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-   -   Muslim paedo escapes jail saying he did not know 13 was underage (https://www.cableforum.uk/board/showthread.php?t=33691916)

tizmeinnit 07-02-2013 00:51

Muslim paedo escapes jail saying he did not know 13 was underage
 
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...x-girl-13.html


http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage...-teaching.html

I searched for his name but no results surprised its not here already.

But seriously how can anyone buy this crap excuse

---------- Post added at 00:51 ---------- Previous post was at 00:50 ----------

http://europenews.dk/en/node/63519 they are laughing at us

Jameseh 07-02-2013 01:28

re: Muslim paedo escapes jail saying he did not know 13 was underage
 
Doesn't really matter what religion he is, do you not have a BBC link?

tizmeinnit 07-02-2013 01:40

re: Muslim paedo escapes jail saying he did not know 13 was underage
 
just because its in the Daily Mail does not mean it did not happen

he used his Muslim upbringing as a defence so how can it not mean anything??

---------- Post added at 01:40 ---------- Previous post was at 01:30 ----------

http://www.thisisnottingham.co.uk/An...ail/story.html local to the case press release

thenry 07-02-2013 02:54

re: Muslim paedo escapes jail saying he did not know 13 was underage
 
wow. so many flaws. he was taught women are pieces of crap but he must have been told about marriage then sex. thats a dead certain infact. id laugh but theres a poor girl at the forefront of this bs.

thesun published the story January 26th. the BBC have nothing. neither SkyNews. all i found was this..

biasedbbc.org/blog/2013/01/27/turning-a-blind-eye/

---------- Post added at 02:54 ---------- Previous post was at 02:28 ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by tizmeinnit (Post 35533319)

just saw this. poor girl. the guys story is bs. i dont care if he was living under a rock, to put forward he was told women are this and that means nothing. the fact is he was attending a religious school where they must of told him about marriage then sex. plus are condoms not suppose to be used by Muslims?

Sirius 07-02-2013 05:58

re: Muslim paedo escapes jail saying he did not know 13 was underage
 
Typical, our laws are walked all over AGAIN.

Chris 07-02-2013 08:16

re: Muslim paedo escapes jail saying he did not know 13 was underage
 
Hmm. That's a little surprising. It's not as if they knew each other in school or anything. It looks to me very much like a straight case of Internet grooming followed by sex with a minor for which he should now be in jail. I would be curious to hear what powerful evidence was offered in support of his claim not to have known it was illegal.

Osem 07-02-2013 09:13

re: Muslim paedo escapes jail saying he did not know 13 was underage
 
Does 'ignorance' provide a possible defence for anyone who has sex with a minor (i.e. rape) then? Plenty of Savile's chums may not have known the girls they were having sex with were underage and how could anyone prove they did? :confused:

AFAIK, being paralytically drunk and incapable of rational thought isn't a defence so why would ignorance be different?

Damien 07-02-2013 09:15

re: Muslim paedo escapes jail saying he did not know 13 was underage
 
Even if he really didn't know it was illegal, that isn't a defence is it? I didn't think any laws had ignorance had as a defence.

Gary L 07-02-2013 09:51

re: Muslim paedo escapes jail saying he did not know 13 was underage
 
A white boy wouldn't have been able to get away with it simply by saying he didn't know. and he didn't attend any religious school.

makes you wonder if this one would have got away with it if the underage girl was Muslim.

tizmeinnit 07-02-2013 10:23

re: Muslim paedo escapes jail saying he did not know 13 was underage
 
I find it very strange the only tabloids that run this was the DM and the Sun would have thought a story like this would have gone mainstream

Gary L 07-02-2013 10:37

re: Muslim paedo escapes jail saying he did not know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by tizmeinnit (Post 35533381)
I find it very strange the only tabloids that run this was the DM and the Sun would have thought a story like this would have gone mainstream

It might be because he's Muslim. and it happened in the UK. I don't know.

Maggy 07-02-2013 10:44

re: Muslim paedo escapes jail saying he did not know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by tizmeinnit (Post 35533381)
I find it very strange the only tabloids that run this was the DM and the Sun would have thought a story like this would have gone mainstream

It might be that they haven't been informed..so why not inform them?:)

tizmeinnit 07-02-2013 10:50

re: Muslim paedo escapes jail saying he did not know 13 was underage
 
its a bit old now but I have emailed The Independent asking why it has not been run

Damien 07-02-2013 10:52

re: Muslim paedo escapes jail saying he did not know 13 was underage
 
There might be stuff left out which makes it a less juicy story? Maybe.

Osem 07-02-2013 11:24

re: Muslim paedo escapes jail saying he did not know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Damien (Post 35533397)
There might be stuff left out which makes it a less juicy story? Maybe.

What you mean less juicy than the demise of Emma Bunton's dog?... ;)

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/pe...h-8484559.html

Quote:

Emma Bunton's dog Phoebe 'found dead on railway tracks' after 'biggest ever' search

Anonymouse 07-02-2013 12:37

re: Muslim paedo escapes jail saying he did not know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Damien (Post 35533361)
Even if he really didn't know it was illegal, that isn't a defence is it? I didn't think any laws had ignorance had as a defence.

They don't, not in the UK. Nor should they.

Zee 07-02-2013 12:43

re: Muslim paedo escapes jail saying he did not know 13 was underage
 
This is ridiculous, he knew perfectly well it was illegal to have sex with a thirteen year old. He's just a paedophile, he knows it and now everyone else knows it! I doubt he is Muslim otherwise he wouldn't be lying about this, must have no religion.

