Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

What did the person who complained hope to gain? peace within himself?


http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...n-PC-joke.html

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

That is a pretty nasty title.

The story is tragic but the guy who lodged the complaint did not make the man kill himself, the guy obviously had issues and the prospect of losing his job was the last straw.

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

So, being suspended and the prospect of losing his job at 61 for a jokey comment was ok?

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

There is such a thing as a 'Politically Correct' person.

I don't know how you can say it's obvious the man had issues. and I'm sure the dead man would tell the person who complained that he doesn't blame him.

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

i agree that the man obviously had other issues that would contribute to this ,but at the end of the day it seems that the suspension was the last straw as Damien said,but it still means that some cretin poked their nose in and got all offended on someelses behalf ,the company should also look at their procedure ,instead of immediate suspension they should apply a bit of common sense and ask a few questions ..in person ..instead of fireing off impersonal emails before any information had been gathered

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

I have noticed that quite often the PC brigade take offence when whoever it was directed to does not. Perhaps the PC brigade should start asking if people mind and if they do not then they should keep their noses out of peoples business

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

Agreed. I get fed up of people being offended on others behalf. especially when the person they are defending isn't offended.

He pushed the black man over.
it's rugby.
I don't care he's black and he's white. he pushed him because he's black.
there isn't an issue here.
I want to make one.
why?
Because it's about colour and race.

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

There are poeple out there that get off on being Politically correct. We have one in our office in Manchester :rolleyes:

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

Gary, your statement is as idiotic as the one made by the person who complained (imho).

What has happened to Mr Amor is a tragedy, and you are cheapening it by stupid comments like that.

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

Yes. it was meant to be :rolleyes:

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

I'm sure people would like to view the complainant as an interfering busy-body but what if it was a manager or supervisor whose job it is to investigate such things?

I'm not trying justify anything that happened in this but it's like people are desperate for someone to blame when it may not be that simple.

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

The problem is, Gary, it is difficult to tell the difference between your "idiotic" statements and your normal ones. :rolleyes:

Your "idiotic" statement could never happen in real life, but you try to make seem as if it could, just because you think it might.:dozey:

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

The manager or supervisor was the one who over heard the joke and took offence to it?

---------- Post added at 10:27 ---------- Previous post was at 10:26 ----------

Go away. you do my head in :) :D

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

then he should have investigated it with a modicum of common sense WHEN a complaint had been made and not before ,it's not any managers place to complain on other peoples behalf

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

Surely if that were the case a full investigation (including talking to the black person involved) should have taken place before the guy was suspended...and it could have prevented the tragedy had such an investigation taken place

.
.
.

POSSIBLY

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

Totally agree - no one should be suspended unless by remaining, they are putting themselves or someone else at risk; on the information we have, this is a total over-reaction.

I wonder why it has taken two months to hit the press, though?

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

In my NHS experience, to suspend someone is not done lightly - in fact its near on impossible (has just taken me over 3 years to terminate someone's employment who has been off sick for 5 years!). I suspect there is more to this story than meets the eye.

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

I don't know the ins and outs of it - but the thread title and some people's reactions gives the impression there was a busy-body to who took it on themselves to be offended on someone else's behalf, thereby leading to this man's death.

All I'm saying is it could have been a manager who had to follow company policy. Not saying that makes it right but the fault could be with the company's policies rather than that of an individual.

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

No but it is not an injustice just would real a rational person to kill himself unless they were already in a poor state of mind. One person effectily though something was offense and reported that, it's obviously not the correct thing to do, but to hold that person responsible for the death of a person is pathetic.

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

Here we go again :banghead:
can I suggest that there's a possibility that none of this is true at all. and there was no immigration people anywhere near the premises that day, and the man killed himself because he may have fallen out with his wife over her cooking?

---------- Post added at 10:54 ---------- Previous post was at 10:53 ----------

Would 'abusive father made daughter kill herself' be pathetic too?

