Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

Police attending Woolwich 'attack'

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-22630303

Re: Serious incident in Woolwich
 

One man hacked to death / beheaded by two attackers who were then shot by Police seemingly. :Yikes:

Re: Serious incident in Woolwich
 

I was in Woolwich yesterday, so thank God nothing happened yesterday. Nice place, shame things like this tend to give places a bad name.

Re: Serious incident in Woolwich
 

i was there when it happened not nice didint see anything but heard a gun shot. i was behind the bus that is on tv but police allowed me to turn round

Re: Serious incident in Woolwich
 

The fatality is a soldier. Unconfirmed reports are this might be a terrorist attack. :(

Re: Serious incident in Woolwich
 

Absolutely shocking to say the least.

Re: Serious incident in Woolwich
 

May he rest in peace.

This will upset a few here however I am glad to see the attackers were dealt with swiftly and that if true that they were terrorists they will not be running us around in circles using every law they can to avoid punishment. :tu:

Re: Serious incident in Woolwich
 

Guy was wearing a 'Help for Heroes' t-shirt. The attackers didn't leave the scene, seemed to be waiting for the police. http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2013/ma...-live-coverage

Re: Serious incident in Woolwich
 

Not that swiftly, they seem to have hung around waiting for the Police to turn up and then attacked the AFO's before they got shot. :shocked:

An absolutely shocking incident, right outside a primary school, and very worrying if others start getting ideas that soldiers are fair game.

Re: Serious incident in Woolwich
 

Not sure on when a crime/murder becomes a terrorist attack.

Re: Serious incident in Woolwich
 

Depends who, what and why they did it. Some twitter users are supposed to have posted that they were shouting allahu akbar or what ever. I have no links or proof of this and being on twitter is not to be taken seriously.

Re: Serious incident in Woolwich
 

Maggie T knew ;) (sorry)

Re: Serious incident in Woolwich
 

Any act of surprise violence against civilians with the aim of attaining religious or political objectives.

Pure speculation but the description of the attackers, the weapon used, victim and their actions before and after begin to ring the Islamic extremist bell with me.

Re: Serious incident in Woolwich
 

That is what is supposed to have been on twitter. If true that this was a terrorist attack then at least the terrorists involved will not be able to do it again.

Re: Serious incident in Woolwich
 

twitter feed has led me to this account, no pictures but comments/timeline

https://twitter.com/BOYADEE

Re: Serious incident in Woolwich
 

What language is that ?

Re: Serious incident in Woolwich
 

Google translate just blew up when i tried to translate it into something i could understand

Re: Serious incident in Woolwich
 

Me too but it's just interesting that, if it turns out to pan out in such a way, where the lines blur. Generally I think of a terrorist attack is an attack designed to kill many civilians.

Re: Serious incident in Woolwich
 

I don't know :shrug: naaaa'mean

---------- Post added at 17:35 ---------- Previous post was at 17:26 ----------

SkyNews: Police treating this as a terrorist attack

---------- Post added at 17:40 ---------- Previous post was at 17:35 ----------

ok ill try lol

twitter feed has led me to this account, no pictures but comments/timeline

https://twitter.com/BOYADEE

2 black guys run a white guy over a couple of times then get out the car and decapitate him with a machete

the Police took the 2 black guys out. a female police officer got out a police car and started firing shots

people were asking why are you doing this to which the black guys replied 'we've had enough' the black guys looked like they were on something. the black guys were waving a revolver gun

The police turn up, the police didnt want to confront them and instead waited for armed response, there were helicopters and everything.

you could tell they were on somthing because the black guys went for armed police with two machetes and an old rusty looking revolver gun

1 black guy who went for an armed female police officer with a machete got shot down (judging by the 'hype' in that comment I'm guessing with a fair few shots)

the other black guy tried to fire his rusty looking revolver gun but it backfired blowing his finger off. the police then took him out too with gun shots

Re: Serious incident in Woolwich
 

It's not speculation anymore, just been described as a politically motivated Islamic terrorist attack on the radio.

