Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

http://www.broadbandtvnews.com/?p=18837

Extremely high ?

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

Makes me wonder if Sky get these channels are we going to see another spat between the two of them.

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

Virgin would be extremely stupid to sell them to Sky at any price. They would be completely at the mercy of a company that runs not only the most successful pay-TV delivery platform, but also the most successful channels. Virgin would be left with only a delivery platform, and totally reliant on its major competitor to provide any decent content to show on it.

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

But that's what Virgin want, Virgin don't want to be a content provider.

It's the old NTL business plan. NTL made up their minds many years ago that they just wanted to deliver the service over their network.

Viritually all of the TV side of things came over with Telewest, and I don't think it has sat well ever since.

I also agree, I don't think VM need to be a content provider.

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

I'm wondering though how much of an improvement Sky could make to those channels if it did buy them, but before that could happen how much time would have to lapse before the sale is agreed assuming the sale would require ofcom approval.

Do VM take the lower bid risking little if any ofcom oversight (assuming the buyer wouldn't come under ofcom), or do they go for the big money and a lengthy wait for the cheque to clear whilst ofcom take their time? :)

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

I doubt Sky sees any opportunity to improve the viewer experience with those channels. At Sky, controlling and dominating the market are considered valid business objectives.

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

There are some hours in the day when Sky don't have enough capacity to screen episodes of the Simpsons. Perhaps they could utilise the purchased channels to ensure Simpsons is always available. :erm:

Seriously though, I'm sure Chris is correct regards Sky's objectives. I'm not so sure Sky would have it all their own way.

The recent dispute showed that, despite being the dominant pay TV provider, Sky need VM more than VM need Sky.

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

I'm surprised Sky has the cash available with the loss it made on buying ITV shares..

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

Sky has alot of money and will make it back if it does buy the channels.

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

Bit like most other companies then.

Sky buying won't really change things too much I don't think.

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

VM has supposedly been selling its channels for what, 3 years now? So, I'll believe it when it happens.

Berkett said last year, that he was trying to find out the value of the channels and the only way to do that is to see what someone else is prepared to pay for them by putting them up for auction.

The value of the actual channels is pretty minimal, I believe it's the Sky EPG slots that is where the real value is gleamed from.

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

They sure do have a lot of money, VM would be crazy to sell to Sky, what would Sky do then, likely charge an arm and a leg for VM to carry the channels and therefore VM then losing the channels completely for months or years just like the Sky basics.

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

Given the new contracts for the Sky Basics now I suspect Sky wouldn't do much, but thinking long term it does mean that in the not so distant future Sky would have the opportunity to deprive VM of a much bigger portion of the available content.

Don't forget Sky is the company that was prepared to throw away millions purely to stop VM buying something that would potentially make them more competitive against Sky (ITV). I'm sure that ethos of throwing money at things, accepting they may lose it, to hurt VM hasn't changed.

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

Or VM sell to Sky conditionally on keeping access to those and whatever other channels for x years, they get cash from the channels and keep access to them, Sky get more for their world domination plans.

Makes perfect sense to me and I suspect to both companies.

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

This would affect TNA Wrestling programming such as, TNA Impact, TNA Epics and TNA pay-per-view broadcasts. Sky airs WWE programming, hence the problem. It is doubtful World Wrestling Entertainment's deal would negatively affect UFC, but there is a good chance it would negatively affect TNA.

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

nice quote from a wrestling site there. (http://www.wrestling-edge.com/tnanew..._from=&ucat=2&)

TNA makes better ratings over here tht in the US and the live shows over here do better than there US live shows, it would make sence for someone to pick them up if they have to.

Also if Sky bought the channels and WWE said to get rid of TNA then that could be seen as an anti-competative move and could show WWE as trying to create a monopoly on US wrestling shows broadcast in the uk.

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

They would be crazy to sell Virgin Media Television! It would mean less on-demand content,higher subscription fees and lower chance of competiting with Sky.

