Is Tivo actually ready for VMs market?
 

Enjoying my Tivo, but more for hardware (1TB & 3 tuner record) than software which promised bug things (that should said 'big things' but maybe i'll leave the typo)

I dont know how big a market the Tivo is used to (currently serving) but:

1/ Lot of what i have experienced seems to be quite dated (pre 2005) - does it even know what a +1 channel is?

2/ V+ has resolved some very very basic issues that Tivo is still totally unaware of - which suggests it's not been exposed to such a large market before

Re: Is Tivo actually ready for VMs market?
 

ive had my TiVo since last friday and have to admit that even with its bugs and issues (most of which ive read and not experienced as of yet) its pretty awesome.
its like nothing else offered by any other pay tv company and its very much the future and im very suprised on how much of an advancement over the V+ box it is.
one thing that is obvious at the moment is that TiVo has been developed for a US market which is apparent with the lack of the red button which the US dont have and and some of the sofware seems very US based, but saying that VM have done a good job to hide the majority of it.

TiVo has a big following in the US but is a generic product over there here VM needed to take that generic product, brand and market it for their company as an exclusive product. its been done well and once the red button is added (both Sky, BBC and other channels) and the other little niggles are ironed out, VM with have an awesome exclusive product that no other company can come close to offering.

after having my TiVo a few days i understand VM TiVo as their future as its unique and nothing else out there in the UK is even close to what it offers.

Re: Is Tivo actually ready for VMs market?
 

How is that relevent to anything? If you want to record something on a +1 channel then set a SL on it. Or set a wishlist which will catch a programme on any channel.

Does V+ record something off a +1 channel if it can? No!

Such as? Yes, the "dropping padding" thing. Nothing else that I can think of though.

Yes, I know he won't answer as he's ignoring me, but that's only because he knows I call him on his "issues" because they're mostly complete rubbish.

Re: Is Tivo actually ready for VMs market?
 

Re: Is Tivo actually ready for VMs market?
 

Nothing but the facts, Hugh. As always :)

Re: Is Tivo actually ready for VMs market?
 

plus 1 channels
 

It is relevant in that I see no reason wht Tivo couldn't be modified so that when it's trying to resolve recording clashes, it could also look at the +1 channels. If it did that, it couldn't hurt and I'm sure would help in some instances.

Whishlist are brilliant for what they do, but for ongoing shows, a series link is better in my view and including +1 channels in conflict searches can only help.

I don't know much anout the US TV broadcasters, but do they have +1 channels? If not, that's maybe why a pretty obvious inclusion of them was ommited from Tivo?

Re: plus 1 channels
 

although I strongly agree with Carl's point on wishlists being much more powerful than series links, I think he's missing the point of how +1 channels should be included as alternatives for the non+1 version of the channel, as it would give TiVo more scope for resolving clashes.

In fact I'd go further and say it's unintuitive not to use the +1 channels as alternatives.

Re: plus 1 channels
 

It seems they don't, or at least not in the way we do.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeshift_channel

Re: Is Tivo actually ready for VMs market?
 

i wont be taking my Tivo back any day soon - i'm sure VM will invest whatever it takes to put it on track - just surprised at a machine with long history/experience in PVR and market it has been selling to (US) to stumble over some basic things i would only expect of new-comer

.

Re: Is Tivo actually ready for VMs market?
 

And this is one thing l have congratulated Virgin on is the superb tivo box they have released.

Re: Is Tivo actually ready for VMs market?
 

That's what happens when you take a product based on the demand for the US Market and try to package it for another country. Instead of being suprised at the small niggles that will be fixed in time be more wowed at how great the product is out of the box and think of the potential that TiVo on VM has.

Most of us can tell even at this early stage VM TiVo is going to be massive and a unique product offering that nobody out there can come close to.

Re: Is Tivo actually ready for VMs market?
 

I agree as a non TIVO user I would consider taking one in the future especially if more HD channels can be added as well , content is the only thing that took me to Sky for my main TV service.

Re: Is Tivo actually ready for VMs market?
 

The dark side of the Lord is losing his grip on you.

Re: plus 1 channels
 

Windows Media Centre does this wonderfully. If there are clashes then it will look across all channels to find another showing that it will then schedule to record. If it cannot find another showing within the the current guide data (it has a fortnights worth) then it remembers what show(s) it cannot record and if they are repeated in the future then they get scheduled to record.

Re: plus 1 channels
 

Now, that's good. Tivo should do that.