---------- Post added at 17:45 ---------- Previous post was at 17:44 ----------

It's got to be politically motivated imo, not necessarily designed to kill either.

Re: Serious incident in Woolwich
 

Can one of the mods change the thread headline to represent the ongoing developments in this story.

Re: Serious incident in Woolwich
 

Now confirmed on the news that the terrorists were shouting "Allahu Akbar".

I am glad that they got there just desserts for what they have done.

Re: Possible terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

I just hope they don't get to enjoy all those virgins for a very long time.

RIP the poor guy who was murdered and condolences to his family and loved ones.

Re: Serious incident in Woolwich
 

[QUOTE=MarkC1984;35574477Nice place, shame things like this tend to give places a bad name.[/QUOTE]

Sounds a lovely place to me too. :rolleyes:

Re: Serious incident in Woolwich
 

not if they got killed which they havent it seems. SkyNews just showed an image of the 2 men being 'detained', they have been taken to hospital. I hope they dont die and face the Law! crackheads !!

Re: Possible terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

Dam its just been on the news that the terrorist **** bags are still alive and have not been killed :mad:.

Re: Possible terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

Pictures of the attackers are now emerging as well as eyewitness accounts. I don't think it's really in doubt now that this is a terrorist incident by Islamic extremists.

Re: Serious incident in Woolwich
 

Face the law, :LOL:

Come on they will tie our courts up in paper work for years using the tax payers money to pay for there lawyers and they will use the human rights act like any other terrorist in this country that we try to deal with.

WE will pay for there defence in court,
WE will pay for there Barristers,
WE will pay for there appeals
WE will pay for there upkeep should they be put in jail here.

Then should it be that they are in fact not from this country but have moved here WE will pay for the years of courts cases while we fight with the EU and the ECHR's to get them kicked out of OUR country back to there own country when they are finally released from prison..

So they will have crapped on us by killing one of our soldiers then they will crap on us by using our laws to make us look like idiots when we try to deal with them.

Re: Possible terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

it will change. it has to.

Re: Possible terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

Nope.

Re: Possible terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

Footage of one of the attackers trying to justify his actions. :mad:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=EROXP8JDG9M

Absolutely shocking, he *sounds* second or third generation British but my god. I've seen a lot of harrowing footage but that is beyond words. Amazing bravery from the members of the public who tried to intervene.

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

omg

Re: Serious incident in Woolwich
 

But there are plenty more in this country where they came from.:mad:
Coming to a street near you.

At the very least it was a racist attack, not that it will counted as that.

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

Why do we need to pay their court costs? I'm for just executing them in prison and saying it was suicide and sweeping it under the carpet. They should have been shot dead on sight, completely justifiable force.

Re: Possible terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

Indeed. The guy seems completely disconnected with what he has done. :erm:

---------- Post added at 19:15 ---------- Previous post was at 19:12 ----------

Because it's likely they don't have money. It's also important to remember that we're not them. You see what he said in that video about people in their lands experiencing that all the time? The difference between us and them is we have a justice system that decides guilt and we don't take justice into our own hands and apply our own judgements on who is guilty and what is a crime. Executing people without a trail is barbaric. We become like those two.

---------- Post added at 19:17 ---------- Previous post was at 19:15 ----------

This attack is quite exception. This isn't a common occurrence. It is not coming to a street near you. Let's not do the terrorists work for them.

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

from twitter. indeed it does deserve a RT

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

Agreed. Terrorist class themselves as combatants in a war and should be dealt with by a short sharp injection of lead to the head.

As for our justice system, its a laughing stock when we have to deal with terrorists in our country, we are told what we can do when we can do if if its agreed we can and if we don't we will be dealt with and lets face it we have seen it already. Its this sort of incident that shows that WE cannot deal with terrorist in the way they should be dealt with because our hands are tied by a system that favours those that break the law.

It makes me sick that we can no longer deal with *******s like this because we have to treat them nicely :rolleyes:

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

Calling it a terrorist attack and having the PM's involvements is just because the government think there is a benefit to do so.

If the police had just responded and shot them, it would have hit the news as a racial motivated attack and forgotten within a week. Minus the beheading, these things happen daily in the UK.

