Pathetic excuse.
 

Andy Antilles at tech support says they are not telling anyone who requests if they are STMd and when it started anymore, with the lame excuse of them checking puts an unnecesary load on their servers.

What they really mean is you might be STMd because of too much load on the UBR you are on, and you now have no way of complaining about it.

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

Wrong again Gary. The command used to query the uBR to give you the start and end time of STM puts load on the uBR.
Go download netlimiter or some other such tool.

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

That's their excuse too.

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

where is your evidence it doesnt put any load on a ubr?

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

As with Andy Antilles, I also work for VM.
We are right, you however, are guessing.

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

If I were to call tech support will they still say that they can't tell me why I have been STMd when I don't think I should be?
There is on average about 5 to 8 requests in any 24hr period where someone will be asking if they are STMd, and want to confirm whether it is that or a fault.

Using this excuse now means that nobody will be told now.

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

You seem to be confusing "reason" with "excuse" (imho).

Not like you not to give VM the benefit of the doubt. ;)

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

Andy says newsgroups are only usually used for either downloading of illegal content, XXX content or arguing between other newsgroups users and boosting peoples ego.

which one you into? :)

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

Correct Gary, tech support would not be able to tell you, first line do not have uBR access.

So those bright buttons that use newsgroups can't/won't download an application that will monitor their usage. Which in turn they can use as hard evidence to show they/you are being STM'd unfairly? Laughable.

And again........ Not an excuse.

Whats your beef with VM Gary, come on?

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

So what you're saying is that upto 8 requests a day for this information is too much. and it's the customers responsibility to challenge being unfairly STMd without the help and evidence provided from the technical support of their own ISP. if they want to challenge it they have to provide their own evidence.

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

You should have at least something to start your claim with.
I see this day in and day out Gary, only to prove that the user has downloaded/uploaded their limit and hit STM.

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

Well I see it day in day out where the user hasn't downloaded/uploaded their limit, and is even discovering a fault as a result of checking with tech support.
It has been acknowledged before that STM has been activated on users accounts as a result of a fault with the system.

This will now be swept under the carpet along with the forthcoming results of the fault investigation.

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

Evidence of these claims made by others, day in and day out. If you please...

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

Here you go mate, you'll find some in all the following places.
Do you think you'll get them to change their mind about not checking for the customer?

virginmedia.support.broadband.cable
virginmedia.feedback
http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=7
http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/forums/f...splay.php?f=75
http://www.cableforum.co.uk/board/12/

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

I just see links to forums, not threads with evidence.

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

none of those forums have any evidence in the first page of topics, try again.

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

The top 2 are Virgin internal news groups.
Any chance of supporting evidence to back up your claim?

---------- Post added at 16:13 ---------- Previous post was at 16:11 ----------

Yes, try the next button, or the button with number 2 or 3.

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

no offence gary l but install bw meter or some other monitor tool if you do get capped/stm and the monitor says different then you got evidence simple as without evidence this thread is pointless

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

I'm in the groups now, I see 2 requests for STM time. No evidence of the trigger being incorrect.

One guy even asks
DU meter for the win.. :D

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

but you said 'day in day out' so if it happens daily, surely 2 or 3 days worth of topics on a couple of forums would be plenty? or is it not happening at all? :p:

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

Hope this helps explain my posting more clearly.


could you tell me what time I was STM'd please.

We are unable to perform this check anymore as it has been requested that we
do not place unnecessary load on the servers. We may be able to advise of
this again in the future once new systems are in place to combat the server
loads. Sorry for any inconvenience caused.

Your kidding right?, sending a very small data request may use about 3 to 5k, you could send hundreds and cause very little load on the
servers, someone pulling your leg.

You've gota be joking ??

Alex Brown keeps insisting STM works as "described on the tin" and
there are "no capacity issues" yet now VM are insisting that yet
another "important feature" cannot be verified as working correctly or
not due the extra load your few requests per day put on the servers".

Yet ever more users are being added to open tickets where there are
STM issues being outside the published hours, will these be swept
under the carpet like so many other service issues which affect paying
customers ??

This leaves paying customers totally unable to tell if any speed
issues are due to triggering STM or any other connection issues.

Highly suspect move....
it would not be unreasonable to suggest this moves only intent is to make it
un-nessasarly difficult for people to check for incorrect STM.
Something we all know is happening far too much and often with no
resolution.

very very poor move indeed.

