TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

Well London's bracing itself for yet more protests tomorrow about the stark realities we all face. I've heard spokesmen and commentators speculating about how many people will show up but it'll be interesting to see just how much support there is and how that manifests itself. Let's hope it stays peaceful!

I've heard Ed Milliband is going to be speaking at the event. If so, I wonder if he'll prelude what are bound to be scathing comments regarding current economic policy with an apology for the role he and his party played in getting us to this point.... :rolleyes:

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

Sky News, drinks and snacks please.
It should be interesting to see how it all goes tomorrow. Its been reported that all public transportation into London is fully booked for the event, including over a thousand coaches and a dozen or so trains. Supposedly its expected to be the biggest UK demo since the anti-war march prior to the Iraq invasion.

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

Plus a few thousand Scotland fans are heading down for the Scotland vs Arsenal game on Sunday.

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

A day of action on a Saturday?

Why not midweek?:confused:

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

I wonder if darker forces within HMG have considered just 'engineering' a couple of major traffic incidents on the M1, M25 etc. and a security alert at one or two of London's rail termini. That'd put a major dampener on the protesters' progress... :)

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

I bet the turnout isn't that great, with the England Euro qualifier being at 3pm :D

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

I have a friend how runs a company union and a big England support, and he will be at the demo.

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

A thought while those of you who will be there are marching:

http://www.economist.com/blogs/bageh.../ed_miliband_0

I'll be joining the silent majority getting on with life, in my case working to earn the money that so many seem to think they're entitled to.

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

Yup - I'm increasingly getting fed up listening to union leaders and the like giving the impression that this is what 'the ordinary people' want and their members shouldn't be paying for the mistakes of others blah, blah, blah.... Well, one way or another, we're all going to have to pay for a over a decade of governmental and personal excess on a massive scale and they need to get real.

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

Good old Grauniad - no bias in the composition of the link name.....:D

Subject of article - Anti-cuts march: police prepare for violent minority
url - anti-cuts march police violence

Subliminal, or what?;)

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

I'm sure it's what a good part of their members who stand to lose pay, conditions or even their jobs as a result of cuts want however both the ICM poll and a recent You Gov poll indicate that the majority either believe the cuts are of an appropriate pace or aren't deep enough.

Either way it's absolutely their right to protest, here's hoping the 'professional protesters' that the campaign has bragged about recruiting from such lovely protests as the previous G7 don't totally undermine their cause and blow away what public support they do have through violence and occupation.

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

Its a day when the public workers are standing up for there rights, and not being kicked in the guts by a government over cuts.

ALL the cuts means that each one us will suffer, through cuts.

I am a union man, this is what is wrong in this country companies walk over employee's and forget that we have rights, we have to support our families, but this government is preventing us from having a decent life.

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

Arthur, I work in a University, and I have not had a pay rise in three years (I am senior management, and we gave up our pay rises, but our colleagues have had pay rises in line with inflation)

Our income is fixed (reducing year on year, actually), so if we gave bigger pay rises, we would have to let some our of staff go, to pay for those pay rises - is that what is you want?

Money, no matter what you may believe, does not grow on trees. Do you, personally, spend more money than you earn? If not, why do you think it is alright for a country to do so? If you do, how do you intend to pay your debts off?

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

:zzz:

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

I'm struggling to see where the government is preventing people from having a decent life by not giving them money. You made your decisions in life, this government prevents you from doing nothing by not 'looking after you'. It's not an entitlement.

Yes you have rights, no-one is disputing that, yes you have to support your family. You, not me or any other tax payer. That's exactly the point, I go to work to support my family not yours or anyone else's.

The money comes from somewhere, it doesn't fall off trees. Try seeing it from the point of view of people who work until May each calendar year just to pay their bleeping income tax bill.

---------- Post added at 21:47 ---------- Previous post was at 21:45 ----------

They didn't do badly there Hugh, my last 2 pay rises were both below inflation which is fairly average I think for the private sector.

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

There are millions unemployed to be being made redundant by cuts, most of my mates are now unemployed due to this problem.

