, engaging debt recovery if required for previous account, possibly even physically blocking/disconnecting the port?
Then re-enabling new account/payment details after credit checks, possibly re-enabling a port in street cab and potentially re-optimising signal levels for any upgraded equipment (or interim node resegmentations) all for nothing?

Worse still actually potentially increasing my bill proportionately as I've already original paid those fees for my own connection (albeit 15 yrs ago! ;) )

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

I think we can safely ignore the rest of your diatribe. Your only concern is YOUR bottom line.

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

Does that mean we can ignore yours, as well?

Business is business. If you don't like it, take your money elsewhere. Oh what's that, the competition doesn't stack up against VM? Well then.

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

Well, you haven't :dozey:

Business is indeed business and customer-focussed business practice is crucial in a competitive market. That's why this is an issue: students in their hundreds of thousands will want to know what they are paying for especially if it's been paid for before.

This kind of thing travels like wildfire on facebook and twitter so grateful to you for keeping its legs; ah, I notice you're an ex-vm employee :D

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

I guess that point went over your head. When you start dismissing people's point of view just because you don't agree with it, then it makes you wonder why people should pay any attention to yours. Why is your point of view more important, more valid and more correct than anyone else's? That's a rhetorical question by the way - because it's not.

Except it's not an issue. This isn't some new policy, this is how it has been working for years. If there was a sliver of truth in what you're saying, then where is the social media outcry? Where are the damning posts on Facebook?

Apparently you're so shortsighted, you can't seem to understand how a business like this works. You can't usually cover all of your costs after the first month. By the time you've paid for the insall engineer, the equipment, the CS agents who set up the account, etc. it usually takes months for a customer to return profit. As others have stated, Virgin simply puts an upfront cost rather than charging more per month. It minimises their risk and allows them to offer these shorter contracts. Otherwise, why on earth would they bother having 12 or 18 month contracts at all?
Perhaps their only real crime is calling it an "installation fee". If it had been called an account administration fee, you wouldn't have the "but it has already been installed!" argument.

So you can read. You don't have to have worked for a company to get basic and simple business sense. You just have to have a bit of common sense. More often than not, markets dictate business trends. If a business can get away with charging more because they offer a better service, they usually will. In fact, if they don't, shareholders can often take legal action as the company has promised to make them money.

For the record, yes I used to work for VM over 3 years ago. I hold no warm and fuzzy feelings for the company. They didn't treat me particularly well, they certainly didn't pay me very much and they treated a lot of my friends who also worked there even worse than me. I still have an ongoing grievance with them regarding a personal matter that will almost never get resolved as well, so rest assured when I defend them for something, it's not willingly.

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

May I ask if you're capable of an adult discussion without prefixing your paragraphs with some kind of barb or insult?

It might well be one of the things that makes you less attractive as an employee.

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

Well done on trying to avoid addressing any points I've made.

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

Also, install fees used to be higher, and they've been around since before student offers existed. And the alternative is to pay BT £150 installation if you want anything shorter than a 12 month contract, for an engineer to come plug in something that's already been plugged in before... Plus get this, BT also charge a ~£60 (IIRC) disconnection fee, even after the end of your contract.

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

BT are not the discussion here and we have been reminded to stay on topic.
That instal fees used to be higher and have been around since before student offers existed is not really the point. Again, it's best to stay on topic.

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

BT charge £30 if you cancel a broadband service rather than migrate your broadband to another provider. Their justification is that they have to send someone out to disconnected the line from the DSLAM

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

That sounds pretty on topic for me. The topic is Installation fees for a new customer, the debate you've raised is that the fees are an outrage and that we should be blanketing social media in protest or something. What the competition does is highly relevant.

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

With all due respect, BT (and other suppliers) are part of the discussion. If Virgin Media were charging extra for short term contracts and other suppliers not then you would have a legitimate grievance.

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

[QUOTE=rhyds;35727631]With all due respect, BT (and other suppliers) are part of the discussion. If Virgin Media were charging extra for short term contracts and other suppliers not then you would have a legitimate grievance.[/QUOTE]


Would there be grounds for grievance? You can always choose a different supplier. And if VM have an advantage by having better broadband in your area, then they can exploit that advantage.

The OP and Kursk think that is wrong on VM's part and some others disagree.

So where's this topic going? Nowhere, I suspect.

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

Whenever a moderator asks that we stay on topic, I re-read the OP. The OP is about VM installation fees. It is not about BT.

Probably true. But with VM reading in the shape of BenMcr, who knows - maybe a review of policy is due?

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

I got the sense from reading Ben's reply that VM regard themselves to be in a comfortable place for now and don't have to compete in that area to any greater degree than now.

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

How do you know when something is expensive or not? By looking at the rest of the market. If I said to you "This object costs £100", is that expensive? It might be, but what if that object was a brand new road legal car? Then suddenly £100 is very cheap. So yes, BT is relevant to the discussion because they provide a direct comparison to the cost of the product.

Debating what is and is not on-topic is probably not on-topic. Feel free to stop replying if you feel it's not relevant.