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

Being a 'PC Idiot' is not akin to Child Abuse. :rolleyes:

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

By all means :erm:

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

Not the old 'I was just following orders' defence.:rolleyes:

If it had been one non-white person saying to another non-white person that 'they had better hide', would there have been a complaint from anyone about it?

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

No, your point is about someone made someone do something.
a PC idiot and an abuser are both the same when you use it in that context.

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

No they are not. By such logic that would mean if someone in a shop had a bad day and therefore was rude to me, and I complained, which led to them killing themselves I would be responsible for that persons death. :rolleyes:

You have to ask if it was a understandable and logical reaction to the event. You also have to ask if the initial incident, i.e complaint or child abuse, was malicious and wrong. If they are abusing a child that is a very serious crime and one in which they give no thought to the well being of their victim. Making a complaint is not of that scale, it's not a crime, and it's something you might easily do.

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

You are using the seriousness of child abuse too much to emphasise your point.

you have 2 victims that killed themselves because of the actions of 2 other persons. the girl who killed herself didn't have any other issues surrounding her. and we leave "abuser made girl kill herself' as it is. we accept this one. it's all proper.

but the other one "PC person makes man kill himself" we jump all over. we can't accept it. we have to say the person that killed themselves must have had other issues already. we don't even approve of mentioning the PC person as for the reason why he killed himself.

humans are hypocritical some times.

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

the two examples aren't even close ,imo one comment leading to a suspension is in no way sufficient reason for a person to kill themselves without other issues playing a part ,
whereas a child being repeatedly abused by a parent is a very good reason and probably happens more than we know

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

Eh? How does that compare to the case? Somebody being rude,and then complaining about it is very reasonable! If the person then kills themselves I would agree there are most likely other factors playing a part.

But sneakily grassing someone up behind their back is an entirely different matter!I would find it very disturbing,especially if I had worked at a place for 30 years,and thought I know my colleagues well,if someone did that to me.

A joke amongst friends is no-one else's business! Just the fact that somebody felt compelled to report this shows the state of affairs in PC-Britain.
But hey,I guess the black guy was from a 'deprived and vulnerable' background,and needed the help of New Liebours socialist all-caring,all-knowing,all-meddling-with brigade.

'Here lies one of the many victims of New Labour's murderous PC ideology.' :rolleyes:

complaining about others,even though the receiver of the joke had no complaint? i find that vile,spiteful,nasty and utterly outrageous! In fact,now I am offended! :shocked:

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

someone should complain for you....

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

well, would you be so kind? ;)

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

How does 'complaining' about someone and 'grassing them up' differ other than the fact that the cause of the complaint and the manor in which you describe it is subjective? Some people might find the comments that they perceive as racist, even though we know it wasn't, rude.

I knew it must be Labour's fault somehow.

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

It is if it happens in the workplace.

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

why?

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

The other misconception people have here is that only black people can be offended at racism. This case, if taken as presented, would not offend me as the intention is friendly and therefore there is no hate or malice intended. Actual racism, where the comment is borne out of ignorance, hate and spite would offend me regardless of the fact that the ethnicity of the target differed from mine.

We also don't know if the person who made the complaint was aware of the context.
We also don't know any other facts regarding the case.

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

The workplace is quite a different environment to the privacy of your own home.

If you are at work and a colleague makes a comment that makes you feel uncomfortable, you might feel obliged to say nothing (especially if the colleague is more senior than you).

If you are at a party in someones house and a guest makes a comment that makes you feel uncomfortable, you can walk away, or tell them to shut up, or whatever.

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

"It is understood that the man was a close friend of Mr Amor and was not offended. However, it was overheard by someone else who lodged a formal complaint."

I suggest that you read that carefully once or twice again and think about the reality of what happened.
Personally I can't get away from thoughts of the old East German Stasi..

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

Whether or not Mr Amor was offended is not really relevant.

