Energy firms' profit margins soar
 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-15302723

That's one hell of a hike in price.I hadn't realised how bad it had got.

Re: Energy firms' profit margins soar
 

doesn't sound like much ,about 34p profit per day for dual fuel but when you take into concideration the number of customers ,in the case of my supplier npower about 6million that is a massive number even assuming only half the customers have a duel fuel contract .
I wonder if that figure is pre tax or after tax

Re: Energy firms' profit margins soar
 

But at the time they said the 18% rise in prices was essential!

Nice to know our extra outgoings are going to a good cause.

Re: Energy firms' profit margins soar
 

Yeah its call fat cat bonuses :mad:

Re: Energy firms' profit margins soar
 

Is the margin gross or net?

Re: Energy firms' profit margins soar
 

What company earns less then £125 per year per customer? Its 34p per day profit just seems a lot due to volume of customers.

I also know they have to invest billions into renewable energy which will cost billions to build the infrastructure; do you think the government is going to pay? Do you think the power companies will pay? No it will come from you and I from the cost of our energy.

:2cents:

Re: Energy firms' profit margins soar
 

The problem is the companies will not allow their profit margins to fall .When faced with rising materials costs most companies will try to absorb the extra cost rather than lose customers to competition ,they try to use the profit margin as a way of keeping retail prices down but with energy companies they are basically a monopoly or cartel with toothless regulation so no such competion exists

---------- Post added at 10:16 ---------- Previous post was at 10:08 ----------

34p per day profit is a huge profit margin given the volume of customers ,in fact if they are net profits they are grotesque .Any investments in renewable energy will be accounted for before the profits are announced and don't forget those investments will usually earn them money as well enough to ofset the initial investment untill it enters a profit

Re: Energy firms' profit margins soar
 

These figures are not actual profit, but predicted possible profit.:rolleyes:

How much profit they make depends on how much customers use, because of things like cold weather. The future weather would be completely unknown to them.:rolleyes: If it actually turns out to be warmer, then they would make less profit.

Re: Energy firms' profit margins soar
 

So much for Privatisation and pseudo competition.

Anyone with half a brain would know where it leads.

We are sooo screwed.

Re: Energy firms' profit margins soar
 

Yes l agree totally in that Privatisation was trumpeted as some great policy which would mean lower prices and better services but what have we got now and that is poorer services and sky high prices.

Re: Energy firms' profit margins soar
 

We know that energy prices won't be going down and we know that customers energy usage is fairly consistent so whilst it must be appreciated that the figures are an estimate and will most likely be lower than quoted it is still a massive number and highlights how vulnerable joe public is to profiteering from energy companies

Re: Energy firms' profit margins soar
 

How would them not being privatised necessarily led to lower prices? The cost of obtaining the fuel, inflation, wage inflation, 'climate change' taxes etc would still be there.

Re: Energy firms' profit margins soar
 

Nothing wrong with privatisation it is the fact that there is no competition .Basically there is a energy monopoly ,we have 5-6 big suppliers who all colaborate when it comes to prices which is why OFGEM need to grow some teeth and start snapping .The government however are in a bit of a pickle over this because they need the tax revenue rom companies such as these to balance the books and reducing their profits reduces the tax revenue

Re: Energy firms' profit margins soar
 

How is customer usage fairly consistent when it varies with the weather? If October turns out to be warmer than normal, customers will use less than normal and yet the companies still have to cover the costs that are not directly related to usage.

Re: Energy firms' profit margins soar
 

It may mean lower prices to the consumer but it would mean a much higher tax subsidy from the government if they where still state owned so either way the consumer loses under state ownership ,at least with private ownership the government and tax payer benefit from the tax revenue generated by these companies and if regulated properly there can be strong competition ,it would be even better if the government had a coherent energy policy that goes further than throwing the voters a bone come election time

---------- Post added at 12:26 ---------- Previous post was at 12:18 ----------

on a yearly basis and using my own bills as a example i would say they are pretty consistant

Re: Energy firms' profit margins soar
 

Are we really suprised they fleecing the country.

While the government let them burn this country they more interested about royal decendency to the thrown than sorting this country out.

Give the regulators some serious power to confiscate half there profits return it to the customers they fleeced.