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

I agree but it is better for VM to know this is a point that irks students.

Look, I am a VM customer of many many years standing. I like VM and I like their service and I want them to move with the times to stay competitive. VM make £bns in profits and small adaptations for a lucrative and huge part of their client base will, imho, keep VM competitive...and that is good for all its customers.

Y'know, I don't have to care about paying for installation or monthly fees, I can afford it. But students...well, a little bit of help for kids who are up to their eyes in debt before they even get into the workplace would be nice.

VM will still be quids in. And young minds have long memories.

Thanks. I will not be debating BT. OP=VM; that's the bit that interests me.

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

Ah. Misremembered. I got a £60 charge and a £30 charge and had to appeal one of the two...

---------- Post added at 12:13 ---------- Previous post was at 12:09 ----------

Perhaps it irks you but you do not speak for the entire student population. Students are quite capable of positing their own outrage over the smallest of issues as it is, we don't need to encourage yet more protests over first-world problems.

I'm sure having to pay for anything at all irks some students. After all they're renowned for being perpetually broke. Doesn't change the fact it's a deregulated their is fair competition for the most part so business get to charge whatever they feel like, and the fact that people are willing to pay it means they're doing just fine.

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

Do they? I'd quite like a sauce for that baloney.

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

Students do indeed have long memories. An interesting point. Looking at this in greater depth, one could think that in a 4 or 5 student house, one will make him/herself responsible for organising t'Internet.

That person has the longest memory if there is anything to grumble about; he/she'll be getting a kicking from the others for taking so long and when it eventually comes, the others will merely pay their whack to the lead.

Later, when they're out inn the wide world, there's a case for saying that c. 60% of them will find themselves in a VM area and more than 50% of those will find that the VM service in their area, even the 50 meg basic, will be faster than FTTC due to copper distance from the cabinet.

So the loss of future business to VM, if they do the calculation at all, wold be somewhat small because of long memories.

Does that make sense?

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

You're right, sod 'em. Why don't they get jobs and earn a living? Strewth.:erm:

Source

Possibly:). They may also collectively agree that "youtube ain't working again, how much did you say we paid up front for this four-letter service?"

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

Enough.

If I see one more childish comment or attack I will suspend you for a day.
In case this is not clear, Im mainly referring to Kushan & Kursk. Act like adults.

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

And yet again you're avoiding the point I've raised.

Here's some news for you: Virgin Media only turned their first ever profit in 2012. The value of that profit? Just shy of £76Million. A far cry from your "£Bns of profit", no matter which definition of billion you use. They've been heavily in debt since the NTL/TW merger. Complain all you want about their prices, but they're not evil overlords raking in all of the money, not the way you're making them out to be. The truth of the matter is they need to charge these kinds of prices, not just to stay competitive, but to stay afloat and actually be able to invest back in the network.

The profitability of the company is a very recent thing indeed.

EDIT: I trust my above comment to be purely factual in nature.

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

That doesn't comply with reports I have seen. If you are right and the respected sources on the internet are wrong, then I accept your word that profit is only £76m :dunce:. Only £76m...

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

haha sauce

https://www.cableforum.co.uk/images/...2014/09/36.jpg

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

Haha:D. Not even sure what the 'sauce' is for Kushan's profit figures. The Financial times report much larger profits but you can always trust them to post baloney :rolleyes:.

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

Stop making up rubbish. The Financial Times reports no such thing.

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/1422975c-d...44feabdc0.html (OK the article has a misleading title but that's pretty obvious to anyone who actually read the content)

Funny enough it's pretty much exactly the same as the Times article that craigj2k12 posted:
And err... right from the horse's mouth...

http://investors.virginmedia.com/pho...ancial-results

http://investors.virginmedia.com/pho...-reportsannual
... Or a profit of £75.9 million in 2011 and minus £388.1 million pounds in 2013...


Sure you're probably going to cherry pick the 2012 results that show a profit of £2913.4 million... and ignore the fact that £2652.0 million of that came from a tax adjustment:
Not actual profit. Sorry if the concept of actual profit confused you.

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

Thank you. It was very kind of you to research this for me. Can't think why I was misled by the title "Virgin Media profits up 4.2% to £1.03bn" which is all I ever read for forum discussions.

Let's keep the thread going though eh? :D

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

Apologies for the double-post but I believe it to be fair to VM to record here that a local and substantial student population have received a letter drop advising them that for a limited period installation for students is free of charge.

If the OP is still reading, now is the time to get VM broadband installed. It is nice to know that Virgin are not negative about changing their policy, albeit temporarily, for a good cause and, after all, it is a shrewd business move.

Well done Virgin Media and thank you:)!

We know the discussions here are read by Virgin staff and if this topic in any way highlighted this issue with VM, then well done to Cable Forum too for providing the soapbox:).

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

While it would be nice if this thread had an impact, I think you'll find it's more likely that it's September, the start of a new University year so VM will be seeing an influx of potential customers.

A happy coincidence most likely.

Re: Avoiding installation fee for a new customer
 

Agreed, but you never know :). Whatever, a welcome coincidence.