Suppose you walked into work and said to a black colleague "Wassup my nigga?"*, and he laughed. Are you suggesting this is acceptable language in the workplace?

* taken from a scene in a Jackie Chan movie.

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

Since I have seen and heard such language between black colleagues yes I would say that is entirely acceptable. It's up to the people involved to decide what is acceptable and absolutely NOT the business of any 3rd party to involve themselves.

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

So if the conversation was overheard by another colleague, action would only be taken if he was offended?

Isn't that a bit like saying there is no need to obey safety rules provided no-one gets hurt?

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

Taking offence and losing a limb in an industrial accident are far from being even a bit alike.

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

Actually it's nothing to do with that at all. Safety rules can be a matter of life and death. A few light-hearted words between friends are not in the same league by any stretch of the imagination.

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

[QUOTE=TheNorm;34999184]So if the conversation was overheard by another colleague, action would only be taken if he was offended?
QUOTE]



yes and it would be upto them(the offended) to report it

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

Killing yourself is not a regular, balanced person's response to difficult situations or occurrences, otherwise we'd all be dropping like flies, just opening the winter fuel bills etc.
It's a desperate, last resort measure.
It's quite safe to assume that this guy "had issues".

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

The issue really is that are we going to allow legislation to underpin all our dealings with one another and do some business have too much layers of red tape in dealing with issues of isms.

We do seem to be at times entering the world of, if you will forgive the unintended pun,black and white.The tints and hues of grey are being eradicated from our lives.Our society does seem to have become an either/or one with no allowances for manoeuvrability within defined perimeters.

Sigh!

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

Agreed. The insidious and destructive evils of political correctness are determined to eradicate free speech and common sense. People speak of PC as if it's some sort of joke but it certainly is not. It's the most evil attempt to do away with debate and free discussion of important issues. If you are not "on-message" then you will be targeted and labelled as some sort of wicked person. We are rapidly losing the traditional British concept of free speech in favour of hardline PC rigidity.

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

Erm, isn't the whole thread about a man losing his life?

Anyway, how about this question: can employees make any comments they like in the workplace, provided no-one complains?

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

Would you feel the same way if the comment had been used in a bullying way? Would you accept someone potentially being bullied because it "was not your business"?

It may not have been immediately obvious to the 3rd party that the comment was used amongst friends.

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

as long as common decency is maintained yes ,because as long as no complaints are made then no one is offended ,and if by chance someone is offended then they can make a complaint and persue it ,it shouldn't be upto a manager to decide for them what they should/should not be offended at

---------- Post added at 19:42 ---------- Previous post was at 19:41 ----------

could have asked

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

Many years ago I was at work, and a college Born in Jamacia and the accent to go with it) called my number, rather than my dads the extention he wanted.

I was in another train of thought when he called, I responded in a unintentional very bad jamacian voice attept with "Yo maan whaat Yoou waant".

I suddenly realised "holy crap WTF have I done" . I said sorry staright away, but was deafended by his laughter down the phone.

For several days I kept saying sorry, but he kept saying don't worry I knew it wasn't meant in offence.

I should say that this guy was my mums supervisor before she went full time.

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

Care to define 'any'? Who decides what can or can't be said? Well it's obviously not the majority.

Even if the remark that he should hide was said seriously, then it could still only be seen as a helpful/friendly comment.

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

He might have, for all we know.

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

Couldn't have put it better myself.

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

i doubt any suspensions would have been handed out if the two parties had been asked

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

If a company recieves a complaint about someone overhearing a comment of concern, they should be asked who the comment was directed to, and in what sort of manner was the comment made.
Then interview the person who it was directed at, did they hear it? Were they offended by it? Are they being victimised by the person who said it? Or was it friendly banter from a mate?
If they were offended, then the person who made the comment should then be disciplined (that could be a quiet word if the victim feels it appropriate or verbal warning), if they believe they are being victimised that should be investigated further and dealt with appropriately.
They should not suspend someone on the hearsay of a 3rd party.

