giganews (usenet)
 

trying to download a linux file for my laptop however i'm getting speeds of 30-50kbps, anybody else got this problem?

50mb connection

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

possible th new traffic shaping even tohugh it a linux distro it will be seen as file sharing protocol

cant be sure this is the problem

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

then what's the point of having a 50mb connection, hell whats the point of the 100mb connection if its just going to be the same?

just under 50 quid for a half arsed product.

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

To be honest we all might as well get used to paying for a top dollor 50 meg cable modem service but getting only a 2 bit adsl speed. Traffic shaping if ever i have seen it. Try a speed test on speedtest.net and i bet you get 50 meg.

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

https://www.cableforum.co.uk/images/...010/11/117.png
aberdeen gets me 20mb

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

Then by that your not being traffic shaped

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

Looks like it's time to post your modem stats and log file to see if there's an obvious problem.

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

Giganews is painfully slow here too. Getting 5k/sec. I've had it happen before and the next night it was fine.

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

[img]Download Failed (1)[/img]

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

I came here to start a thread about Giganews too. I've been with them for 2 years and I could always max out my connection consistently. In the last week or so, my download speeds have looked like this: -

[img]Download Failed (1)[/img]

Giganews say there's no problem at their end. I can get around 19 Mbps consistently in speed tests and when downloading files direct from the web. It made me wonder if this is related to the new traffic shaping. It's happening to me outside peak times though, and my area hasn't been upgraded as I'm not receiving the new faster upload speeds. Could it be possible that Virgin are testing their traffic shaping in my area? Whatever the cause, it's doing my head in.

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

Just did a quick test myself and I'm getting 53MBit/6.6MB/s from Giganews. So whatever is happening in the previous posts isn't happening to me (yet?).

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

I had a similar problem on Astraweb yesterday evening and changing the port fixed it.

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

I've tried ports 119, 80 and 23 with Giganews and I've tried news.giganews.com and news-europe.giganews.com, but it makes no difference at all.

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

Your download power level should be 6dBv or less. Need to call it in, to stand the best chance of avoiding our Indian friends I suggest you call in the morning close to 08.00am on

0800 052 0431

Also keep an eye on your upstream power you don't want that going over 55dBv.

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

i got the download power down to 7db using the wee connectore type thing you get supplied when the modem gets installed.

i think its a ubr issue, somebody on another forum told me to use ssl settings and it worked a trick, 50mb full :) but i just want my wow back to normal

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

if ssl fioxed it that suggest shapp[ing

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

Im having trouble with Astraweb today and yesterday. My downloads are usually a consistent 1200kbs, yesterday and today they would jump up to 600kbs then go to zero for a few seconds, then jump to 300kbs then drop and so on. I've changed using SSL servers now, im getting a consistent 300kbs, but im not sure if thats cause i've downloaded over my VM threashold today and im being throttled (Thats the speed it usually goes at when im being throttled). Ill report back later!

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

Have a look here, changing to port 443 worked for me.

http://www.cableforum.co.uk/board/35116567-post6.html

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

It's got to be the new traffic shaping, because at around midnight, the speed suddenly changed: -

[img]Download Failed (1)[/img]

I've tried rebooting my modem and I definitely don't have the new, faster upload speeds, but I guess that's a separate thing to the traffic shaping. I assumed that the traffic shaping would arrive when the new upload speeds did.

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

Yes faster upload speeds are totally separate and no, traffic shaping is not waiting for the new upload speeds but is effective across all tiers now.

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

in all areas?

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

Yes in all areas.

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

Ok I dont know hwo you know this but will take your word for it, if truethe affect on my congestion isnt noticeable, maybe a bit on jitter but not much, throughput seems unaffected.

in fact I am wondering how well the shaping is working, I am getting slow speedtests whilst I have low jitter at night, which is very odd. I am wondering if the shaping is shaping my speedtesting, http traffic etc.

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

http is not affected, it isn't a magical fix to totally solve oversubscription but is a step in the right direction.

