Direct Debit Theft
 

I am wondering if anyone can tell me how to deal with Virgin Mobile.
The case was, I recently asked for a PAC code because of the erratic charges on my bills [Bill no. 1522302795] and I was told that the early termination fee would be £205.00 to which I agreed to.
Virginmedia later that month took out £367.90 from my bank a/c without notice. This I consider as theft!
I have since called virgin mobile team several times for someone to give me a breakdown of how this figure was arrived at. No one in your call centre seems to know what to do or care.
I subsequently wrote to both your addresses in Trowbridge and Swansea, still to no avail.
Apparently there is no means to complain to Virgin Mobile. Can I report this to the police or Financial Ombudsman?

Re: Direct Debit Theft
 

Cable Forum is not owned or controlled by Virgin Media.

Re: Direct Debit Theft
 

Direct Debit guarantee - if money has incorrectly been taken from your account, your bank should be able to ensure it's refund. Have you contacted them?

If you cannot get any resolution to your complaint from Virgin Media, then contact OFCOM as the regulator.

VM aren't good at paper. Unless your letters were recorded delivery so you can p[rove a receipt they probably ended up in a black hole somewhere. You may first wish to try the CEO's office at Virgin Media to see if they can cut through to the problem neil.berkett@virginmedia.co.uk

Re: Direct Debit Theft
 

As Rob said use the direct debit guarantee. Contact your bank and get the payment returned.

Re: Direct Debit Theft
 

Contact your bank, tell them you dispute the amount and want it reversing.

Re: Direct Debit Theft
 

I agree that the CEO's office is the best place to start and that it is tempting for staff to "lose" paper correspondence.

I'm confused though, are members now allowed to give out VM email addresses for people to contact if they have problems, as I was asked not to do it by a moderator :confused:

Re: Direct Debit Theft
 

Re: Direct Debit Theft
 

Neil Berkett's email address is allowed as it goes to the CEO's office not him personally.

Also the CEO's office is likely to refer the OP back to Customer Services as a first port of call and very likely the bill is prorated and correct.

Your can get your bank to do an Indemnity for you but if the payment is correct it will always be repaid to the claiming company at which point you may incur bank charges, that is also part of the Direct Debit Guarantee as the company will never be out of pocket if the payment is rightly theirs.

Re: Direct Debit Theft
 

This is why i don't have DD's for sky ,virgin mobile or any other service company .Giving them access to take what they like is only asking for trouble

Re: Direct Debit Theft
 

If you re-read the OP's post you'll see that Customer Services have failed to explain the charges when asked.

Money can only be taken by DD only if it is properly justified and accounted for. If the customer is not provided with proper billing, especially if they have demanded it, then there are legitimate grounds for complaint escalation.

Re: Direct Debit Theft
 

I have read it actually on the first day it was posted, but if the payment is legitimate and an Indemnity claim is made which proves to be incorrect the payee can demand payment back in full without warning which can leave you short of money and potentially overdrawn because an Indemnity claim does not mean the money claimed back is actually yours even though it is now back in your account.

As for the CEO's Office it will be unlikely they will become involved apart from possibly getting a call from a Customer Services manager who would explain the charges but that would be it as far as them taking ownership of the issue.

The agents spoken to originally should have explained any charges in full rather than dodging the issue if the OP's original post is request as that is unwarranted and unprofessional.

Re: Direct Debit Theft
 

No it goes to him, but is also managed by CEOs

That isn't how it works. If you do an Idemnity claim that is successfull you get the money back. However it then becomes a debt with the company the D/D was for

They can't then reverse the claim, they would have to bill it to the customer the same as any other charge

As the OP says they weren't notified of the D/D amount, then that would be valid claim as the D/D rules haven't been followed. If they had been notified it wouldn't be valid claim as the process itself had been followed

Re: Direct Debit Theft
 

By implication you are saying the issue shouldn't be escalated to the CEO office as a complaint. But the OP has, as posted, tried to get Customer Services to provide him with a proper account, both by calling and by writing. If Customer Services refuse / simply will not / are incapable of dealing with the issue, when should the CEO office get involved?

Re: Direct Debit Theft
 

You actually believe that he reads all those emails, get real it is not his personal email address and he will never see the inbox for that email address.