Re: plus 1 channels
 

Now don't get me wrong I love my TiVo but I wish VM went with Windows Media Centre Embedded... :(

Re: Is Tivo actually ready for VMs market?
 

I don't think that TIVO is ready for the general VM customer, there are too many issues at the moment

Its OK for us techie types who visit the forum and get responses from VM people and work arounds

It depends on how quickly VM can update the software and remove the problems

Quicker updates to resolve bugs one at a time might be better than waiting ages for a huge update and giving the impression that nothings being done about the problems

Re: Is Tivo actually ready for VMs market?
 

l think it is ready and as with any new box there will also be litle bugs and issues.

Re: Is Tivo actually ready for VMs market?
 

If anyone else in my family took TiVo, they would have struggled and possibly given it back. Only by ploughing the forums and nagging VM staff over at VM support forum did I get workarounds or indication of upcoming fixes. Rest of family would never go to Internet for advice on STB.

Can't see my other relatives working it out either. Its easy to say "create a wishlist with optional keywords", "change series link priorities", "check recording hiccups and upcoming shows to resolve conflicts", but not everyone will find that easy to deal with or even get in the right headspace to tackle the problems.

I'm liking TiVo more and more and glad I didn't send it back, but it's not yet a noddy STB.

Re: Is Tivo actually ready for VMs market?
 

Glad you are gradually getting used to it, you just have to persevere.

Re: Is Tivo actually ready for VMs market?
 

You would be a very good advocate to show them how to use the box:D:D

As I have said above:D

Why would you not like to go back to the V+:D:D:D:D

Re: Is Tivo actually ready for VMs market?
 

New Tivo might be leaps and bounds ahead of V+, might even be the best 'cable' PVR for long time & i am looking forward to it - but there's plenty comes more than close - in fact only couple posts down:

Would it still be Tivo if it's got WMC engine in it?

Re: Is Tivo actually ready for VMs market?
 

And is Windows Media Centre better then when I last used it with XP Media Centre Edition? I bought the MCE remote, a big hard-drive for films, installed My Movies, but the reality never lived up to my expectations (and it seemed to crash a lot).

I wouldn't swap TiVo for MCE (although MCE might have improved since I last used it). Also one of TiVo's features I like the most - suggestions - seems to be unique to TiVo. I love the fact that I don't have to set up lots of recordings, just teach it my likes/dislikes and it'll record plenty of programs to watch, without too much effort on my part. It's strange that more set-top boxes haven't copied this feature :confused:

Re: Is Tivo actually ready for VMs market?
 

Patents .

Re: Is Tivo actually ready for VMs market?
 

Ah, that explains it :) :tu: . And I can see now that if you had such a great feature, that made your set-top box unique, then you would strongly patent it. Makes me glad this tech has found its way to the UK via Virgin.

Re: Is Tivo actually ready for VMs market?
 

I don't think it was ever intended to be a "noddy" STB, In principle the Thumb function should be simple, but inevitably it is complex platform now if Apple did the user interface.....................;)

Re: Is Tivo actually ready for VMs market?
 

No it would be a WMC box.

You do realise the MCE XP is 10 years old right?

Re: Is Tivo actually ready for VMs market?
 

If Apple did the interface, you would only be able to watch what Apple approves of and any recordings would have to obtained by the iTunes store :D

Re: Is Tivo actually ready for VMs market?
 

And flash wouldnt work :D

Re: Is Tivo actually ready for VMs market?
 

I spent last year using 7MCE with 2 Xbox extenders and Sky HD as my primary TV source. The guide was brilliant, the UI was goregous (and is still missed) but the reliability was 'complete arse'. If VM had gone to the new MCE embedded I think we would have had a 'better fit' than TiVO. Lets face it, the majority of customers will be somewhat nonplussed with the recommendations system. Embedded MCE would have given them a red-button framwork, a streaming framework, Silverlight & Flash compatibility and a sexy sexy guide. But probably not the help with the integration that TiVO have given, so greater cost to VM. Plus, MCE embedded was only announced this Jan. Tivo was already in the homes of triallists by then.

Re: Is Tivo actually ready for VMs market?
 

Yep all true but like you say "xbox extender" and "gorgeous UI". Also I'm guessing embedded would bring the reliability. TiVo is a better fit but I do wish it had the MCE UI.

Re: Is Tivo actually ready for VMs market?
 

