Originally Posted by BBC

Deputy Labour leader Harriet Harman has apologised for branding Chief Treasury Secretary Danny Alexander a "ginger rodent".
Ms Harman - a former equalities minister - made the comments at the Scottish Labour conference in Oban.

Originally Posted by Chris (Post 35115566)

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotlan...itics-11658228

At least her personal spin doctor had the good sense to send out a press release telling everyone Hattie has apologised. Although I don't imagine she's going to get up in front of the Party faithful in Oban and make her apology as loudly as she made her original comments.

Silly person.

Originally Posted by Mr_love_monkey (Post 35115587)

he _does_ look like a rodent though...

Originally Posted by Danny Alexander via Twitter

I am proud to be ginger and rodents do valuable work cleaning up mess others leave behind. Red squirrel deserves to survive, unlike Labour

Originally Posted by Matt D (Post 35115622)

http://twitter.com/dannyalexander/status/29188404196

Originally Posted by Guardian

The joke about Alexander, the MP for Inverness, Nairn, Badenoch and Strathspey, was greeted with laughter in the hall. However, it backfired as Harman found herself accused of insulting all Scotland's redheads.

George Lyon, Scottish Liberal Democrat election chair, said: "There are no depths to which Labour will not stoop. They aren't fit to be in opposition, let alone in government."

The SNP also hit out at the Labour deputy leader over her "childish abuse" of Alexander. Nationalist MSP Shirley-Anne Somerville said the high number of redheads in Scotland meant the "silly remark isn't anti-Danny or anti-Lib Dem, it's anti-Scottish".

Ms Somerville, herself a redhead, said: "It's a gaffe that is overshadowing what Iain Gray thinks should be his big day. Coming from the doyenne of po-faced political correctness, these remarks show she and Labour have lost the plot since losing the election."

Originally Posted by Matt D (Post 35115636)

http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2...-ginger-rodent



Stupid enough comment to make anyway, but to say it in a country in which the hair colour in question is rather common was even more stupid.

Originally Posted by Paul M (Post 35115790)

Seems rather like a whole bunch of people, totally unrelated to the comment are (as usual) getting offended on behalf of the actual target - who seems to have taken it on the chin and replied rather well.

Originally Posted by nomadking (Post 35115808)

It's more a matter of being hypocritical than of being offensive. Imagine her reaction, if someone was referred to as a 'blonde bimbo'.

Originally Posted by Paul M (Post 35115804)

Well thats your view. :) We dont find it anything like that on the offensive scale.

(and in case your wondering, my wife, and two of my daughters are ginger. They thought it funny.).

Originally Posted by Chris (Post 35115854)

I think it's the person making the comments, rather than the hair colour of the person receiving them, that made this outrageous. Hattie Harperson is, as the Grauniad so eloquently put it, "the doyenne of po-faced political correctness". For her to launch an ad hominem attack on a fellow Parliamentarian based on his appearance is hypocritical in the extreme. It calls into question exactly what is behind the principles she was so keen to ram down all our throats while she was in the Government as the Equalities minister.

Originally Posted by Paul M (Post 35115790)

Seems rather like a whole bunch of people, totally unrelated to the comment are (as usual) getting offended on behalf of the actual target - who seems to have taken it on the chin and replied rather well.

Originally Posted by Ignitionnet (Post 35115891)

I think it's a hobby of some people to get offended on behalf of others.

Originally Posted by Chris (Post 35115973)

Precisely ... that has been her hobby. Or so she led us to believe.

Originally Posted by Maggy J (Post 35115798)

Well coming from a stand up comic maybe Paul..but not from an MP and to be honest having seen how youngsters who are ginger get bullied relentlessly about their hair colour I can't help but be offended on their behalf.Substitute black for ginger or even the N word and it might make some sense of how it is offensive.

Originally Posted by TheDaddy (Post 35116267)

Then again it might not make sense, people have been killed and persecuted for their skin colour, to compare that to a bit of name calling no matter how hurtful is offensive imo.

Originally Posted by Maggy J (Post 35116269)

And where do you think persecution starts..it starts with name calling before it gets to the worst aspects.When people find they can get away with name calling THEN they proceed to the next level.:rolleyes:

Originally Posted by TheDaddy (Post 35116273)

Yeah course they do, that's why we have been stringing gingers up for years like the Klu Klux Klan used to :rolleyes:

Originally Posted by Maggy J (Post 35116275)

Maybe not but only if people speak out against the abuse of people's characteristics..;)

Originally Posted by TheDaddy (Post 35116276)

I don't remember any campaign on behalf of gingers and there hasn't been an orange genocide to date, like I said people say hurtful things to each other all the time, luckily that pasty skin is thicker than it looks and they have and will get by without us normal* people feeling sorry for them :D

*uses the term loosly in my case

Originally Posted by Maggy J (Post 35116277)

Tell me would you make abusive comments about someone disabled?Or blind,or with Downs syndrome?