Of course not the banks just let the claim get reversed and forget about it, whoever gave you that information is wrong but you think that you know know better.:rolleyes:

Re: Direct Debit Theft
 

If the bank reverses the claim and the op gets all his money back ,any money owed due to the cancellation of his contract then becomes a debt to VM which hopefully the next time they try to collect will be billed correctly with a breakdown of the costs.

http://www.thesmartwaytopay.co.uk/di...guarantee.aspx

Re: Direct Debit Theft
 

Which clearly states if the money is refunded in error it must be paid back to the payee which strangely I have already stated.:rolleyes:

See Ben as to the breakdown of costs as it is his company not mine as Virgin Media tend not to do that which many on here will agree.

Re: Direct Debit Theft
 

It won't have been refunded in error though .The op isn't denying he owes money just the amount and that VM have taken more than the amount agreed without informing the op so the claim will be valid as per the guarantee ,he will get his money back and be billed for the correct amount.Any money refunded belongs to the op as it is not for the bank to decide who owes who money, that is an argument between VM and the OP .

@Rovimax

personally i would cancel the DD either by phoning the bank or through online banking ,get your money back into your bank and then agree to pay any sum owed to VM only after a breakdown of costs have been issued and do as i do ,never have DD's to phone/internet companies or tv subscription companies

Re: Direct Debit Theft
 

I take it you have little or no understanding of what a Direct Debit Indemnity actually is by the above comment, you ring your bank tell them a payment has been wrongly taken by the payee, the bank say OK we can bring it back but if you actually owe that amount then the payee can reclaim it, the bank only has your word that the payment was taken incorrectly as they do not have the time or the facility to investigate your claim hence the warning given.

I have worked in a banking call centre and have done many Direct Debit Indemnities which the majority of posters on here have never had dealings with and on each call we have to warn the caller of what can happen if the claim is incorrect or not a valid claim.

Try not to allow emotions to get in the way of facts.

Re: Direct Debit Theft
 

I know full well how a DD works thank you :rolleyes:

You said that the money refunded does not belong to the payer even though it is refunded to his bank account,wrong ,the account holder is free to do what he likes with money in his account ,any money owed to the company will become a debt and claimed in the usual manner i.e through billing with a correctly broken down itemisation.The banks simply act as a channel for the money they are not there to mediate between payer and payee.In this case the DD was for more than the agreed amount so the OP should reclaim the money and then get an itemised bill from VM and then pay the correct sum of money which can only be collected from his account if he gives authority to VM

and this(in bold) is just completely wrong

Re: Direct Debit Theft
 

It is not a refund it is an indemnity which is different and if incorrect the money can be requested back and as the was a Direct Debit on the account in the first place the OP had given permission for monies to be taken.

So according to your post anyone can claim back money for any reason just because they feel like claiming it back, why not try it and tell us the result as it will do wonders for your credit rating.

Of course Ben could pm the OP and ask if he wanted any help with this issue.

Re: Direct Debit Theft
 

Under the DD guarantee a DD taken in error or for the incorrect amount the payer is entitled to a "full and immediate"* refund from the bank ,the bank then fill out a indemnity form to get the money from whatever company took the DD originally that bit is the banks problem and nothing to do with the customer .

*"immediate" in banking terms usually means about 3-4 days

I have had to use the DD refund on 3 occasions ,1 with virgin mobile and 2 times with sky .On both occasions too much money was taken i reclaimed the full amount in 4 days and arranged to pay the correct amount using the companies on line payment service which i still do

I think the fact you used to work in a banking call center is both a blessing and unsurprising .I have been told by my banks call center on many occasions that the only way to cancel a DD is by giving at least 48hrs notice ,totally untrue ,i have also been told that a DD can only be activated if i go into the branch and sign the mandate again totally untrue .In my experience some banking staff have no idea how a DD works

Re: Direct Debit Theft
 

And that is where you are wrong.

---------- Post added at 12:43 ---------- Previous post was at 12:41 ----------

As I'm not in a customer contact role, nor have I ever worked in the Mobile side of the business nor have any access to the billing systems, there wouldn't be much point in me doing that as I wouldn't be able to help.

Re: Direct Debit Theft
 

You really think that he reads thousands of emails per day, he has staff for exactly that and a different email addy for internal and external use.

---------- Post added at 15:12 ---------- Previous post was at 15:07 ----------

An Indemnity is instant so once again you are wrong and so wide of the mark it is amazing to read, it shows instantly in your balance and is therefore available to be spent even though you are advised that it may be claimed again by the payee.

Also if a Direct Debit is within 48 hours of its payment date it cannot be stopped which is correct so do try getting your facts correct before posting rubbish.

It probably a great idea that you are no longer a builder/jobber/cowboy as the rubbish that comes out of you must have meant you giving outrageous estimates for jobs and possibly why we are now driving for a living.:rolleyes:

Do you find the above amusing as you must have when you posted your comment above as did find my above comment amusing but my reason for moving is to a better job so again so wrong and no surprise either.

