Virgin limiting download speeds intentionally
 

Im sure Virgin are intentionally limiting download speeds intentionally.

For a few days now ive been doing a few downloads starting at around 25 past 9 and its been really slow around 800k. At around 9:45 if a file is downloading it will stop for about 8 - 10 seconds THEN the download speed jumps from what it was when it stopped around 800k to over 7mb/s and then it will settle at the full 2.2mb/s i should be getting and its done this for a few days in a row and the downloads im downloading are from different websites.

Re: Virgin limiting download speeds intentionally
 

What websites?
Links please :)

Re: Virgin limiting download speeds intentionally
 

It could just be that after 9PM everyone starts their downloads causing higher loads on your ubr which inturn will give a slower speed.

Re: Virgin limiting download speeds intentionally
 

Could be lots of things TBH Jon but we'll need more than what Chris has offered us.
You know, the basics that anyone who's been here awhile would have seen asked for and posted.

Modem levels, ping and trace to bbc or google. Do this when your connection is "limiting download speeds intentionally" And when its not.... Where you are downloading from so we can go have a look see ourselves.

And I'm not having a pop at you Chris, this kind of sweeping statement is made far to often.

We know about STM so if you have new evidence to share of further "throttling" "management" would you post it here for us all please Chris.

Re: Virgin limiting download speeds intentionally
 

that made no sence to what i posted.

---------- Post added at 00:03 ---------- Previous post was at 00:03 ----------

how can i get more evidence than what ive noticed so far?

---------- Post added at 00:04 ---------- Previous post was at 00:03 ----------

+ according to Virgin Media the Max my UBR hits is less than 70%

Re: Virgin limiting download speeds intentionally
 

Umm, wait ten minutes before starting the download?
Some more information is definately required, where are you downloding from, how are you downloading, what with, have you tried other places?


That made perfect sense and is entirely possible.

Re: Virgin limiting download speeds intentionally
 

I get the same here in stockport, if I log into Giganews or any HTTP download at 4:30PM or later i get around 700k down. Log in at 3PM I get upto 2.2mb. I have even tested this by staying off all day and loggin in at 5pm and starting a download. I looked at the modem stats...nothing has changed.

I'm about to call VM and ask them to bill me for 20 days at 20mb and 11 days at 700k as that's what i have here. I have called and openly asked if i am being throttled back and each time i have heard no as the answer.

I just came to the conclusion traffic shaping in my area is compulsory without you even needing to exceed a bandwidth limit.

Re: Virgin limiting download speeds intentionally
 

same here bigtoe in SK6. tonight has been particulary poor - just getting better now - up to 8M

Re: Virgin limiting download speeds intentionally
 

but highter stress on my UBR wouldnt cause the speed to increase hense why it makes no sence.

Re: Virgin limiting download speeds intentionally
 

Good luck in getting them to admit anything like this.

I believe, but can't prove they limit certain protocols 100% of the time (ftp, nntp, bittorrent). When I have used bittorrent, I get a nice speed for x minutes, then it drops like a lead ballon to 80kbps, and stays there with no variation at all. If it was the "nature of bittorrent" you'd expect some variation as seeders come and go.

To be fair to the staff here, even if they work for VM, and know this to be the case, they aren't going to risk their jobs by admitting it publically either. They do their best for us within the constraints they have (if any).

Re: Virgin limiting download speeds intentionally
 

/ Dons tinfoil hat and backs away from thread until some infomation of substance is produced.

Re: Virgin limiting download speeds intentionally
 

I use newsgroups and UTorrent, I download around 35 tv programmes every week, yes sad I know but hey, I get full speed consistently, so that doesn't look like limiting protocols to me.
When I was trained, we were told the worst thing we could do was lie to a customer, iirc it can get you sacked.
Any customer I've seen who has been traffic managed, I've told they are being so, why they were traffic managed, what time it happened and when they will be released from it.
And to be perfectly honest, I resent the implication that I'm a liar.

Re: Virgin limiting download speeds intentionally
 

I merely said it was my belief, which stems from my experiences. Not that it was the truth.

Belief and truth can exist independantly of each other. If you are offended by that, then I apologise.

Re: Virgin limiting download speeds intentionally
 

There are always good and bad in all walks of life

Re: Virgin limiting download speeds intentionally
 

What are you using to do the downloading (which browser or downloader program)?

