Christians arrested for defending their beliefs
 

A Christian couple have been charged with a criminal offence after taking part in what they regarded as a reasonable discussion about religion with guests at their hotel.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...#ixzz0RdJnSjSo

Re: Christians arrested for defending there beliefs
 

Can't imagine why that didn't go down well.

Re: Christians arrested for defending there beliefs
 

neither can i , everyone is entitled to there beliefs ,cant see why a debate about religion and dress should end up in court :shrug:

Re: Christians arrested for defending there beliefs
 

Maybe someone either didn't want the debate, the debate went too far or the person complaining didn't like what they heard. Either way I don't see how a debate should be classed worthy of court.

Re: Christians arrested for defending there beliefs
 

well in this biased towards the minority system we have in this country I can see it. The charges are clear

racially aggravated public order offense. Something you would normally receive a caution( apart from the racially bit) for unless its with some uptight religious idiot who then wants to say its racsist although time and again we its been said Muslims are not a race

I do think for the standard white christian or none Islamic citizen in this country our freedom to express opinions has been quashed in favour of pandering to Islam

Re: Christians arrested for defending there beliefs
 

Religiously aggravated public order offence, do try to read your own quotes zing ;)

Last I checked, it's not a christian belief that Mohammed was a warlord and that traditional middle eastern dress is a form of bondage.
I don't know, maybe one of the christians on this forum could comment on whether that's part of their religious beliefs?

Re: Christians arrested for defending there beliefs
 

And we are only hearing from one side - the Mail and the couple who have been charged.

Re: Christians arrested for defending there beliefs
 

This might well be the only country in the world where this could happen. Even the Taliban allowed people to have their own beliefs. It comes to something when it could be said that the Taliban are more tolerant about something than the Government of this country.

Link

Re: Christians arrested for defending there beliefs
 

We *are* tolerant in this country. We are free to believe what we wish. The problem arose in this case because the Christians called Mohammed a warlord and said that the way they dress their women was a form of bondage.

How would Christians react if a Muslim insulted their way of life in a similar way.

Re: Christians arrested for defending there beliefs
 

We don't know all the details, you might want to hold back the wave of righteous anger until we find out what they actually said. Since as Foreverwar pointed out we only have the side of the accused and the Daily Mail, who will always be against the Muslim side.

Re: Christians arrested for defending there beliefs
 

Of course you also need to see where the article came from in the first place.

Re: Christians arrested for defending there beliefs
 

oopps me bad lol

---------- Post added at 11:13 ---------- Previous post was at 11:12 ----------

how often does anybody on either side of the fence hold back on here ;)

Re: Christians arrested for defending there beliefs
 

P.S it's in the Telegraph as well http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/news...lim-guest.html

But not in the Liverpool Echo

Re: Christians arrested for defending there beliefs
 

Depends on who 'We' refers to. There is the general population and then there are those in control.

They do, all the time.

If something/someone is allowed to be praised, then it/they must be allowed to be criticised. Otherwise what is left is a distorted viewpoint.

Re: Christians arrested for defending there beliefs
 

I personally have had to see the religion I followed bad mouthed on a regular basis. I will discuss with anyone and if someone saying something nasty about what I think then I certainly do not go running to the man and tittle tackle. Some of these Muslim moaners (and I now its a minority of them) need to grow some balls

Re: Christians arrested for defending there beliefs
 

They may/may not react in similar fashion but the real question is would the police get involved and would the case come to court?

In any event, given the abject failure of the authorities to deal with the far more serious abuse and harrassment suffered by this family over a period of years, I think most people would think this incident is trivial by comparison and ought not to be occupying the Courts.

Re: Christians arrested for defending there beliefs
 

Hmmm, whilst having exceptionally limited knowledge of the Public Order Act from what I do know I wouldn't have thought it should applied in cases like this.

Still the CPS know best. Considering the levels of evidence they demand before they authorise charging (thankfully not in Scotland. Yay!) they must reckon they've got a decent case and chance of conviction.