By keeping Virgin Media Television,its hold Virgin TV security in competiting with Sky.

I mean Living is the UK's most popular channel! What the hell!

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

As everyone knows, l have always been critical of VM Tv etc, and l believe if Sky does buy VM channels, it will benefit the consumer, and that is paramount.

Even though, they have had arguments before, between them, if the customers gets a better deal, then l am for it.

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

In my personal opinion, VM make very little from the TV service as they always lost money from it and is mainly used as a retention tool. That is why you used to have to have a phone to get the TV service and currently you can only get the free package (size m) if you have a phone line.
Phone and BB make money, TV doesn't, so the only investment into TV is to keep customers on the BB and phone! (minimum to stop churn)

This isn't my perfessional opinion! (If you want that, PM me)

hic! :drunk:

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

monkey, VM TV and the cable TV package are completely different things. Nothing will change with regards to cable TV, VM TV are the ones who product Virgin 1, etc.

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

This is how Virgin TV,Virgin Media Television and UKTV Channels are:

Virgin TV:

Cable TV platform and service provider with multiple choice of channels from a range different broadcasters such as BBC,Virgin Media Television,UKTV,Sky,Discovery,Viacom,MTV and a few more. Virgin TV delivers direct to the consumer. The TV channels and on-demand content are brought to you by Virgin Media limited, each cable franchise is listed as a private limited company of its own and is owned by Virgin Media which is a plc for example, Cable London Limited which covers Enfield,Camden,Harringey,Hackney and Islington of north London. That way it makes it easier to sell of individual franchises if they are under performing.

Virgin Media Television:

This is a TV channel broadcaster for the UK Pay-TV and Digital terrestrial market. It is also content provider for Virgin TV. The company owns and broadcasts Living,Living 2,Living+1,Living+2,Challenge TV,Challenge+1,Challenge Jackpot,Bravo,Bravo+1,Bravo 2,Virgin 1 and Virgin1+1. Virgin Media Television also owns a percentage of Setanta sports news. Virgin Media Television previously was part of United Artists group and became wholly owned by the Telewest Broadband group in 2000. Orignally,the broadcaster aired Bravo,The Childrens Channel(TCC)(Now Trouble),The Family Channel(Now Challenge TV) and in 2005 Player which became Bravo 2 and FTN which is now Virgin 1. Living became part of the group in the mid-90's,previously UKTV held Living and was called UK Living.

UKTV channels:

This is also a broacaster and airs the following channels; Watch,Watch+1,Alibi,Alibi+1,G.O.L.D,Dave,Dave+1,Ed en,Blighty,Home,Home+1,YEsterday,UKTV Food and UKTV gardens.

It is a 50/50 joint venture between the BBC and Virgin Media Television. The broadcaster airs is channels across: Virgin TV,Sky,Tiscali TV,Smallworld Media TV,Wight Cable and Freeview as well as Top up TV.

Virgin Media Group has planned to offload its 50% share in UKTV channels. This is not the whole of Virgin Media Television. It is recommendable as it will release a lot of cash,Virgin Media doesn't really provide much content for these channels anyway and popularity for these channels is decreasing which is why they have all been rebranded!

I don't think Virgin Media is 100% sure it wants to sell Virgin Media Television, Living TV has aired exclusive shows and provides Virgin Media,Tiscali TV and BT Vision customers a lot of on-demand content. This channel is very popular and must bring in a lot of revenue!

Furthermore, Virgin Media has also looked into the possibility of acquiring Playboy, why would they be interested in buying that if they no longer want to be a content provider???

As mentioned above Virgin Media do use Virgin TV as a tool to keep Phone and broadband customers,however Virgin Media also use Broadband and phone and even Virgin Mobile to keep Virgin TV subscribers.

And you don't have to take Virgin phone to get Virgin TV, You can still order Virgin TV as a stand alone product through tele-sales. Bare in mind there are some streets and franchises that do not have Virgin's own telephone service.