Reporting it differently or toned down would stop others from trying the same, if they think there no-one will notice. At this stage I think this is just two people, obsessed with religion and The West, who crossed the line in to violence, rather than a terrorist cell. The accent of one them shows they have lived in London for at least 10 years, so if he was from overseas originally, he came here at a young age.

Re: Possible terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

I am sorry it this comes across as negative, but I don't think that it will in the foreseeable future.

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

Its a terrorist attack as they look like they targeted a soldier, they were shouting allahu akbar or snackbar what ever it is that the terrorist shout all the time when they are killing inocent people. You can call it what ever you like, but i will call it a terrorist incident because i honestly beleave it is.

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

Let's hope this doesn't act as a trigger for others with similar ideals.

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

Well considering that we cannot deal with them effectively because we will be seen to be as bad as them :rolleyes:, then yes we will see this again because they know we will not be able to stop them properly. :mad:

Re: Serious incident in Woolwich
 

Nice place?! It's a toilet! :dozey:

Re: Possible terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

People in their lands ffs what Greenwich, do they realise how stupid they sound, I wonder if he's ever even been to 'muslim lands' at least if he'd been to Afghanistan he might have done us all a favour and got shot in the face.

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

We've had the criminal justice system here for a long time. How many times has this happened? Somehow I don't think that fact that we don't just execute people with a fair trial is why they do it. You can't deter crazy people, these guys ran at the armed police trying to get shot. The 7/7 bombers blew themselves up. The threat of death will not deter them. You're arguing we adopt aspects of Sharia law which is hardly sticking to them, it's what they want.

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

No i dont but we need that option, however some people would sooner we did not :rolleyes:

In cases like this i believe in shot to kill if they have been seen to have killed.

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

If they targeted a soldier, based on religious views then it is more a hate crime in my eyes, although the dictionary meanings of the dictionary of both words may differ. This may be because of the War on Terror brainwashing by the government through the media in the past though.

If they targeted the guy not knowing he was a soldier but based on him wearing a t-shirt supporting the troops, its another story.

Allah akbar (or whatever it is) is also used daily by most Muslims as a saying. Just happens that we think of the barbaric terrorists shouting it when we hear it. Terrorists or extreme deranged religious fanatics, they were obviously Muslims.

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

What difference will that make? That's what they want. Both in terms of their deaths and that they want this country to be more like that...

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

It'll save the country a couple of million quid in keeping them in relative luxury in prison for the next 30 years or so.

Personally if they did this because of what is happening in 'their lands' (East London judging by the accent but never mind) I'd quite happily give them a lift back there and drop them off from about 50,000 feet.

Surely if Allah is happy about them committing murder they won't come to harm and will be miraculously saved...

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

They're not terrorists don't give them the kudos of such a title.

they're common murderers plain and simple, and they should be tried, judged and sentenced as such.

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

No way would it or will it be treated as a racist attack. Can't have statistics telling the full truth can we?

Islamic terrorists in this country, who'd have thought it?:rolleyes:
How many normal people carry guns, machetes and knives around in their car? The attack was by TWO guys, not just one person losing the plot. There is a report that says that they ran the guy down with the car first.

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

Gets my vote, it does sicken me that people think we should treat these *******s nicely.

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

This what our country is, and it shares that trait with most other civilised nations that have abolished the death penalty and all other civilised nations which give people a trial. Even America gives people trials before death sentences and then they end up costing the state just as much, if not more, to execute.

Besides it's what they want. They wanted to be killed today by the sounds of it.

If they're like all the others they'll think death is part of the plan and they'll be rewarded in death. Again, they'll probably jump before they're pushed off that plane.

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

Who is doing the killing?:rolleyes:

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

Can't see it being a particularly long trial though; Caught literally red handed and all with the murder weapon in hand.

As for the jump before being pushed, I say why not let them? Will they put their money where their mouth is?

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

The death penalty would sort these type of people out for good but instead we will keep these evil people in jail at the taxpayers expense.

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

We would execute them at the taxpayers expense too.

