This one's going down
 

A Newcastle schoolgirl was hit by a police car which had accelerated to more than 90mph only seconds before, a court has heard.

Hayley Adamson, 16, was struck by the marked vehicle and killed instantly as she crossed Denton Road in the Scotswood area of the city in May 2008.

Newcastle Crown Court was told the car's blue lights or siren had not been activated.


http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/tyne/7975178.stm

Re: This one's going down
 

lets hope so

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Outrage i hope he gets locked up the family must be devastated i live on a main road. I have daughters aged 7 and 11 my 11 year old starts secondary school in September she be making her own way there. Police don't seem to want to know speeding motorist's along here or the dangerous illegally parked vehicles on the footpath. Meaning pushchairs and the school kids got to go out in the main road.

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Nice to see Innocent until proven guilty doesn't apply to Police officers.

Also nice to see there are so many class 1 pursuit trained drivers on the site :rolleyes:

Anyway while it seems from the initial reports he is at fault there are times when excessive speed is necessary.

Oh and from a Mod point of view I'd suggest the thread title might be changed to something more suitable to suggest whats in the thread.

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Odd wording, "accelerated to more than 90mph only seconds before". So, he was going somewhere between 0 and 90mph then?

Denton Road is big, long and (mostly) straight, seems a strange place to not notice a police car. Will be interesting to find out the exact circumstances.

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:shocked:

You make it sound like they are superior drivers and there's an excuse somewhere for why this happened.

Not on normal roads and not on a 30MPH one. not only is it reckless, he didn't give anybody a chance of knowing he's approaching at that speed.
A poor girl died because he probably didn't want to alert the car he was after.

How about This copper's going down? :)

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nice to see the police closing ranks
and nice to see sarcasm isn't dead
and this highly trained driver ran someone over,i have never run someone over must be lack of training.

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No, Derek is pointing out that Class 1 pursuit drivers are better trained than normal drivers, but has not stated that as an excuse (imho).

Gary, your last comment does you no justice.

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They are superior drivers. And there may well be a valid reason why this happened, all the facts will come out as the trial continues.

---------- Post added at 21:17 ---------- Previous post was at 21:16 ----------

Closing ranks? I'm only pointing out that its not always cut and dried. In fact in my first post I said it appears that he is at fault.

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dude it would not have mattered wether he was a copper or not. 90mph in a 30 zone at a time kids could be about? do not really care about his qualifications. Would you pursuit without your blues and twos?

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Training is not the same as experience.
90MPH is 90MPH. training doesn't make it any slower.

Police Officer then.

---------- Post added at 21:22 ---------- Previous post was at 21:20 ----------

No they are not.
I'm a superior driver. only difference is I wasn't trained by a police man and I don't have a certificate.

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Kids? It was almost midnight on a Monday night.

Probably not. As I've said the full circumstances will come out but *IF* the car was trying to make ground on the car that pinged his ANPR camera without alerting it firing on blue lights and sirens would allow them to escape.

---------- Post added at 21:26 ---------- Previous post was at 21:25 ----------

At the risk of going off-topic what makes you a superior driver?

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so he turns round goes 90mph without sirens and kills someone and you think its ok? is an arrest that precious to you that a teenager can die and you feel the need to jump in and say we are prejuduced because he was a cop? well I would have been just as disgusted no matter who killed her.

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I'll use that one next time I get stopped for doing 37MPH. after he's given me an earful about how dangerous my driving is.

He more than likely will use that excuse. infact it's probably a dead cert that he will.
It's a poor excuse and will be seen as disrespect to the girl that died.

Because everyone tells me I am. do I have to get an approval by the police in someway to prove it? :)

---------- Post added at 21:34 ---------- Previous post was at 21:31 ----------

I would too. my judgement would be no different whether he is police or not.