Whats all ridiculous is the fact they make it so clear about him apparently being a Muslim.

"Muslim abuser who 'didn't know' " and the article starts with "a Muslim who raped a 13 year old".

I never see them starting articles with "A Christian raped..." or "An Atheist raped..."

they're just trying to twist and stir trouble.

Damien 07-02-2013 12:46

re: Muslim paedo escapes jail saying he did not know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Zee (Post 35533442)
This is ridiculous, he knew perfectly well it was illegal to have sex with a thirteen year old. He's just a paedophile, he knows it and now everyone else knows it! I doubt he is Muslim otherwise he wouldn't be lying about this, must have no religion.

Whats all ridiculous is the fact they make it so clear about him apparently being a Muslim.

"Muslim abuser who 'didn't know' " and the article starts with "a Muslim who raped a 13 year old".

I never see them starting articles with "A Christian raped..." or "An Atheist raped..."

they're just trying to twist and stir trouble.

Well in this case he seems to have used his Muslim upbringing to say that he didn't know it was illegal so I think the papers are within their right to mention his alleged faith.

He can be a Muslim even if he lies, just not a very good one. ;)

Zee 07-02-2013 12:58

re: Muslim paedo escapes jail saying he did not know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Damien (Post 35533443)
Well in this case he seems to have used his Muslim upbringing to say that he didn't know it was illegal so I think the papers are within their right to mention his alleged faith.

He can be a Muslim even if he lies, just not a very good one. ;)

Yeah but it seems to be everywhere, they're making sure you don't miss it at all that he's apparently Muslim.

Gary L 07-02-2013 13:00

re: Muslim paedo escapes jail saying he did not know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Zee (Post 35533450)
Yeah but it seems to be everywhere, they're making sure you don't miss it at all that he's apparently Muslim.

Well, he looks Muslim in his pic too. so you can't miss it anyway :)

tizmeinnit 07-02-2013 13:06

re: Muslim paedo escapes jail saying he did not know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Zee (Post 35533442)
This is ridiculous, he knew perfectly well it was illegal to have sex with a thirteen year old. He's just a paedophile, he knows it and now everyone else knows it! I doubt he is Muslim otherwise he wouldn't be lying about this, must have no religion.

Whats all ridiculous is the fact they make it so clear about him apparently being a Muslim.

"Muslim abuser who 'didn't know' " and the article starts with "a Muslim who raped a 13 year old".

I never see them starting articles with "A Christian raped..." or "An Atheist raped..."

they're just trying to twist and stir trouble.

His whole defence depended on it so of course they are going to use it. I do like the way you jumped in and said he can not be a Muslim if he did this and is lying.

---------- Post added at 13:04 ---------- Previous post was at 13:02 ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zee (Post 35533450)
Yeah but it seems to be everywhere, they're making sure you don't miss it at all that he's apparently Muslim.

What you have to bare in mine is some Muslims are doing bad things all around the world and a lot of these Muslims would like to see every westerner dead.

---------- Post added at 13:06 ---------- Previous post was at 13:04 ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zee (Post 35533442)
This is ridiculous, he knew perfectly well it was illegal to have sex with a thirteen year old. He's just a paedophile, he knows it and now everyone else knows it! I doubt he is Muslim otherwise he wouldn't be lying about this, must have no religion.

Whats all ridiculous is the fact they make it so clear about him apparently being a Muslim.

"Muslim abuser who 'didn't know' " and the article starts with "a Muslim who raped a 13 year old".

I never see them starting articles with "A Christian raped..." or "An Atheist raped..."

they're just trying to twist and stir trouble.

You must have missed all them Catholic nonces then ;)

martyh 07-02-2013 15:51

re: Muslim paedo escapes jail saying he did not know 13 was underage
 
If this is true and he has been taught that women are no better than lollypops found on the street then surely the school needs to be questioned about it's teachings .If one of it's students has turned out to be a peodo then how many more are going around with that attitude .Were the Rochdale Muslims taught the same thing ?did they see women as pieces of meat because of what they were taught at a muslim school ?

tizmeinnit 07-02-2013 15:58

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 
is this related to the same child grooming gang then? I found very little on this but nothing seemed to tie it to that case?

If not can the thread title be changed as as far as I could see it has nothing to do with the other case

martyh 07-02-2013 16:03

Re: Child grooming gang found guilty
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by tizmeinnit (Post 35533531)
is this related to the same child grooming gang then? I found very little on this but nothing seemed to tie it to that case?

If not can the thread title be changed as as far as I could see it has nothing to do with the other case

I know had me confused as well :confused:

Lew 07-02-2013 16:05

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
My mistake, I thought it was related to the other case. Threads un-merged.

tizmeinnit 07-02-2013 23:12

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Lew (Post 35533537)
My mistake, I thought it was related to the other case. Threads un-merged.

cheers dude

Sirius 08-02-2013 06:18

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
The long and the short of it in my eye's is he got away with it because of sodding religion. Wonder if i can get of a speeding fine saying i was told speeding was fine in church :erm:

The guy should got to jail end of story.

Maggy 08-02-2013 09:38

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
Well I suspect that someone somewhere is going to be making a complaint about the judgement officially..

Osem 08-02-2013 09:52

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
Let's hope so.

Sirius 08-02-2013 11:09

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Maggy J (Post 35533777)
Well I suspect that someone somewhere is going to be making a complaint about the judgement officially..