Re: Energy firms' profit margins soar
 

They're not fleecing the country ,they are taking advantage of a lack of regulation and a virtual monopoly ,any business in their position would do the same .

Re: Energy firms' profit margins soar
 

You are getting to sound like a politician or a spokesperson for the energy industry. :D

It doesn't matter how you word it we are getting royally shafted, and have been for a long while.

Re: Energy firms' profit margins soar
 

i didn't say that what they are doing is right just understandable ,petrol suppliers ,water companies and the worst one of all imo is the insurance companies they are all at it ;)

Re: Energy firms' profit margins soar
 

Agreed 100% :)

Re: Energy firms' profit margins soar
 

Slightly off but basically big companies cashing in again:

What's a rent-a-roof scheme?
'Free' solar schemes, also known as rent-a-roof schemes, are run by companies eager to cash in on the feed-in tariff. For example, the following companies all currently offer rent-a-roof schemes: Sainsbury's Energy,British Gas, Eon, Homesun, A Shade Greener, Freesource Energy, Isis Solar, Sunshare and more.


Read more: http://www.which.co.uk/environment-a...#ixzz1amThqKbh
Consumer Champions Which?
Under Creative Commons License: Attribution Non-Commercial

Why would the government let these companies cashin on these schemes?

Re: Energy firms' profit margins soar
 

I don't think it's understandable, putting aside the fact people have been hung for profiteering in times non to distant, how thick are the people running these businesses? Being so blatent might increase profits for a year or two but if they'd been a little more subtle they could have got away with it forever, their greed will lead to the regulator killing the golden goose with luck.

Re: Energy firms' profit margins soar
 

I don't think things will change much at all. Next to fuel, gas and electricity must be giving the government the biggest return in taxes, so they are not going to give that up too easily. How on earth did they get away with putting gas up by 18% and nothing said by the government and Ofgen, oh yes, they did play lip service to the rises but that is all. All that was said it that it will cause inflation to rise, the fact there was not a cap put on the increase considering the current climate is unbelievable.

It may be the case that all the politicians hold many shares in the energy business so they want to make as much money as they can while we all suffer.

Re: Energy firms' profit margins soar
 

hit nail on head they propably making a mint which effectively they part of the cartel so wont do nothing while MP's party to the big fiddle this country burns.

The utilities since privatisation just vehicle to make a section of rich more richer on stock market but to hell with who its trampling on small businesses/poor/low paid/sick/elderly increasing going into serious financial difficulty. I think the regulators deliberatly weak as many politition rake it in.

Thats why there demo's the government wont do nothing they part of the corruption of this greed vehicle called capitalism. It worked to degree but they got greedy went too far they not just happy with big profits they want the shirt off your back. Its about time its all now controlled they had the goose its about time they got the fury of the people.

Give people back there money/jobs get government who not frightened take the banks, utilities, industry.

Re: Energy firms' profit margins soar
 

Really - can you back that statement up, or may it be the case you are making it up?

Re: Energy firms' profit margins soar
 

Putting things into perspective, I think the average annual energy bill is around £1350, which makes the net profit nearly 10% (which seems high) when £15 is around 1% which seems ridiculously low. I'd guess that the true number is somewhere in between, but probably quite a bit higher than needed.

Re: Energy firms' profit margins soar
 

Companies with shareholders are ultimately responsible to their shareholders, and thus profits must be "adequate" or the shareholders will sell up and try elsewhere.

Whilst bank depositors receive such minimal returns during this extended period of bank recovery (and then taxed on their returns), shareholders expect much greater returns and are therefore very fickle on whether they stay with a company or leave it like rats off a sinking ship.

So companies of every ilk are desperate to keep their investors happy, and that means increasing profits and dividends, fuelling inflation which devalues their investors' profits, so greater and greater demands are placed on companies to increase income further.

And it's us at the bottom of the pile who pay the price! :mad:

Re: Energy firms' profit margins soar
 

Exactly.:(

Re: Energy firms' profit margins soar
 

I said "Maybe" not that they all had shares, so there is nothing for me to prove. I certainly didn't make it up as it is a possibility, and maybe, it is for other to prove that they have not.

Re: Energy firms' profit margins soar
 

erm, no...

