Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

155 people have died after Israeli bombers launched a series of air strikes against key targets in the Gaza Strip

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/mid...st/7800985.stm

the uk is partly to blame for the careless was we set up the state of israel back in 1948 :(

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

???????????? The UK was responsible for setting up most of Africa, Australia, North America....so we're responsible for just about everyone if we follow your way of thinking....

It's a shame that the Palastinians and the Isrealies keep taking pot shots at each other, but it's purely them making the present day decisions and nothing to do with what Britain did in the past....

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

i was talking about the way we careless set up israel and the bad way we did it ok it's not totally different from the things we did in it other places but it stll has more ramifications today than most the other things that the british state did

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

And you lot talk about Iran being a threat. Israel is the biggest threat to Mid East peace.

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

It's past history, there's been 50+ years since then that the simple mistakes Britain amongst others created that should now be rectified... You can't forever blame us for the continuing mistakes of another nation that we have very little control over...

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

The US and UK have immense control over Israel. Without them Israel would not exsist. The Israelis are a brave bunch arn't they? Dropping bombs with an F16 on innocent women and children.

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

Thats right, if only they would just commit suicide by blowing themselves up, that would solve everyones problems in the middle east......oh hang on--the arabs though of that one first :D

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

Iran's never been a threat to middle east peace, they get on well with most of their neighbours...

Isreal being a jewish state in the middle of an Islamic region always was askign for trouble, but as I said in the previous post they've had 50 years to sort themselves out and what have they done?? Nada...

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

Droping bombs from the sky and suicide bombers are two cheeks of the same ar**. The Israeli army are as bad as the suicide bombers.

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

Israel says "Stop firing rockets at civilians or we retaliate".

Hamas fires more missiles, hiding amongst a civilian population.

Israel retaliates.

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

The trouble is that Israel will always go that one step further than the Palestinians.She always uses a sledgehammer to crack a nut level of opposition. :(

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

ah, so perhaps israel isn't the only threat to peace in the middle east (as you said in your post #4)

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

Imagine, if a new heretic Hindu cleric declares that the Hindus of the world should come back and live the holy land of Brum. You will be saying that is madness..... but that's exactly what the Israelis are doing. Israel keeps expanding in the West Bank, in Jerusalem... They brought in the Russian Jews, they now have to house them. In Israel, Russian is more widely spoken than Hebrew....

and there is no hope, the new Chief of staff at the White house has fought with the Israeli army...

Hamas has to sit back and enjoy.....

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

Problem is Israel possesses nuclear weapons. Israel is the biggest threat to peace in the middle east.

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

They'd never use them (mind you the age of them doubtful if they'd actually work!!!) and they're purely a detterant..

The only scenario I can see is if Isreal was just about to lose the region...If they threatened to use them at any other time UK/US/Russia and a few other nations would force the issue...

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

If you want an unbiased view on this current round of aggression by the Israelis, watch PRESS TV Sky channel 515

---------- Post added at 15:17 ---------- Previous post was at 15:15 ----------

Not only that, their Mossad are involved in destabilising other countrys in the middle east in order to topple their leaders, the most current attempt was on the Turkish Government.

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

http://www.arabmediawatch.com/amw/Ar...y/Default.aspx



un bias ?

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

How does an Iranian State TV channel represent an 'unbiased' view?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Press_TV

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

I know its Iranian Owned, but they sure know how to report things fairly and honestly.

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

I take it that should read:-

'They sure report things in a manner corresponding to MY biased viewpoint.'

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

The Israelis have a book that is hardly 'new' and declares that the land was given them by God.

It's not like the Jews are newcomers to the land after all, they have been around that part of the world for a few centuries now. OK a lot of them left to find work overseas but does that make it right to deny them a homeland?

I'm not saying I agree with the way they are behaving all the time but simply that they do have a valid historical claim to be there.

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

Before you comment, why dont you actually watch the channel.

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

Don't have Sky, so have to rely on the Internet.

http://www.presstv.ir/detail.aspx?id...onid=351020101

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

Here you are , this is the live streaming link:

http://www.streamick.com/index.php?tv=presstv

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

Can't Israel show some restraint? Every time they go way over the top.

Also Chaos, you need to understand the difference between unbiased and agreeing with you. Iranian owned makes me suspect them, I am in France at the moment so cannot see the channel itself.