Quote:

Originally Posted by Osem (Post 35533786)
Let's hope so.

To be honest i feel this result will stand because if its changed he and his family will try the race card.

Maggy 08-02-2013 11:16

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Sirius (Post 35533810)
To be honest i feel this result will stand because if its changed he and his family will scream "RACISAM" :mad:

It's not a racial issue it's a religious one apparently but I take your point.However British law is very clear about various religions in this country having to adhere to the laws on under-age sex and under-age marriage so I do think someone in authority will be saying something before a precedent is set.

tizmeinnit 08-02-2013 11:19

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
Can a lenient sentence be changed?

Osem 08-02-2013 11:38

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by tizmeinnit (Post 35533816)
Can a lenient sentence be changed?

Yes, it can happen both ways.

Sirius 08-02-2013 12:15

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by tizmeinnit (Post 35533816)
Can a lenient sentence be changed?

Lets hope so

Osem 08-02-2013 12:30

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

When someone has been found guilty of a crime in a court of law, the judge decides what sentence they should serve. In some cases, the Crown Prosecution Service (CPS), or another interested party, may think that the sentence is not severe enough and can contact the Attorney General to request him to consider if the case should be referred to the Court of Appeal.

It is then for the Court of Appeal to decide whether the sentence is 'unduly lenient'.
http://www.cps.gov.uk/news/fact_shee...ent_sentences/

Quote:

Referral to the Court of Appeal is possible only for some types of offence, and must be carried out by the Attorney General within 28 days of the day after sentencing. This 28 day time limit is fixed and cannot be extended.
Example:

Quote:

At the Old Bailey, a defendant was convicted of causing death by dangerous driving and ordered to do community service. The CPS referred the case to the Attorney General, who referred it to the Court of Appeal. The sentence was increased to a prison sentence of three and a half years.

Gary L 08-02-2013 12:59

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
Who can complain that a sentence is unduly lenient?

Quote:

Victims, their families, and members of the public may complain to their local CPS Area office, which may refer the sentence to the Attorney General if they consider the sentence to be unduly lenient
Come on puplic. let's put this person behind bars where he belongs.

tizmeinnit 08-02-2013 13:10

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
I think that there is less than a week before time runs out

if the date of the first release is right 25th Jan then we have 2 weeks.

Gary L 08-02-2013 13:18

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
If his defence was that he didn't know it was illegal to have sex with a girl of 13 (I presume UK law he was referring to)

then what of his own religion (which he based his ignorance on) is there any age restrictions in 'Muslim' law?

Does it even recognise rape of a child?

Sirius 08-02-2013 13:27

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Gary L (Post 35533850)
Who can complain that a sentence is unduly lenient?



Come on puplic. let's put this person behind bars where he belongs.

:tu:

danielf 08-02-2013 13:38

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
Unless there is something to this case which is not being reported (which wouldn't be that strange given the sources), I'd be surprised if the CPS didn't appeal.

Incidentally: From my reading, the judge didn't actually accept his plea that he didn't know underage sex was illegal. He was spared jail because he suspected it would do him more harm than good, not because the judge accepted his claim.

Gary L 08-02-2013 13:42

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by danielf (Post 35533862)
He was spared jail because he suspected it would do him more harm than good, not because the judge accepted his claim.

More harm?
mess up his mind or something.

ok. that's fair enough.
I don't want to see anyone going to prison for rape or anything if it means doing so will mess up their mind.

It would be good though if the judge could explain what he means by “more damage than good”
because it does sound like it will mean the person will feel like he's being punished if he goes to jail.

danielf 08-02-2013 13:47

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Gary L (Post 35533866)
More harm?
mess up his mind or something.

ok. that's fair enough.
I don't want to see anyone going to prison for rape or anything if it means doing so will mess up their mind.

All I'm saying is that it's unclear what exactly led to the judge deciding on a suspended sentence. What we do know is that he did not accept the guy's excuse. If the fact of the case are as presented, then I'd be surprised if the CPS didn't appeal. But I'm also not discounting the possibility that there may be more to this case which isn't reported by the Fail and the Sun.

Dude111 08-02-2013 13:55

Its no surprise someone like this would say that :(

tizmeinnit 08-02-2013 13:58

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by danielf (Post 35533869)
All I'm saying is that it's unclear what exactly led to the judge deciding on a suspended sentence. What we do know is that he did not accept the guy's excuse. If the fact of the case are as presented, then I'd be surprised if the CPS didn't appeal. But I'm also not discounting the possibility that there may be more to this case which isn't reported by the Fail and the Sun.

or the local press with the interview with the mother??

danielf 08-02-2013 14:00

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by tizmeinnit (Post 35533879)
or the local press with the interview with the mother??

Which one is that?

tizmeinnit 08-02-2013 14:06

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
Linked to it near the start . Local press to the events quoting mothers distress over the verdict

---------- Post added at 14:06 ---------- Previous post was at 14:05 ----------

http://www.thisisnottingham.co.uk/An...ail/story.html

Sirius 08-02-2013 14:07

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
I dont give a sod if jail would have done him harm, i would do him a LOT of harm if i had the chance to get my hands on him. :mad: Dirty little pedo

tizmeinnit 08-02-2013 14:08

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
he got off cuz he pleaded guilty the mitigation was his religion whether that swayed the judge or not he used it in his defence . No way should anyone get away with a sex crime like this and this guy has as good as

danielf 08-02-2013 14:15

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by tizmeinnit (Post 35533891)
Linked to it near the start . Local press to the events quoting mothers distress over the verdict

---------- Post added at 14:06 ---------- Previous post was at 14:05 ----------

http://www.thisisnottingham.co.uk/An...ail/story.html

The local story doesn't really add anything, does it?