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Some of the facts and possibly fabrication. Its human nature to try and get out of something and it would not be the first time fellow officers manipulate things to get one of them off( I speak from experience as an uncle of mine was a copper assaulted a fellow and the bull crap that comeout got him off with it)

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hmm training should make it safer ( i am not nor have i ever been an officer of the law;) ) though i wouldnt say it makes them superior drivers

side note the police ( and politicians ) make this harder to defend with thier constant speed is bad instead of bad driving is bad message

i wouldsay not having his lights and two tone on wont help but pedestrians should be taught to look out for cars but unfortunately are still brainwashed by the media that they have a perfect right to walk anywhere and the nasty car drivers will always be at fault

in this case he was working and made a desicion to try and stop a crime it may or may not have been a good choice but at least he was doing his job i have more of an issue with those exceeding the limit while not on duty

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car comes at you @ 90mph in a 30 zones its gonna be on you massively quicker than normal. If the car was traveling any slower(or faster for that matter) she would be alive now. You can not blame someone crossing a road as the car would have been a dot in the distance then suddenly bang purely because it was traveling 3 times the limit

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That statement is invalid - I haven't told you that, and I checked with my mates, and they haven't either :).

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don't normally disagree with you but on this i will

if he was rushing to get to your house because the nasty man was attacking you you would want him there fast

if a loved one has a heart attack you want the ambulance there as fast as he can

if your house is on fire and others are still in there you want the fireman there quick

pedestrians should look and check what's coming and NEVER assume they are travelling at the proscribed limit

as with those i used teach when driving yes the 32 tonner coming on to the roundabout to your left maybe should be giving way to you but if he cant stop it will be your relatives sueing him !

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No OK but there are some circumstances where I think sirens and lights might not be absolutely necessary.

No. The Police aren't paid per arrest but every time you drive after someone you have to balance the risks to yourself, the public and the person you are pursuing.
In this case someone died. From the initial reports I'd imagine he'll be found guilty of death by dangerous or death by careless driving. Either way he'll probably lose his job and license and quite probably his liberty.

Err yes. If you want to discuss the full ins and outs of Police driving it would be nice if you had some form of advanced (Police, Ambulance, Fire Brigade, Armed Forces) driving training with regards to high speed driving.

And some of the facts can't be fabricated. The use of lights etc. is recorded, the ANPR will have recorded when it alerted the driver, recordings of transmissions etc. can't be tampered with and I'd imagine the crash investigation would have been undertaken by a separate force.

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the lack of blues and twos in this is unforgivable. An ambulance or fire engine at night use the lights and often leave the sirens off . Police should do the same. a car with no warning traveling at 90 mph in a 30 is just not on . After all if someone was threatening me this copper would not have got here would he as he killed someone

---------- Post added at 21:51 ---------- Previous post was at 21:48 ----------


So you think on the face of the evidence he is guilty. And you come into this thread having a go when you yourself think in law he is guilty? whats that all about man?

You also say police do not get paid by arrest but your commanding officers get pressured to improve figures with government targets etc and that pressure is passed down or am I wrong?

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Tell that to her parents.
and then tell the parents of the girl that was killed by a drunk driver the same.

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On the initial reports I think he'll be found guilty.

Whether there was a reasonable excuse for his actions remains to be seen and the full facts will need to come out.

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i agree not having the blues and twos on does make it harder to defend but there are many reasons for not putting them on including just for getting




pedestrians must make sure its safe not assume that the cars will be doing the correct speed

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what would be a reasonable excuse?

---------- Post added at 21:58 ---------- Previous post was at 21:56 ----------

I think not expecting a car traveling at 90 mph is reasonable

Now id be careful crossing a dual carrageway

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I'm not wanting to discuss the full ins and outs of police driving. I am a skilled driver, and proving my grade shouldn't determine whether my opinion counts.

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not defending him just giving reasons why it could be valid

car the anpr triggered could have been one going to an armed robbery a terrorist a murderer or just ( using the word ironically ) a joyrider ( they never knock down pedestrians do they )


not saying that he had those excuses BUT any pedestrian should be aware that they could have

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Surely it does, if it is backing up your opinion (showing that it is informed)?