Re: Christians arrested for defending there beliefs
 

yeah either that or some Muslim pressure group said charge them or we will cry discrimination

Re: Christians arrested for defending there beliefs
 

I cannot disagree with you over that one.Seems to me though that the case in question here has a good chance of being proven and adds another tick to the stats sheets..whereas the suicide pair were viewed as nuisances because it would have been more time consuming to chase up and there was a severe shortage of staff on hand because they were probably all busy writing up reports in triplicate.

Re: Christians arrested for defending there beliefs
 

There is a massive difference between criticising and insulting. I would say that the Christians in this case did the latter. Criticism can be justified. Insults cannot.

We don't know the full details, but based upon available evidence, I do think that at most, this should be a civil (and not criminal) offence, and should have been sorted long before it reached court.

Re: Christians arrested for defending there beliefs
 

Seeing as Christianity doesn't say that Mohammed was a warlord etc this is more about a Muslim person (apparently) getting offended by something the couple supposedly said.

I wouldn't mind betting she had 'encouragement' to take action but in any case the fact the couple are Christians has as I see it, nothing to do with this at all. Just the usual Daily Mail "Muslims are taking over" BS.

Re: Christians arrested for defending there beliefs
 

I'd imagine the conversation didn't stop with calling Mohammed a warlord, but went on to suggest he was a paedophile too.

Re: Christians arrested for defending there beliefs
 

I'm guessing those with a fondness for putting words in people's mouths would consider anything fair game if it whips up some controversy. Good old Daily Mail and its fans.

Re: Christians arrested for defending there beliefs
 

I don't think that the couple being Christians had anything to do with it, but with being anything but a Muslim. Do you think that if it had been a fellow Muslim says whatever had been said, that a complaint, never mind a charge would have been made?

It's not as if the couple originated the views allegedly expressed, many people(including many Muslims) have been expressing them for a long time.
Link

Re: Christians arrested for defending there beliefs
 

You don't know what they said. The full details of what they said cannot be revealed for 'legal reasons'.

Re: Christians arrested for defending there beliefs
 

Hence the use of phrases such as 'whatever had been said' and 'views allegedly expressed'.

Re: Christians arrested for defending there beliefs
 

From one side.....

Re: Christians arrested for defending there beliefs
 

But from the side that will have legal documents from the CPS to back up what they say they have been accused of.

Re: Christians arrested for defending there beliefs
 

No, from the side that has been published by the media in the way the media wish to present it.

Re: Christians arrested for defending there beliefs
 

They and the CPS are the ones with copies of the legal documents. They can prove what they are being accused of, which is the issue here, not what actually did or didn't happen. The case will be Crown v ...., not X v Y.

When a Jehovah's Witness calls at my door and I explain that I don't believe in God, am I likely to get arrested as a result? What if I criticise their beliefs with regard to blood transfusions?

Re: Christians arrested for defending there beliefs
 

Actually, it is fairly relevant what did or did not happen - it's what's normally called "evidence".

The CPS feel there is enough evidence to bring a case against the couple, but then have not commented further - unlike the couple and their supporters, who obviously (and quite rightly) have their own slant on this.

btw, my personal thoughts on this are that if this was just a spirited discussion about each faith (merits and issues), it's really dumb to have a court case about - but, unfortunately, there is not enough information to validate this assumption.

Re: Christians arrested for defending there beliefs
 

Re: Christians arrested for defending there beliefs
 

was muhammad a war lord ?



26 battles suggest to me he may have been something along those lines


1. WADDAN
2. SAFWAN
3. DUL-ASHIR
4. BADR
5. BANI SALIM
6. BANI QUAINUQA
7. SAWIQ
8. GHATFAN
9. BAHRAN
10. UHAD
11. HUMRA-UL-ASAD
12. BANU NUDAIR
13. DHATUR RIQA
14. BADRU-UKHRA
15. DUMATUL-JANDAL
16. BANU MUSTALEQ WITH HADRAT JAWRIYA
17. AHZAB
18. BANI QURAIZA
19. BANI LAHYAN
20. DHI QARD
21. KHAIBAR
22. WADIYUL-QURA AND TAIM
23. MECCA AND FALL OF MECCA
24. HUNAIN
25. GHAZWA
26. TABUK

Re: Christians arrested for defending there beliefs
 

I don't think the real issue should be whether or not he was a warlord, but whether someone is allowed to freely claim that he was and, just as equally, someone should be allowed to freely claim that he wasn't.