If the facts are as reported, the CPS should appeal, and he should go to jail. No argument there whatsoever.

tizmeinnit 08-02-2013 14:23

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by danielf (Post 35533900)
The local story doesn't really add anything, does it?

If the facts are as reported, the CPS should appeal, and he should go to jail. No argument there whatsoever.

it adds validity to the story as I said just because it is in The Daily Mail does not make it untrue

They will argue he got a prison sentence but suspended due to mitigating circumstances and the guilty plea. Any right minded person will agree with him going down so we are both in agreement

thenry 08-02-2013 16:02

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
if he gets off then the school needs to be shut down. whats going on at the religious school now? this has been brushed under the carpet by mainstream due to it possibly causing big problems by public distress. the authorities must feel they can deal with it themselves but I don't buy into it all. that school, unless it was some terrorist school must have told the guy marriage before sex. its so simple how can anyone not understand that.

with regards to doing more harm blah blah.. what about a prison sentence and rehab, you know what happens a lot when handing out punishments!

martyh 08-02-2013 16:21

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
It worries me that there will be an entire generation of men who think like he does because of the closed community he was educated in .The school cannot be named for legal reasons so i hope that means it is being investigated and closed down as any state school would be if they taught children those morals.
When will Muslims realise that they cannot perpetuate certain aspects of their culture as they are not conducive to a modern multicultural society like ours .They do themselves no favours

tizmeinnit 08-02-2013 16:22

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by martyh (Post 35533981)
It worries me that there will be an entire generation of men who think like he does because of the closed community he was educated in .The school cannot be named for legal reasons so i hope that means it is being investigated and closed down as any state school would be if they taught children those morals.
When will Muslims realise that they cannot perpetuate certain aspects of their culture as they are not conducive to a modern multicultural society like ours .They do themselves no favours

when they realise they can and we are all dead and they rule the world?

Damien 08-02-2013 16:32

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by martyh (Post 35533981)
When will Muslims realise that they cannot perpetuate certain aspects of their culture as they are not conducive to a modern multicultural society like ours .They do themselves no favours

'Muslims' don't all think the same. These extreme examples are a minority.

Sirius 08-02-2013 16:32

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by henry (Post 35533960)
if he gets off then the school needs to be shut down. whats going on at the religious school now? this has been brushed under the carpet by mainstream due to it possibly causing big problems by public distress. the authorities must feel they can deal with it themselves but I don't buy into it all. that school, unless it was some terrorist school must have told the guy marriage before sex. its so simple how can anyone not understand that.

with regards to doing more harm blah blah.. what about a prison sentence and rehab, you know what happens a lot when handing out punishments!

He needs to spend some time in a correctional facility, he might even find out what rape is from the other side.

martyh 08-02-2013 16:40

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by tizmeinnit (Post 35533982)
when they realise they can and we are all dead and they rule the world?

Probably about right that .
In our laudable efforts to integrate other cultures into this country we have basically given free reign to allow inequalities to continue because it is their culture paying no heed to our own efforts get rid of inequalities .We ,as a society still have certain inequalities that need addressing but we most certainly do not teach it and encourage it

Damien 08-02-2013 16:57

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
No he simply isn't right about that. Muslims do not want to rule the world 'when we're all dead'. Also martyh, you rightly aren't happy if people opposed to Gay marriage are labelled bigots but don't seem too concerned with labelling Muslims, some 1.6 billion people, with the same brush.

This guy is a Muslim, he may well have used his alleged faith in this case, that doesn't reflect on anyone but himself. He is no more representative of Muslims than a random Christian is of Christianity or a random white guy, let's say a racist one, represents white people.

Lew 08-02-2013 17:00

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
You mean all Christians aren't like Fred Phelps?

martyh 08-02-2013 17:01

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Damien (Post 35533987)
'Muslims' don't all think the same. These extreme examples are a minority.

Well there are hundreds if not thousands of these 'extreme' examples out there because just about every Muslim community has one of those faith schools all teaching that women are second class citizens

tizmeinnit 08-02-2013 17:03

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Damien (Post 35534003)
No he simply isn't right about that. Muslims do not want to rule the world 'when we're all dead'. Also martyh, you rightly aren't happy if people opposed to Gay marriage are labelled bigots but don't seem too concerned with labelling Muslims, some 1.6 billion people, with the same brush.

This guy is a Muslim, he may well have used his alleged faith in this case, that doesn't reflect on anyone but himself. He is no more representative of Muslims than a random Christian is of Christianity or a random white guy, let's say a racist one, represents white people.

I put my hands up I am a bigot I do have an issue with Muslims it is a trust issue I have none for them. Does that make me racist? course it does not. I can live with my bigotry and my mind will not change

martyh 08-02-2013 17:03

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
I've just noticed that the word 'Muslim' has been removed from the thread title ,i would ask why

Sirius 08-02-2013 17:09

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by martyh (Post 35534008)
I've just noticed that the word 'Muslim' has been removed from the thread title ,i would ask why

History is being rewritten in front of our eyes and I bet its not the answer you were looking for ;)

Gary L 08-02-2013 17:12

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by martyh (Post 35534008)
I've just noticed that the word 'Muslim' has been removed from the thread title ,i would ask why

Because him being a Muslim and his defence being that of a Muslim has nothing at all to do with how or why he appeared in court and his Muslim school teachings were a factor in his crime.