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

Wholly speculative on your part.even if it was bullying it would
be up to the bullied to complain.

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

Except it's not just about whether the person to whom the comment was directed found it offensive. It's also about people around them who may overhear.

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

:) Agreed

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

that's exactly my understanding of how most companies work especially i imagine one that is affiliated to the NHS
when i was a manager my company had a similar protocol ,as has been said earlier suspensions are not usually handed out like sweets i imagine it would cause problems for any company having to suspend an employee ,not to mention the cost

---------- Post added at 20:07 ---------- Previous post was at 20:04 ----------

and therin lies the problem too many people are offended by remarks serious or in jest made by someone without knowing the background to the conversation

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

Has anyone got a valid interpretation of the events/comments where they could be seen in any shape or form as being negative?

If a black person had said it to another black person, there wouldn't have been complaints from anyone., but because it was a white person saying it, it is automatically classed as being racist. Isn't that racist?

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

imo yes it is

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

Well that's a managerial decision.
If it's something like one worker saying to another "those bloody muslims coming here spreading islam through rape, they should be rounded up and shot" then yes, understandable how that would cause offence to most people.
A worker talking in a mock west indian voice to a west indian mate, overheard by a caucasian Englishman and reported, then a serious talk with the person reporting it to find out why they found it offensive and why they think anything should be done when the two involved are perfectly happy with what occured would be in order.

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

Agreed. We don't have a lot of information, so I am speculating. In fact, I thought that was clear from the use of the word "may".

True, in an ideal world. However, a lot of bullied people are too frightened, proud or ashamed to report it, which is why other people sometimes get involved. I've suffered quite severe bullying, which actually took the form of a lot of name calling. I was too ashamed of how I was handling it to report it. If I had, or someone had made it "their business" and reported it, I could have been saved a lot of anguish, and would have been stopped from seriously considering suicide.

I am not saying that the person shouldn't have reported his concerns. However, the most the company should have done is to talk it through with both the deceased and his friend to see what had happened. They should then possibly have just asked the deceased to mind what he says. They should not have taken any action other than that, and certainly should not have suspended him

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

Again, the point is not "was someone offended". The point is there are limits to what you should say in the workplace.

Ultimately, this is a management decision.

I strongly disagree. Victims are often too scared to complain; it is up to managers to make sure the bullying never gets this far.

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

Well as far as I'm concerned, the busy body who reported him has his blood on there hands.

My dad and his mate have called each other 'blue' for years, is this racist?

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

[QUOTE=TheNorm;34999318]Again, the point is not "was someone offended". The point is there are limits to what you should say in the workplace.QUOTE]


i think thats what i said ,maintain common decency ect ,i accept that you cant go round swearing and using blatant racial insults but a joke between friends is not in any way offensive and its not upto a 3rd party to make it offensive

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

I've seen people taunted in the workplace because of their weight. Suppose the target of these comments laughed them off at work, but in reality was in deep depression and one day decided to end his/her life.

Who would you then say had "blood on there hands"? The manager who didn't report the abuse?

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

Damn, you *have* lived a sheltered life. You should have been in some of the toolrooms I've worked in over the years.

Management decisions?
Victims scared to complain?

Sorry, you need to grow some.

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

you're talking about bullying though and i think it's everyones responsibility to guard against that ,this was a comment made in jest ,not even a racial comment ,just a flippant remark to a friend blown up by a manager who on the face of it didn't follow proper procedure

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

It's all very well saying "you need to grow some". Doesn't stop people commiting suicide over what is basically name calling.

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

again i would agree ,but this was not bullying ,different thing altogether

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

Hmmm. I'd dispute the 'basically name calling' call here. What destroyed this man was the intervention of a 3rd party who had the power to wreck his life.

As has been said before, that's the one with blood on his hands.