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

Not civilian tagets, so some restraint in the eyes of the world. Not so Hamas and their indescrimate attacks by rocket, mortar, bomb and suicide bomber.

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

The best way to fight someone that has power over you is to obey them.

The ability Israel has to project it's will (and explosives) into the West Bank and Gaza Strip is vastly superior to that of Hamas et al. As long as the Palastinian militia don't realise that they are nothing more than a traumatic nuisance to Israel the better. If they truely loved the Palastinians they would lay down thier arms and declare themselves. That way Israel would feel more secure and would have an opportunity to reevaluate the aggresive policy they currently practice.

On the other hand, Israel is far too casual with it's firepower and should be more willing to put it's own soldiers in harms way to the realisation of a more surgical strike with far less 'collateral damage'. That in itself would solicit more respect from some palastinian militiamen and perhaps get them to open thier ears from time to time. It's very easy right now to dismess the IDF as cowards.

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

So if Iran was to possess nukes then Iran would be the biggest threat? ;)

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

No, Iran is not a warmonger, they have not started a war in over 400 years

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

You are quite correct......Israel should simply launch indiscriminate, unaimed missile strikes into Palestine.....hang on--the Palestinians thought of that one first.....but no-one seems to berate them for it :scratch: :confused:

---------- Post added at 17:19 ---------- Previous post was at 17:17 ----------

Good point but is it bcause they won't or can't? :shrug:

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

Israel's response is disproportionate only because they have vast amounts of military firepower and technology at their disposal. Hamas do not. If the boot were on the other foot I'm sure that we wouldn't be seeing anything different to what's happened over the past couple of days.

Both sides have valid grievances but neither are willing to resolve them in a reasonable and sensible manner.

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

Your dates are a little out - Iran invaded India in 1734, invaded Russia in 1826 - but hey, what's a couple of hundred years between friends.

btw, the wonderful non-warmongering Iranians - weren't they the ones who sent human waves against the Iraqis to be mown down? Also, didn't they turn down the Saudi cease-fire option after Iraq withdrew their forces in 1982, and invaded Iraq in June of '82?

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

I accept that, 1826 was the last time iran invaded another country. Still, its not recent is it. The Iraq - Iran war was started by the Iranians, it was started by Iraq - backed by the US. They Invaded NO ONE. But the israelis are thinking about invading Gaza just today!! As well as dropping bombs on innocent women and children as we speak.

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

Your lack of knowledge/understanding of the middle east is quick shocking you know.

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

There is no substance to your ramblings.....

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

Apparently there was enough though.

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

I totally agree that Iraq started the war - but in 1981, Iran turned down the offer of a ceasefire whilst Iraq still held any Iranian territory (quite rightly, imho) - however, when they finally drove the Iraqis out of Iran, a ceasefire was offered to Iran, which they turned down - they then continued into Iraq (which most people would call "invading").

BBC

"By 1982 Iranian forces had regained the territory they had lost and pushed across the border into Iraq. Khomeini rejected an Iraqi offer of a ceasefire.

So although Baghdad had started the war, it was Khomeini who prolonged it."

Which appears to contradict your proposition that the Iranians weren't "warmongers".

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

US sponsored

---------- Post added at 20:56 ---------- Previous post was at 20:36 ----------

To be honest, I was told that the Israelis had their own satellite spying satelitte(=viewing) the Hamas rocket lunching facilities. The Israeli gov withdrew the funding few months ago, thus their accuracy was gone. Whatever the reason, the Israelis are criminals for killing 115 arabs.

Xaccess & foreverwar get off chaos, this is a forum and not a bully ground.

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

Maribel,

forwarding salient facts is not bullying - if people post incorrect data, should it be left to stand?

I thought forums were about airing differing viewpoints?

btw, people seem to forget the over 100 rocket and mortar attacks in past week from Gaza into Israel - or don't they count?

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

over 100 rockets??? versus how many annexations in West Bank or Jerusalem?

To all: did you buy dill from any supermarket? it now says grown in "west bank". Milliband wanted to ban it but arabs (=Palestinians) were growing it and the Israelis were selling it ;)

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

Yes they have a few including commercial imagery sats which they use on an ad-hoc basis. AFAIK these rockets are not launched from a "facility", they are man-portable and launched from wherever is deemed appropriate.