That's why :)

martyh 08-02-2013 17:14

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Damien (Post 35534003)
No he simply isn't right about that. Muslims do not want to rule the world 'when we're all dead'. Also martyh, you rightly aren't happy if people opposed to Gay marriage are labelled bigots but don't seem too concerned with labelling Muslims, some 1.6 billion people, with the same brush.

This guy is a Muslim, he may well have used his alleged faith in this case, that doesn't reflect on anyone but himself. He is no more representative of Muslims than a random Christian is of Christianity or a random white guy, let's say a racist one, represents white people.

That is naive to say the least .This guy got his attitude towards women from school and his home life The judge said ‘He’s had an unusual education, certainly in terms of the sexual education provided. Comparing women to lollipops is a very curious way of teaching young men about sex.’.

so from that it is plain as day that Muslim faith schools and muslim home life are teaching that women are second class citizens to be used as tools ,not all but enough to be very concerned about .



Sirius 08-02-2013 17:14

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by tizmeinnit (Post 35534007)
I put my hands up I am a bigot I do have an issue with Muslims it is a trust issue I have none for them. Does that make me racist? course it does not. I can live with my bigotry and my mind will not change

Good for you, stick with your convictions :tu:

thenry 08-02-2013 17:14

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
he's faked and scapegoat the religion.

Osem 08-02-2013 17:15

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
Well he probably wasn't Muslim anyway...

Gary L 08-02-2013 17:18

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Osem (Post 35534022)
Well he probably wasn't Muslim anyway...

They should ban him from the school then. I don't see why they should teach him to disrespect women they way they do if he's not even a real Muslim.

martyh 08-02-2013 17:23

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by thenry (Post 35534021)
he's faked and scapegoat the religion.

well he hasn't because he did go to a Muslim faith school ,and his home life encouraged that way of thinking because that's what his parents believe .That was mentioned in the trial .So i would say his perception of women is 100% down to his strict Muslim up bringing .

thenry 08-02-2013 17:27

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by martyh (Post 35534025)
well he hasn't because he did go to a Muslim faith school ,and his home life encouraged that way of thinking because that's what his parents believe .That was mentioned in the trial .So i would say his perception of women is 100% down to his strict Muslim up bringing .

I get that. What I'm saying is this could have all been stopped by the fact he must have been told of marriage before sex. Its as if all this has been him picking out what he wants and discarded the rest.

Damien 08-02-2013 17:28

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by martyh (Post 35534019)
That is naive to say the least .This guy got his attitude towards women from school and his home life The judge said ‘He’s had an unusual education, certainly in terms of the sexual education provided. Comparing women to lollipops is a very curious way of teaching young men about sex.’.

so from that it is plain as day that Muslim faith schools and muslim home life are teaching that women are second class citizens to be used as tools ,not all but enough to be very concerned about .



I agree he got it from his home life and I don't like the treatment of woman in the Muslim faith. That said Christianity isn't great when it comes to woman's rights either. Yet these are often not the only influences on a person's character. How the religion is taught, the child's upbringing, and society as a whole can also shape a child.

This guy's upbringing is not indicative of all Muslims. It may highlight a problem in the culture of young Asian men and and woman but if we are going to examine that we must do so in way that doesn't make sweeping generalisations of an entire faith or race.

tizmeinnit 08-02-2013 17:35

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Damien (Post 35534028)
I agree he got it from his home life and I don't like the treatment of woman in the Muslim faith. That said Christianity isn't great when it comes to woman's rights either. Yet these are often not the only influences on a person's character. How the religion is taught, the child's upbringing, and society as a whole can also shape a child.

This guy's upbringing is not indicative of all Muslims. It may highlight a problem in the culture of young Asian men and and woman but if we are going to examine that we must do so in way that doesn't make sweeping generalisations of an entire faith or race.

The Islamic fundamentalists want to kill all Christians they do differentiate

This is about a guy who had sex with an underage girl and used a Islamic upbringing in his defence this is incontrovertible

thenry 08-02-2013 17:39

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
yeah but equally its contradictory. Is anyone going to actually believe a person brought up to follow strict religious rules have missed out the obvious? I mean marriage before sex is massive in the faith.

Sirius 08-02-2013 17:39

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Osem (Post 35534022)
Well he probably wasn't Muslim anyway...

Well he's not now according to the thread amendment :LOL:

martyh 08-02-2013 17:40

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by thenry (Post 35534027)
I get that. What I'm saying is this could have all been stopped by the fact he must have been told of marriage before sex. Its as if all this has been him picking out what he wants and discarded the rest.

That was the judges view ,he said that the Islam Faith (if taught correctly)does teach that so he didn't(the judge) buy into the idea that Adil didn't know it was wrong in his faith if not the law .I agree that Adil is cherry picking aspects of his faith but that does not negate the fact that the Islam faith as a whole ,and for that matter most faiths i know of,teach that women are second class people .It is those teachings that allow people like Adil to do what they do because "my faith says i can" .So i stand by my conviction that there is a very real problem with most Muslims in this country and the way that they interpret Islam

Gary L 08-02-2013 17:44

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Damien (Post 35534028)
This guy's upbringing is not indicative of all Muslims. It may highlight a problem in the culture of young Asian men and and woman but if we are going to examine that we must do so in way that doesn't make sweeping generalisations of an entire faith or race.