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

I doubt there would be much trouble raising the money with a whip-round.

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

It would cost considerably less then keeping them in prison though.

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

That hasn't proved to be the case in America:

http://www.economist.com/node/13279051

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

It wouldn't sort them out at all .This type of person cares not one jot about the type of punishment he would get .Killing him would simply make him a martyr for other nutbags to follow ,at least with him still alive he can be exposed for the criminal he is and treated like a criminal and not some sort of glorified man on a mission to be revered by other nutbags

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

That will be all the appeals and keeping them alive on death row. Administering the actual death penalty will be relatively cheap.

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

Yeah but if you're going to execute someone the appeals process is something you probably want to keep.

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

disgusting stuff

I err on the side of the death penalty in debate


hate to be a bit on the cliched side but


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rivers_of_Blood_speech

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

They should have one appeal and that should be it.

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

every time we get an atrocity on this scale we always get calls for the death penalty to be re introduced ,it will never happen and nor should it .Whilst we have police who are prepared to fabricate evidence because they get a bit miffed over some up himself politician how can we ever consider executing people

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

Judges can decide more appeals if the evidence is there. You can't just you've had your appeal if new information has come to light. Also 7% of people on death row have since been acquitted of their crimes, you want to reduce the chances of this happening. We've had cases of people on life terms who've latter been found not guilty. The risk of killing innocent people isn't worth it and the cost isn't worth it.

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

I don't think it was meant in the literal sense. More a warning of general violence.

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

To quote the actual bit, to see how his comparison fairs, eh?

Didn't quite work out in the States the way he thought, did it? Whilst there is still entrenched racism in some of the states (especially in the Deep South), he missed out forecasting a Black President, a Black Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff (who also became the US Secretary of State), a Black Supreme Court Justice, etc etc.

One horrible attack by two morons does not make "rivers of blood", because if it did, what about all the other people killed in knife attacks in this country?

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

It was made in the absolute literal sense! _ I don't know why people always try and dumb it down when it stares you in the face so literally

---------- Post added at 21:29 ---------- Previous post was at 21:26 ----------

yeah - but if you look carefully they are not actually that black - more like mild mulatto - there's no way a louis armstrong coloured president would be in office


its a token appointment


I am not making racist statements I am just stating facts

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

But how many of those acquittals are where they've actually established somebody else did it, rather than retrospectively saying there wasn't enough proof or their lawyer didn't do a good enough job and other excuses like that.

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

Actually, you mean figuratively.....

If it is literally, where are these actual rivers of blood, please?

---------- Post added at 21:31 ---------- Previous post was at 21:30 ----------

Let me guess - some of your best friends etc. etc......

btw, love the idea of the President and US Secretary of State/Joint Chief of Staff being a 'token appointment'.......

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

no - please elaborate

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

Well, figuratively is when you use a figure of speech to exaggerate something, and literally is when it is the exact meaning. In this case, rivers of blood would be hyperbole.

Wiki

hth

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

He never said "rivers of blood", the reference was a literary one. Where in the UK is the river Tiber?:rolleyes:

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

This is the same video that Derek posted but with the missing footage.

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=d0f_1369235265

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

Fine.

---------- Post added at 21:38 ---------- Previous post was at 21:37 ----------

Even for those who have been court red handed with video evidence and loads of witnesses, maybe just like this one?. Anyway the cost of a bullet to the middle frontal area of there head is not that expensive.

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

well I suppose you would have to get into a debate about fluid dynamics and movement to establish what a river consisted of - but it's safe to say there will be a lot of anger about seeing a black dude (probably claiming dole aswell) killing one of oursoldiers serving our country.

In reality he's probably suffering from major paranoid schizophrenia


I'm not trying to troll or stir things up - I am just reacting to that clip I saw on the BBC site


There was a bunch of Islamists a while back all with banner saying "Down with Democracy" - in a protest about democracy in our own country (the dopey f*ckers)

not so angry that they refuse the handouts from that democracy I will wager

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

You're confusing literary and literally (which was used earlier).