A neighbour down the road was told that he was being made redundant as his company could no longer afford to operate in this country due to costs that he has to pay, his company is now moving to Holland, five of his mates were laid off also, and they were the drivers.

The government cust are digging into every service going, and now they are digging into the armed forces, this march is to show that they are not prepared to have these cuts, as they will get worse, Clegg is a liar, and Cameron couldn't organise a childrens party, without deciding who to cut out.

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

Arthur, please tell me, where should the money come from to pay for the services you want to keep and not cut? Can you at least answer that?

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And why are we having these cuts?

Oh, yes - the massive debts accumulated by the previous government, spending money they didn't have.

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

I hope you're not holding your breath.... :D

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I find it hard to believe most of your mates worked for the state or in jobs dependent on the state, and I find it hard to believe they are already redundant when there's a very long way to go here.

Good advertisement for cuts, thanks. Cuts mean lower taxes are an option, lower taxes mean lower costs for businesses so they keep their business in the UK - spot on!

Yes, I hate to point it out to you but the government isn't the entire economy. As far as many businesses go taxes and bureaucracy just get in the way and their reliance on the state is minimal.

Prepared or not they're getting them because the rest of us aren't prepared to pay a quarter more tax to keep them in jobs and the money markets aren't prepared to allow us to borrow like there's no tomorrow.

If you want to see what happens when economies ignore deficits go and see Portugal.

I have to wonder if your opinion, or most of those marching, would be different if they were in my position - paying more in income tax than your entire gross income, receiving virtually nothing from central government as even my own council virtually pays for themselves with their council tax revenue.

Of course they would.

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

No, no, no. FGS! It's nothing to do with that lot. It's all down to Thatcher's greed and those pathologically evil ConDems trying to grind the working man's nose into the dust.... :rolleyes:

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

No, but I'm going to make a cup of tea, bring in some wood for the stove, go round and lock the doors ... Maybe then I'll root around the cupboard and see if I can find a biscuit or two.

Who knows, maybe Arthur might have solved the debt crisis by then. :erm:

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

This one?

http://www.statistics.gov.uk/images/charts/206.gif

That of course doesn't come close to showing all the debts obviously. No interventions, PFI, unfunded liabilities, whatever else was stashed through creative accounting. ONS figures are more informative.

http://www.statistics.gov.uk/article...lic-sector.pdf

http://www.hm-treasury.gov.uk/d/psf.pdf

Yep, they were happily ramping the debt up since 2003. This with the .com boom and dividends from 3G licences around 2000, and before that the Tory spending commitments which helped with reducing the country's debt before hand. Planks.

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

well if you are paying that much tax either your accountant is crap or you are earning enough not to have worry about paying menial bills like gas, electric, council tax ,fuel ,like the rest of us lower class :rolleyes:

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

:D

I have to admit it really boggles my mind... the amount of people in this country living off the public sector (us) is quite staggering.
All you hear is moan,moan,moan about cuts this and cuts that... well guess what?

SOMEBODY HAS TO PAY FOR ALL THAT CARP!!

Do we think money grows on trees or the gov can continue printing money ad infinitum?:rolleyes:
Also,I don't understand why people want the government in their lives so much??:confused:
I'd rather have a society where people look after themselves and each other,and run their own lives... people almost want to be dependent!:td:

Well,I don't so I fully support the cuts... in fact,they go nowhere deep enough,seeing that people who haven't done a days work for a long time can still afford their 9 am beer...:erm:

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

Yay class warfare.

I don't have an accountant I'm afraid, I'm salaried. I'm in that rather large group in between the extremely rich people and the not so well off, the skilled, salaried worker who is entirely middle class, neither affluent nor poor.

I neither look up to those who are rich nor do I look down on those who have less money than I do. I would love to know why it's such a crime to do well that it merits the sarcasm.

Also be good to know why it's fine for me to pay more and more tax. It's my money, not the state's. Why should I spend my own time and money studying, improving myself, my own blood pressure working a damn stressful job and occasionally ridiculously long hours to hand all that money over so that I'm not better off than the 'lower classes' (your words)?