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

The word is Quite

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

Israel disgusts me. They have illegaly occupied Palestine for 60 years but everytime the UN has a vote....America uses its veto power to stop anything being done.

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

A salient fact most people tend to disregard, its the loonies on both sides that keep this tragic situation running.
Nutters firing rockets indescrimately into Israeli towns week after week is bound to bring a response, and anybody who has followed this mess over the years know only to well that the Israeli response will be brutal.
The current stand-off has gotten nowhere since the 67 war, it must be plain to both sides the only real solution is a deal akin to the road-map, there is no military solution for either side.
Also general elections are due soon in Israel, so I imagine any future leader wants to come across as tough, but what worries me is that the Israeli's are now more likely to vote in the hard liners from Likud.

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

While i think Israel has a lot of things to answer for this isn't one of them for those bashing the israelis exactly how many rockets would you tolerate being fired at you before you did something and what else is it that you would do ????. This needs a diplomatic solution and sooner rather then later but there has to be give on both sides now the US can make that happen a little with Israel but who will do it with hamas.

If your going to fire rockets across a border you have to know eventually retaliation is going to come and i can't help feeling that these headlines of civilian losses are exactly what hamas hoped for rather then anyone asking too many difficult questions of them. What would be helpful in the discussion of this is if some people speak with facts to back them up rather then a slanted personal agenda as seems to be happening.

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

Ironically, the only way peace will be acheived is with the right wingers in power in Israel.
Take when Sharon (will they please just let the man die?) was in charge, he had the support of the right wingers, and the left wingers in striving for peace, hence the withdrawls from Gaza (of course the demolition of Israeli houses in Gaza was slammed by those who couldn't understand why it had to happen).
The left cannot gain enough of a majority to be able to take on any right wing opposition.

If you look at the steps given towards peace, Israel has always been the one to give, and give, and rarely gets peace in return.

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

Theres a hell of a lot of history for the Jews, they have been persecuted for donkeys years, killed by the million, & regarded as animals. Its no wonder they hit back.

Launching a rocket & killing people indiscriminately is one certain way of asking for a smack in the mouth. The Israelis overreacted, yes, & its understandable. They must be so sick & tired of being killed, its a wonder they dont retaliate a lot more.

If the US & UK are responsible for anything, its preventing Israel from taking this conflict to the next level. Israel has all the firepower it needs to settle this, or any other conflict. But keeping pushing, & threatening them will only bring that conclusion closer.

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

Why do you people hate the Arab so much? It is the Israelis who wiped Palestine of the map, not the other way around.

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

Just read through this thread from the beginning looking for the evidence of hatred of Arabs. Must have been expunged by the Illuminati.

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

The hate is everwhere, look on this page you will see it. It is unjustified, Israel is the aggressor so why support them?

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

I wouldn't feed the troll if I were you ;)

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

Hmm, considering I grew up in Saudi Arabia, and have strong ties to the middle east, hate the arabs? Pull the other one!

What I do have though is a greater understanding of the history and politics of the area than you appear to have. It is not as black and white as you seem to believe. There are many shades of grey, with humanitarian action from both sides working towards peace in the midst of a warzone, with one side at least predominantly attacking non-civilian targets.
While Fatah embessled international aid, building it's leaders $1million mansions and leaving the people it was supposed to support to starve (much like the arab nations have done) in order to keep them repressed and use Israel as a scapegoat, it has been left to international charity organisations to get aid to them, including Israeli charities (one of which I had the honour to work with).

In 1948, for instance, it was Egypt, Syria, Jordan, Lebanon and Iraq who invaded and attacked, Israel didn't attack them to start the conflict.
In 1967 Egypt was the agressor and paid the price.

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

You like to think you have a greater understanding, when all you are doing, is twisting things to suit your version. No sane mind could believe that Israel is the victim. The Israelis are treating the Palestiniens just as the Nazis treated the Jews in Europe. They are no better. If you were brought up in Saudi Arabia,you should be ashamed of your blatent disregard for the Palestinien people.

---------- Post added at 12:26 ---------- Previous post was at 12:22 ----------

If Israel wants an end to rocket attacks then should they not consider an end to the occupation of the Air Space and territorial seas in and around Gaza? Those areas do not belong to the Israeli Government.