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

I'd like to think people are thinking about the friends & family of the victim of todays atrocity & how they must feel, rather than see this thread used as a excuse to air views about American politics & Enoch Powell.

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

There were two men involved, not just the one.:rolleyes:

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

indeed.

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

Agreed.

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

If people didn't bring up the death penalty, there wouldn't be any need to discuss American politics.

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

I said it wasn't meant in a literal sense of actual rivers of blood. The quote originally used was a literary reference.
How did I get it wrong?:confused:

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

Agreed, but when people use the incident as something to help promote their hobby-horses, they must expect to be challenged...

I think the perpetrators are animals, not because of their religion or ethnicity, but because of their actions - my thoughts are with the poor bloody victim, and his family and friends.

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

That's virgil the greek poet who I seem to recall made a cameo appearance in Dante's Divine comedy 300 years later - and not the pilot of Thunderbird Two as some of the younger posters may have thought

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

Virgil was Roman.

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

I don't care about America, i care about this country and our right to deal with terrorist how they should be dealt with not pussy footing around them treating them nicely and with a respect they would never ever give us as some think we should. I just wished the police shots had killed them and we would not been to be having the same boring facts thrown at us about America and what they do. This is the UK and we should be doing what WE do. Still as they are alive they will have access to lawyers, nice warm prison cells, food, visits from the loved ones, freedom after so long.

What a shame there victim will never get any of that or any closure for his family and friends when the time comes to let these ******* terrorists walk our streets again :rolleyes:.

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

What if they're mentally ill? What if later one of them claims that he was coerced (by whatever method) into taking part? Even cases that seem cut and dried aren't always and they're rare.

Besides in this specific incidence it would be stupid to kill them because that's what they want. Putting them in prison for life and treating them as common murders, nothing special, would be far greater punishment to them. We don't want to encourage further martyrs either. We will let any others know they won't be treated as a special case, no special status, just murderers like all the other murderers.

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

Prison for murderers who pre-meditated their crime, should be a simple cell with a bed and nothing else. Prisons are still too cushty these days.

Personally I believe in an eye for an eye when it comes to the majority or murderers.

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

Amazing seeing the footage of 2 women calmly walking past one of the killers and then other 2 women/girls talking to him near the car and the dead man.

Do programmes like CSI get it wrong or did there seem to be a lack of blood spray on a killer. Was the man dead from the impact of the car before they attacked him further?

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

However i am willing to bet that they DO NOT get life meaning life. We are to soft because i seem to remember that we have been told we cannot give full life meaning life sentences without parole. They WILL walk on our streets again at some point. Just hope that when they do it is not one of your family they decide they will kill with a big knife.

---------- Post added at 22:16 ---------- Previous post was at 22:06 ----------

I once posted on here that if we cannot string them by there necks then we should put them in a cell and never let them mix with other prisoners, never ever let them out and only feed them what they need to stay alive. I was told by those that fight the corner against the death sentence on this forum that we cannot do tha, there reason was its against there human rights and would be classed as a form of torture. So in other words we must treat them better than the way they treated there victims :rolleyes:

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

quite a few of them if imagine, certainly since dna became available and when you say the lawyer didn't do a good job do you mean they were drunk or slept through the trial

http://www.innocenceproject.org/Cont...Nationwide.php

http://www.fdp.dk/act/texas-sleeping.php

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

No. You can get life imprisonment. A life sentence will come with a minimum term before you're considered for parole but the parole board isn't mandated to grant it. There are also several prisoners currently serving whole life terms in the UK: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...e-life_tariffs

We can keep someone in prison until they die. Three people were imprisoned under such terms last year.

I would think you would want them to be mixed with other prisoners. Incidentally long periods of isolation is torture. A whole life of it would be pretty sadistic.

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

And killing somebody and trying to cut their head off, isn't? You would have to keep them in solitary to protect prison staff and prisoners.

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

It is but I don't tend to measure my own standards against murders.

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

Hearing on LBC that it's kicking off in Woolwich.

re: Soldier murdered in terrorist incident in Woolwich
 

Would not surprise me if its the locals getting annoyed because the police shot the nutters. Followed by looting of high cost electrical stores