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

has the sky offer gone through is there a time limite any new news on whats going on as it all seems to have gone quiet

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

That article clarifies that BSkyB haven't been banned from bidding, just banned from buying it on the cheap through a third company.

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

Why would they bother to do that if they did not intend to decline Sky's bid?

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

So that if Sky win the bid they fork up as much as possible for them because VM know they can afford it :D

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

I think that making a quick buck selling these channels to Sky would be a huge mistake, and would possibly be something the Competition Commission would need to be made aware of. Sky have a ridiculous level of control in the market as it is, and with Living in their grasp I'm tempted to believe that Sky would simply charge what they like for them.

I guess the way around it would be to build a set carriage cost in to the sale, but still I don't fancy it.

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

Mistake, but if Sky are offering the highest bid VM have to come up with some seriously good reasons to their shareholders why they declined it.

The clause is not an uncommon one - it should be remembered that VM and News Corp, through their holding in BSkyB, are competitors! No doubt there will also be a clause there guaranteeing VM carriage of all the channels for the foreseeable future also.

It's not about sticking it to 'the man' it's just business. VM are perfectly happy to sell to Sky but are not naive enough to underestimate Sky's 'Uncle Rupert' and the reach of his company.

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

Looks like it's back on again according to Media Guardian.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2010...b-virgin-media

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

does anyone think now $KY have got thier hands on VMTV channels we will see the following:

$ky will make VMTV move the channels to the highest pack of VM effectivly losing 8/9 channels for (M+ AND L Subs)
$ky will encrypt V1 ON FREEVIEW AND MAKE IT PART OF THE PICNIC
$ky will make sure we virgin customers on a regular basis that VM have lost the channels.


I for one is very un-happy that this has happened

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

It hasn't happened - the Guardian think it MAY happen

As for what you have said

1) Even if Sky bought the channels the carriage agreement would still be in effect meaning the channels would stay exactly where they are

2) Sky have not had any regulatory agreement for Picnic - at the moment that's dead in the water and Sky are concentrating on providing Broadband VoD to their satellite customers instead

3) It's not in their interests to gloat if they did buy them - as that would likely bring the regulators eye to look very closely at the purchase

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

but $KY could change the carriage agreement as an when they please IF they have the channels.

ok Picnic is dead in the water

as for Sky not gloating we only need to look at the vm/sky dispute for thier gloating!!

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

No they couldn't - however once the current carriage agreement ends then there would have to be a renegotiation.

That was different. That was after Virgin decided not to pay for the channels at the price Sky wanted. So the gloating was over the fact that Virgin could have the channels but didn't want them - not who owned them

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

ok i see ur point... we will just have to wait and see what happens... But im pestimistic about the whole $ky buisness!

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

Saw this over on a comment on the Guardian article

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/5c024c4c-0...44feabdc0.html

Virgin has undertaken a series of refinancing deals that have reduced net debt and postponed the maturity dates of loans towards the end of the decade. Because of that, said Mr Berkett, there was "no compelling need" to sell assets such as Virgin Media's pay-TV channels, which include Living and Bravo.

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

wat does this actually mean tho... Im not that smart...lol

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

It would mean Sky would have more of a monopoly of tv content, which most would say is a bad thing.

It would mean that VM would loose any bargaining with Sky over the price of carrying there channels. Again a bad thing.

I can't think of anything good. :(

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

I think he meant what does the FT thing mean.

According to that it means that Virgin don't see the need to sell the channels at the moment - so the Guardian article maybe complete speculation

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

Oh I see. He didn't quote your post so I didn't realise.

I hope you are right about it maybe being just speculation.

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

Well if Virgin Media do sell the TV channels then they have failed. I think they should just get rid of the UKTV channels.

Rather than sell off Virgin Media TV, they would be better off offering more content and more channels, better still,they would better off at TV Broadcasting rather than being a service provider.

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

And the multi-billion pound network fits into this how?

I'm re-reading and it still reads that you're suggesting that Virgin Media would be better off getting rid of the retail operation and becoming a broadcaster and content producer.