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

I think you should read my post again now.

As for twisting things, have you ever actually been to Israel or the West Bank?
Do you actually realise what you're saying with regards to the Nazis?
Do you really not know what happened to the Jews in Europe? Does the word Shoah mean nothing to you?
Have you no knowledge of the refugee camps under Egyptian and Jordanian control? How terrible the conditions were? How much distain they treated their Arab brothers?
While Israel welcomed persecuted jews from around the globe, Egypt and Jordan treated their fellow arabs like pigs.

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

Xaccer's i think you've had too much tipple this xmas if you think you can introduce facts on this to certain posters who no matter what you say will continue with their view so save yourself some time and effort now m8 and give it up. I notice the Israel bashers have not answered my points yet about how many rockets they would tolerate or how else they would have responded and funnily enough i wasn't expecting a response of any substance as that would require some thought rather then some good ol Israel bashing.

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

Xaccers, remember the old saying -

Never argue with an idiot. They bring you down to their level and beat you with experience.

Also, this link has a lot of truth in it (imho).

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

Very true guys, what was I thinking? :D

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

Its nothin to do with making you angry, it do with countering your atrocious claims. You are the idiot Foreverwar, you are also a wannbee bully. Your love for all things Israel is clear. There is no point trying to reason with someone who has been indoctrinated.

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

Which map would that be?

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

We should all love one another, and give each other hugs to show we care.....

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

That is enough return to the topic now if you have a problem with a poster report it do not throw around insults.

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

This one:

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

Getting back ON TOPIC

More air strikes today..

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/mid...st/7801662.stm

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

probably a softening up exercise prior to a ground invasion, who knows when this is going to end, i cant see it benefiting either side,it will just breed more hate.

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

Well they have been talking about calling in a number of reservists...

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

They are probably thinking about establishing a buffer zone big enough to stop most of the rocket attacks or at least make it easier to target the rockets. This isn't going to end well now or ever if they cannot get round the table and come to a resolution they can all live with and that isn't going to happen anytime soon.

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

So all those little childrens bodies were not civilian then? Try and defend the indefensable in your own mind if you wish but don't try and excuse it to the rest of us. How many rocket, mortar, bomb and suicide attacks have there been by Hamas in the last six months prior to last week anyway?

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

None, because there was a ceasefire.

From the BBC link quoted earlier -
"The Israel-Hamas truce was regularly under strain and was allowed to lapse when it expired this month.
Hamas blamed Israel for the end of the ceasefire, saying it had not respected its terms, including the lifting of the blockade under which little more than humanitarian aid has been allowed into Gaza. Israel said it initially began easing the blockade, but this was halted when Hamas failed to fulfil what Israel says were agreed conditions, including ending all rocket fire and halting weapons smuggling."

I personally think the Israelis are over-reacting (which they have a history of).

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

Seeing as your so keen to keep count didn't Israel send troops in to Gazza in November and kill a Hamas member a couple of weeks back, funny sort of cease fire but when you consider the slow death Gazza was suffering, perhaps blowing the hell out of the place was the humane thing to do after all.

Exactly the point I was making

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

Israel has taken crap for too long. If someone keeps having a go at you, you eventually have a go back. If they wont sit down & talk, yet keep on having a go, you smack em down. Its unfortunate, but thats life.

Xaccers post, 55, made a lot of sense to me, but then again, Ive been around a bit longer & traveled more than most.

I dont remember Israel taking their land by force, the way I remember it was the U.N. that mandated the area be split into two, one for Jews & one for Arabs. The land was given to the Jews & the Arabs have been trying to get it back ever since. The Middle East is a ticking time bomb. As far as I can see, the Jews just want to live in peace, but the Arabs just wont let go. They wont leave it alone. Their like flies round a dinner table, a pest. One you eventually get sick of, & swat.

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

Do you mean this? Link

"The clashes began late Tuesday after Israeli forces burst into Gaza to destroy what the army said was a tunnel being dug near the border to kidnap Israeli troops.
Despite the outbreak of violence, both the Israeli authorities and officials with Gaza's Hamas government said they wanted to restore the calm that has largely prevailed for five months.
After the Israeli incursion, Hamas gunmen battled Israeli forces and Gaza residents reported hearing explosions, gunshots and helicopter fire. One Hamas fighter was killed, prompting a wave of mortar fire at nearby Israeli targets.
An Israeli airstrike then killed five Hamas militants who the army said were preparing to fire mortar shells. Hamas responded with the rockets."