This and the upgrades which are happening will see a marked change and can only be seen ATM where the upgrades have happened.

Perhaps an analogy is a motorway, P2P and newsgroups will at peak times be in the slow lane, emails and other non time sensitive in the middle lane and everything else in the fast lane. Not a perfect comparison but good enough I think.

Yes there are one or two problems with it with some online gaming but they are being ironed out.

I am sure once the upgrade reaches you, you will see the improvement.

As Igni has stated in many posts the supply of bandwidth cannot equal demand at the price it is now and that goes for all ISP's not just Virgin.

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

I started Usenet last night at 23:00. Same results, stupid throughput. At 00:04 instantly rocketed up to 2.44MB/s solid. Congestion isn't a problem it seems. It's a pure and simple money suck. Pity it ruins their reputation into the mix.

It's shaping. Simple. I have downgraded all my services to the bare minimum, TV removed, BB to the lowest, landline gone. Just waiting for BT to install Infinity in my street then it's bye bye to the biggest bunch of liars we've ever seen.

I knew this would happen once NTL got their grubby paws on Telewest. I gave them 5 years to wreck it. They exceeded expectations.

Cable are finished. Nothing but liars. AVOID.

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

Of course it's shaping, they've said they are doing it. Good luck with BT as they are worse.

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

I didnt say was affected deliberatly, I meant it might not be working right for whatever reason. Shaping equipment can mismatch traffic, go wrong etc.

If thats not the case then if an area has serious problems with all the following. STM/shaping/letters(granted letters are not enforced yet) then I think people would find it hard to say its not oversubscription. Because you looking at a scenario where 75% of the capacity is not used by p2p/nntp, and heavy users under other protocols still throttled under STM.

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

I didn't say it wasn't oversubscription, just a step in the right direction.

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

yep I meant if others still try to say its not oversubscription. Shaping of course shouldnt be used to replace upgrades but rather just to ensure QoS at peak.

---------- Post added at 02:43 ---------- Previous post was at 02:34 ----------

interesting, I found a few threads on the official forums, some saying the shaping is affecting gaming (this one not too surprising, expected it) but also its causing an mtu issue and a guy suggested a mtu of 900 as a workaround, now my speedtests have shot up from 5-10meg/sec to 18.43meg/sec, maxing out there because seem to be hitting ack saturation on upload due to the smaller packets.

I did notice some mtu oddness on VM's network the last couple of weeks but had nothing conclusive on it, I will test again in the day and at peak with the lower mtu.

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

Worse? At what? Providing 5% of the service as sold as? You forget, VM sell their packages based upon SPEED. To restrict to dial up speeds because I am white, I am black, I have 11 toes, I use Usenet, http, email etc is just nonsense.

<WHATEVER>

Enjoy your NTL (disguised as Virgin)'s service. BT don't need to hide behind another company's brand to operate. Why do NTL? Huh?

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

No doubt you will find out and report back here. Hopefully you will prove me wrong.

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

I am going bed, but what I have learned from reading VM's own forums.

Unclassified traffic appears to be shaped down, this obviously will void VM's claim only nntp and p2p is throttled. Ignition's own post on there showing a speedtest done on port 8095 showed this.

Few complaints of games been affected.

Few complaints of http been affected ranging from slow http downloads to missing images and pages timing out.

and of course the mtu issue reported.

its worth noting although shaping is disabled at midnight (after STM peak stops) traffic is still probably been routed through the equipment.

I am curious what the name of the equipment is VM are using. If its ellocoya's or something else.

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

Welcome to the new Virginmedia ADSL emulation mode.


This is a free upgrade for all VM's customers at no cost and will show you what ADSL users having been getting for over a year now :rolleyes:

Welcome to

You buy one you get less free






.

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

Same here.

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

+ 1

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

how the have the gaul to charge just under 50 quid for that, is a damn right joke.