Re: Direct Debit Theft
 

No he doesn't. Not denying that others don't have access to the address, but it is his address, and he does use it

Re: Direct Debit Theft
 

I have met Neil at a event and it is his e mail, he does not get thousands per day either.

Re: Direct Debit Theft
 

Try taking your own advice.

Re: Direct Debit Theft
 

DD's and the repayments are handled by BACS process which takes at least 3 days ,which is the fastest i have had one

http://www.thesmartwaytopay.co.uk/Di...rectDebit.aspx

also i could go into my online banking and cancel any DD's the day before they are due and they do not get payed.

If the factual errors you have posted are anything to go by then it is a very good job you no longer work in the call center ,and i'll thank you to refrain from commenting on my job choice ,you know nothing of my skills ,experience or circumstances so do not ever attempt to insult me in that way again

The OP has been correctly advised by myself and other posters to claim the money back under the DD guarantee and based on his info given he would be successful ,he would then need to arrange payment to VM for any monies owed .Telling him that any repayment could be taken off him without warning leaving him overdrawn as the money doesn't actually belong to him is just plain wrong on so many levels .By claiming an indemnity the authority for VM to approach your bank for funds has been removed so they cannot ever go into that account again unless a new instruction is given by the account holder ,they must therefore use more traditional billing methods and send a bill for the correct amount

Re: Direct Debit Theft
 

A Direct Debit Indemnity has nothing whatsoever to do with the BACS system and if you call up and ask for one to be done it is back in your account as soon as the button is clicked, if your bank tells you otherwise they are lying.


<removed>

Re: Direct Debit Theft
 

Re: Direct Debit Theft
 

I have been reading this and thinking about what has happened to the OP. When a CSA quotes the Early cancellation fee it only covers the line rental and does not take in to any charges that will not be showing on the account (due to be shown on the next bill).

So when the OP has said "excessive" charges this is what could have transpired, due to the extra cost of the DD than the stated price?

Re: Direct Debit Theft
 

However they still should have a bill detailing the charges before they were taken out - however the OP says they didn't

Re: Direct Debit Theft
 

It is a very good job that we no longer have to go down main street to the corral then for a builder/jobber as well, as you clearly have no idea that an Indemnity Claim is instantly back into your account the difference is I know more about banking than you can fit in your 10 gallon hat.

Re: Direct Debit Theft
 

We were advised (when i worked for O2) was for the customer to cancel the DD as f there was one pending it will be collected. They would get a revised bill 14 days after the cancellation / port date.

Re: Direct Debit Theft
 

Why not stop cyberstalking or are you still trying to Yan k my chain.:dunce:

Re: Direct Debit Theft
 

I'm not sure what that has to do with anything

The issue as far as I see it is that the amount taken was different to what was suggested, and that there was no notification of the amount - which is required by the D/D scheme as it is a variable amount

Whether is then a dispute of the amount is a different issue.

Re: Direct Debit Theft
 

Sorry should have said that we were advised to to say that it is a guideline and will not show any call charges that will be pending, That is why we were told to tell the cust to cancel the DD and wait for the final bill.

Re: Direct Debit Theft
 

But still, to take out an amount that you have not notified about within the notification period is not valid (unless it's a fixed amount) and the customer can correctly use an indemnity claim to get it back

Re: Direct Debit Theft
 

Yes they can and I always told the customer about that as well. That is why I told customers to cancel the DD and wait for the final bill.

I was just trying to get across what could be the problem.

Re: Direct Debit Theft
 

Thanks guys, your contributions have been quite informative and eye openning. One or two things happened during my quest. Firstly, this email address (neil.berkett@virginmedia.co.uk) does not work- my email postmaster kept returning emails to this address.
Secondly, I applied for Indemnity and I was given two contravening statements. The first bank staff told me VM could re-apply and take the money from my a/c without notifying me, and a second staff reassured me that they VM could not as the DD is cancelled. I am waiting to see what happens. Sorry for being slightly naive here. Thanks again guys.

Re: Direct Debit Theft
 

You are correct the email address is neil.berkett@virginmedia.co.uk so it should work.

Re: Direct Debit Theft
 

Are you able to check your account still and see what the call charges were in regards to the cancellation fee that you were quoted?

Re: Direct Debit Theft
 

All my calls o VM were supposed to be free. Thanks

Re: Direct Debit Theft
 

I didn't think that any supplier had a package where ALL calls are free.

Re: Direct Debit Theft
 

Think that post was supposed to say 'to VM' ;)