---------- Post added at 16:23 ---------- Previous post was at 16:20 ----------

Are you aware of STM being incorrect on certain UBRs at anytime whilst an employee of VM?

---------- Post added at 16:24 ---------- Previous post was at 16:23 ----------

So did Gary_the_Troll :)

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

Thats right Gary, I see claims, not evidence.
Show me/us the evidence.

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

Gary L bashes thread YAY seriously Gary your a typical customer that doesnt listen unless its something that you want to hear, just download DU meter.

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

I already have DU meter. I will download it again if it makes the thread go back on topic.

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

Is there not enough CPU spare on the uBRs to cope with this command being run here and there?

I'm sure that plenty of CPU would be freed up on them by turning STM off :)

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

Virgin can't just do it 'here and there'.

Just as they can't just answer bill queries 'here and there'

They either have to offer the service to all customers or to none of them

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

That really is a pathetic excuse. The amount of load generated by one query is tiny and lasts for a fraction of a second. In fact most network hardware supports constant monitoring by SNMP anyway. Either they bought the lamest UBRs in the world EVAR or their are just making a pathetic excuse.

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

VM's OSS team not being idle bstards and giving us a web interface so that we can see how much we've used for the win.. :D

Then there's the issue of multiple people using say the VM supplied router. Not sure why they should have to start messing with MRTG / PRTG because VM are too cheap to ensure their network has adequate capacity :angel:

Actually that's probably a bad idea if the CMTSes alledgedly can't even handle the load of a couple of queries, heaven knows what having to report utilisation stats per modem would do to them.

Shambolic, and while you might find your pithy comment funny I don't. It typifies the attitude of some of VM to customers, from pretty senior management down.

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

As with Gary. Show us your proof.

/me un-subscribes from thread until someone posts something more than just thin air.

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

Or they haven't upgraded the CPUs on the kit and it's struggling both with all the extra customers they've been packing on each one thanks to the capacity they've saved with STM, and thanks to having to run STM. ;)

---------- Post added at 16:55 ---------- Previous post was at 16:54 ----------

As with your constant requests for proof, show me a show proc cpu history output from one of these alledgedly under strain uBRs. :angel: You're the one who said they couldn't be queried as it puts stress on them.

Evidently you have none either, beyond rote repeating of what you were told.

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

Or maybe the people that design uBRs think that will be used to route internet traffic rather than to be queried directly and constantly, and build appropriately?

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

Or they design and build them to be used to cleanly route appropriate amounts of internet traffic, rather than overloaded through being made to monitor and control the traffic of thousands of customers. ;)

If the uBRs are using the recommended hardware for their loading and whatever monitoring VM are using, and they are queried regularly in many other ways, it shouldn't be an issue.

It's either a lame excuse sent down from on high to stop the techs querying for whatever reason, maybe while certain managers carry out their latest trial to 'improve' our service, or there's some kit that's badly underspec.

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

Show us your proof then. show us the proof that it puts a strain on the network in the few seconds it takes to make the query, and then we'll know that we are not being fobbed off with what the title of the thread says. a pathetic excuse.

---------- Post added at 17:15 ---------- Previous post was at 17:11 ----------

He hasn't answered any of my questions put to him either. I think he's expecting me to let him do all the invisible facts and figures, and just believe them :D

---------- Post added at 17:17 ---------- Previous post was at 17:15 ----------

Here's a fresh one. it's only 30 mins old.
posted in the virginmedia.support.broadband.cable group.

Yet again for the squillionth time i have been STM'd before i have really
downloaded anything. Noticed i've downloaded the huge total of 32meg but it
most probably kicked in at 4pm like it has done on the other (i think) 10
occasions - all on a sunday. Can someone PLEASE do something about it
instead of the usual "we'll pass it on". And can you please switch STM off
on my connection as you and i know it has been done incorrectly.

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

don't think he is allowed to post that kind of stuff gary but i am kind of getting it simple command can put load on the server and btw i am all up for auto email if being stm'd lol not gonna happen but would cut down the random calls saying have i been stm'ed

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

I would actually like to see comprehensive usage stats by the day, month and for each STM applicable period along with notice of if / when and for how long STM'd.

Not too much to ask from an ISP of VM's size imho.

