old VMNG300 with own router!
 

hello, my first post here.

I have searched for the answer to this question but still can't find a definitive answer. I have had 2 superhubs and they are both pretty poor for anything more than 2 or 3 light users.

Both my hubs have various DHCP issues, stutter and drops in hot weather, wifi is not too bad but it's not my priority anyway. I am not a network engineer but do work in Tech support for a competitor. I use virgin because at the moment it is a lot better than ADSL2+ (no fibre at my BT exchange).

From what I can gather (and please correct me if im wrong) people are able to use the old VMNG300 with a router. This modem performs better than the super hub in modem mode. I have read about the upstream and downstream channels and that at current speeds the VMNG300 is >= the superhub in modem mode, but the super-hub is more future proof.

My question is this.. I have been given an old but what appears to be working VMNG300, can this be used or are the people that are using it only able to do so due to the fact they had this modem on an old service?

I read that equipment needs to be activated at VM's end... if this is the case, are there any known work arounds or hacks? Does anyone have experience calling virgin to get a VMNG300 activated, or is it really not worth the hassle? :erm:

Thanks in advance!

Re: old VMNG300 with own router!
 

have you tried the super hub in modem only mode ? Thats how I set up my sister in laws and they are often running 2 360's a ps3 and laptops with no problems using a separate router both 360's are wired in as is the tower and smart hub tv.

i used this one http://www.amazon.co.uk/Belkin-Wirel.../dp/B005626U9W

Re: old VMNG300 with own router!
 

I am using a VMNG300 myself with no speed issues currently.

However I'm pretty sure it's 'impossible' to get a 300 out onto your connection as VM won't/don't do this.

I managed to hang on to mine since the 50Mb service launched and it's still going strong, thankfully.

I'm sure someone on here will confirm whether or not you can.

Re: old VMNG300 with own router!
 

ya, once a modem has been removed from the network VM won't re-register it so unfortunately it is a no go, you also won't get a new one out of VM either because they haven't got any.

As your remark about performance, I was under the impression from several posts I have read that the vmng300 was marginally better when it came to latency (vs the shub) but this was refuted a couple of weeks by someone I trust implicitly. Tbh dude for what you are going to use it for you probably arent going to notice any difference between the vmng300 and the shub. The shub works brilliantly in modem mode and the most important thing you have got to worry about it using a decent router wich can address your requirements regarding stability, dhcp, good wi-fi and I would also suggest dns.

As far as future proofing goes you are better off with the shub because the shub can load balance across 8 downstream channels whereas the vmng300 can only use 4. Many peeps see this as a down side but I am using one on 120mbits and never have any problems getting max speed. I do consider myself one of the lucky few though because I know I am in an area with low utilisation. When we move on to 200mbits I know I am going to need a shub because with the vmng300 I would have to have 4 downstream channels all to myself in order to achieve the throughput.

Re: old VMNG300 with own router!
 

The VMNG300 is simply a superior modem than a SH.

Speedtest/Pingtests confirm this.

Re: old VMNG300 with own router!
 

[citation needed]

Re: old VMNG300 with own router!
 

lol, that is what i was going to say because I thought the vmng300 wouldn outperform the shub as well but Seph said he has run some tests and they pretty much equal each other

Re: old VMNG300 with own router!
 

Thanks for your reply!

When you say removed from the network, if the modem was working at a friends house last week, would that mean it will still work at my address, or is the activation account specific?

I'm not sure i mentioned what i was going to use it for. But latency is a big issue for me. The modem will be connected to a debian server which will be running a web application that demands low latency, the faster the better. It will work with any latency but the lower the better!

If the SH is faster then great, but from what I have heard it is not. Do you have a link to your friends findings on the speeds? Maybe there is some differences between the performance based on firmware. Maybe the old superhub was slower and the newer one is a bit faster.


hmmm. when is the 200 planned ? and is the upload 20mbps ?

Does anyone know about the SuperHub2 ? does this offer modem only improvements? If yes how do i get one from VM?

---------- Post added at 19:15 ---------- Previous post was at 19:13 ----------

Thank you to all who have replied to the thread I really appreciate it!

Re: old VMNG300 with own router!
 

I was a long time advocate of my VMNG300 and only removed it as I was on the SH2 trials. My SH2 is in Modem Mode and I can't notice any difference between it and the 300, only difference being 6 DS channels on the SH2.
I doubt if VM will provision an old 300 in any case, best just to get an SH2 and use it as a Modem. :)

Re: old VMNG300 with own router!
 

SH2 is better in almost every way from the SH1. It's a decent router and its modem is at least on par with the ambit 300 (I believe it uses the same chipset?) but it can handle 8 channels instead of the Ambit 300's 4. SH2s are given to people on 60 or 120 I believe. If you're moving house and take one of those packages, there's a good chance you'll get a SH2. Just check with movers first.

Re: old VMNG300 with own router!
 