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

What killed the man was the actions of the *company*. Not the person who made the complaint. The company did not need to suspend him, which is what apparently caused the suicide.

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

I agree, people do seem to be more and more easily offended by remarks. On the other hand saying something in jest is neither here nor there. There are a lot of things I could say in jest to some of my colleagues that others would find extremely offensive. It doesn't matter whether they don't know the background. It is my responsibility to make sure I make such remarks in a suitable environment and sometimes that means not in work.

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

The person reporting it to the company may not have known that it wasn't bullying.

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

No, it definitely isn't solely a managerial decision. It's a point of law.

There aren't two people involved there are three.

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

and thats why he should have asked a few questions before going to the extreme of suspension

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

No, in many cases it absolutely isn't a management decision. And nor should it be.

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

I didn't think he did. I thought he just reported it to someone else who did the suspension. I agree, however, that the suspension should not have occurred.

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

The company had to play safe. In a world where legal action is the norm and the oldfashioned ideas of 'common sense' no longer are valid they have to play the PC game.

I maintain the individual who decided to set himself in judgement is the one with responsibility for the death.

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

No, it's a managerial decision as to how to handle it. Nothing in law says "If person A hears something from person B which offends person A, then person B must be suspended before investigating"


Um, the third person being the one asked why they think anything should be done when the two involved are perfectly happy with what occured would be in order.
Who esle did you think should be asked? :rolleyes:

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

The company may well have been protected if they just had evidence they have investigated the complaint.

Anyhow, as an experiment, let's turn the story around. If the article had been about a man who committed suicide after a comment made at work, no one had reported it and the company had done nothing because no one had reported it, would you still say everyone who saw what had happened and did nothing was right?

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

Nope.complaining is up to the person the remark was aimed at.

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

I don't accept that. why would somebody else find it offensive?
9 times out of 10 I'd say it's because they've been told to by the hysteria.

A little girl today likes to tell tales. always telling her mother 'Gary' said this 'Gary' did that. she thinks it pleases her mother to be told these tales. and I expect she feels good for it.

but I don't go running to her mother everytime she does or says something. If I did we'd argue with each other more than we do already :D

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

I never said there was a law that says person B must be suspended. My original statement was about the relevance of third parties overhearing and being offended. There is plenty in law that says that this is relevant - it is not just about the nature of the conversation between person A and person B and how they both perceived it.

Um... pardon? In the final part of your post (#61) you referred to "the two [people] involved". When having conversations and banter in the workplace you need to consider who else may overhear. As somebody overheard there were not two people involved - there were three.

---------- Post added at 22:59 ---------- Previous post was at 22:54 ----------

Nope. Plenty of company policies will disagree with you on that point. And anyone who overhears and is offended by the nature of the conversation has a right to raise a complaint. The complaint may not be upheld, but they still have a right to make it.

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

Does that include the one about seeing 2 fit ladies on the way into work. or just the 2 fat ones?

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

I was speaking generally, rather than about this specific case. Personally I wouldn't have found a remark like that to be at all offensive. Nevertheless it's not something I would say to somebody (even somebody I knew well) at work because I can kind of see how somebody overhearing may take it the wrong way or be offended.

If I was the manager responsible for dealing with it then I most definitely wouldn't have suspended anyone and if this man felt he was under any risk of losing his job over it then I can hardly think how they could have handled the situation worse. I think I'd probably just have had a quiet word and asked them to be mindful of who else may overhear things they're saying in jest.

As I said earlier I agree people seem to be getting more thin-skinned over the past few years. The only hysteria I've seen tends to come from sources like the Daily Mail though. ;)


:confused:

---------- Post added at 23:09 ---------- Previous post was at 23:07 ----------

Pardon? :confused:

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

I'm also interested to hear replies to this question. I hope no-one suggests the person contemplating suicide should "grow some" ... :rolleyes:

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

I'm still wondering how it could be taken the wrong way or truly offend someone, other than the PC mafia insisting that someone should be offended.