Is having some small measure of success such a crime that it must be punished with punitive taxation? What a great way to remove any incentive to try and excel, what a completely soulless, homogenous concept :(

I work for me and mine, it's not a part of the social contract that I spent my time and money on my career so that I could subsidise people who couldn't be bothered with school or arsed to go to college and learn new skills or are happy cruising between unskilled jobs while complaining about how little they are paid.

Happy to pay the tax for people to go to college, overjoyed to improve social mobility, absolutely resent paying taxes purely for wealth redistribution.

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

Although i don't agree with Arthurs continued waffling about the present government and refusal to admit that most of the fault lays with the previous Labour government (which incidentally answers the question your struggling with in post 16) i can sort of see where he is coming from .We have no real policy to increase this countries earning potential ,we are not encouraging companies to grow or come to this country ,indeed as arthur says companies are leaving this country so where exactly will the new jobs come from to replace the ones lost if new companies don't start up or the old ones move back post recession ,we have a growing population and receding job potential for that population

answers on a plain postcard addressed to the government,downing street , uk

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

Well, the corporation tax-cut is a good start... of course,having a flat income tax would also help.

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

I take it you missed when the Chancellor stood up for an hour and announced a corporation tax cut, enterprise zones and various other measures?

If it makes you happy we've 800,000 people retiring next year, should free up a few jobs.

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

Tell you what,I'll chip in a tenner for the bouquet...:(

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:rofl:

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

in the public sector? :p:

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Haha.

Across all of them dude. Post-war baby boomers, first cohort hitting 65.

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

I assume that is gallow humor?? :D

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Lets put it this way, this government is making millions out of money that they are getting in VAT, Taxes they we pay in fuels hikes, in this country, we pay MORE taxes than any other country.

They say they will supply training to get the unemployed back to work, 1) what training, l have been on there training scheme, and it is crap, l spent two weeks, leatring how to write to companies for work, how to write a cv, how to cold call companies, how to speak on the phone for interviews. 2) What work, all up and down the country there are people looking for work - what work, by the time a job is advertised - its gone, when you call. You ask the job centres for a grant to get to interviews and use the phone, they say - ask friends or neighbours.

Companies are leaving this country, as it it too expensive, prices are going up - but not the wages.

Go to a job centre, most of the adverts are from agencies - who make the money in getting you work on a daily basis.

The last time we had a major rally in London, it was over the poll tax and that was under a Tory government - who is running the country now, yes the Tories.

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

yeah,just kidding.... although we could probably make do with about a million or so less in the public sector... it's shocking,really.
A German government(!!) commission published a report a few years back saying they could do with about Two million (!!) public servants and about a quarter of all laws and regulations less!! Imagine the money that gets burned every day... :spin::spin::spin:

---------- Post added at 22:57 ---------- Previous post was at 22:53 ----------

Well,I don't know Arthur,TBH I have job offers galore at the mo... I even have to refuse stuff!!:shocked:
There's plenty of work out there,and a positive,can-do mindset is a good start,imo. (although I quietly suspect you don't really care for that)

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

Oh really? I think you'll find other countries pay far more in taxes. Thats why they tend to have more comprehensive social care programs as the citizens are paying far more in comparison to the UK.

Erm I take it you missed the protest against the Iraq war. That was pretty major, then there was the hunting demos, police protest march etc. etc.

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

nope i didn't miss it ,and granted it is a step in the right direction and will help but will it atract companies here to replace the closed ones or the ones that have moved abroard

out of those 800,000 retirees how many of the jobs will be replaced ,how many of them will be self sufficient ,living without state aid

---------- Post added at 23:25 ---------- Previous post was at 23:23 ----------


yes but weren't they protests against a labour governments plans ? :)

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

Most would be replaced I'd have thought. As far as being self-sufficient goes that's rather the point. The UK Uncut crew seem to consider self-sufficiency a swear word.

---------- Post added at 08:30 ---------- Previous post was at 08:26 ----------

Off we go.