Correct - The modem would have to registered on your account. Won't happen...

Re: old VMNG300 with own router!
 

Thanks

Any way to get the SH2 without moving! maybe i will look on ebay ? or will that also need to be activated?

i'm on the 30 ATM but plan to upgrade to 60 or 100, not that the bandwidth will make a great deal off difference to what I am using it for.

The Upload on 60 is 6? and 10 on the 100?

Re: old VMNG300 with own router!
 

Unfortunately, the upload speeds on 60 haven't been upped to 6Mbps yet (or at least not in many places), they're still on 3 (30 is 2). 100 can be 5 but is sometimes 10, depending on how they were doubled. 120 is 12 though.

Re: old VMNG300 with own router!
 

You cannot use any VM equipment you buy from a 3rd party site.

All you are buying is a doorstop!

Re: old VMNG300 with own router!
 

The Superhub's are not on par with the VMNG300.

But they are now your only choice.

SH2 is then the obvious one.

Re: old VMNG300 with own router!
 

As standalone modems they are. The SH1 suffered abysmal wireless and as such that cannot be used when comparing them.

The SH2 by all reports seems to have the wireless issue resolved.

Don't get me wrong, I loved my VMNG300 and left VM when they attempted to force me to use the SH1 when I was offered 100Mbps as an insentive to stay with them (they promised I could keep it but the engineer would not have it).

The VMNG could still be here after firmware upgrades but VM are following other ISP's in going for an all in one "One size fits all" package.

Re: old VMNG300 with own router!
 

The 300 provides the lowest latency of the three.

Re: old VMNG300 with own router!
 

[citation needed]



...[still]

Re: old VMNG300 with own router!
 

There's only anecdotal evidence to back up this assertion Kush.

Even then the difference is minimal.

Re: old VMNG300 with own router!
 

When my friend used to live around 2 mins away from me he signed up to VM and got the SH1. Obviously had Wi-Fi problems but was better when modem only was introduced.

However his latency was always around +25 of whatever mine would be to the same servers across a few online games and speedtest & pingtest severs.

The same when pinging BBC directly, I get around 13/14ms while he never got below 25ms.

The different was, I had a 300 and he had a SH1.

And again, if anyone with a SHUB does a variety of speedtests/pingtests, they cannot match the latency my 300 gets.

If you choose to believe otherwise then so be it.

I have already seen countless tests when I contemplated getting a SH.

It was clear that latency did increase on that hardware and I wouldn't get it as a result untill faster speeds make is mandatory.

Re: old VMNG300 with own router!
 

Orrrrr, the difference was...

That your friend was using a different connection. Anyway, the SH1 isn't a great device but the SH2 is solid. If you want to argue that the Ambit 300 is better, then perhaps you should be aware that it shares the same modem with the SH2.

I had an Ambit 300 right up until I moved and now have a SH2. In modem mode, the SH2 gives me a more solid connection.

Show me a graph that looks like this on an Ambit 300:

https://www.cableforum.co.uk/images/...2014/07/35.png

(Those couple of spikes were me doing some heavy downloading).

Re: old VMNG300 with own router!
 

We were on the same part of the nextwork, same Exhange and evevythig. In fact, the cabinet was actually closer to his house than mine.

For some reason I cannot get a graph to work, I plan on formatting my PC next week so maybe it will work then.

But for now I can still show speedtest and pingtests.

I mean, if anyone can beat my 4ms to London or my 10ms to Paris, for example, I'll send you a cookie.

Re: old VMNG300 with own router!
 

So if i can't buy a better modem or a get a SH2 im stuck with the SU?

Anyone know a way to get a superhub2 without moving ? I have 5 months remaining on my contract so can't call retentions/relations

Re: old VMNG300 with own router!
 

I'm sure you can get a SH2 if you pay for it, I think it's £50?

Re: old VMNG300 with own router!
 

http://www.thinkbroadband.com/ping/s...24-08-2013.png

VMNG300 on a quiet day on 100 waiting on 120 upgrade by end of month. You win ;)

Re: old VMNG300 with own router!
 

If you can't get a replacement from VM then you are stuck with what you have, even though I don't know what an SU is.

Whatever if it's an SH1 then just stick it in modem mode and use your own router.

Re: old VMNG300 with own router!
 

What exchange you're on has no impact on your broadband with Virgin. That's ADSL. And the cab you're talking about might not have been the one you're connected to. You'd be surprised.

Your graph working or not will have nothing to do with your PC if you're using a router. It's the router that responds. If you're plugged directly into the modem, then it'll be your firewall stopping it. Still, it's quite amusing that you're spouting this as fact but by pure coincidence you can't create the data to prove it.

I would really like to see a 4ms to London ping from Manchester.

Re: old VMNG300 with own router!
 

Don't you just love people spouting BS about VM's network when they are totally clueless about how it works?