Have you taken any advanced driver training (and passed)?

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My opinion is that a police officer doing 90MPH in a 30MPH and killing someone, is the same as someone doing 90MPH in a 30MPH and killing someone.

Training doesn't alleviate the irresponsibility of it. all it means is that one probably had a straighter line of approach than the other.

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What exactly does that mean?

Are you saying that any pedestrian should be aware that a speeding car going at 3 times the speed limit may knock them down and they should be aware of that fact or even worse that it could be a Police car without his Blues and Twos on at least giving some warning, are you actually in the real world.

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IIRC the first car-related pedestrian death was where the car was moving at only 4mph. If someone suddenly steps out into the road there's not much you can do even if you are on a bicycle.

So you think that she could have crossed the road safely if the car had been going at 30 mph? It doesn't specify how far across the road she got before the collision.

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I have i am licensed to drive any type of vehicle not that i enjoy driving them. My opinion as i said before he should be locked up his negligence has cost a school girl her life. If it was my daughter i would want to run him over at 90MPH. I hate speeding i have to tolerate it with my job and living on a main road. The speed limit outside my front door 30MPH evenings its more like 40-50 with speed humps. Some have gone 70+ two of which have overturned in the last 10 years living here. Also some people got run down (lost count). My job is a refuse loader/driver wile loading ive been hit by a car in the last 6 months since i started the job even flashing beacons don't slow people down. As a driver i hate speeding only time i like it is in formula 1 where it belongs.

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Why don't you watch this video then

"If you hit me a 30 mph the is a good chance i will live"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HeUX6LABCEA

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yes i am in the real world

if you want to stay alive as a pedestrian it is you who has the best chance of achieving that by looking for what's coming and not assuming they will be travelling at the proscribed limit

even if this officer is guilty and has no good excuse the girl will still be dead

the way for the next pedestrian faced with a speeding car to stay alive is to not cross in front of it

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The video I posted above says it all about the speeds so please can everyone give it a click that reads this and see what it says about being hit at 30mph let alone 90mph.

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Try concentrating loading and collecting bins wearing high vizability clothing with flashing beacons and crossing the roads behind a bin lorry wile thinking of speeding drivers. Some of which mount the pavement at speed to get through gaps where they cant wait 5 seconds (how i was hit from BEHIND)

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Doesn't change the fact that a collision would still occur at 4mph or 30mph. Whether the outcome is fatal depends more on the injuries sustained than the speed. You can be killed by another pedestrian knocking you over if you fall in a particular manner(eg hitting head).

Didn't she or anybody else see the car before crossing the road? Were they looking or were they too busy talking to each other(equivalent to using a mobile phone while driving).

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You do not expect a car to be doing 90mph so do not try to use the defence she had stepped out or that she may have been talking to her friends.

It does not matter who the driver is as he is fully to blame for this and should rightfully lose his job and also he should serve time but in all likelihood he will be let off.

Anyone defending this how exactly would you behave if this death was your daughter would you still actually think that it was OK and that the poor chap was only doing his job and stay all lovey dovey liberal over it, or would you want his scalp.

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Would you please post the link where it states he was a class 1 driver please. Unless the training has changed recently, your average traffic cop has a short, police driving course, which does not even come close to civilian Advanced Driving standards.

Police class 1 drivers, have exceptional skills, however, no police officer would consider driving at such a speed in a 30 zone. To do so, without very good reason, would be nothing short of extremely dangerous, bordering on criminal. To pursue a vehicle without warning devices on is not only stupid, but against Police policy.

Had a member of the public driven like that, he or she would be thrown to the dogs, & rightly so. Police Officers are answerable to the Law just the same as you & me. Based on the info I have read, It does seem that this was, a stupid, reckless driver, who killed an innocent girl.

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I think that's what makes it ok to some. and the possibility of them having the same view if it wasn't a police officer that killed her is probably 0.