Not really although taxes are very high. The money to 'look after' you along with all the union men marching today has to come from somewhere after all and however besmirched they may feel it's not the 'working man' that pays the bills.

This I've no experience of.

This of course makes no sense. If the wages aren't going up then the costs of doing business are being held down by this. Deflation of wages is how Germany and other places became so internationally competitive. It's precisely those wages not going up that will price Britain back in.

You totally confuse the costs of doing business with the costs of living. They are far from one and the same although they share some common features. For most companies the largest cost is staff. Businesses don't suddenly become more profitable and drop their costs right down by paying a shedload more money to 'the workers'. Quite the opposite.

No idea but wouldn't surprise, agencies advertise all over.

No comment required.

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

Everyone is working in the week.

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

I may be wrong but I think we're still waiting for "arthurmoneygrowsontrees@cloudcuckooland.net" to tell us where the money for his 'Utopia' is going to come from. Now there's a surprise..... :rolleyes:

---------- Post added at 09:12 ---------- Previous post was at 09:09 ----------

What about all the millions of unemployed and retired. If you believe what the union leaders tell us you'd have thought they'd all be out there protesting.

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

But the people that work want to protest too?

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

Well they can take a day off can't they or are they all slaves working 24/7? I mean it's obviously such a good and important cause, far more important than a cough, dentists appointment or a hangover I'd have thought. Tell you what though, having the protest today is unfair to all those peeps who work at weekends so I suggest that all protests be made public holidays so as many people as possible can attend. :rolleyes:

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

No. just stick with the weekend.

You're right. having the protest on a weekday would be less of an inconvenience to those that work weekdays, and of course weekends.

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

OK matey, obviously people who work weekends don't matter. Or perhaps we could have a weekday protest for them.... :erm:

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

LOL

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

Having the protest at a weekend is unfair to all of those who wanted to go to London to shop, see a show, visit a museam, indeed anything that they want to do with thei leisure time and yet will now be disrupted.

It is a simple fact, for many years governments and local authorities have been spending significantly more than can reasonably afforded. There are no blank cheques in the world economy. Why do some people seem to believe that there are limitless funds? If you personally have financial limits on how much you can put on credit cards, mortgages and other debt, then why does the same not apply to government? The books have to balance

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

Well perhaps they could move the protest to somewhere with a bit more room like Greenland or somewhere like that. HMG could just print some more money and pay everyone's fares...... :)

Last night I was listening to a union leader (FBU?) banging on about how union members ought to be protected from all of this. The debt and other economic problems could be sorted out by taxing big companies and the rich more. Whilst he acknowledged the much worse working conditions and wages in India, China etc. he didn't seem to accept that it's these factors which make them so competitive and that unless we do something drastic we're going to lose more and more jobs to countries like these. The very people and companies he wants to tax more will just leave the UK and their taxes lost in their entirety. His view seemed to be that people like his members have a divine right to be insulated from life's harsh realties just because they're decent people, work hard and do a good job. I dare say people like him get elected because they say what their members want to hear as opposed to the stark economic reality which faces us all whether public or private sector workers.

Anyway, we're off to the smoke on official business shortly so will report back on what we see. If I don't make it back, it's been nice knowing you all.... (well, most of you anyway ;) )

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

Shame children can't protest given they're the ones who'll be picking up the bills for our reluctance to pay our way.

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

Perhaps that's why the TUC is billing this as a family event. They like to appear to care about children but don't appear to feel a legacy of massive debt or economic meltdown is something our kids ought to be too concerned about.

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

You make it sound like this is going to go on forever. or at least till Labour get back in and make it alright again :)

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

Oh yes, please, please, please bring back Gordon so he can save the world again... :rofl:

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

Give it time, and I don't think anyone will care if it was Gordon.