Re: Christians arrested for defending there beliefs
 

cant argue with that .

Re: Christians arrested for defending there beliefs
 

No one has said anyone can't, just as no one has said this is why they were charged - it's what else that was said (that we don't know about/has not been reported) that may be the reason for the Public Order offence.

If you read further down the article, the defendant's solicitor states
It all, imho, depends what is meant by "explaining those beliefs to others that do not hold similar views" - we have had posters on this forum whose idea of "explaining their beliefs" was to verbally attack, in a virulent and abusive manner, those who did not agree with them; but I am sure it will all come out in the trial.

Re: Christians arrested for defending there beliefs
 

What's your definition of a Warlord though? What's the definition by the agreived and defendants?

Re: Christians arrested for defending there beliefs
 

Re: Christians arrested for defending there beliefs
 

Yep - if only life in 21st C. Britain was a simple as that......

Re: Christians arrested for defending there beliefs
 

or free from oppression.

Re: Christians arrested for defending there beliefs
 

or free from political correctness and intolerance..

Re: Christians arrested for defending there beliefs
 

Minor prophet? That's a new one to me.
Mortal prophet yes, but certainly not minor!

Re: Christians arrested for defending there beliefs
 

But intolerance is basically a difference of opinion. Those that refer to people being bigots are actually by definition, bigots, for calling others bigots.:D

Re: Christians arrested for defending there beliefs
 

Tortuous, and faulty, imho, logic.

For example - I think that the Klu Klux Klan, who treated African-Americans as a lesser race, lynched them, and terrorised them by setting fire to houses, churches, and beating those who stepped out of line, were bigots.

I think those who ran the apartheid regime in South Africa, treating the original inhabitants of the country as third-class citizens with less rights because they had a different colour of skin, were bigots.

Lynching people is not "a difference of opinion". ;)

Re: Christians arrested for defending there beliefs
 

So much for the right to free speech. Another one way street. Pandering to the Muslims.

Muslims calling our troops murderers out on the streets = no action.

Christians saying Muh was a warlord = Firing squad.

No wonder we`re the laughing stock of the world.:td::td:

Re: Christians arrested for defending there beliefs
 

Re: Christians arrested for defending there beliefs
 

The mail doesn't arouse resentment. "I" resent Muslims denouncing our troops as murderers. Theres a limit to free speech, & they crossed the line. We do pander to their beliefs, & I for one am sick & tired of hearing about Muslims, & their rights.

Re: Christians arrested for defending there beliefs
 

Any other examples where we apparently 'pander' to their beliefs?

Let me guess, Winterval? Baa Baa rainbow sheep?

Re: Christians arrested for defending there beliefs
 

I suppose if you're going to be selective as to when people use the term 'bigot', then I suppose that you think that a drive-by shooting or putting a tyre around someone's neck, filling it with petrol, and setting it alight is just 'a difference of opinion'.

Re: Christians arrested for defending there beliefs
 

With you quotin em, case closed.

Re: Christians arrested for defending there beliefs
 

How many Muslims do this? It's not their fault if you decide to characterise the entire religion based on the action of a minority. You could say the same for fundamentalist Christians of which the United States has many examples if you wished to 'resent' Christians. How about the Jewish faith? Quite successful in America and anti-Semites use examples of their success to say America is 'run by jews'.

The Mail does feed this resentment to Muslims by publishing, time and time again, examples of pandering to Muslims. The fact these mostly tend to be mis-characterisation of the events or outright lies means nothing to those who already wish to find a reason to dislike Muslims.

Re: Christians arrested for defending there beliefs
 

No - I thought you did.

Re: Christians arrested for defending there beliefs
 

You do realise that both incidents were fallacies and didn't really happen?

Re: Christians arrested for defending there beliefs
 

So hang on, you believe in freedom of speach, except when it breaches the peace, such as insulting our forces in public (which I agree, the police should have intervened), one would presume because we look up to them, respect them, and hold them dear, but not for when muslims have people they look up to, respect or hold dear?

