this is why the press needs regulating
 

seems reporting on facts isnt the job of the media now, instead its to incite trouble.

http://politicsuk.eu/archives/14347
http://liberalconspiracy.org/2013/01...its-scrounger/

and the articles in question.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...-benefits.html
http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage...oft-touch.html

Even briefly skimming the articles gives a big warning sign, if you discount the housing benefit and council tax benefit they are claiming she leads a luxury life on payments of under £80 a week.

Re: this is why the press needs regulating
 

Of course these two particular links are going to be shining beacons of truth and not have their own agenda just like the Sun and the Fail. :dozey:

For a lot of people any benefits non-UK residents get are too much and her own admittance that its far better than the benefits available in her homeland are sure to fuel the worries that people have over the amount of Romanians etc. that can come here from 1st Jan 2014 without any restriction.

Re: this is why the press needs regulating
 

yes an actress conveniantly paid to say that will of course admit that :)

is the agenda now we have to compare ourselves to places with lesser treatment of people and not reporting on facts is the way forward.

Re: this is why the press needs regulating
 

Ok this is going to pour petrol on the fire but why just say non-UK. People can come from anywhere as long as they work & do not draw on the taxes I pay. If they can find work why can`t others. Around we go :erm:

Re: this is why the press needs regulating
 

What about the ones who pay taxes too?

Re: this is why the press needs regulating
 

and yet the sum of the benefits received is correct ,maybe the reporting is a little one sided as is common for the sun and mail and true to their political bias but that's what happens when people take the word of these type of stories at face value

Re: this is why the press needs regulating
 

if I am reading his right, there is people here condoning the media lieing to push an agenda?

below link of someone who has worked it out as well, but advance warning is lots of bad language so dont watch if easily offended.

Sorry but if it needs a warning it isn't suitable for a family friendly forum - Derek

Re: this is why the press needs regulating
 

I don't condone the media lieing ,but lets face it it's not that far from the truth

Re: this is why the press needs regulating
 

the sum is irrelevant because things like housing benefit are based on the costs of the accomodation, its not cash in someone's pocket.

if someone on £80 a week can live a life of luxury, then surely someone on 24k a year the uk average must be living the life of royalty right?

---------- Post added at 16:13 ---------- Previous post was at 16:12 ----------

its a million miles away from the truth.

so you said you dont believe it but then say its not far from the truth. so obviously you do believe it. If it was close to the truth then surely they could find a legitimate situation to report as facts.

---------- Post added at 16:16 ---------- Previous post was at 16:13 ----------

simple question, who would be against the media been required to only report facts.

not allowed to post opinion in anything other where its specifically titled to be as such eg. a blog.

Re: this is why the press needs regulating
 

The sum is not irrelevant at all :rolleyes: .The whole article is based around the benefits she gets .If she was living in private accommodation she would be getting the rent paid straight to her ,note the article says "fully furnished flat" local authorities don't provide furnished flats .She may be getting the rent paid straight to the landlord or she may be receiving it in her weekly pay out .Council tax rebate is another benefit she is in receipt of which does go straight to the authority ,but she is still in receipt of it .

That selective reading of yours still a problem then :rolleyes: ,i didn't say i believed it or not ,i said ...,"maybe the reporting is a little one sided as is common for the sun and mail and true to their political bias" .
Your articles are just as guilty of misrepresenting the details to suit there own agenda

You can't stop the media from reporting things in their own way as long as they don't break the law .If you don't like the political bent of a newspaper don't buy it

Re: this is why the press needs regulating
 

The thing is, while I realise that those two papers lie (indeed, both have had to retract stories because of it), I am not sure I believe the blogs any more.

Why? Because while you can argue that newspaper regulation is pretty useless in this country (and I would agree), there is absolutely NO regulation of blogs. People can set up a blog saying anything and as long as they sound convincing, people will believe them. Look at the guy on youtube who claimed to have found a way to get infinite power out of a coiled extension cable just by plugging the plug into one of the sockets (and even produced video "evidence" of it). Some people believed him even though they KNOW it's physically impossible.

Re: this is why the press needs regulating
 

Very true ,blogs such as the ones posted by Chrysalis to "prove" the lies of the papers are themselves just as guilty of being one sided and unrepresentative of the actual facts .In this case the woman in question is Lithuanian,is in receipt of benefits,and most likely cannot afford to take a job below a certain pay grade .She does appear to have a good life and by no means appears to be on the breadline ,possibly because she is the widow of a murdered Russian billionaire as claimed by some other bloggers

http://beforeitsnews.com/eu/2013/01/...e-2502394.html

Re: this is why the press needs regulating
 

Correct, but the difference is the amount of people that view blogs compared to headline stories.

The reason this story got caught is this lady has appeared in other news stories as well. She got recognised.

Other thing to bear in mind is good blogs have at least some evidence attached to them whilst modern story reporting in papers is generally factless completely or just sourced by a minister who himself is lieing.

The fact remains newspapers are publishing more and more stories that are without facts and getting away with it, they can highly manipulate the population. They also seem to conveniantly ignore certian things that should be reported, although thats a different subject to this post.