Gordon! Gordon! it'll be bigger than the royal wedding probably :)

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

Gordon's alive!

http://www.denofgeek.com/siteimage/s.../600/27587.png

---------- Post added at 11:00 ---------- Previous post was at 10:32 ----------

Here's a nice thought anyway, this could be us if we listen to the protesters and do as they wish.

http://www.openeurope.org.uk/researc...estructure.pdf

---------- Post added at 11:10 ---------- Previous post was at 11:00 ----------

This also echoes my thoughts

The Selfish Left.

---------- Post added at 11:16 ---------- Previous post was at 11:10 ----------

Me too actually. Get contacted at least a couple of times a month.

---------- Post added at 11:19 ---------- Previous post was at 11:16 ----------

For those interested there is a 'March For The Alternative' iPhone app. Don't worry, for those impoverished peeps who can only afford an iPhone 3GS it works on that one too.

There's some irony there in pretty much the most expensive smartphone having an app for this somewhere.

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

They'll be too busy being sent up chimneys and down mines by the evil Tories.

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They're the real tragedy about all this Derek to be honest. They're the only group I really feel for here, they have the right to be given the best education we can possibly provide for them and we've ****ed away the money to educate them, wasted what was there, and left them an inheritance of debt and tuition fees. :(

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

Yep, that pretty much sums up my feelings on this too. :tu:

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

Off we go - kicking off in Oxford Street.

---------- Post added at 13:58 ---------- Previous post was at 13:57 ----------

On the upside it got Milliband farting through his teeth off the screen.

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

He's a bit of a kno.. div isn't he.

using Martin Luther King too.

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

really looked like they were protesting - "i just found this crowbar laying around officer, wasn't going to use it................honest".



the police are damned if they do and damned if they don't.

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

Best time to cause a maximum impact I would have thought.Very kind of them to give the poor commuters a kind thought in that case.;)

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

lets hope that is the case ,but companies needing to lose staff will obviously rather use people retiring and rightly so imo

my point about being self sufficient was directed at the 800,000 retiring .How many of those will have adequate pensions ,or any pension at all so they aren't getting benefits ?.What worries me if people are retiring and taking benefit because of a lack of pension funds then that puts a increased strain on tax revenue which would be falling because less people are working and fewer companies are paying tax to the treasury because they have either gone out of business or moved abroad (i hope i am making sense here :)).It would be possible to fall into a cycle of paying more tax revenue to welfare whilst recieving less tax revenue wouldn't it ? which obviously is the point of cutting the welfare bill ,but wouldn't that be pointless if new jobs are not being created to pay tax back into the system at a higher ratio than money paid out

apologies if my ramblings don't make much sense but i know what i mean :dunce:

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

Gordon Brown wanted everyone to rely on welfare during their retirement, that's why he plundered 12 figures from people's pensions.

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

so that means the pension black hole will compound the problem of a downward spiral of less tax revenue and more going out in welfare unless more tax revenue is raised ?

What we need are real jobs created that will contribute a meaningful amount of tax without being subsidised by welfare payments because of low wages

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

Quite. And by 'real jobs' we can immediately discount the public sector, which has to be paid for out of taxation and therefore isn't really contributing meaningful tax at all.

You know, I have the strangest feeling that a good number of today's marchers were public sector workers.

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

Chris,from the reports I read online I'd wager your feeling to be a certainty...

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

as do i ,it seems quite obvious now(if it wasn't before) that the last government used recruitment into the civil service as a way of keeping unemployment numbers down by creating non-jobs in Whitehall and the the town halls now the cuts have to be made the true numbers of created non jobs will become apparent .Now we will be in a position where the tax payer having funded wages for these jobs will now have to fund redundancy payments and benefit payments for the people losing their jobs .
Top priority must be to get new companies up and running ,encourage companies to move here and rebuild a manufacturing base in this country .What we don't want ,after giving the subject much thought and taking the opinions of more knowledgeable posters than i into consideration ,is the unions trying force the government into keeping the non-jobs and being an unnecessary burden on the tax bill .Yes it is a shame for those losing their jobs ,and i am suffering as well ,but if this action (the cuts in progress at the moment) is halted then the downward spiral of less tax revenue and more welfare will get to a stage where it won't be possible to undo it without going the way of Ireland and Portugal

that is the honest opinion of a manual self employed worker who is suffering from the cuts but thinks the nasty tasting medicine will be better for him in the long run

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

It's absolutely ridiculous, I agree, and one of the most annoying things about today's march is the "me too!" politics of Labour, which has been hanging on the coat tails of today's march despite knowing that what the TUC really wants is for the country to keep borrowing and spending its way out of trouble. The loony left's anti-cuts manifesto is one that even Labour at its most profligate knows it cannot possibly sign up to.