I'm a bit confused now.
is this explaining why the word Muslim was took out the title?

because he is not representative of all Muslims?

That's like saying that if a Christian did something we should take out the word Christian so people don't get the wrong idea?

thenry 08-02-2013 17:55

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by martyh (Post 35534036)
That was the judges view ,he said that the Islam Faith (if taught correctly)does teach that so he didn't(the judge) buy into the idea that Adil didn't know it was wrong in his faith if not the law.

then why this outcome? where did you get those quotes from btw?

Quote:

Originally Posted by martyh (Post 35534036)
I agree that Adil is cherry picking aspects of his faith but that does not negate the fact that the Islam faith as a whole ,and for that matter most faiths i know of,teach that women are second class people .It is those teachings that allow people like Adil to do what they do because "my faith says i can" .So i stand by my conviction that there is a very real problem with most Muslims in this country and the way that they interpret Islam

I totally agree.

martyh 08-02-2013 17:55

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Gary L (Post 35534039)
I'm a bit confused now.
is this explaining why the word Muslim was took out the title?

because he is not representative of all Muslims?

That's like saying that if a Christian did something we should take out the word Christian so people don't get the wrong idea?

like this thread

http://www.cableforum.co.uk/board/20...ia-eweida.html

or the Christian B&B thread

Gary L 08-02-2013 18:00

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
I reckon that if you think about it. there's a possibility that there's only 1 true Muslim in the world. all the others do something that discounts them as a true Muslim. leaving just that 1 true Muslim.

Same can be said about all religions.

---------- Post added at 18:00 ---------- Previous post was at 17:56 ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by martyh (Post 35534049)
like this thread

http://www.cableforum.co.uk/board/20...ia-eweida.html

or the Christian B&B thread

This is it.

http://www.cableforum.co.uk/board/20...se-appeal.html

Does that mean that those particular Christians are representative of all Christians when it comes to gays?

No.
at least I don't think so.

Sirius 08-02-2013 18:01

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Gary L (Post 35534050)
I reckon that if you think about it. there's a possibility that there's only 1 true Muslim in the world. all the others do something that discounts them as a true Muslim. leaving just that 1 true Muslim.

Same can be said about all religions.

---------- Post added at 18:00 ---------- Previous post was at 17:56 ----------



This is it.

http://www.cableforum.co.uk/board/20...se-appeal.html

Does that mean that those particular Christians are representative of all Christians when it comes to gays?

No.
at least I don't think so.

Have you noticed how there is so much debate in the news that is religion based and it all tends to be BAD.

Gary L 08-02-2013 18:03

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Sirius (Post 35534053)
Have you noticed how there is so much debate in the news that is religion based and it all tends to be BAD.

Another subject. but yes. religion is evil.

martyh 08-02-2013 18:07

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by thenry (Post 35534048)
then why this outcome? where did you get those quotes from btw?

.

The one quote i used was from the first link that popped up but it is basically the same as the one from the mail

Quote:

Describing Rashid, the judge said: ‘He’s had an unusual education, certainly in terms of the sexual education provided. Comparing women to lollipops is a very curious way of teaching young men about sex.’



But he said that Rashid knew what he was doing was wrong.


‘It was made clear to you at the school you attended that having sexual relations with a woman before marriage was contrary to the precepts of Islam,’ he said.
As for the outcome ,i fear that the same reluctance to address 'Muslim issues' (for want of a better phrase) that occurred in Rochdale was present in the court




thenry 08-02-2013 18:10

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
ah i read the mails links :dunce: that just proves hes a fake known by the Judge :confused:

Damien 08-02-2013 18:14

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by martyh (Post 35534036)
That was the judges view ,he said that the Islam Faith (if taught correctly)does teach that so he didn't(the judge) buy into the idea that Adil didn't know it was wrong in his faith if not the law .I agree that Adil is cherry picking aspects of his faith but that does not negate the fact that the Islam faith as a whole ,and for that matter most faiths i know of,teach that women are second class people .It is those teachings that allow people like Adil to do what they do because "my faith says i can" .So i stand by my conviction that there is a very real problem with most Muslims in this country and the way that they interpret Islam

Most Muslims is again awfully broad and hard to back up. Then again so is the definition of treatment of women since its arguable if society as a whole is truly equal when it comes to sexism.

You have to distinguish between members of a faith. You cannot label 1.6 billion people based on the actions of a minority who attract a disproportionate amount of attention. There are Christians in America who famously protest the funerals of solders, or children or pretty much anyone else. The fact they're Christian does matter as it's from their faith they have found such hatred. However that doesn't impact at all on all the other Christians. They're in no way responsible for their actions and we can learn nothing about all these peoples' character from those protesters. Also there has only recently been the scandal of Child Abuse in the Catholic Church! Yet most rational people wouldn't use it to claim that it is representative of 'most Christians.

Gary L 08-02-2013 18:16

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Damien (Post 35534068)
You have to distinguish between members of a faith. You cannot label 1.6 billion people based on the actions of a minority who attract a disproportionate amount of attention. There are Christians in America who famously protest the funerals of solders, or children or pretty much anyone else. The fact they're Christian does matter as it's from their faith they have found such hatred. However that doesn't impact at all on all the other Christians. They're in no way responsible for their actions and we can learn nothing about all these peoples' character from those protesters. Also there has only recently been the scandal of Child Abuse in the Catholic Church! Yet most rational people wouldn't use it to claim that it is representative of 'most Christians.