Re: this is why the press needs regulating
 

That's a question of such utter naivety as to be unanswerable as presented. Perhaps first of all we should establish what you would consider to satisfy a requirement to 'report facts'.

If I ran a story, for example, that simply reported that more than 700 people survived after their ocean liner struck an iceberg and sank in the north Atlantic, would that statement of pure fact qualify?

Re: this is why the press needs regulating
 

Please read my post :)

---------- Post added at 10:56 ---------- Previous post was at 10:55 ----------

.

* If paying tax they are not drawing down my payments - pay a lot less I guess ,OK but still paying what is required of them - thats a whole new ball game !!

Re: this is why the press needs regulating
 

In that case if the authority reported those figures I think it wouldnt qualify as fact unless backed up, also the article would have to state as reported by the authorities and the figure may be subject to change should later evidence surface. If its a web article it could eg. be updated if the 700 turned out later to be wrong.

Fact is quite simple unless you dont want it to be, it has to be something based on something that is known to be true. Since you seem to be looking for holes in this it suggests you happy with stories been made up, and manipulated. The news media job is supposed to be the let their readers know of events that they otherwise wouldnt know about, but now its more then that the news media aim to change how people think. In effect whoever controls the news controls the country.

Re: this is why the press needs regulating
 

Well, 10 out of 10 for missing the point, but I'm afraid you get a big fat grade F for seriously suggesting that news reporting should be confined to what information is shared by "the authorities". I knew you were an unreconstructed leftie but calling for our media to carry on like Tass and Pravda is going some, even for you.

As for that ocean liner ... Perhaps I should spell it out a little clearer. If I reported that 700 people survived the sinking of RMS Titanic, which is a bald statement of fact, would that satisfy your requirements for newspapers to report only facts?

Re: this is why the press needs regulating
 

please explain the point as your post confused me anyway.

I dont know if the 700 is fact or not so I cant answer it directly. The article would have to publish the evidence. It couldnt be alone based on a comment.

Re: this is why the press needs regulating
 

Ok, I'll spell it out.

You demand that newspapers should print only facts, as if this were somehow a solution to the "problem" of political bias in our print media.

It is a fact that about 700 people survived the sinking of RMS Titanic. To run a news story stating that the ship sank and 700 people survived would be to run a story that contained only facts. It would, however, create an entirely misleading picture due to not reporting the fact that more than twice as many people - about 1,500 - perished.

So, when you call simply for the reporting of facts, you do nothing to prevent people selecting facts to create whatever impression they choose.

Would you like to make an alternative suggestion for righting the wrong you believe is being perpetrated by our news media?

Re: this is why the press needs regulating
 

so why didnt you just say would I have a problem with papers choosing to omit fact's, I dont understand the point of trying to make posts hard to understand. you assumed I knew how many were on the titanic, you assumed wrong.

clearly this would still be a problem, but also clearly its not as bad as outright publishing lies. you never heard of one step at a time?

Re: this is why the press needs regulating
 

You would appear to be stating if someone has a differing opinion to you, and by highlighting what they see as potential flaws in your proposition, they must happy to be fed lies and manipulated.

Unusual viewpoint.

Re: this is why the press needs regulating
 

Sounds very New Labour to me... :D

Re: this is why the press needs regulating
 

How would it be in any way better than publishing "outright lies" (an allegation you have not, incidentally, proven with respect to your OP) ?

If anything, the use of selected truths to mislead people is worse than the use of outright falsehood because the use of truth lends credibility to the whole story.

Quite apart from the chilling implications of the kind of State control you seem to want to see implemented over our print media, you really haven't thought this through at all, have you?

Re: this is why the press needs regulating
 

People are gullible enough they believe outright lies anyway.

Do you really believe by the way there can be a shred of truth someone can have holidays abroad buy designer clothing, and live a comfortable life on under £80 a week? Clearly there would be other cash involved in such a situation. I knew the story was tripe before even doing any research on it.

Why dont you just say it, you think the current mechanism of lieing is fine. As you clearly dont want any change. Otherwise you would be saying I agree but your proposed solution is wrong how about this instead.

Re: this is why the press needs regulating
 

If only the extremely gullible are taken in by such things, where is the need for heavy-handed State regulation in the first place?

Re: this is why the press needs regulating
 

most people are gullible, thats why.

Re: this is why the press needs regulating
 

Well, that's where you and I are poles apart. You can keep your left wing, authoritarian, nanny-knows-best approach, thanks very much. I don't need the State to do my thinking for me.

Edit

Nor, for that matter, do I need the EU telling me what to think, what values are acceptable and which journalists are approved to write the news I choose to read:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/ukne...urnalists.html

Re: this is why the press needs regulating
 

I also don't want the press and media in general to speculate for me.I can do that all by myself.Just give me the facts not the inference.:mad:

Re: this is why the press needs regulating
 

Sure you do or you'll just come to the 'wrong' conclusions... :rolleyes:

Re: this is why the press needs regulating
 

Stop being so gullible ;)

Re: this is why the press needs regulating
 

They don't speculate "for you". They speculate in order to produce a product you may choose either to buy and read, or else ignore. If you want bald statements of fact then you can go and get those from the Media Resources page of every government department and major corporation in the developed world.