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

They don't.. Some of that charge is the phone line

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

I guess VM have thought this through and are quite happy to risk losing the '1%' of their customers that use Newsgroups/p2p

I was thinking of a move to BT Infinity, but it looks they have the same sort of throttling with this kind of traffic.

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

its not just that its online gaming as well

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

If you use SSL does it get round the traffic shaping? Comments I've read seem to suggest that that's the case.

Why couldn't they just leave the system as it is? I thought that the traffic management was there to deal with the "5%" of people downloading/uploading large amounts. Now my connection is being crippled with traffic shaping as well as traffic management and I'm losing anywhere from 60% to 95% of my connection speed for up to 12 hours a day. I'm not buying the "it's not financially viable not to have it" thing at all, considering Virgin Media's profits are on the up.

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

Moving to SSL fixed the issue for me but not sure I have gone over fair usage as I have been in Bali for 3 weeks and the modem was powered off. Oh and I wasnt traffic managed

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

ok I have tested. and will pass this on oto VM.

mtu 900 5 speedtest.net london tests in a row.
18.34
18.66
18.29
19.01
18.10
mtu 1500 repeated
6.26
1.27
12.09
6.06
10.69

tbb speedtest, port 8095 was ok port 80 slow. (mtu 900)

port 8095 15.66 meg
port 80 6.66meg.

repeated with similiar results.

I have not tested yet if normal browsing and youtube etc. improve with lower mtu as still not using VM for that.

single stream ftp downloads remain flaky even with mtu 900.

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

i'm on 50mb just downloaded 5.6gb file at16:45 @5.92mbps, no capping/throttling here.

Location: Derby
Provider: NewsDemon
Port: 80
SSL: YES
Client: SABnzbd+ 0.5.4

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

try it again past 5pm - I think that's when the throttling kicks in

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

ah yes just seen this:

"File sharing

We moderate the total volume of file sharing traffic on our network between 5pm and midnight on weekdays and midday and midnight on weekends. This policy is restricted to Peer to Peer ("P2P") applications and Newsgroups (which are commonly used to distribute large amounts of data)"

i'll give it 5mins and report back

Update: 17:10
Nope still downloading at 5.80MB/s to 6.01MB/s, just started another download of a 6.4gb file.( i aint going to lie and say its linux distro hahaha)
Location: Derby
Provider: NewsDemon
Port: 80
SSL: YES
Client: SABnzbd+ 0.5.4

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

trying large file from Astraweb (ssl) now - I'm on 50Mb package

getting 20Mb via port 563 (the problem one)

getting full 50Mb via port 443

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

On port 443 i'm maxing out at 20mbit with a perfect flatline which is perfect, however it is all up and down on port 563 anywhere between 2mbit-18mbit which is hopeless.

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

Just tried usenet here

Astraweb

ssl enabled

ssl-eu.astraweb.com

port 563 15-18 mbs

port 443 full speed

50mb btw..

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

What about torrents guys? on the 50 meg package are they being shaped after 5 pm ?

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

mmm yes any p2p software is shaped

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

No idea im afraid i wouldn't touch those with a barge pole now i use newsgroups. :)

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

Look like it just tried utorrent can't get any more than 5mbs

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

use encypton you can get full 50mb on anything

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

Not so Andy

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

if you mean world of warcraft seesm that something serpeate ;)

everything i ave tried so far if i use encyption it boost the speed encyptions i have uysed is ssl ad vpn and ssh tunneling all improbe the speed for torrent, newsgroups and some http transfers tha ti have tested so far fdoesnt mean it ful prove just meant if you are having problem try enyption

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

VPN works ;)

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

pure oversubscription this time of day, mtu 1500 = 1-5meg on speedtest
mtu 900 = slightly higher 5-10 meg.

latency is very high also.

so VM have just showed that 75% of the capacity in my area is not capable of handling traffic on port 80,443,21,22,8080. rest squeezed into other 25%.

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

I have just started to get really slow speeds on Giganews also.