So what you're saying then, is that there's no reason why the word Muslim has to be excluded from the title?

martyh 08-02-2013 18:43

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Damien (Post 35534068)
Most Muslims is again awfully broad and hard to back up. Then again so is the definition of treatment of women since its arguable if society as a whole is truly equal when it comes to sexism.

You have to distinguish between members of a faith. You cannot label 1.6 billion people based on the actions of a minority who attract a disproportionate amount of attention. There are Christians in America who famously protest the funerals of solders, or children or pretty much anyone else. The fact they're Christian does matter as it's from their faith they have found such hatred. However that doesn't impact at all on all the other Christians. They're in no way responsible for their actions and we can learn nothing about all these peoples' character from those protesters. Also there has only recently been the scandal of Child Abuse in the Catholic Church! Yet most rational people wouldn't use it to claim that it is representative of 'most Christians.

What i'm getting at is that All Muslims are taught via the Koran that women are not equal (i actually believe the correct terminology is "equal but not the same").Islamic education in this country perpetuates that idea because it's in the Koran with no repercussions from mainstream society even though any state school or Christian school teaching that would be shut down so why is that allowed to continue ?as a direct result of that teaching Adil and his like take that basic Islamic teaching to the extreme with results we have seen in this thread and in Rochdale .So i think saying "Some Muslims" is about right because most if not all are taught that women are not equal to men .Fair enough some Muslims treat women worse than others but the basic idea that women are not equal is prevalent in all Muslims

Damien 08-02-2013 19:02

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by martyh (Post 35534091)
What i'm getting at is that All Muslims are taught via the Koran that women are not equal (i actually believe the correct terminology is "equal but not the same").Islamic education in this country perpetuates that idea because it's in the Koran with no repercussions from mainstream society even though any state school or Christian school teaching that would be shut down so why is that allowed to continue ?as a direct result of that teaching Adil and his like take that basic Islamic teaching to the extreme with results we have seen in this thread and in Rochdale .So i think saying "Some Muslims" is about right because most if not all are taught that women are not equal to men .Fair enough some Muslims treat women worse than others but the basic idea that women are not equal is prevalent in all Muslims

Well let's be careful because I don't think any of us here are Islamic Scholars or even have read the Quran. I do know that often with these religious texts you can selectively quote and interpret from it to make whatever case you want. According to Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Women_in_Islam, it's rather a complex topic. It states that women are equal, but one must serve the other, but that only applies to marriage.

It's not as simple that the religion teaches that woman are second class citizens. As with most religious texts you can use it to make either case.

Also you didn't say some Muslims, you said most Muslims. You also agreed with a poster that Muslims want to take over the world when 'we're all dead'.

Women are not equal is prevalent in all Muslims? Well in some respects the same could be said of Christians. After all let's look at the problem with woman bishops. What about society in general? Where it's not easy for women to reach the higher reaches of our society and where they're often judged more on appearances than on merit. Women who get leered at on the street or whistled at. I think women in society can be explored a lot more and it's not a Muslim problem alone.

There is a problem in some Asian communities, predominately Islamic ones, when it comes to women as the Rochdale case showed (this case shows nothing other than one child abuser). However this doesn't represent Muslims as a whole any more than child abuse in the Catholic Church represents Catholics.

---------- Post added at 19:02 ---------- Previous post was at 18:55 ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gary L (Post 35534070)
So what you're saying then, is that there's no reason why the word Muslim has to be excluded from the title?

This seems to have happened when we had that merge issue a couple of pages ago, it wasn't editorialised. Changing back now.

Hom3r 08-02-2013 19:08

re: Muslim paedo escapes jail saying he did not know 13 was underage
 
Personally theres no excuse, hang the bloody lot of them.

Gary L 08-02-2013 19:17

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Damien (Post 35534095)
This seems to have happened when we had that merge issue a couple of pages ago, it wasn't editorialised. Changing back now.

Thanks, Damien.
can you just change the first know to not, now? :)

thenry 08-02-2013 19:21

re: Muslim paedo escapes jail saying he did not know 13 was underage
 
I've read the Quran but I couldn't tell you much in detail. Either I don't remember or not much was mentioned. It was iirc women should be covered and all, shouldn't travel alone, stuff like that basically in a nutshell keeping women under the thumb. Real backwards and no compromise such as women being able to be indepentant etc. It does say heaven lays at the feet of your mother so what does that say? I don't know tbh.

martyh 08-02-2013 19:28

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Damien (Post 35534095)
Well let's be careful because I don't think any of us here are Islamic Scholars or even have read the Quran. I do know that often with these religious texts you can selectively quote and interpret from it to make whatever case you want. According to Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Women_in_Islam, it's rather a complex topic. It states that women are equal, but one must serve the other, but that only applies to marriage.