Re: this is why the press needs regulating
 

So you think it is fine that newspapers have the power they have had in recent times?You really don't think that they need putting in order?Just what do you want?The same free for all we have had all this time? Or some responsibility accepted for lives ruined because of speculation,inference and down right lies?

Re: this is why the press needs regulating
 

I think the first thing we need to affirm is the rights to free speech and freedom of political association. Both of those rights will result in unruly and partisan behaviour in our Press but on the other hand the practice of those rights by our Press have contributed in no small part to what we have here in the UK, arguably the most stable, long-lasting democracy in Europe, if not the world.

The truly horrifying thing in all this is the enthusiasm with which some people are prepared to clamour for official regulation of free speech. The moment that occurs, speech is no longer free.

It cannot be repeated often enough: the behaviour which led to the Leveson Inquiry was almost entirely already illegal. The failure ultimately was one of law enforcement, not lack of laws to enforce.

On the civil side, we already have some of the toughest libel laws in the world. The only thing missing there is the ability of the less well off to finance a libel action. There may be scope for some reform there, but let's face it, most of the people complaining at Leveson were certainly not short of the resources required to take on even the biggest of our newspapers had they wished to.

Our national newspaper editors all know what the law is and they know what the PCC code of conduct is. What is required is law enforcement by coppers who are prepared to pursue hacks rather than take backhanders from them, and voluntary regulation that both works and is seen to be working.

Re: this is why the press needs regulating
 

Well the cynic in me can see that you honestly believe the situation is retrievable because you are a decent journalist..However there are many in the industry who do not deserve that job description being just hacks.they will continue to behave in the same old despicable manner and the poorer victims of their trade will continue to have no cheap redress available to them..and the PCC was and would still be no match for those who put profit before ethics because it had no teeth legally to insist on a industry wide participation in self regulation..

Re: this is why the press needs regulating
 

so wanting a decent press means I am left wing.

I think you are happy with lies as they suit your political swing. I didnt mention anything politically I just mentioned inaccurate stories which of course seem to be much more common in both the mail and sun than other papers, but they not the only 2 papers at it.

If a news story thats accurate is printed but I dont like the truth thats fair enough, very different to complete rubbish been printed.

Are you a journalist, as maggy has said?

---------- Post added at 19:34 ---------- Previous post was at 19:25 ----------

where did I say that?

newpaper articles are not meant for voicing opinions they are for reporting factual stories.

blogs are more suited to opinions yet I find blogs posting more facts than newspaper articles, its backwards.

Also if a story is proven to be trash against an individual and especially if they rich they have legal recourse.

Lets say a story is printed saying "army veterans will not be treated the same as DLA fraudsters" and you wanted to take legal action as been labeled as a fraudster whats the legal procedure for that?

---------- Post added at 19:38 ---------- Previous post was at 19:34 ----------

seems the mail pulled the article?

Re: this is why the press needs regulating
 

I think the problem is that you tend to label stories lies and rubbish when you don't agree with them .You have yet to give any convincing ,un biased evidence that the story you are complaining about is lies and rubbish ,so how about you follow your own advice and give us some hard verifiable facts

Re: this is why the press needs regulating
 

No, demanding Press regulation on the pretext that people are gullible and somehow need protecting is left wing, or at least, that sort of patrician authoritarianism has been a characteristic of the British Left for quite some time now.

And I think you see lies where the stories don't suit your political swing. Oddly enough, neither the Mail nor the Sun are known for being sympathetic towards the Left.

Trained, qualified and time-served. Not working on a newspaper these days though.

Yes, I was forgetting the famous Newspapers Enablement Act 1972. It forbids newspapers from being partisan or running opinion pieces doesn't it. Oh, hang on, there's no such thing.

Chrys, do try not to confuse what you think someone should be allowed to do, with what they actually are allowed to do. Newspapers are, and always have been, free to voice an opinion and as they, not the government or some 'independent' regulator, have editorial control of their content, they are free to choose what to report and how to report it.

Bloggers, likewise, are free to simply report news or to be a soapbox, or both.

Re: this is why the press needs regulating
 

Yesterday at 18:07 when you responded to Chris with which I had highlighted when I quoted you, when his opinion differed from yours.

Re: this is why the press needs regulating
 

no I label as rubbish when they fiction.

the mail story posted similiar to the sub except they revealed she had a credit card which was been used to find a lifestyle (but was very different to what the headlines entailed), that story is now pulled. The sun just posts a story about a women who also appeared in a story as a kgb agent's wife, who is actively looking for work as an actress and says she is living it up on under £80 a week, doing research on the journalist who posted the story reveals some interesting information.

I could post a story that martyh is santa claus and it would be the same amount of truth as that article.

It does seem I have learnt something here tho, people will put agenda ahead of morals. Not just politicians and journalists.

Re: this is why the press needs regulating
 

There's none so blind as those who will not see...