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my oldest son went to school with the girl in question he new her and most of her friends he knows what she was doing with her friends in the dene accross the road at that time of night on a school night ...the same as kids do all the time in the dene

the night after the accident some of the locals from scotswood started to throw stones at police and ambulance and fire engines they called out deliberately "so they could get back at them"

i feel sorry that this officer has had his career and life ruined because an alledgedly drunk teenager staggered into the road while he was trieing to catch up with a suspected stolen car

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Who said the car was a suspected stolen?

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according the local news about half hour ago the officer turned round after his onboard computer told him the car was suspect so he tried to catch up with it

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So because she was now allegedly drunk it is OK to be mown down by a car doing 90mph would you be as forgiving if it was your allegedly drunk child, I think not!

As for the accusation she was drunk were is the proof not that it matters when the car hitting you is doing 90mph.

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i didn't say it was ok
what i will say is that it is an unfortunate result of actions taken by both parties

her friends she had been drinking with allegedly

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Sad really. she died for the sake of a crime that usually ends up costing nothing more than a slapped wrist.

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So her action of crossing the road is mitigating circumstances for a car to hit her at 90mph and kill her instantly., as I said above what would your reaction have been if it was your child and be totally 100% honest.

I would want him to lose everything if it was my child and I would not like to think what I would do if he got of virtually scott free with a reprimand and a minimum ban.

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it was a sad case alround nothing has changed though the kids still go in the dene untill the early hours,the parents still don't see anything wrong with it

---------- Post added at 23:52 ---------- Previous post was at 23:42 ----------

yes i would be bitter and twisted i would want want to rip his head of and i would probably never want accept any blame either .

next time someone is getting beat up or burgled or possibly your car stolen would you want the police tootling along at 30mph ..be honest now

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What's your badge number officer? I can't see it from here :)

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I know that in America there was major controversy a few years back over high speed police pursuits that resulted in a number of deaths, so much so that some states now have very stringent laws about when and when not an officer can initiate a pursuit in a built up area.

I think that if you were to ask one hundred men between 20 and 40 how they rated themselves as a driver the majority would certainly put themselves above average, ie "better than most" and when I was that age I would've said the same.
In 1994 I got the chance to put my money where my mouth is;) my brother-in-law worked for a BMW franchise who'd organised a track day at Brands Hatch.
Basically the morning was spent hammering around the circuit as passengers of the instructors in an array of BMW's, when our turn came in the afternoon the instructor asked all of us how we rated our driving to which nearly all of us said, "well not the best, but certainly above average", then we got our chance...to a man we were all crap in comparison to these instructors.
Its easy putting your foot down and hitting a 140mph in a straight line, but correct braking going into a corner then exiting without losing any speed is a different matter, that day certainly made all of realise that without specialized training we were nowhere near as good as we'd like to think.

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Amateurs! :)

This is so sad......

Cops think they can do ANYTHING THEY WANT and its sick!!!!

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I would want him to have his Blues and twos on to at least give some forewarning that he is speeding and chasing an offender as without them he is just another reckless driver speeding without any reason who killed without any consideration or thought for his victim, which is pretty much the norm for the average offender behind the wheel, and he is just another offender.

I will be very interested to see how this case progresses and to see if he actually gets punished for his recklessness.

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Seems like an excellent idea!;)

Hardly worth shouting the odds until we have ALL the facts IMHO.:erm:

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wouldnt this part of the forum be a nicer place then if everyone waited and did not post opinions just waited till the results are in then agree or disagree with them. There would be a lot less fights then and a hell of a lot less members with infractions and you poor mods would have so much less to do ;) This part of this tech support forum afterall is the source of a good portion of the hassle on this site ;)

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My oh my, the stench of bovine excrement emanating from this thread is almost choking. All we have so far is the report from the first day of a trial. That means all we've heard is opening statements, followed by the evidence-in-chief for the prosecution case.

I also think the thread title is very unfortunate. It sounds to me like the OP thinks all coppers are guilty of something. I.E. "This one is going down (unlike all the others)." Pardon me if I'm reading it wrong, but I suspect I'm not the only one who thought that was the implication.