Re: Christians arrested for defending there beliefs
 

Yes but those told out to be false didn't they? More ammuniation for the Muslim-haters to cause resentment against Muslims. Most of whom have done nothing to deserve the resentment they get from ignorant, ill-informed, people.

Re: Christians arrested for defending their beliefs
 

I knew that would get you all going. Short answer, Religion is a pain. Its responsible for most of the trouble in this world, with Muslims leading it.

damien. I hope your not flaming me by calling me names, are you?

Re: Christians arrested for defending their beliefs
 

No, ignorance and intolerance of religion is the pain as well as biased reported and people being only too willing to believe its headlines.

Re: Christians arrested for defending their beliefs
 

Why?

Re: Christians arrested for defending their beliefs
 

Because armchair experts are only too willing to believe any headline about religion rather than research the matter objectively.

Re: Christians arrested for defending their beliefs
 

PEOPLE are responsible for most of the trouble in this world..even those who eschew religion have been known to stamp all over peoples rights and use violence to achieve their ends.Look at the way Communist Russian and Communist Asian countries have stamped all over people's freedoms.

Re: Christians arrested for defending their beliefs
 

Hmmm, So the reports of riots, idiots shouting at soldiers, & so many other FILM reports are false too? I don't read any newspapers m8, I can only say what I see, in most countries where the Army has been in the last 40 years, Religion has often been the driving force behind the violence.

Maggy, Yep, I agree.

Re: Christians arrested for defending their beliefs
 

As you say, you weren't there, you only know what you've been told. I'm not saying it didn't happen but you're relying on reporting to form your opinion. And if you use the Mail for that then we've shown you what will go wrong.

As has politics, greed, weapons, drugs etc.

Re: Christians arrested for defending their beliefs
 

[QUOTE=Russ B;34875476]As you say, you weren't there, you only know what you've been told. I'm not saying it didn't happen but you're relying on reporting to form your opinion. And if you use the Mail for that then we've shown you what will go wrong.[QUOTE]


No Russ. I said I only say what I see. Like I said, I didn't read papers.

Re: Christians arrested for defending their beliefs
 

Do you do any other research on religions? Or do you just decide that the whole thing should be banned based on the actions of a few? I'm really curious as to why you're so against one of the main facets of my life when I (and AFAIK nobody I know) pose you no risk at all.

Re: Christians arrested for defending their beliefs
 

I`m certainly not against any beliefs you have. You have the right to believe what you want, & the right to say it. Just as I have the right to say what I want. As long as people don't break the law, free speech is part of our life. Not so in some countries.

We`ve been here before Russ. you are a believer, I`m a non believer.

Every war has a cause. Religion has played a very large part in most conflicts I have ever either been involved in, or read about in text books.

You believe your religion is the "true" & right one. Other people believe their religion is the right one, immediately, there is a conflict. People have killed each other for their beliefs since time began.

I have no intention of researching religion m8. I couldn't live long enough to get through them all. I prefer to spend my time doing something I want to do, even if its washing the pots.

I hold no bad feelings toward people who believe in God. Just as I hold no bad feeling toward anyone who believes in Science.

I cant remember the last time "Non believers" went onto the streets ranting & chanting about their beliefs, or the last war which had "Non believing" at its roots.

Re: Christians arrested for defending their beliefs
 

You've just summed up my point perfectly. Why does there have to be a conflict? I'm a Man United supporter, a few of my mates follow Liverpool, does that mean I go around their houses with stanley knives on match days? I follow Swansea, a good mate of mine supports Cardiff. Those 2 teams have one of the most violent rivalries in the UK. How is it I don't try to glass him when I walk in my local when the 2 teams are playing?

This is what I mean by religious ignorance, people automatically assume much without actually doing any research (and reading the Mail is not research). I've got no issues with people following a different deity. What I do object to is people telling me their view is right and mine is wrong (this can come from followers of other faiths or in CF's case followers of atheism). Interestingly I have never heard someone of a different faith tell me that. Ever. None of my Christian friends have tried to convert anyone. You only pay attention to the ones who hassle you in the street, or cause pain, torture or death to others.