It could just be the speed indicator being a little inaccurate (as it can be on Internet Explorer for instance).

Re: Virgin limiting download speeds intentionally
 

Wouldn't the timings be then varied if that was the case???

I wonder if anythings been scheduled to run on that pc at those times though??

Re: Virgin limiting download speeds intentionally
 

As Mags said if you call up and we answer then you get the truth, probably why we actually post on here.

If we lied to a customer and they thought we had, then they could call back and report us and then our notes would be checked and then we would be asked to verify what we told you and what means we used to find out what we told you, the are always procedures you can invoke if you feel wronged no matter what company you speak to.

As for the issue of downloading I subscribe to Demonoid and use Zuze on Linux Mint and can download a movie in less than 30 minutes if I want to, so no restrictions on my Virgin connection.

Re: Virgin limiting download speeds intentionally
 

Unfortunatly, from experience, whenever I've phoned up in the past, Ive ended up speaking to your Indian collegues, which is why, I'll be honest with you, I've stopped bothering to report any problems I have.

They aren't the easiest of people to speak to, and they seem to go out of their way to blame your PC, rather than fix the issue. Meaning I have to constantly call back and back and back, until I get someone in England. Usually once you get through to England, things are plain-sailing.

For example, roughly 2 years ago, I was having really bad problems with a low upload rate, and I mean, single figure upload rates. This had a knock-on effect on my downloads. India constantly blamed my PC, or a "national problem". After about 3 weeks of this, I discovered the newsgroups. One posting on the news groups, and their reply is "You need an engineer visit. When are you going to be in?", it was fixed 2 days later.

Apparently it needed my forward path adjusting or something. So, India had constantly lied to me.

Bad experiences like this, are sadly remembered, while the good ones, aren't. I have several bad experiences with calling VM, and being... lets just say "fobbed off".

I do apologise to the people here, the people on here are generally good and honest people, but as I say, I can only build beliefs based on the experiences I have had in the past.

Re: Virgin limiting download speeds intentionally
 

Your frustration is understandable and we who post here obviously take peoples feelings into consideration or we would stop after a few wrong words were posted.;)

Re: Virgin limiting download speeds intentionally
 

Virgin have introduced traffic management from 4pm to 9pm, if your a heavy user.

I noticed my speed was drastically reduced and rang support, they explained my account was capped, and all the details i needed to know are on the website.

I explained i am a heavy user that's why i use virgin, as the 20mb package was unlimited.

if I wanted a 4mb service i would pay for a 4mb service, they put me on to tech support who explained that traffic management was in force and it was on from 5pm to 11pm and was advised to read the FAQ on the website

As usual the web site mentioned a trial and the times were from 4pm to 9pm, as a heavy user I can not accept this limitation and will be voting with my feet.

My location is north London, there is no mention of the trial running in London, from the posts on the forum I guess they are rolling this service out across the network.

Virgin sort your house out, customer service has taken a serious nose dive in the wrong direction, its not surprising if you have a billing issue you get through to customer service in the UK

I see this as a marketing angle to push the 50mb service

Re: Virgin limiting download speeds intentionally
 

Traffic management has been a reality for ages, now, rollout started in mid 2007 - well before 50mb was in the picture.

Re: Virgin limiting download speeds intentionally
 

Also, there no is no longer a 4Mb service.

Re: Virgin limiting download speeds intentionally
 

i am experiencing the same issues here in harrogate. It only seems to affect HTTP downloads. I used to get 2.4mb/s from easynews but now it sits at a steady 800k

Re: Virgin limiting download speeds intentionally
 

They may have refered you to the wrong website, or you might have misinterpreted it. The trial areas are pretty clear, otherwise STM is the same nationally.

Just out of curiousity, how much do you download in a day?

Re: Virgin limiting download speeds intentionally
 

And yet, three posts made by you on this subject, with a similar number of requests to provide evidence to support your claims, which you seem to have failed to do.....and all this thread has become is another STM bashing one, with the possibility of the tin foil hat brigade bringing up the rear....sheesh.

It's a lot easier to help Chris if you help us, honestly.

Re: Virgin limiting download speeds intentionally
 

I am a heavey user, I can dl a couple of gb easy in a day, that's why I used virgin or telewest back in the day.

I was not aware of STM until they upgraded my modem, thats why its a bit of shock for me.