Exchange. Pleeease. https://www.cableforum.co.uk/images/local/2015/12/3.gif

Good to know they don't even know it's the router that responds to pings and don't even know how to enable it.https://www.cableforum.co.uk/images/local/2013/08/4.gif

Re: old VMNG300 with own router!
 

I guess you learn something everyday, I merely pointed out we were part of the same local 'network' / Exhange. Don't claim to be a expert either way.

I am positive about the Caninet, I actually asked the engineer.

I don't use a router.

I have disabled my firewall and it still dosent work.

I can create the data. Pingtests/Speedtests.

It's in my sig, I did hit 3ms but then I think my IP changed and all my results from speedtest were gone. But yeah, Take a look.

Re: old VMNG300 with own router!
 

Re: old VMNG300 with own router!
 

@pip08456



I have a VMNG300.

It's modem only.

Re: old VMNG300 with own router!
 

I see no ones is getting a cookie then,

Is the Almighty Superhub not up to the challenge :/

Re: old VMNG300 with own router!
 

Of what? Coming over to your house to do an actual comparison?

Re: old VMNG300 with own router!
 

Re: old VMNG300 with own router!
 

OMG! I never knew that!

Re: old VMNG300 with own router!
 

Then why did you mention the Superhub has router mode in your previous post?!???

I don't have a SH so it's irrelevant, what EXACLY was your point when you said:

"Unless you are running in modem mode the SH is a router"

????

I don't get it? I said I only have a modem.


@Kushan

First you wanna see a graph to compare.

I suggest speedtest and pingtest and how I believe a SH could never get / replicate my test to London from Manchester.

You asked where the 'data' was for my 4ms claim.

It's in my sig.

You claim you have 'the best' graph and how a 300 can't match it.

Well, I disagree, the SH cannot match the low latency of a 300, hence why you can't produce a speedtest to back up your claims.

I'm curious, please actually post a speedtest from a London server and see what latency you actually get?

All in all, it should be able to match a 300 right? And with a graph like yours it should be no problem.

Have a go a Paris too.

Re: old VMNG300 with own router!
 

Not necessarily, but it's happened before.

Best way to do it would be to phone the activations line, give them the MAC address and cross your fingers. It's worth a try.

Re: old VMNG300 with own router!
 

I can see sarcasm is wasted on you, you really thought I didn't know the VMNG300 was only a modem?

Kush cannot produce a TBB graph as he doesn't have one.

You say you have one but cannot produce a graph.

I'm wasting no more time on you.

Re: old VMNG300 with own router!
 

I'm not participating in this any further, Maggie has made her point quite clear.

Re: old VMNG300 with own router!
 

You seem to have a lot of time to waste with little to no input.

So, as I understand it, you tried to be 'funny' in the post where you quoted me but it was more confusing than 'funny'.

If you don't have anything to contribute, it's better to not spam a thread with pointless posts...

---------- Post added at 23:46 ---------- Previous post was at 23:44 ----------


Wow, always backing out when it suits you.

My point is made.

The SH cannot match a 300 when it comes to latency.

If you can prove me wrong, feel free to do so.

Untill then, I am correct, like I said at the very start.

EDIT: Pip, you are in your own little world.

Kush posted a graph.

I do not have a graph, only speedtest and pingtests.

No idea what you going on about, as always.

Re: old VMNG300 with own router!
 

Umm, no.

Maggy is a mod and I'd prefer to continue posting on this forum. If she says it's time to cut it out, then so be it. Nobody has won this argument here but getting a ban/suspension isn't worth it.
Seriously, that's the last of it. Feel free to start a new topic debating the Ambit 300 vs Superhubs.

Re: old VMNG300 with own router!
 

Fully respect Maggy's position and the post was directed to make sure things stay civil, not to cease a legit debate.

Dosent help when Pip is trying to get 'funny' jokes in but there you go.

I asked a something simple anyway, replicate a test to London and Paris and we can compare your acclaimed better SH.

Feel free to PM me if that's what you prefer.

But I stand by the fact that the SH cannot outperform a 300.

No one has proved me wrong.

Re: old VMNG300 with own router!
 

Basic rule of debate - If you put forward a position, it's usual for the proposer to provide the data, preferably independent rather than anecdotal, that proves their case, not for others to provide the argument is false (although it improves the factual basis of discussion if they can....).

Re: old VMNG300 with own router!
 

given by whom?

those who have a vmng300 will either have had it from older days or were given it by the CEO office as a workaround for problems exhibited with the superhub. Since the superhub got modem mode I think very few people will have been given a vmng300 as the superhub in modem mode is considered the fix for those who dont like the superhub as a router.

I dont know if VM will activate a vmng300 got by unofficial means.

I remember one time I rang to get the vmng300 reactivated when a girl who was in activations tried to activate it for me it blocked her doing it, the device had some kind of block on it which the CEO office had to overide, and my vmng300 was supplied by VM officially so it will be even harder for you.