VMTV is not a core business. VM will ensure that they have access to the channels at reasonable rates written into the sale - they know given half the chance Sky would screw them over and will ensure that they don't.

VM are financially very savvy, note how they have consistently managed to stay ahead of the curve refinancing their debt with quite advantageous terms. If they think the time and value is right then it probably is, and there's no reason why selling to Sky would be an issue.

Most cable companies don't have content arms, doesn't make them a failure makes them a platform operator purchasing content and distributing it via their greatest asset, their network.

VM have plenty enough cash to not need to sell, if they do it will be purely for operational reasons.

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

Newspapers are extremely good at putting two and two together and making 22,222.

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

sky should say to virgin we will give you 2 pence for dem make virgin sell them for nothing

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

Just what we need another miss-informed troll on the forums:rolleyes::td:

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

indeed... I think it's best to ignore "da troll" :D

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

What was that is there an under bridge dweller about :LOL:

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

seems so "unda da bridge!" :LOL: :rofl:

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

I think it's Arthurs cousin!:D

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

If VM do sell of their channels to Sky so that they can concentrate on their broadband, and mobile services, as well as TV On Demand, does that mean that our subs will increase even more?

Over the years, buying and selling by companies NEVER, NEVER EVER benefits the customer, only the shareholders and managers. And with incomes continuing to shrink (apart from the managers and the shareholders of course) it might mean that more and more people are going to find it much harder to meet their ever increasing bills.

In any case, I thought that with Sky buying these channels from VM is supposed to be anti-competitive.

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

How old are you young man our 5 year olds sentences make more sense.;):D

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

yous only have a problem cos yous no im rite so yous have 2 react like this u are :dunce::D

i am 15 years young not that dat matters:confused::td::dozey:

---------- Post added at 08:42 ---------- Previous post was at 08:40 ----------

u are just scared cos sky is gonna kill virginity media :P

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

Fifteen? I must admit I had you down as being a bit younger. Perhaps because I've got a 13 year old grandson who is a lot more mature than you.

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

Please stick to the topic, and remember that baiting any member is likely to get you warnings.

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

Not scared at all.. I think it's a bad thing, but that's only because its competition that forces companies to innovate with new services and channels and to keep prices down.

Both Sky and Virgin have some nice things that the other doesn't operate (either at all or as well), such as On Demand (Virgin wins here) and all the red button stuff (Sky wins here). Do you *really* think that would happen if one TV provider was in the market? No, it wouldn't. What would happen is that they would charge what they want and offer what services they want. They could, after, all, get away with it. If they wind the customer up, who is the customer going to go to?

If you want to see a restricted but extremely expensive service, carry on, support Sky. If you want the prices to stay low, and keep Sky (together with the cable companies) innovating to improve services and reduce prices, then we need someone (not necessarily VM) who can challenge Sky.

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

Some people won't be happy till they see Vm gone, they'll soon change their views when an un-challenged sky put the prices up.

---------- Post added at 17:41 ---------- Previous post was at 17:39 ----------

Vm can not afford tp put the subs up. They do every year inline with sky and inflation. In fairness to Virgin at least when the subs go up we are seeing additions to our services.

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

why:confused:

---------- Post added at 19:37 ---------- Previous post was at 19:36 ----------

they cant put money up bcos people will just go to sky and virgin wont have any people left which means no money:p:

---------- Post added at 19:38 ---------- Previous post was at 19:37 ----------

thankyou;):beer: av a beer from me:cool:

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

You're not old enough to buy him one:D

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

A nice concise post and straight to the point, as to what point, I have no idea due to it being rather in the style of text speak.:D

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

I would have thought if sky continue to buy everything up and being more of a monopoly then they already are, surely the EU would get involved eventually,does anybody know what it would take for the EU to look into anti competitive behaviour .?

Of course ever increasing bills could be remedied by cancelling services and going to freeview,though how much of that will be left if sky gets their mits on a pay DTT service.:mad:

Although i would still keep vm broadband.