£35 a month is a lot to pay, for a 5mb, when I signed up about 5 or 6 years ago it was because it was uncapped.

Im already looking for anlternative supplier

Re: Virgin limiting download speeds intentionally
 

I have got the same problem and lots of other people have posted about this as well. It isnt traffic management in the sense that they are capping your speed but something is definitely wrong. I wouldnt say it happens ever night bit it definitely happens frequently regardless or what prog or protocol you use (newsgroups/torrents). I'll start some torrents downloading as I am going to bed (anytime between 2100-midnight) and it will kick off at full speed for about 30 secs and then everything it will drop off (no connections) for about 1 min, then they'll all start to come back and it will start up for another 30 secs before dropping off again and when this happens it can go on for an hour. It has never bothered me because I know the problem resolves itself in the end and by the time I wake up in the morning everything will be downloaded.

Re: Virgin limiting download speeds intentionally
 

For some reason tonight, all my downloads have been capped at a flat, stable 250k/sec maximum.
I'm down to 10% of my 20 meg :/

This is through every mean I can think of. HTTP, usenet, FTP, whatever. Multiple downloads won't make the total bandwidth break 250k/sec.

It's odd. I haven't downloaded anything all day and only started to download something tonight at 2am, well past what I thought the traffic shaping hours were.

Frustrating!

Re: Virgin limiting download speeds intentionally
 

Things other than traffic management can affect your speed. How are you connecting? Ethernet? USB? Wireless?

Re: Virgin limiting download speeds intentionally
 

Its nothing to do with how you connect to the modem, its to do with intentional capping without the need to exceed bandwidth limits.

All VM reps on here,

If VM are doing this why don't they charge accordingly..IE 4 while 9 you get billed 70% cheaper than at the other times?
If you did this 90% of the moaning would go away and you would be accurately delivering the service you are advertising.

Coming back to why they are doing this, I think you need to look at those over subscribed areas...such as Manchester etc. Could it be they are rotating bandwidth caps day on day or week on week regardless of bandwidth used to ease strain on the network?

Re: Virgin limiting download speeds intentionally
 

Your post is a tad confusing.

In two sentences you claim they (VM) are intentionally doing this I've marked those in red, and then then you claim "if" VM are doing this, marked in blue.

Perhaps it may help your post of you could provide evidence to support the red highlights, other than a few posters having problems with downloads, and given VM's apparent transparency on when and why they reduce speeds?

In fact, you may have answered your own point in the possibility of the subscribers being in busy traffic areas, rather than deliberate capping of speeds outside of an STM window.

Re: Virgin limiting download speeds intentionally
 

I think you will find im pretty au fait with the way DOCSIS works and the infrastructure in general and i can confirm my issues are not down to over-subscription. My UBR is not in any way overloaded.

There is definatly something going on at a level deeper into the network than the UBR. i have not had the time to investigate this further but when i do i will let you know what i find.

VM are in no way transparent, previous experience should tell you this !

Impz

Re: Virgin limiting download speeds intentionally
 

There is lots of _free_ network monitoring software that you guys can use to show many protocols in action, size of packets, requests etc. I'm sure I could come up with a few links if you need them should the powers of google fail you.
As Toto said we can't help if you give us nothing to work with.

Re: Virgin limiting download speeds intentionally
 

i wasnt asking for help merely stating the facts of my experience !

Re: Virgin limiting download speeds intentionally
 

my 2mbit has been capped at 1mbit for 48 hours now using this forums speedtester
tested at 3pm 6pm 9pm and 12am

Re: Virgin limiting download speeds intentionally
 

Check your speed from gamefiles.blueyonder.co.uk

---------- Post added at 17:27 ---------- Previous post was at 17:26 ----------

Could you provide a few links

Re: Virgin limiting download speeds intentionally
 

Network probe
VisualSniffer
SolarWinds Real-Time NetFlow Analyzer

Even found a free bandwidth monitor.
NetWorx
And simple network scanner.
SoftPerfect Network Scanner

Re: Virgin limiting download speeds intentionally
 

I'm certainly not one to cry wolf out of the blue, but something certainly seems to be up.

My default connection is indeed wireless, but even wired I do not get more than 250k.

Internal wireless transfers (computer to computer) work flawlessly and at normal speed. It is only when attempting to download or upload a file then I have issues.