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It could mean he has seen quite a few cases where a police officer has hit someone whilst driving fast most of whom do not get done for anything and correctly so in a lot of cases

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You're excused. you are reading it wrong.

This one is not aimed at any individual group or profession, any misinterpretations are purely coincidental :)

---------- Post added at 12:40 ---------- Previous post was at 12:37 ----------

We should do that with politics. wait until we see who gets in and then discuss it afterwards :)

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Re: This one's going down
 

What would be an appropriate thread title? as some are clearly trying to make an issue out of the phrase "this one"

It was meant as "this driver that killed while speeding is going down" but others want it to read "this police man that killed while speeding is going down" when it doesn't have to be.

It's only an issue if you want to make it one. :)

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on that one i would say its one for health and safety as you should not be crossing next to the bin lorry

see

highway code rule 7

http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/TravelAn...code/DG_070108

pedestrians have to learn to follow the rules if they want to stay alive

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I was under the impression that the forum wanted our opinions, our thoughts, on current events. If we wait until a verdict is reached there wont be much to speculate about, & not that much to debate.

In any event, I would openly condemn anyone, Police or otherwise, doing 90mph in a 30mph zone. Its dangerous. Full stop. No crime is worth the risk involved. Had this driver met, & collided with an oncoming vehicle, there may have been many more deaths. The risk, is not worth it.

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actualy if he can show it could have hindered his duty there is no speed limit for a police office see "Section 87 Road Traffic Regulation Act 1984" link here http://www.statutelaw.gov.uk/content...tDocId=2223981

as the car was fitted with ANPR i would suspect hes a class one driver

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Either 90MPH is dangerous for anyone to drive at on a 30MPH road. or not at all IMO.
If it isn't the case then change the adverts to speed is only dangerous unless you're a police officer.

are they dangerous drivers in civillian clothes doing 90MPH on a 30MPH?

He later told investigators from the Independent Police Complaints Commission he had not wanted to warn the Megane driver by switching on his flashing headlamps, rooftop beacon, or two-tone siren.

And he claimed he had driven the Volvo in a “safe and controlled� way.


---------- Post added at 13:40 ---------- Previous post was at 13:36 ----------

Someone said that it was a suspected stolen.

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and if the person with the knife to your throat says "if hear the police coming things will get worse" ?

Re: This one's going down
 

This forum is indeed here for people to share opinions and thoughts on current events. But most of the current events we discuss are not ongoing court cases where the whole truth is only revealed one piece at a time over a number of days. Sharing an unqualified opinion on the guilt or innocence of someone in the full knowledge that not all the facts have yet been revealed is a tad irresponsible I think.

I can think of a number of admittedly very extreme examples where it would be entirely justified. However, I'm reserving judgement in this case, just as the jury in the courtroom are doing. I see very little point in sharing an opinion when I am fully aware that I do not possess all the available facts.

Re: This one's going down
 

This isn't the movies.

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Then they can approach at a slower safer speed

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Well, here again is the problem with getting all hot under the collar at news emerging from an ongoing court case. What, exactly, is the point in you demanding 'where is the proof'? There are a load of highly-paid barristers standing in a court room right now, showing proof for all the claims being made, and a jury is sat there listening and watching it all.

Only when it has all been laid out and the jury is considering its verdict can we hope to have a meaningful discussion about the rights and wrongs committed here.

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So now the driver had a knife at someones throat?

He was trying to chase a car not rush to the scene of a siege or robbery so do not try to confuse the issue by mentioning a scenario that has absolutely no bearing on this discussion and you are just attempting to cloud the the issue.

You do the crime you do the time and what that driver did was a crime and it does not matter that he was wearing a uniform at the time.

Any rubbish posted about he was only doing his job is rubbish, he killed someone because he did not do his job properly.

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The only rights and wrongs I'm bothered about are doing 90MPH on a 30MPH road. and not using the lights and siren to warn anybody. be they drunk or sober, young or old.