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

No I seem to remember hearing some thing happening in November, pity I didn't pay more attention ..................

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

This? or this

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

I think our government should carry a bit of the responsibility for not denouncing the attacks or at least not seemingly supporting them, the whole world spoke out as one and there we were America's lap dog doing as we were told and towing the party line, to think we used to be admired the world over for our fairness and diplomacy

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

I dont want to have a go at anyone in particular, but some of you show a complete lack of common sense, military knowledge, or terrorist tactics.

Small groups often use tactics outlawed by virtually every civilised state. You do not launch any attack, or fire from, any building or area, used by the civilian population.

Should you do so, you will deliberately be inviting a deadly response from your enemy. The outcome will be civilian casualties. Saddam used these tactics during his reign, with great success.

Hamas fired unguided rockets from the Gaza, into Israel. They were not targeted, they were indiscriminate. Only luck stopped a large death toll. Israel responded by targeting the area the rockets came from. Civilians died. GREAT VICTORY for Hamas. These rotten Jews have killed our children.

Israel may have done the killing, but HAMAS pulled the trigger.

It was a deliberate act of murder. They knew that any professional army will only target known enemy locations. In other words, the launch, or firing point. Deliberately setting the enemy up to kill civilians has been done for years, its nothing new, but I am amazed at the number of people who cant see past their own noses.

This isnt rocket science, its basic military knowledge. Its called PROPAGANDA, & some of you fell for it.

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

Yes 'some' of you certainly did if you think that's in any way an excuse

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

Those are both the same incident that I posted. :confused:

Erratum - having checked my earlier link, I put the wrong one in.

Oops, my bad - I meant to post this link earlier - apologies.

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

Can you clarify? Excuse for what??

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

No one is excusing Israel or it's response but as i have said before if you were in the position of the israeli's how many rockets have to be fired into your country before you retaliated and what other form of retaliation would you use no one has answered that yet. Israel has the military punch so of course they are going to use it when they feel threatened or are people seriously suggesting that hamas should be allowed to continue firing rockets into Israel without any form of retaliation ??.

Beat Israel with a stick for some of the things they have done they didn't need to do but this isn't one of them and as SMG said if hamas really cared about the people so much it wouldn't have fired rockets from civilian areas another point that gets forgotten by those wanting to endulge in some Israel bashing.

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

I've never said Israel doesn't have a right to defend herself...Just that she doesn't always have to OVERreact as she so often seems to do.A response is expected but does it have to be out of proportion? :(

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

I take it not many people know the history of the conflict and even Israel existing is against international law.

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

All to often countries do over react. However, it is recognized throughout the world, once your country is hit by foreign missiles, then you are effectively under attack, & in a state of war.

To launch a response in proportion to the attack takes a lot of working out. However, if your attacker uses terrorist tactics, as I said in post 76, then civilian loss of life is great propaganda. Hamas has no interest in people, only its own cause.

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

I keep hearing this, just because you have travelled does not make one an expert on a subject.

---------- Post added at 19:07 ---------- Previous post was at 19:05 ----------

Well said.

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

Foreign missiles? The whole of 'Israel' belongs to the Palestinians, they have no right to be there in the first place.

And let's not forget that it was us....the British who handed over Palestine to the Zionist Jews, when yet again we had no right to do so. And look what we started.

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

You are correct:

Who is wiping who off the map?

https://www.cableforum.co.uk/images/local/2008/12/5.jpg

PS How do i make my images smaller?

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

Everyone, is going on about this situation, that has been going on for years, yet no one has actually said, who is going to stop it, At the moment, it is tit for tat, and it is innocent people that are getting killed, some bloody christmas isn't it, we get US and Britain sending in peace talkers, but they just keep bombing each other, doesn't make any sense.

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

Err..The History of the conflict is not simple and International law is decided by the winners. The idea of International Law is absurd in most cases so I fail to see why people bring this up.