On the subject of getting people onto the State payroll, yes, this is something Gordon Brown was sadly very good at. The other thing he was very good at was getting the middle classes hooked on benefits in the form of tax credits, all safe and fluffy and administered almost (but not quite) as if it were a tax refund, just to make sure we all went for it without feeling as if we were having to deal with the dole office.

Hence we now have many thousands of public sector workers who have just found out that Labour's profligacy has serious consequences but who are prepared to shoot the messenger rather than direct their ire at the muppets who actually caused the mess, who were marching along with them this afternoon, and many thousands of middle class Grauniad readers who are seriously hacked off about having to give up their annual gîte holiday because the decimation of their tax credits means they can't afford the flights any more.

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

I was watching a bit earlier and saw Ed Balls asked outright what the alternative they were crowing about was.

When it became clear he didn't have an answer other than moaning about the current plans he made a swift exit.

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

on the subject of the march itself i notice that the usual anarchical brigade have shown their prescence in the name of anti-capitalism ,do they not realise that it was anti capitalist ideas that got us in this mess in the first place

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

I wouldn't call light-touch regulation in the banking sector anti-capitalist.

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

i take your point but thats how confusing blair/brown where to me anyway ;)

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

I'm not sure I understand?

The reality is that lots of countries have to go through drastic cuts brought about by an international wanking crisis. Our situation may be worse than for others, but to claim that the previous government is singularly to blame for it is just madness.

The more I think about it, the more I hate this wretched two-party system that is geared towards blaming the other party for electoral gain rather than thinking about what's good for the country.

Edit: Oh. The W-word survived to swear filter. Nice.. :tu: :)

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

i agree with your comment on the 2 party system but how do change that without losing a lot of democratic values ,aren't most governments based on a 2 or more party sytem ?

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

I'm definitely not advocating a one party system. Multi-party coalition governments have my preference. It's pretty much the norm on the continent, and leaving Italy aside, it works well generally. There's very little of the partisanism and seewaw politics that's the norm for the UK. You definitely don't get people blaming one party over what happened 30 or 40 years ago.

UK politics seem entrenched to me, and it's neither healthy or helpful.

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

Ask yourself this.. Which government responsible for most of those taxes? The one that's been in power for 10 months or the one that was in power for 12 years before it?

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

Why is it that everyone is blaming Brown and Blair, what has happened since the coalition came in is some very violent rallies by students over students fee, then today we have a TUC march, which has also led to violence on the streets of London.

Isn't this telling people something that, it is about time something was done, l don't like to see the riots that we have had on the London streets and what has happened today is only a tip of what can happen during the reign of this coalition.

It was stated regarding the riots at Fortnum and Mason's was caused by the millions of pounds of tax that is NOT paid by the management.

Where were Cameron and Clegg tonight, they should have been on Tv condeming this, but they were probably at home entertaining there rich friends and let the old bill look after the aggro, tomorrow they will be on TV talking out of there hat about it. :(

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

that's what i blame for the mess we are in ,which may answer your query on my earlier comment about being confused over blair/brown ,i found their policies hard to differ from earlier conservative policies while at the same time berating the conservatives for their policies
Maybe the present coalition will herald a new type of politics in this country

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

Well done to all who marched today.

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

Arthur you have a very short memory.

It was those 2 idiots that created the mess we are in. One of those idiots got us into a war that has cost us MILLIONS and he did it on a lie. Those MILLIONS could have been spent of schools, Hospitals and lazy gits that will not work because that can get benefits instead.