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

Sorry. that should be the converation heard about the 2 fit or fat ladies at work :)

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

If someone was accused of being rude, shoving people out of the way at the top of a flight of stairs and other things, should they be suspended and potentially sacked?:D

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

In response to my point about it being a managerial decision on how to handle it depending on what actually occured, you said it wasn't a managerial decision, it was a point of law.


We're talking about someone overhearing a conversation which two people are involved in, ie the person making the comment and the person it is directed at, understand?

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

I think I'm still confused. No, actually I am still confused. :)

---------- Post added at 00:36 ---------- Previous post was at 00:22 ----------

Possibly I've misunderstood or not made myself clear. You described asking the person to whom the comments had been made whether they were offended. How they felt about it is not the only consideration. They may have found the whole thing hilariously funny whilst the third person found it highly offensive. The third person's perception may be significant, whether the manager likes it or not.

Yes thank you. I've been quite clear on that right the way through. :)

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

There's been a misunderstanding :)
I said not just ask the person the comment was made to, but also ask the person (the 3rd party who wasn't involved in the comment making or receiving) why they found it offensive and why they think something should be done, and what should be done, considering the two people involved in the comments have no issue with it.

So if Jeff over hears Tony calling his good mate Bob "Sooty", and Jeff finds it offensive as he, like Bob, is of African origin and reports it to his manager/HR.
The manager checks with Bob and finds out Bob's had that nickname since he was 6 and Tony certainly didn't say it to be offensive.
This should be explained to Jeff, who most likely will understand that no offense was meant and not have a problem with it.
At no point should Tony be suspended.

Now lets say Jeff over hears Adolf calling Isaac a stinking Jew, so reports it to his manager. Isaac says he's not phased by it, Adolf is just a bigot and he doesn't let it bother him. The intent however was to insult and cause offence, as such Adolf should be disciplined for it.

While Tony isn't going to call anyone else Sooty because it's not their nickname, Adolf may say such things to any members of staff (or even customers) who are Jewish.

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

I was just wondering whether there'd been a misunderstanding and in fact we were both in complete agreement. It seems that is exactly the case.

I concur - that's exactly how it should have been handled. It would have made for a far happier end to the event for everyone concerned.

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

No, it is not assumed the he/she took offence to it. As a manager it is their job to investigate and challenge such behaviour. It is the job of management to ensure fairness in all situations and if this comment went unchallenged, it would send a message that management have no interest in ensuring that inappropriate language can play no part in working life.

---------- Post added at 11:57 ---------- Previous post was at 11:54 ----------

Again, another assumption that the manager in question took offence, rather than actually doing their job.

---------- Post added at 12:05 ---------- Previous post was at 11:57 ----------

Indeed. It is entirely possible that this is not the first time an incident of this nature had occurred within the company. With the tragic news of this man's fate, it is now unlikely we shall ever know. If the company release any statement referring to any such incidents, they will most likely be accused of a smear campaign.

---------- Post added at 12:18 ---------- Previous post was at 12:05 ----------

This is a typical device used by the Daily Heil in order to cover themselves from being accused of making things up. I am not necessarily saying that is the case here, but their track record speaks volumes.

---------- Post added at 12:22 ---------- Previous post was at 12:18 ----------

I am afraid that is not quite true. If ANY of my employees, black or white, used such language they would be facing disciplinary procedures. I do not bias my colleague relations policies to distinguish between "street talk" or "banter" and what is considered to be professional and appropriate language.

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

Whoever it was that took offence and reported this was wrong to do so without doing a little questioning beforehand and i speak as someone that has been in this situation before and the issue was resolved with some quiet discrete talks between the parties involved with no bad feeling at the end of it. What we ultimately have here is another example of a culture that is growing in the UK and it is not a pleasant or enjoyable culture it is highly destructive and damaging to both individuals and institutions.