It looks like everyone has stopped trying to compete with cash rich sky and hoisted the white flag, and just want to sell to them,and without proper regulation so it will continue.

---------- Post added at 13:51 ---------- Previous post was at 13:42 ----------

Who is "virginity media" a porn channel perhaps.:)

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

We can all agree that if Sky buy them it would be detrimental to the channels apart from the odd member, :)

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

this is the problem we have with Sky owning the content and the platform. It makes them too powerful and the only bargaining tool VM had against that they are selling off. Not sure if that really makes much sense but looks to be the way VM go.

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

I could understand if VM had a clause where they could keep them for say 20 years or maybe even 15 years because that gives them plenty of time to service their debt properly and pay a significant portion of it, plus they will have been able to establish further growth by then as the full DSO would have come and gone and they could invest in their infrastructure and platform to compete better with Sky with their customer growth and therefore revenue. Or they could have the time to build up another channel portfolio. VM might aswell get out of the channel market now anyway because it has become so heavily saturated by the sheer amount of channels now available that it's hard to establish a decent audience share now anyway and even if you can it's hard to keep it up every day and it's only going to get harder in the future.

Their TV service needs significant investment to seriously challenge Sky and this will be made even harder once BT roll out fibre and Sky can piggy back on the back of that and offer a truly great VOD service. Sky seem to be ahead of Virgin in-terms of innovation, besides vod of course, they had HD first and are now creating a 3D service all while VM are still getting their hands dirty with HD only now. I hope VM are able to use the BT infrastructure (at a cost) to infiltrate the areas where cable is currently not available. then they can truly compete with Sky. I suppose they have to sell if they want to invest but just please VM not to Sky!

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

Technically Telewest had HD first as the TVDrive was launched before SkyHD was

Unfortunately Sky has always had deeper pockets than cable in the past so has been able to get to the actual content quicker. Also having a single technical platform has helped - rather than the 3 different ones Virgin have had to contend with.

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

I forgot they had BBCHD first:erm: Ok SKY had the first real HD offering in the country.

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

Telewest has the old ITV HD Test Channel as well but I forget it channel number.

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

But that's all it was a TEST channel.

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

It did show some content to be fair.

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

Why did they pull it then and only come back years later on freesat? How much content are we talking about?

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

Wikipedia is your friend ;)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ITV_HD

Quote:

The channel originally existed on a trial basis from June until November 2006, primarily to show the World Cup games to which ITV had the rights

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

based on VM negotiations with Sky in the past I expect them to get screwed on the deal

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

That's exactly what i expect mate. Vm will think they have got a good deal only to get screwed over later on and i think they will take a direct hit as Sky will hold all the cards.:(

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

Not to mention the fact that Sky has shown an amazing ability to just abandon old platforms and technologies..

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

It has now been announced on a certain rival site that Sky and VM have come to a deal where Living and Bravo will be available on Skyplayer! Will we be getting sky on demand i bloody doubt it!

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

If you google living bravo one of the top hits takes you to the full article. Is this a sign a deal has been done? Is VM getting anthing in return?

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

I wonder if this was the deal in the first place? That it wasn't actually a vmtv acquisition but a vod negotiation. Knowing Sky they won't be offering anything in return apart from money for the content whilst keeping their own to themselves. Surely the article would have mentioned that they had come a mutual agreement and each provider could have content on the subsequent platforms.

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

Well neil Berkett did say fairly recently that now vm have renegotiated loans there was no pressing need to sell the tv divison ie living bravo.

So maybe just maybe it was a vod deal only.

And the journalist who printed the other story got it slightly wrong about the tv channels sale.,now it would not be the first time a papers got it wrong would it.;)

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

Very possible.

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

Would it not be more likely that any positive for Virgin would be held back until tomorrow? when the announce their quarterly results?

Re: Sky makes £160m bid for VM channels
 

I suppose you're right:)