The present government will now have to clear up that mess. You seem to suffer a lot of selective memory when you go off on one of your fact-less rants. You have been asked on many occasions what you would do to fix the problems but ALL you ever say is stop the government. After watching Ed Balls give a interview on the telly today i think you and him are the same bloody person. He had no clue, No answer and could only rant, Does that ring a bell by any chance

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

Sounds like Gideon to me.

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

Ed Balls has no policies, he's purely a political attack dog. It's part of the turn off for Labour right now actually, they don't appear to have any policies they have become the party of 'no', pointing out the government's mistakes while offering no idea what they would do instead.

---------- Post added at 08:08 ---------- Previous post was at 08:07 ----------

I semi-echo this. Well done to all those who marched and exercised their right to peaceful protest. I may disagree with the reason for marching but I applaud the exercise of the right to do so.

---------- Post added at 08:13 ---------- Previous post was at 08:08 ----------

Looking at the comments at http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/haveyours...ch_achiev.html along with the opinion polls supporting austerity I'm not entirely convinced that Milliband's assertion that the TUC march was speaking for the mainstream majority was correct.

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

So yet again the TAX payer is going to have to pay to clean up the mess after a bunch of idiots run riot in London.

The unions will be over the moon with what happened because it gets them front page coverage and they will BLAME the Government.

The anti police groups will love it because they can pervert what happened and blame the police.

I did not see anyone yesterday blaming LABOUR for what is happening considering there 10 years of financial mismanagement has created the reasons for the CUTS.

The only people to suffer from this are the TAX payers who will have to foot the bill because the Unions don't like the Government and will organise even more of these riots. I wonder how many more shops and buildings will be smashed and looted during there next riot

Miliband and Balls seem to think we can continue spending money that we don't have. The unions seem to think that Miliband and Balls will mysteriously create money to spend. If Labour had not been ousted can you imagine how much more we would owe. But hey don't worry because between Arthur, Labour and the unions have the answer its called SPEND SPEND SPEND. :)

To quote a user on the BBC news site

Why should they some of them had a grand days rioting

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

:clap: :clap:

"arthurmoneygrowsontrees@cloudcuckooland.net" clearly has rose tinted brain cells and a pathalogical inability to grasp basic facts.

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

Just think of it as a head of state visit. costs to enforce the census, or a bomb dropped in Libya. and it won't seem so bad.

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

Well done to all those who marched who didn't behave like violent morons.

The thugs who caused trouble use any opportunity to create mayhem and frankly don't deserve the freedom to protest. They are a total disgrace!

Given the way these splinter groups are now openly operating and the contempt with which they view the law and public safety, I feel the police need to review their tactics. Yesterday, as on previous occasions, numerous illegal acts were being carried out right in front of the police and nothing was being done. I appreciate their aim is not to exacerbate the violence but I tend to think turning a blind eye in this way gives encouragement to those engaged in, what starts as, minor illegality to up the ante. I'm not referring to to hard core of anarchists here but rather those who're drawn in to this sort of thing, sometimes quite naively, who're probably the majority.

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

What about the thousands of bombs dropped in Iraq and Afghanistan because we listened to a lying scheming git and his party. I wonder how much that has cost the tax payer. ???

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

Both of them !!!!! we are heading back to the last Tory goverment, as well.

High unemployment/ bank rate/ mortgage, but big money men/banks as usual are well off........:mad:

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

There you go then. just loose change :)

---------- Post added at 09:47 ---------- Previous post was at 09:45 ----------

And that is what the general public are seeing. they don't care about the ins and outs of it all. they just see it for what it is.

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

The headlines earlier were "Peaceful protest hijacked by anarchists".
I don't recall "Student protest hijacked by anarchists". Though it's known the anarchists were there during that demo, probably the same vandals we saw yesterday.

I'm just a bit relieved the headlines weren't "Peaceful protest hijacked by students."

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

Unemployment goes up in recessions, that's life.

Bank and mortgage rates being too low for too long caused a lot of the problems to begin with.