Again, tonight, I am only able to download files at a precise (+/-2k)250k/sec.
That's including files from the virgin/blueyonder game sites. The last few days I have noticed uploads to FTP have been drastically slower than normal too. 25k/sec instead of a healthy 60/70+k/sec.

I really can't explain this with something on my end. The modem seems to have the right configuration and the signal levels look in the norm. If it's like this tomorrow, I might have to call up.

EDIT:
I'll also point out I'm not posting in this thread to directly accuse Virgin of doing this, but it was the most relevant topic at the time and I didn't want to post a nee thread just to say something.

Re: Virgin limiting download speeds intentionally
 

Just for the record absolutely no problems in Hertfordshire, nothing out the ordinary happening here.

2.35MB/s - Torrents
2.35MB/s - FTP
2.35MB/s - HTTP
2.35MB/s - NNTP
2.35MB/s - HTTPS

Re: Virgin limiting download speeds intentionally
 

Thu, 26 Feb 2009 20:49:46 UTC

Test 1: 1024K took 4259 ms = 240.4 KB/sec, approx 1981 Kbps, 1.93 Mbps
Test 2: 1024K took 2884 ms = 355.1 KB/sec, approx 2926 Kbps, 2.86 Mbps
Test 3: 1024K took 3624 ms = 282.6 KB/sec, approx 2329 Kbps, 2.27 Mbps
Test 4: 2048K took 6137 ms = 333.7 KB/sec, approx 2750 Kbps, 2.69 Mbps

Overall Average Speed = approx 2497 Kbps, 2.44 Mbps


oh and im on 20mb...

Re: Virgin limiting download speeds intentionally
 

Just an update on my story of speed woes.

After a long call to technical support and customer service, it turns out that since Virgin took over NTL, I have not paid for broadband on my package.
How odd! Someone must have noticed this week and knocked me down to a 2 meg package (but not disconnected me?) and now all is resolved after agreeing to pay for it again. At least they aren't back-dating me.

I wonder why I never noticed how cheap these bills have been before.

Re: Virgin limiting download speeds intentionally
 

What more could be said. Hahahah. :D I hope u kept your 2 meg so u get ur free upgrade ?? :D

Re: Virgin limiting download speeds intentionally
 

Exact same problems here.

Seems to be happening when using RapidShare.com, Megashares.com and Netload.in, coupled with Internet Download Manager.

Also, I keep getting timeouts on Firefox 3.0.6 and Internet Exploder over the past 2 days, especially when browsing eBay.co.uk and Amazon.co.uk and Channel 4 Football Italia website, did it for the past 2 days, but it appears to be fine for the time being, although Amazon.co.uk and eBay and still being a pain.

I have not bothered calling Virgin Media, as they will always say the same things over and over again, eventually it will lead to an engineer coming out, nothing happening and then we start off where we left off, with me complaining about several issues, being told to unplug modem as they read off what to say off the computer screen.

Then I'll say nothing has worked, they'll prioritise the problem and escalate it, I'll get a phone call from a manager to say that Virgin Media are looking into the problem and nothing will happen again...

I've had this problem with Virgin Webmail and it took them 4 months to sort out access to my account, because they couldn't be bothered sorting it out and offered apologies, which did not seem genuine, to which I disconnected the phone.

It may well be they are upgrading the exchange or whatever to make way for 50Mb, I don't know for sure, what I do know is something has been happening over the past 2 days which has resulted in a bad service being provided by Virgin Media for whatever reasons.

Although I usually have high praise for Virgin Media, this is just one of those times I'm not sure what to think.

Re: Virgin limiting download speeds intentionally
 

been haveing some issues with my 50mb connection sometimes going to 2mb (250KB/s) when i max me download out for about an 1hr but norm dead on 9pm some times

other times i am getting 35mb (4MB/s) when going from giga news but the Virgin download test is showing full download but that test is inside the network so does not count :) other tests seem to give full download (6MB/s) (going to use an dif news server (Astraweb)due to only been 3-4 hops from my connection+ it looks like its pluged directy into virgins network (no man in the middle gateway), giga news is more like 8-11 hops + looks like it has to go tho london gateway)

need to test more as it has done it to me 2 times droping speed to 2mb , change the IP on me virgin modem seems to fix it, need to play more

Re: Virgin limiting download speeds intentionally
 

@aMac There are so many packages out there and the billing systems are so complex (the joke used to be that NTL simplified from two billing systems to three) that these kinds of oversights are almost bound to occur. They shouldn't, mind, but they do.