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I agree, it sounds really, really bad. However I don't believe in condemning a man before he has had the chance to explain his actions. So I won't be forming an opinion on this until I've heard his defence.

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I doubt very much this is the case but imagine how we'll all feel if it turns out the officer in question was chasing a paedophile who'd abducted a child, I know its unlikely but something could well come out from his defence team that makes us look at the case in a different light.
As mentioned above we just don't know yet.

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It was the automatic number plate recognition system that reacted and he tried to chase the vehicle at 90mph and killed a child of 16.

Even if the car was a paedophile it does not detract from his abject failure and total disregard for passersby he showed by speeding at 90mph without his Blues and Twos on.

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I would feel he should have been approaching the car in a safer fashion perhaps get a helicoptor up in the air and getting backup to trace the guy and child safely

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How many helicopters do you think the Police in the UK have?
And do you think they fly at all hours of the day and night?

What would he have said?

"Yeah I'm looking for a car. It's a dark colour and was in this street an hour ago heading that way."

I'm sure it would be easy to trace in the hour or so it could easily take for a helicopter to get overhead.

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there is always one over our bloody estate every night

would have thought if there was a child abduction there would have been a lot of support in place already

Re: This one's going down
 

Your probably right, and the chances are if his found guilty they will throw the book at him, rightly so, I'm just a bit uncomfortable condemning the guy before his had a chance to defend himself.
If the court finds him guilty then he deserves everything he gets, but until then there is a chance, no matter how slim that he may have mitigating circumstances.:shrug:

Re: This one's going down
 

Excuses and scenarios thread is the other one :)

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I really would like to hear mitigating circumstances that stopped him from having his Blues and Twos on which may have prevented this from happening.

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Well if you reserve your judgement until you've heard the defence case, you will hear whatever mitigating circumstances he has to offer. Then you can make an intelligent assessment of whether they're reasonable and whether he's guilty. ;)

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no people have been asking why a police car should ever speed without lights i just pointed out ONE of many reasons for doing so

i have in no post said he was right to do what he did but i wont condemn him either with out all the evidence

to say that police should NEVER do this sort of speed in my opinion just shows a lack of understanding of the job that they are required to do

yes they will make mistakes

BUT especially for pedestrians it is up to them to make sure its safe to cross a road before doing so

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It was at night and that is reason enough to have his Blues and Twos on.

Could you be sure it was safe to cross if you did not know the oncoming vehicle was doing 90mph and if so how come you are able to react that fast, how can any person be expected to see if it is safe when a car is approaching at that kind of speed.

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There are reasons and possible explanations why the lights and sirens were not on.

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The reason being he didn't want to alert the Megane that he was approaching.

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First although it may sound horrid I think the fact it was a child that died rather than an adult shouldnt be relevant, he ran someone over. People get emotional when its a child.

He may not have turned his siren on etc. so he wouldnt alert the other car, but I think either he or the police force need to be found guilty.

The reason been if he was in a situation where he wanted to catch the vehicle but not be detected then he should have done so at a lower speed perhaps 40 or 50mph, 90 seems excessive. If 90 was necessary then that to me classes as an emergency and the siren would need to be on.

So the question should be is it operational procedure to do 90mph in a 30 zone without sirens and lights in that situation ie. is this how he has been trained.

If yes, then he personally should not go down but the police procedures need to be reviewed.

If no then he needs to go down.

Something else I am going to add here as well, it is something I have complained to both the police and my MP about.

I live next to a mini roundabout, and I have observed over the past 2 years something that didnt used to happen many years ago.

The police here at night will approach the roundabout with only their lights flashing and no siren, they then turn on the siren about 2 seconds before they reach the roundabout and then turn it off again. When I complained it was mainly about a sudden noise that comes out of nowhere as its far less disruptive to hear a quiet siren get louder and louder than a very loud siren thats suddenly turned on outside your house.