On my 50meg connection I can always saturate it at over 6000k/sec but now I can barely pull 1000k. All other web traffic is fine and speedtest shows me at 49.3Meg.

Definite traffic shaping

https://www.cableforum.co.uk/images/...010/11/114.png

Edit: Turned on SSL and I'm back up at 6000k d/l. There you have it!

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

I know it has been said that it will be limited at a more local level but I find that hard to believe.

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

Changing my Astraweb to SSL has fixed the problem for the time being.

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

Without wanting to offend someone, but what exactly is Giganews used for ?

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

How long till they restrict em all tho???

Lucky i only have 1 month left on my contract 50mb btw... if it starts getting bad on all ports, think i am just gonna downgrade to 20mb and use vpn as its difficult to get full speeds of vpn with 50mb...

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

In simple terms it is a newsgroups provider where you pay a small monthly fee to get access to newsgroups where you can simply download whatever is on their servers.

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

http://vpnuk.net/shared-ip.html they provide up to 100mb

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

Not sure they would be ok with usenet looking at there T&C.

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

Thats looks ok, For £5.00 might give it a try ;)

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

I'm on the 50mb and using the VPN via giganews. No problems here.

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

What speeds do you get via giganews vpn amst
erdam server?

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

I was getting between 300k and 500k/sec last night. I have SSL switched on. Maybe I need to try moving port...

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

5.1MBs usually. I haven't tried any other server yet but I may give the eastern USA one a go.

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

So what could possibly be on their servers that would warrant someone wanting to pay for the privilege of doing so and why would VM want to restrict speed to such servers ?

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

Im sure you can guess what the majority of content on there is, Although newsgroups where not designed for it and have been around since before the web as we know it. However I believe the reason most people are complaining is because of how badly the system has been implemented.

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

Incidentally, I just got an email from Giganews saying all of their accounts now offer ssl

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

Ok, if i guessed 'copyrighted material' would i be correct, why do people talk in riddles, why dont they just say i am trying to downloand <insert copyrighted material here> but VM are managing my connection so i can't download it quick enough ?

I find it a bit odd that someone would pay to download copyrighted material ?

As a percentage then, and honestly i am genuinely interested, what proportion is legit and what isn't ?

Sorry I am hijacking the thread, I will stop, this has probably all been discussed before.

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

You would be correct and I don't have very much experience with newsgroups but the majority of content is copyright since they will be big files and the legit content will just be text. The legit stuff although dying out is support forms, news articles (as he name suggests) etc. Most isp's used to or still do provide free access to newsgroups but block certain groups, In fact VM used to (or maybe they still do?) provide support newsgroups which is where all of the virgin staff on the forums used to be before they moved to the virgin forums.
And as for paying to download copyright material people always have and continue to pay for copyright material.

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

Paying for copyright material is not an infringement and is the open legitimate way.

Paying for a hign speed connection to a newsgroup to download infringing material is not.

@vmfriend most ISP's say it is 5% of customers.

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

I dont find it odd, a fair few people download such material due to lack of availability rather than cost.

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

Why? - not to condone such practice, but one legitimate DVD can cost more than a months subscription to a newsgroup download service.

Also, specifically for TV programs, it is often possible to download episodes of series being shown in the USA significantly in advance of their screening in the UK. Some people find that worth a relatively small monthly fee.

I wouldn't even try to estimate that - there are over 100,000 newsgroups, a lot (especially the 'text' groups) carry legitimate content, others, such as the 'alt.binary' groups carry a lot of copyright infringing material.

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

I meant paying somebody for access to or a copy of the material that has not come from the distributor. Like buying a copy of a dvd or cd from somebody who has ripped it from an original disk or downloaded it then burnt a few copies to sell.

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

I know what you meant but it was not what you said, I merely clarified.

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

I understand what you mean, I was trying to make the point that from what I have read most people seem to offer cost as a reason to download copyright material, although I am sure that there are some people who could afford to pay choose not to.

It just seems strange that someone would pay a fee of any kind when the reason for not paying for copyright material could be cost.