@UnReal, leexgx

How many network connections are open on your systems when your speeds drop? You can find that from the command prompt, netstat -a. The other possibility is that the reporting feature is being delayed by something, while the download continues. So you might be downloading at a constant rate, but the monitoring is breaking; it sees X come down in time Y, that's rate A, then something breaks and it doesn't see X come down in time Y so it reports rate B, then it catches up and sees 2X come down in time Y again and reports rate C. What's the average transfer rate after it finishes?

The other possibility is that news servers are limiting the heavier downloads from their side. Depending on their management software they could be using an initial burst type deal, where your first X Gb are at one rate, and then thereafter slower. That would be efficient for them in the same way that STM is efficient for Virgin.

Re: Virgin limiting download speeds intentionally
 

From the netstat -a command and assuming I'm reading it correctly, its 4 connections.

I don't use News Servers, or Usenet, etc.

Just filehosting websites.

It still seems to be happening even at this time, which is ridiculous, I have not downloaded anything all day, I gave a file a try to try out the netstat -a command and it happened again.

I'm hesitating to go with a 50Mb connection, unless this starts working as it should!

Re: Virgin limiting download speeds intentionally
 

i did 40 connections at one time (got my frends giga news account) i allso slelected the US server as well as eu and gave me 400KB/s more thats all (guess i should be asking giga news realy these questons)
but Virgin is makeing errors in the packets as some times i get 2-3 stalled connections but i am on an 20mb connection now (other house) and i was getting stuck connection (but limited to 1 out of 20) allso getting some (not downloading) or alot of packet loss when downloading (teamspeak voice) not had problems like this before tho

net stat does report 20 connections

i not tryed to fix any problems yet i play with it tonight and for the next 3-4 days (check power levels yet and other things on my modem) but does seem more likey its an Main out side pipe problem or one of the links inside virgin pipes are is semi broke or bandwidth starved

Re: Virgin limiting download speeds intentionally
 

Using P2P stuff for me is impossible now after i have D or U about 300Mb of anything in total my connection actually dies... Kinda like a DNS reset or something, almost like something is coded into it saying to turn itself off.

Last 3 times i have tried to dload a linux ISO i get exactly the same effect be it at night or during the day.

Its not faulty hardware or flooded routers - Im confident its a measure imposed by Virgin aimed at 10mbit customers in my area..

HOw could anyone be ripped off for 20 or 50 in is beyond beleif.. No matter what package you choose you get the same limits and capped speed for 16h a day if you live in any urban area with any real ammount of customers.

Re: Virgin limiting download speeds intentionally
 

If you've a large number of connections it can saturate the modem/router/TCP-IP stack, but that doesn't look like the issue here.

Filehosting websites do cap upload from their end, unless you spring for a premium account, and even then they can change rates on downloads in order to spread load on their servers. Check the FAQs on the sites would be the first port of call.

If you're seeing packet loss, that can (and does) cause slow speeds. I'd recommend running an extended ping to a known good server. The command for that is ping -n X website.address, where X is a number greater than 4. I like to use multiples of 25. Your choice. I'd also recommend a great wee command called pathping, which is half tracert and half ping - it identifies every hop between you and the target website, and then pings them. It can tell you where the packet loss creeps in.

I'd also recommend posting your modem signal levels if you've got an issue. You can find them from modem configuration page, the old 192.168.100.1, all that's needed is the SNR, up (and down) stream power levels, and maybe the frequency. Don't post the MAC address, or your IP address, one of the admins will just have to take it out.

Re: Virgin limiting download speeds intentionally
 

Just noticed this thread! Yes i believe they are, i've made a thread with a poll to see how many other users find this the case. Sorry didn't mean to hijack your topic :)
- KFK.

Re: Virgin limiting download speeds intentionally
 

If they limit download speeds intentionally before you hit the STM limits, check the Acceptable Usage Policy - they're quite within their right to, especially if you're a very heavy user. I kept my 2Mbit because the 10Mbit modem shared between 5 of us frequently gets STM'd (almost daily when all 5 of us are in and using it) and it's almost impossible to browse the internet or (as I frequently do) play online games late in the evening.