But this news report makes me also realise there is a serious danger to turning of sirens in between major junctions in that they not providing any audible alert to pedestrians who may be crossing the road especially blind people. Recently the police are baffling me more and more.

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The can be but it also failed to give any warning of his approach at speed.

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I`m sorry Derek, I may be on a different wavelength to you here, but, are those reasons & explanations justification for this man to drive at 90 mph in a 30 mph zone, & do those reasons justify the death of a young girl??

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By studying the road you're about to cross for more than a millisecond. That's how.

"Oooh, that car's belting up here..." vs. "Oh look a car, i'll make it".

Re: This one's going down
 

yes they can not saying they do here but they can

---------- Post added at 18:39 ---------- Previous post was at 18:38 ----------

exactly

Re: This one's going down
 

Not to prejudge the situation I'd like to reiterate something I pointed out in another thread..todays teenagers are a danger unto themselves in regards to traffic.They have no respect for traffic and behave with the utmost stupidity when crossing the road during daylight hours and when perfectly compos mentis..Something I see every day when arriving at and leaving school.

If as someone was suggesting it was dark and the poor girl was drinking it may well have made such an attitude even worse.

However I would like to hear more about the case and the evidence given.

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I don't think it'll make any difference to some if the police man was doing 200MPH with no lights or siren. they'd still probably suggest that it might not have been his fault that a girl got hit and killed.

but I think if it was a common thief and constant offender that were to have done it, we probably wouldn't be hearing any arguments of how it might not be his fault.

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a car traveling at 90mph could be round a corner or possibly be out of site when you start crossing the road then because its traveling at a stupid pace bang its on you to late to do anything

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Or on the brow of an hill. if you get lucky and it misses you. hope that the next few along the line are just as lucky.

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Assuming this was the middle of the night, a car accelerating to 90mph will surely make a decent amount of noise as well... Then again, turning a corner at 60-90mph will surely be rather difficult, and i hear in this case the road is particularly straight.
On this one, if the above turns out to be true, i agree with Coggy. Teenagers are indeed a danger to themselves. I too witness this day to day.

My sister personally owes her life to a skilled driver who managed to stop literally against all odds when she walked out into the road.
A fireman this time. Very quick reactions, and had taken an advanced driving course in his time...

Sad to think, that in a different time, even by a few seconds, this young lady may have just witnessed a car zoom by...

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Oh what utter crap. This guy should not have been doing 90 end of story anyone thinking its ok then wake up and smell the coffee. This guy wanted a bust he thought he could sneek up without blues and twos and it didnt go well for him. I know its supposition but if he had a good enough reason he wouldnt be in court

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I've worked it out. it's not speed that is dangerous. it's not having a certificate to say that you've had advanced driving lessons that's dangerous.

I think we should go and get ourselves one of these certificates and shoot around the streets knowing that if any idiot is stupid enough not to look and see me coming then it's their own fault for not looking.

I might be helpful though and wire up a doorbell to the front bumper.

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if you took an advanced driving course you may start to see things differently

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If a loved one of yours got killed by an advanced driver on a 30MPH road. driving at speeds up to 90MPH and killing her instantly at around 70MPH. you'd probably see things differently.

Or maybe not.

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my kids if they do as they have been taught they wouldnt cross a road with a car coming unless they were sure that it was not going to come any where near them before they completed crossing the road

only today i saw three very lucky girls crossing a road all looking at one of the girls mobile phones right in front of a driver who lucky for them happened to be looking at them

they could have been killed or seriously injured if he had been distracted by any of the many other things he needed to be paying attention to along that bit of road

but that car could have been a joyrider speeding an ambulance rushing ( they don't always have thier sirens going in built up areas ) or a police car trying to do his job

and although quite rightly if it had been a joy rider you could say he shouldnt have been there they would still only be dead or injured because they were not looking at the road !

roads should all be considered as dangerous as a motorway to cross and parents should be instilling that in thier kids and never letting them think that any road is in anyway safe to walk across with out thoroughly checking its safe to do so !