Enough atheists rant about being non-believers on CF. Some are even proud of being 'born again atheists'.

Gulf? Falklands? WW1? WW2?

Re: Christians arrested for defending their beliefs
 

Enough atheists rant about being non-believers on CF. Some are even proud of being 'born again atheists'.[ quote russ B]


i'd be hurt by that if i gave a hoot :)

Re: Christians arrested for defending their beliefs
 

Not interested in hurting anyone - just pointing out people evangelise on all sides.

Re: Christians arrested for defending their beliefs
 

We've had several "christians" on here stating atheists are wrong for their beliefs Russ, just as we've had atheists saying religious people are wrong to believe, or in a few cases that the atheists believe it to be morally wrong but not that the believer is wrong to hold their beliefs as is their right, after all each of us has a different moral code.
Oh and of course, who could forget, we've also had christians on here going as far as to say other christians aren't actually christians.

Re: Christians arrested for defending their beliefs
 

[/QUOTE]You've just summed up my point perfectly. Why does there have to be a conflict? [/QUOTE]

Human nature.



[/QUOTE]This is what I mean by religious ignorance, people automatically assume much without actually doing any research (and reading the Mail is not research).
[/QUOTE]


Please Russ, I have told you so many times, I dont read newspapers.


[/QUOTE]You only pay attention to the ones who hassle you in the street, or cause pain, torture or death to others.?[/QUOTE]


I must admit, I have a grudge against bullies,


[/QUOTE]Enough atheists rant about being non-believers on CF. Some are even proud of being 'born again atheists'.?[/QUOTE]


Even CF members have the right to Free Speech Russ.


[/QUOTE]Gulf? Falklands? WW1? WW2?[/QUOTE]


Hmmmmmm. Have a re-think.

Re: Christians arrested for defending their beliefs
 

You never give up do you? That last line was aimed at me - and saying things like that is expressing an opinion that some might find controversial (although I'm sure the majority don't care seeing as it was backed up with scriptural references to show why I came to that conclusion) but is infiniately removed from causing wars, ranting in the street, conflicts etc

Re: Christians arrested for defending their beliefs
 

Non-Christians?

Re: Christians arrested for defending their beliefs
 

Yes - plenty of them tell us there's no God etc. While they're entitlted to that view they have no right to moan when they get accosted by the 'God Squad'.

Re: Christians arrested for defending their beliefs
 

'We' did buy some space on a bus though...

https://www.cableforum.co.uk/images/...2009/09/12.jpg

Re: Christians arrested for defending their beliefs
 

Never give what up Russ? :confused:

Re: Christians arrested for defending their beliefs
 

Human nature to insist on there being a conflict when there is none?

It wasn't aimed at you.

So I can count on your support when the atheist armchair experts come along and round on me in threads like this?

I'd never deny them that. But surely they can have no reason to complain when these Christians (apparently) come knocking on doors and 'bother' them in the street.

I just did. The answers stay the same though.

Re: Christians arrested for defending their beliefs
 

You've misunderstood SMG's point, which is easy to do, I had to read it several times.
To ask it a different way; what was the last war fought by athiests for their belief in no god?

Re: Christians arrested for defending their beliefs
 

That's only a valid point if removing a belief in a god would reduce wars or fighting. As you know people will find any reason to fight be it land, power, racism or whatever.

Re: Christians arrested for defending their beliefs
 

Totally agree, while religion can be a rallying factor in wars as we're seeing at the moment, in most cases any difference with the "enemy" can be used instead although probably to a lesser effect.
Religion is probably the easiest tool to use for the job.

Would an Islamic suicide bomber still blow himself up if he was instead a humanist arab?

Re: Christians arrested for defending their beliefs
 

Russ, You are a very religious person, that I know from our conversations, but I dont think any of this is personal, its simply that people have different views. Anyone is entitled to their opinions m8, its when people take exception to whats being preached, or denied, that people start to get upset, like I said earlier, Human nature, being what it is, doesn`t take much to cause a conflict.