I agree ,i do know that the Quran does not say that women are not equal ,it is something that has been interpreted over centuries so the end result is that to varying degrees Islamic women are not equal to men

Quote:

Also you didn't say some Muslims, you said most Muslims. You also agreed with a poster that Muslims want to take over the world when 'we're all dead'
A flippant remark (note to self ...use more smilies)

Quote:

Women are not equal is prevalent in all Muslims? Well in some respects the same could be said of Christians. After all let's look at the problem with woman bishops. What about society in general? Where it's not easy for women to reach the higher reaches of our society and where they're often judged more on appearances than on merit. Women who get leered at on the street or whistled at. I think women in society can be explored a lot more and it's not a Muslim problem alone.
Again i agree ,the difference is that Christian schools do not (as far as i know)teach that women are not equal .I have already touched on this earlier and recognise that there is still some way to to go with womens rights ,wages is one aspect but the basic principle in our society is that women are equal ,in law if not in practice(but is improving i believe) ,with Muslims in a lot of cases it is actually law that women are not equal


Quote:

There is a problem in some Asian communities, predominately Islamic ones, when it comes to women as the Rochdale case showed (this case shows nothing other than one child abuser). However this doesn't represent Muslims as a whole any more than child abuse in the Catholic Church represents Catholics.
The one thing they have in common is the lack of respect for women predominantly due to the Islamic teachings .I'm not saying that the teachings these people had told them to go and rape children but it did teach them that women where not equal and that teaching has allowed for crimes like this to happen .

thenry 08-02-2013 19:32

Re: Muslim paedo escapes jail saying he did not know 13 was underage
 
well I can confirm the Quran does scream out inequality between male & female.

danielf 08-02-2013 19:52

Re: Muslim paedo escapes jail saying he did not know 13 was underage
 
[flippant]

If Christians were big on equality of the sexes they wouldn't have a problem with gay marriage.

[/flippant]

Osem 09-02-2013 11:13

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Sirius (Post 35534053)
Have you noticed how there is so much debate in the news that is religion based and it all tends to be BAD.

Yeah and all of it about muslims, not a mention of other religions at all... :rolleyes:

Sirius 09-02-2013 11:56

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Osem (Post 35534286)
Yeah and all of it about muslims, not a mention of other religions at all... :rolleyes:

Well it does not take the brains of an archbishop to work that out :LOL:

Escapee 09-02-2013 14:56

Re: Muslim paedo escapes jail saying he did not know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Jameseh (Post 35533318)
do you not have a BBC link?

Was that a serious question;)

This is actually quite old news now, I reported on this in another thread ofa similar topic on 27/01/2013

The thread title was: 'Indonesian judge says rape victims enjoy it'

I posted

Quote:

The accused could have used the same excuse as this guy.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...x-girl-13.html

Apologies for not finding a more suitable link for some members, I am unable to find the story from what some members would consider a reliable source. I have searched on the BBC website digging into the local sections where they often hide politically incorrect news, but not had any luck.

I guess this story may turn out to be old or untrue, but perhaps it's just a little unpalatable for the BBC to report.
I did search on the BBC for a few days after I posted, even looking right down into the regional news where the BBC like to hide non pc stories. If I find any story which may not be pc to report, I always I always check to see if the BBC are running it. I have found in the past that stories showing certain groups like this have appeared on the BBC only to be pulled very quickly!

I admit that I do look at some very unreliable sources for news, but rather than taking at face value I research to see what I can find out about the facts of the story. This often leads to news that for one reason of another is not reported by certain organisations.

Relying solely on the BBC as a source of news does not give oneself the full story, which can lead to an unbiased view.

Damien 09-02-2013 18:50

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Osem (Post 35534286)
Yeah and all of it about muslims, not a mention of other religions at all... :rolleyes:

Really? It isn't that long ago that the biggest threat Britain faced from Terrorist wasn't from Muslims but Irish Republicans who were predominately Catholic. Most terrorist activity in Europe involves separatist movements, such as Basque in Spain.

danielf 09-02-2013 19:16

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Damien (Post 35534493)
Really? It isn't that long ago that the biggest threat Britain faced from Terrorist wasn't from Muslims but Irish Republicans who were predominately Catholic. Most terrorist activity in Europe involves separatist movements, such as Basque in Spain.

Left wing extremists as well. Rote Armee/Baader-Meinhoff in Germany and the Red Brigades in Italy, but that's a while ago.

Damien 09-02-2013 19:25

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by danielf (Post 35534501)
Left wing extremists as well. Rote Armee/Baader-Meinhoff in Germany and the Red Brigades in Italy, but that's a while ago.

Well let's not forget the Lord's Resistance Army headed by Joseph Kony (yes, of Kony 2012 fame) in parts of Africa (mostly the middle part).

Quote:

The group is led by Joseph Kony, who proclaims himself the spokesman of God and a spirit medium. Since 1987, Kony is believed to have recruited between 60,000 and 100,000 child soldiers and displaced around 2 million people throughout central Africa.
Predominately Christian fundamentalism and this is a nasty group, child soldiers and constant deaths thoughout the years. This is an actual army of terrorists operating in Africa.

Their Wiki page shows a pretty horrific list of deaths:

Quote:

Between September 2008 and July 2011, the group, despite being down to only a few hundred fighters, has killed more than 2,300 people, abducted more than 3,000, and displaced over 400,000 across the DR Congo, South Sudan and the Central African Republic.

Osem 09-02-2013 19:30

Re: Pedo escapes jail saying he did know know 13 was underage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Damien (Post 35534493)
Really? It isn't that long ago that the biggest threat Britain faced from Terrorist wasn't from Muslims but Irish Republicans who were predominately Catholic. Most terrorist activity in Europe involves separatist movements, such as Basque in Spain.

I think you missed the fact that I was being sarcastic following Zee's post re. the media fixation with Muslims as opposed to other religions. ;) I lived through the IRA bombings in London and my late wife narrowly missed bombs at the Ideal Home Exhibition and London Bridge in the 70's and 80's.


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