Something had to be done about the region post-WW2. There was already a large number of Jewish settlements in the area, which they legally brought from Arab land-owners. After the mass migration post-WW2 they had to do something. Israel overreact every time but to say they have no right to be there is flawed IMO.

---------- Post added at 20:35 ---------- Previous post was at 20:33 ----------

Very well said, I do think Israel need to occupy the higher ground when these sick murders deploy such evil tactics though. Israel do it every time and it plays into the terrorists hands!

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

Have a look at the map at 1946...........it may educate you.

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

I disagree in the most fundamental terms. What you are describing and (apparently) condoning are Crimes Against Humanity. Someone likes country a and dislikes country b, fair dos, but trying to legitmise Crimes Against Humanity needs challenging again and again and again.

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

Bit of a dig at me there eh.:)

Absolutely right, but we are talking about conflict here. One country against another, one group against another, combat, terrorism, tactics, a smaller faction against a larger one. As a soldier for half my life, serving all over the world, I have experienced this type of conflict for myself.

Unlike armchair warriors, who know nothing about the real world, except what they read..

Please enlighten me, what experience do you base your arguments on.

---------- Post added at 19:58 ---------- Previous post was at 19:55 ----------


I suggest you re read my post & explain why you think I condone crimes against humanity.

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

I'm happy to. What you described were crimes against humanity. The parts that were apparently condoning it were the parts that justified it in abstract terms such as other people here don't know "military" stuff if we can put it like that.

and
Any sustained attack on a civilian population is a Crime Against Humanity. You are condoning it here below by switching and saying well, it's actually the other side's fault and well heck they had to strike back (presumably disproportionately).


Sounds like condoning it to me.

It is nothing new, it has been done for centuries. However humanity has grown up and it is now rated amongst the most heinous crimes to exist. For someone who says they aren't condoning it, I find it strange you don't mention this rather large change that happened in the 20th century.

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

It is nothing new, it has been done since time began. Its called war m8, civillians die in wars, it may not be right, but its a fact of life.

For years we have had people over analysing issues. Your replies are the biggest crock I`ve heard yet. You need to take a look at the real world, stop reading books & open your eyes.

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

You seem to have forgotten to mention where you got the maps from, chaos me old mucker....... ;)

It sounds a really unbiased and even-handed source.

JewWatch.Com

Subtitled "This Scholarly Library of Facts about Domestic & Worldwide Zionist Criminality"

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

My point is this: Crimes Against Humanity aren't interested in the rights and wrongs, in the he said it/she said it, the military tactics. They are interested in the results and the results are absolutely devastating :(.

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

Firstly I think we should all feel for the innocent men, women and children on both sides who've been kiiled and are destined to die in this long running dispute.

It seems to me, though, that whilst the Israelis may feel they're winning the war militarily, they're losing the propaganda war. Their reaction (military and otherwise by blockade) to provocation (genuine, perceived or manufactured) seems increasingly and unnecessarily indiscriminate and if it is intended to make Israel a safer place I can only say that it's misguided. I don't think anyone in that region is any safer as a result of what's been happening - quite the reverse in fact! If Israel carries on escalating its response to attacks the whole region will sooner or later erupt into war. What's needed is for Israel to take the moral high ground, to stop indiscriminately punishing innocent men/women/children in Gaza and to act in accordance with international law.

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

:tu::clap:I totally agree - Israel needs to show leadership by not (over-)reacting.

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

The results of what?? Do you actually know what your talking about???

You have twisted my post to impress upon others, your point of view. Your replies make very little sense, apart from manipulating the content to your own viewpoint.:dunce:

---------- Post added at 20:37 ---------- Previous post was at 20:35 ----------


Good post m8.

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

The results of these actions, of course. 250 deaths. I haven't manipulated anything. I was pointing out that the actions break international law and where you questioned it I pointed out that international law is not interested in these other things of which you speak, nor is it interested if anyone finds them a "crock of" anything. I would say it was you who manipulated things as you pretty much inverted things talking about "tactics outlawed by virtually every civilized state" and then saying that rather than an attack on a civilian area it was infact completely the other way round and was if your enemies did it from a civilian area.

What you don't like aren't my opinions as such other than interpretations of it, they are fundamental tenets of the modern world.

Re: Scores die in Israeli air strikes
 

My Ars*.

"Its life Jim, but not as we know it"