Believe me m8, we are quite capable of fighting & killing without provocation.

---------- Post added at 00:42 ---------- Previous post was at 00:25 ----------


I moan when I am accosted. I dont want any of the God squad preaching THEIR beliefs to me. My view is simple, & as I have said many times.

My attitude is, if you believe, fine, just DONT bother me with YOUR beliefs.

I only get annoyed when idiots, wheather its religion or double glazing or some other subject I`m not interested in, bother me & try to either convert me, or flog their crap.

In a debate, its my choice to either flip to Datacave, or join in. People, in my opinion, have no right to try & preach their religion, or Atheism, to others.

---------- Post added at 00:51 ---------- Previous post was at 00:42 ----------

Originally Posted by SMG http://www.cableforum.co.uk/board/im...s/viewpost.gif
I must admit, I have a grudge against bullies,

100%,

Re: Christians arrested for defending their beliefs
 

One thought that goes through my mind, is that if people like the one's in this thread are "always" being persecuted for being offensive to Muslims, how on earth does the Daily Hate and other papers of its ilk get away with their constant drip drip anti-Muslim stories?
It seems to me this cowards paper is no better than the poop-stirrer who hides at the back of a crowd goading others to take action, whilst he holds he's hands up saying "nothing to do with me guv".
I doubt that any other newspaper has done more to alienate the nation against one section of society than this shameless rag has...and yet they still seem to get away with it.

Re: Christians arrested for defending their beliefs
 

We aren't safe in our own country anymore.

Re: Christians arrested for defending their beliefs
 

We must choose our free speech words very carefully.

Re: Christians arrested for defending their beliefs
 

Or as my Nan used to say 'if you can't say summat nice,say nothing at all'.

Re: Christians arrested for defending their beliefs
 

To quote Steven Weinberg (Noble Prize for Physics 1979).

"With or without religion, good people can behave well and bad people can do evil; but for good people to do evil—that takes religion. "

Re: Christians arrested for defending their beliefs
 

What? Free to use threatening, abusive or insulting words?
Out of interest, do you support what those who shouted abuse at our soldiers did, now what they said, but for using abusive and insulting words?

Re: Christians arrested for defending their beliefs
 

But it is being suggested that it wasn't the arrested couple that started the topic. So, it may not be one side made comments that where classed as offensive and the other side didn't, but only one side complained and it happened to be the one side, the Police and the CPS would take any notice of.

Re: Christians arrested for defending their beliefs
 

If two people in a public place within earshot of me breach section 5 of the Public order act, then I'd be well within my rights to report them and expect them to be arrested.
Doesn't matter that I wasn't part of the conversation, or even if I was the other side of the room, they broke the law, I can chose to report them for it.

Re: Christians arrested for defending their beliefs
 

A quick question to all those who have criticised the muslims in this case:

If *you* followed a religion, and someone suggested that the founder of *that* religion was a warlord, and then suggested that the clothing that the womenfolk of *your* religion was a form of bondage, how would you react? Would you be offended? Would you just laugh it off?

And yes, if you follow no religion, you can answer this. Just imagine for a second that you did follow a religion.

I personally would be offended.

Re: Christians arrested for defending their beliefs
 

But this looks like a case of X starts an discussion/argument with Y, X insults Y's religion but Y brushes it aside and isn't fascist and so doesn't complain. Y then says something in reply which X deems insulting and complains to the Police. It wasn't a third party who reported it, it was a participant in the discussion.

Re: Christians arrested for defending their beliefs
 

Well isn't this fun first off hardly anyone supports that very small non representative group of malcontents that were throwing abuse at our troops and that has been stated many times on here as well as many other places and by many many muslims as well. Secondly this issue is nothing to do with that at all and why that issue is raising it's head in this thread is beyond me as that was out and out abuse and incitement by a bunch of trouble makers and nothing at all to do with free speech.

This issue though is a little more complicated and what is valid is the argument that it should be in civil not criminal court. As for the couple themselves i have googled the hotel in question and no where on their advertising do i see it state this is a christian run hotel or mention christianity at all. So why did they feel it appropriate to enter into a discussion about religion at the breakfast table and would they have done so if they didn't have a muslim guest.