Welcome to the real world, where governments can't indefinitely spend money they don't have trying to convince you the world is perfect, keep employment down by employing everyone themselves, and run monetary policy for political reasons rather than economic ones with no regard at all for the consequences.

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

The simple fact is the budget is in deficit even with these cuts. You can't run anythere where your losing money every year, it's not sustainable. It's depressing enough that we won't even begin to reduce the deficit until 2014...

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

Nah - it was Anthony and James.....

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

Yep, per my previous comments this is a 1% per year cut in real terms.

In cash terms spending will continue to go up.

Public spending will be at the same levels as 2007/2008. In other words this is a winding back of the growth of public sector since the banking crisis started to take hold.

Although if you believe the unions these are savage, vicious cuts that will turn Britain into a desolate war zone where feral tribes roam filthy, littered streets full of burned out cars.

The one really big thing to note about these cuts, the biggest thing about them, is the rhetoric.

That and how much those who can't vote, kids, are getting shafted to keep pensioners and baby boomers, who can and do tend to vote in larger proportions than any other group, on side.

---------- Post added at 12:33 ---------- Previous post was at 12:11 ----------

http://image.spreadshirt.com/image-s...rts_design.png

---------- Post added at 12:35 ---------- Previous post was at 12:33 ----------

As far as the occupation of Fortnum and Mason goes, transparent class warfare.

http://www.nickpickles.co.uk/?p=729

The UK Uncut press release reeks of it.

http://www.ukuncut.org.uk/blog/press...tnum-and-mason

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

Whilst I endorse their right to do it, I really don't see how 250,000 or whatever people turning up to protest about what the likes of the TUC and Ed Balls like to claim is such catastrophic economic policy is some sort of major watershed. It doesn't even represent a majority of public sector or union members, let alone the rest of us.

---------- Post added at 13:28 ---------- Previous post was at 13:11 ----------

In respect of the police handling of these events, where are all the usual suspects who're always banging on that police brutality is somehow systemic and endemic? So far as I can see, the vast majority of the police were entirely peacefully engaged dealing with the vast majority of protesters - no police violence, no police intimidation, no police overreaction, no police incitement, no police harrassment! Having frequently heard it said that the police always set out to cause trouble, leave empty vans lying about to incite mayhem and get off on dragging 'disabled students' out of their wheelchairs and assaulting them, I'm surprised there wasn't any trouble affecting the main protest. How could that be I wonder? Did the police brutality department have a bad day? :confused: Or could it just be that the vast majority of people weren't breaking the law by attacking police, intimidating others, destroying public property etc. and were treated accordingly? From what I've seen it was only those who were committing serious breaches of the law who came into conflict with the police and quite rightly so!

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

It isn't too surprising the public sector is feeling threatened.

http://business.timesonline.co.uk/to...cle6974029.ece

If these have any validity it speaks volumes.

By the same token, however, the NHS has had money pumped into it but has likewise become considerably less productive.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/healthcare...iciency-issues



---------- Post added at 13:40 ---------- Previous post was at 13:32 ----------

Another view of things from the gentle, calm and always balanced Old Holborn.

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

Before people start ranting and having a go at me, lets put one thing into proportion, NO matter who is running this bloody country, Labour look after the working class, The bloody Tories look after the rich.

There are ways that these cuts can be brought in, they stated that it would take FIVE years, what they are doing is basically overnight, When they were talking before the elections, they said they WOULD not increase students fees( they now have) they stated they would not harm the NHS (they have) they stated they would not hit the education system (they have). There must be an awful lot of Tory lovers on this forum.

I was about in the poll tax riots and everrhtying thing that was brought in by Thatcher, and all the aggro she brought, Cameron and Clegg are doing exactly the same.

IF Cameron and Clegg are in power, why is it quiet on the Politcally fron this morning condeming what happened yesterday, They have cut the police budget, and yet they were having there ass's kicked yesterday by mindless thugs, Have they come out and praised them- no.

Re: TUC Day of Action - 26th March
 

Well Labour governments are renowned for wasting money and in the last decade they really excelled but that's another subject.