When you say USA tv series, again i take the point, however someone has still paid to produce the series and likely it will appear on tv in the uk where a subscription is required, so again avoiding paying, again I accept that some people could afford to pay but choose not to because they want to see it as soon as possible.

I don't want to start an argument, i genuinely want to understand why the use of torrents/newsgroups etc is a contentious issue and why some people choice to use them and some not.

In addition i would rather people just admit to downloading films/music illegally and that they are annoyed that they can't download it 24/7.

Of course paying to download copyrighted material is legitimate, but I assume newsgroups is not a legitimate source (ie the original content producer does not get a cut of the action)

---------- Post added at 22:58 ---------- Previous post was at 22:56 ----------

Apologies for typos, I can't edit them for some reason.

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

It is currently FAR safer to download stuff from newsgroups rather than torrents and normally you get your full internet speed instantly when STM and traffic shaping aren't in operation, so paying £7 a month for that is well worth it i think.

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

It is FAR safer to download from EITHER newsgroups OR a private torrent tracker.

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

Private torrents i have never used, been using newsgroups maybe 4yrs or so. :)

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

I agree, it is a question of balancing the payment of about £8.00 a month for several download 'opportunities' compared to £12 for one legitimate DVD. Your last comment is the most apt, in my opinion.

As above, this is relative - someone downloading a DVD a week could see the newsgroup subscription fee as an 'affordable' option compared to the full retail price of the legitimate media.

As I said, it isn't my intention to condone such practice.

Not an argument - a discussion, hopefully :)

In my opinion the 'difference' between newsgroups & torrents is that use of torrents 'automatically' implies sharing your download via the peering system.

Using newsgroups implies a 'personal' download of material that - conceptually - is made available by a 'common carrier' & not shared. The 'excuse' here being that if one downloads a film or TV program, then deletes the file after watching it, then no 'distribution' of illegal content has occured.

Very true - the irony of that is moot.

Newsgroups 'legitimacy' seems to have avoided direct sanctions, so far, but the successful prosecution of a newsgroup indexing service earlier this year was interesting.

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

does VM usenet have ssl? getting half speed is no fun
should i change my mtu from 1500?

customers should be the only ones to decide what they use their connection for

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

No they don't allow SSL.

I have now committed to a paid for newsgroups provider with SSL and a separate VPN provider so i can tunnel if needed, It means i still get full speed.

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

May I ask which VPN you have signed up to Sirius

Many Thanks

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

http://vpnuk.net/serverstatus1.php


On a 1 month trial at the moment

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

Me too ;)

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

Only if you're sure the private tracker has a decent entry system. Most of the so called private trackers let anyone join so they're as safe as a public torrent site.

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

Do you get full speed thru ur vpn sirius?

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

never mind

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

when i use it i have been getting about 30 meg which is better than the 1 or 2 meg VM restrict me to via shaping. Note i only use Newsgroups on the vpn not torrents. To be honest i dont think i will keep with them its a pain in the arse.

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

35mb for me which is alot better than 800kbs I was getting

I've just noticed I've had the 5mb upload increase today

Iam about 6- 7 miles west of Sirius ;)

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

I am with astraweb currently ssl on port 563 is throttled but port 443 aint. Throttled speed here was 28mb tonight must depend on load on local area. Lincoln btw.

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

Which side of the water :)

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

North.

---------- Post added at 21:35 ---------- Previous post was at 21:16 ----------

To be honest it does not bother me that much as i aint downloading as much as i used to (me contract is up in a month) cause its a software based throttle i reckon there's gonna be ways round it. I know it sucks weekend losing 12 hours sat and 12 sunday, and 7 every weekday. But seeing as i only download off peak anyways i aint that bothered. According to vm 100mb is comming to lincoln before month end! Think vm 50mb is still better than the bt infinity tho...

Re: giganews (usenet)
 

I found http://www.clickonf5.org/software/11...a-germany/6369 while ago, dunno if it's of any help anyone?