From the little we know and there is obviously a great deal we do not know words were uttered that anyone with half a brain would have known were insulting and highly offensive to anyone of the muslim faith and therefore should not have been said by owners of any establishment that is open to the public. How many whites were present and was this muslim lady the only non white there ? (i know that simplifys the whole religion thing as you don't have to be white to be a christian or non white to be a muslim).

If that was the case then this is not about free speech it could be about something a little more sinister such as out and out bullying by people looking to make some worthless point.

I think religion is being misused here in the case of the owners and i think it is only being used by the daily hate to create a "christian vs muslim in the homeland of christianity" type of attitude and to whip up some good ol anti muslim hate which this particular paper seems to revel in doing. Taking this to court is not a case of pandering to muslims or a further erosion of this and that for the benefit of muslims as some like to see it. What we seem to have is a couple of people with beliefs who chose to express views not commonly held by christianity as a whole (as far as i know) as an attack on a person staying at their hotel and trying to hide behind religion as an excuse.

Never have i stayed at a hotel even some openly christian ones where religion was a breakfast table discussion point and certainly not to the point that this so called discussion went too. If you look at it another way this muslim lady is fighting a decline in one of the things we british used to take great pride in that being a good host\hostess which this couple were certainly not.

Re: Christians arrested for defending their beliefs
 

Doesn't matter who said what first or last,when dealing with other people's religion and beliefs one should tread lightly and carefully and RESPECTFULLY.If you can't, best to say NOTHING and keep your real thoughts to yourself.

Just having the right to free speech doesn't give one cart blanche to be offensive or rude or abusive or DISRESPECTFUL.

Or as my Nan used to say, think before you speak...;)

Re: Christians arrested for defending their beliefs
 

I would not be offended. People are free to speak their own minds, as long as its within the law.

Freedom of expression is a right. However, as I watch the 6 Italian soldiers on TV, being given a state funeral, the crowds turned out to honour them, I cast my mind back to the useless idiot Musim protestors who slagged & shouted at our troops. I am disgusted. Is it any wonder people show disgust? Some Muslims are just a pain in the ARSSE.

Re: Christians arrested for defending their beliefs
 

I suggest that you are building supposition upon supposition (I can find at least 5 in your post) to support your position, as none of what you are stating is in the original Daily Fail article - do you have another source, please?

Re: Christians arrested for defending their beliefs
 

Some as in very few. I mean how many were there? It was a very, very small group. Less than 10 if I recall. That nutter 'Christian' church in America (Their name escapes me) which has similar numbers and pickets the funerals of dead American soldiers are quite similar.

So some Christains are also a pain (which is a nice way to put it!) as are some Muslims/Jews/Jehovah's Witnesses/Atheists/Agnostics.

Re: Christians arrested for defending their beliefs
 

Excuse me? If I complain that a group of asians insult our armed forces, I'm a fascist am I?
It doesn't matter what the subject is about, if an offense under section 5 of the Public order act has been comitted, then anyone who is the victim of it can report it to the police.

Again I ask, how is calling Mohammed a warlord or stating what women of another religion wear is bondage in any way defending christian religious beliefs?

What evidence have you got that the couple had their religious beliefs insulted?

Re: Christians arrested for defending their beliefs
 

One of the problems with using online news references is that an article can often be changed later.
Daily Telegraph
The story is starting to travel the world, US, India, Germany, Canada.

Re: Christians arrested for defending their beliefs
 

Or they can use British law.

Re: Christians arrested for defending their beliefs
 

1) thank you for you full answers to my question posted above
2) So according to Neil Addison, the (self-proclaimed) expert in religious law, if someone is insulting you or something you hold dear, the solution is to walk away? Would this hold true for those who were very upset (myself included) by the behaviour of the idiots who protested when the Royal Anglians marched through Luton?

As someone on another forum stated

Re: Christians arrested for defending their beliefs
 

Calling out Troops "Murderers" is not only unreasonable, but very likely to incite a riot. Bit different than an argument about "Ficticional" Gods.