Would you beat up any of the above?

Of course the answer is no.Why is it no?

Originally Posted by TheDaddy (Post 35116279)

Hardly abusive were they and would I make such light hearted comments to a blind person, why don't you ask Jefferson.

Originally Posted by Maggy J (Post 35116275)

So if people here don't mind I'll carry on being offended on behalf of minorities who do get more than their fair share of abuse about things they cannot do much about..

Originally Posted by Maggy J (Post 35116280)

I'm trying to find out why certain groups are not to be the but of jokes but other groups are seen as fair game..because I cannot understand the distinction shown to one and not to the others..

I'm not getting at you, I'm trying to understand and maybe challenge some people's perceptions about how they view some people.

After all anyone takes the urine out of a body builder is perhaps all set for a Darwin award.But a little person...Who is going to mind if the mick is taken out of them?

Originally Posted by TheDaddy (Post 35116284)

Everyone is fair game in my book but it has to be fair, I don't like bullies or myself at times in the past when I have gone a little ott but as long as there is a genuine smile on every ones face its all good.

I think we established why certain groups are considered fair game as well, when you have been persecuted under threat of death and in some countries still are due to your skin colour, sexuality or religion it kind of elevates them above most peoples micky taking imo.

Originally Posted by Maggy J (Post 35116275)

So if people here don't mind I'll carry on being offended on behalf of minorities

Originally Posted by Maggy J (Post 35116275)

So if people here don't mind I'll carry on being offended on behalf of minorities who do get more than their fair share of abuse about things they cannot do much about..such as physical characteristics..

Originally Posted by Ignitionnet (Post 35116291)

I'm not sure about anyone else but I certainly don't 'mind' my only emotion reading things like that would be pity.

Originally Posted by Maggy J (Post 35116333)

I don't need your pity..I just need you to empathise with those who get the abuse.;)

Originally Posted by Ignitionnet (Post 35116341)

I entirely empathise I just don't patronise or inflame by taking offence by proxy.

People, especially children, can be cruel. It's usually catharsis, covering up some personal insecurity, done to feel better, improve self-image, feel a sense of superiority over other people.

A bit like taking more offence for slights to others than the recipients themselves do just the opposite side of the coin.

Originally Posted by Maggy J (Post 35116349)

So someone is getting abuse in front of you because of their ginger hair ,is obviously upset but you won't say a word?

Originally Posted by Maggy J (Post 35116349)

So someone is getting abuse in front of you because of their ginger hair ,is obviously upset but you won't say a word?

Originally Posted by Pierre (Post 35116359)

Of course, you tell the child the sticks and stones routine, and that it is the person calling you names that has the problem etc.

But that is all.

Life is not fair, kids will meet many nasty people in life, even when grown up and in the work place.

You teach the child fortitude to deal with these types of people, for themselves.

And not go riding in on a white horse trying to solve the problem for the child.

The problem will not be solved, not by you or I.

The case in point is that Mr Alexander is a successful MP and I'm sure throughout his life he probably got some stick but it hasn't stopped him achieving, and one could probably argue that having the mental fortitiude he has and having a thick skin has probably helped him to where he is today

Originally Posted by Ignitionnet (Post 35116372)

I didn't say anything of the sort. Not getting offended on behalf of other people is quite different from not caring.

Originally Posted by Maggy J (Post 35116386)

What if it's adults putting the boot in?Instead of name calling?

Originally Posted by Pierre (Post 35116398)

If you're talking physical abuse then you are moving the discussion onto to something else entirely, no doubt to try and rationalise your previous OTT stance.

Wont work I'm afraid.

Originally Posted by Maggy J (Post 35116386)

Doesn't quite answer the question though.:erm:

Originally Posted by Ignitionnet (Post 35116420)

Answers it perfectly clearly. 'I said nothing of the sort' isn't really equivocal as far as I'm aware.

As my posts have said throughout just because I don't get offended on behalf of other people doesn't mean I don't have any empathy and don't care.

There are shades of grey. There's no need to feel compelled to don a super hero costume and dive to the defence of the oppressed at every opportunity in order to have empathy and consideration for them.

If it makes you feel better however my perceptions have been changed by your posts.