Basic debating 101 - the proposer of a position provides proof of his statement, which can then be debated; it is not for others to disprove the thesis, but to discuss the evidence.

(Maybe you are a invading space alien, who has taken on human form to help your plans to take over our planet - can you prove you have not....)

Re: Energy firms' profit margins soar
 

You called??? ;):D

Re: Energy firms' profit margins soar
 

good for revealing the figures but thats it.

ofgem are toothless, simply making them simplify ripoff prices wont achieve anything.

Re: Energy firms' profit margins soar
 

The story is misleading.
Also.
Which means even an extremely small profit will see the % increase to be large.

Re: Energy firms' profit margins soar
 

We're just a forum Hugh. not a court of law ;)

and he did say maybe (suggestion, a thought, guess) just in 2 words.

Re: Energy firms' profit margins soar
 

Re: Energy firms' profit margins soar
 

both are misleading.

eg. centrica owns british gas and when british gas was losing money centrica was making profits far exceeding british gas losses.

Re: Energy firms' profit margins soar
 

Centrica doesn't just operate in the UK and doesn't just supply retail gas/electricity, so you have to only look at any profits Centrica made in the UK from retail energy supply.

Re: Energy firms' profit margins soar
 

Centrica are a wholesaler not retail.

They can artifically supply it to british gas at high cost so the profits for british gas are artifically low.

Re: Energy firms' profit margins soar
 

I don't care who is profiteering I just want them to stop.

Re: Energy firms' profit margins soar
 

Well Chris Huhne got a bit of a pasting on sky news this morning because all he said was that basically it's our respnsibility to "check ,switch and insulate" .So we have to fork out a shed load money that will take years to get back and spend all our time constantly switching suppliers for no real gain because they are all priced the same anyway ,but at least it will get the government off the hook because they have no power to force the energy companies to do anything anyway

Re: Energy firms' profit margins soar
 

Basically the same as the spokesperson from MSE said a few days ago. Those who are paying the high prices/fuelling the profits are people who do not switch and people on PAYG meters.

Re: Energy firms' profit margins soar
 

Well comparing like for like when they have such complicated tariffs and when they don't even tell customers who ask what their cheaper tariffs are, who can actually make a really informed choice?
:rant:
Good for Ofgen for trying but basically none of the consumer ombudsman have any teeth so we are all basically stuffed whatever service we consider.

Just about the only one that can do anything is Ofsted and that's because they are dealing with the only service that is mainly still in the public domain.:rant:

Re: Energy firms' profit margins soar
 

:clap:

Re: Energy firms' profit margins soar
 

wasnt sure to put here or inflation thread but here goes.

Got bill today.

I am currently paying £60 combined a month for my electric and gas and live on my own in a 1 bed flat, to me thats an extorniote cost for gas and electric. My balance is they only owe me about £100 so the overpayment over the course of the year isnt a lot.

Since its a 6 month bill I can see the effect of the price rise. Its worse on electric.

Electric before 14 sept I was paying 10.94p a unit and after sept 14 its 11.64p a unit. A .7p unit increase thats approx without using a calc about 6-7% increase I think. On top of this the standing charge has gone from 7.2p for a 150 day period to 13.2p for a 35 day period. That looks to be a huge increase. Almost doubling of price. For the 5 month period before the increase the standing charge was £11 so approx £2.20 a month now its nearer £4 a month.

Re: Energy firms' profit margins soar
 

I think you'll find these price hikes are being used to pay for bankers bonuses, how much longer must we put with this????

Re: Energy firms' profit margins soar
 

Until someone brave enough in power is prepared to take on these insidious companies and put the public first for once but then again politicians will think about themselves before they ever get around to helping the consumer.

Re: Energy firms' profit margins soar
 

One thing I've noticed is energy companies now charge an "early termination fee" if you want to switch away to another company to soon.

Wish I lived nearer the cost, then I'd stick up a vertical turbine on the roof and use the power from that.

Re: Energy firms' profit margins soar
 

And what would you do when the wind is too calm or too strong?:rolleyes:

Re: Energy firms' profit margins soar
 

I'm surprised that the energy companies don't try to bring in fixed term contracts like mobile phones and tv subscriptions

Re: Energy firms' profit margins soar
 

I'm sure I'm on 12 month contracts for the discount deals I've got with EDF and British gas.