Come to think of it, it must have been 6-7 years ago when I tried XP MCE - just before Vista came out - has it been that long :( One of the problems I had was the slow boot time, compared to other AV devices. Maybe with an SSD boot drive, in a special media PC enclosure, with the latest MCE... no, not again - I'll wait for MCE embedded :)

Re: Is Tivo actually ready for VMs market?
 

TBH, with modern powersaving and sleep, you just have the machine resume on demand. I'd quite happily go back to MCE but only for free TV. In my opinion, the problems I experienced were caused by the software kuldges I had to use to get pay TV in there, and load in 3rd party guide data.

Re: Is Tivo actually ready for VMs market?
 

No thank you to WMC. I am a windows man through and through but WMC on Win7 is still slow, buggy and horrid to navigate. WMC on the 360 is even worse, far too slow compared to browsing files natively.

Tivo is as complicated as you want to make it. V+ really is a dumb box, it could record and you could set a series link. And that is it! It was just a glorified video recorder. You can still record with relative ease and set series links on Tivo. So it is still very consumer friendly.

But if you want to use the more advanced features then they are there. Plus the interface just looks beautiful and my Mrs seems to have no problem using it, in fact i have a hard time getting her off her dramas on youtube.

Re: Is Tivo actually ready for VMs market?
 

Not if you want the start and end of your programme to be recorded correctly especially on the BBC channels at the moment with no default padding available

I just love the look switching between hi res and low res screens as you go through the options, plus losing the video window as you manually add padding to a planned recording

Re: Is Tivo actually ready for VMs market?
 

How is the BBC not running as advertised Tivos fault? Asking a few questions after you set a recording is a good thing so you can set up everything in one go.

Re: Is Tivo actually ready for VMs market?
 

But the Sky box which is older tech does this for you , without setting any padding. Setting padding isn't a biggie however you'd have thought this could be automated like Sky and many freeview boxes with a dynamic epg.

Re: Is Tivo actually ready for VMs market?
 

BBC is running spot on time yet TIVO appears to miss the first 30 - 60 seconds because there is no default padding on the start as it appears that TIVO is expecting ads on the front of every programme.

Re: Is Tivo actually ready for VMs market?
 

The difference being that each broadcaster is responsible for it's own EPG listings and, as I understand it, can be heavily fined if it is wrong.

It's not directly to do with Sky themselves.

Whereas the Tivo EPG is not under VM's direct control and is not dynamic.

Re: Is Tivo actually ready for VMs market?
 

Very Very true:D:D:D:D

Glad you are back Carl and i said that you would be OK:D:D:D:D

Re: Is Tivo actually ready for VMs market?
 

Nice to hear from good old Carl again.;)

Re: Is Tivo actually ready for VMs market?
 

Less of the "old" please. I'm only 40-something :p: On second thoughts.... :D

Re: Is Tivo actually ready for VMs market?
 

Just because there is no default padding doean you can't add it.

With a series link you only have to add it once. On single shows, you have to add it each time, but it takes seconds.

I'm not saying there shouldn't be the option of default padding, there should, but to say you're having problems with missing the begining and end of shows because you can't be bothered to add padding seems a little OTT.

Personally, I think the way Tivo handles padding is flawed and I don't use it. Hopefully, they'll make it act like the V+ and then I'll go back to using it, but there still needs to be a default padding option for those that do.

Re: Is Tivo actually ready for VMs market?
 

I'd hope that with default padding that anything you record remotely from the website would be padded as at the moment there is no option to set padding while remote recording from the pub

Re: Is Tivo actually ready for VMs market?
 

Sorry Carl but at least you are not as old as me.:D;):D

Re: Is Tivo actually ready for VMs market?
 

I was going to say "who is" but that's just not nice :p:

Re: Is Tivo actually ready for VMs market?
 

Thats alright as l was born to take insults.:D:D:D

Re: Is Tivo actually ready for VMs market?
 

A match made in heaven then, as I was born to make them :LOL::PP::jk::sorry:

Re: Is Tivo actually ready for VMs market?
 

Perhaps Rupert Murdoch should enroy you as his right hand man.:D:p::D

Re: Is Tivo actually ready for VMs market?
 

Trouble with putting MS anything in is when you want to (eventually) link non-MS PC's in.

MS have a habit of locking things down so only MS will work and not everyone uses MS.

Re: Is Tivo actually ready for VMs market?
 

I have a Windows Media Server sitting in the corner and you would be surprised how well it works with my MacBook Pro, even supports Time Machine. The problem with it is it doesn't run WMC.