Once upon a time the UK was renowned for it's ability to handle situations with humour and banter between friends but now we have to be careful of the growing and ever present "i am ready to be offended on someone else's behalf" brigade that are infesting so many places. As for this man having underlying issue's and this single incident was the last straw, no not really this was a man who had worked all his life had built relationships clearly with his co worker's.

Maybe work formed a massive part of his life the threat of having that taken from him because of something so petty may well be all that was needed to send this individual into suicide. That is putting aside the fact that at 61 this guy wasn't likely to get further employment i think that is enough to send anyone over the edge.

If this was a case of someone commiting suicide because of continued and sustained offence from one to another no that would not be correct but also i doubt that such prolonged offence would have gone unnoticed and more then one person would have complained and appropriate action taken also not what happened in this case. In this case one person got offended on behalf of one other person and without using any brain power or common sense made a complaint and potentially massively affected this man.

It is time in this country for us to tell those looking to be offended to get stuffed and lets get back to those old days where friends could have a laugh and banter without one eye over their shoulder and back to the days where a conversation between two people stayed that way unless there was very very good reason for it not too which wasn't the case here.

We really have become a nation of cry baby's always looking for someone else to handle things for us and that is funnily enough the general creeping culture that follows a socialist government who take more time to interfere in the lifestyles of people rather then working to make the country better.

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

The problem with such a principle is the message it sends. If such language is allowed to be used in a work environment it sends a signal to those who wish to use it to bully and prejudice. They will continue to use such language, safe in the knowledge that action will only be taken if their victim complains. As we well know, many bullying victims remain so because they are afraid to complain. In fact, that is how things used to be "in the bad old days," when things like this went on unpunished. Nothing happened until someone sees what is happening and complains on their behalf.

---------- Post added at 12:35 ---------- Previous post was at 12:31 ----------

The trouble is that legislation was necessary to do so. Up until recently, racism and bullying was rife in the workplace and went unchallenged. It was wholly necessary to enact laws to protect the victims of such behaviour.

---------- Post added at 12:41 ---------- Previous post was at 12:35 ----------

So people can bully with impunity, so long as their victims don't complain?

---------- Post added at 12:49 ---------- Previous post was at 12:41 ----------

This is correct and should have happened. In fact it is entirely possible that it did happened and Mr Amor took offense and refused to cooperate, which could have been the real reason for his suspension.

In general terms, this is wrong. It is not incumbent for the recipient of such remarks to prove they are offended or not. It is, however, incumbent upon management to carry out their duties according their policies. A school teacher does not ask a child if he is being bullied, if they are certain bullying is taking place. If the victim is too scared to admit it, the bullying will continue.

---------- Post added at 12:52 ---------- Previous post was at 12:49 ----------

As pointed out before, it is not.

---------- Post added at 12:56 ---------- Previous post was at 12:52 ----------

But how does one judge whether that person's level of offence is relevant and who is truly qualified to decide? Surely the fact that one person found it offensive should be enough?

---------- Post added at 13:01 ---------- Previous post was at 12:56 ----------

A truly short-sighted perspective.

Why on Earth would ever be considered racist?

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

What was there for ANYBODY to be offended about?

Even if the comment had been made in a serious manner, it could only be seen as being helpful advice to hide. It's not as if he was calling the immigration officers over to investigate the guy.:rolleyes:

There is not a general way in people that are offended can take action. Only members of 'privileged' groups are allowed to have action taken, and most of that is because those groups are told that they should take offence, and not because they are truly offended.

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

Hardly "wrecking his life." Yes, a workplace suspension is a bit disruptive, humiliating and yes, very disturbing, but hardly life wrecking. The reasons for this man's decision to take his life was unlikely to be based on his relationship with his employer.

Re: Politically Correct person makes man kill himself.
 

I'm not sure what you're getting at with the part of my post you quoted.