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

I know it's not possible for him to post that kind of stuff. that's why he can say what he says without having to back it up. he just wants everyone to back up their counter claim, and if they don't then what he says is right :)

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

There is and checking to see if someone is STM'd using very very very very little resources so wont really add to load.

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

on another point i think less tech savvy users don't no the difference between stm and over subscription and also this is a Sunday were most people are on the net. thats why i think they think they have been capped wrongly

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

After working on network hardware for VM for quite a few years to say the least, it will barely put any load on at all.

Only reason not to do it is if the UBR is already over subscribed/utilized, which some (well..alot these days) are...

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

That is a very good point you have made there. they have to be monitored and queried very regulary, so 8 or so queries for the benefit of the customer shouldn't be a problem, but it is a problem becuse it's the customer who wants the information and not themselves.

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

sorry trax came out wrong

"but i am kind of getting it can a simple command put load on the ubr imo i don't think so"

dam man rushing thngs don't help lol backwards and forwards between forums doesn't help either.

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

If the kit isn't going to be placed under excess duress by these queries being run we can only assume that people are playing games with the STM again and don't want people finding out that they've been STM'd as part of one of these trials.

I really don't understand why they'd not want people to know though, considering STM improves our service. :confused:

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

Now I've lost all credibility in you.
The command doesn't put any load on the UBR as it's not the UBR that's queried, instead it's the authentication server.
you surely should know the difference between the two, and you could have told me all this in the first place :rolleyes:

I'm more convinced now that this is all being made up as we go along :confused:

Is these the same authentication servers that are being asked thousands of times a day, Hello, cable modem here. how are you, can I have an IP please?

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

Gary L that does make sense tbh did r00t get busted lol.


edit

actually quick google search isn't it the dhcp server which give the ip out after being verified through Some sort then getting the config file through t ftp or am i completely wrong?

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Universal_Broadband_Router

A typical CMTS allows a subscriber's computer to obtain an IP address by forwarding DHCP requests to the relevant servers. This DHCP server returns, for the most part, what looks like a typical response including an assigned IP address for the computer, gateway/router addresses to use, DNS servers, etc.

The CMTS may also implement some basic filtering to protect against unauthorized users and various attacks. Traffic shaping is sometimes performed to prioritize application traffic, perhaps based upon subscribed plan or download usage. However, the function of traffic shaping is more likely done by a Policy Traffic Switch. A CMTS may also act as a bridge or router

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

I don't know, but we're not going to be asking r00t :D

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

1) Cable modem searches downstream frequencies, the Hamster in the modem twiddles the tuning knob until he hears Radio DOCSIS.
2) Modem listens to the parameters of the channel so that the Hamster can observe good manners in knowing when to speak on the phone in and what number to call.
3) Hamster speaks, uBR listens and tells Hamster how loudly to speak, and when so that Hamster can win the phone in prize of getting online.
4) Hamster, feeling somewhat lacking in identity, requests an IP address. uBR proxies this request and forwards it to DHCP servers, configured on it as cable helper addresses.
5) Once Hamster has an IP it requests a config file from the TFTP server specified in the DHCP offer it received earlier.
6) Once Hamster has a config file to tell it how and when, and how much it can talk it asks for the time.
7) Once Hamster has the time it begins its' jibba jabba.

When a router or PC is connected to the cable modem it asks for an IP address, the modem forwards this request to the uBR which forwards it to DHCP servers configured as IP Helpers, and then forwards the response.

When the uBR needs to work out which modem has what devices attached to it it can either ARP for them or ask the DHCP server depending on how it's been configured.

---------- Post added at 19:27 ---------- Previous post was at 19:03 ----------

Wrong r00t it's not the uBRs that are under load it's the ACS authorisation server.

So purely a case of VM needing to upgrade their internal AAA setup.

Had we been given this information straight away instead of you giving out incorrect info along with your helpful netlimiter suggestion it would've saved a 4 page thread, fun though it was. It's still pretty appauling that VM have to limit the amount of commands people can use managing their kit, laughable infact, but it's not a CMTS loading issue.

*Note to self don't listen to r00t.

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

can someone tell me what all these abbreviations stand for as im thick lol cheers

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

ACS Access Control Server
AAA Authentication, Authorisation, and Accounting
CMTS Cable Modem Termination System

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

Ok Virgin wont tell you they cant or wont who cares if your service is shocking you need complain instead of crying that tech support wont tell you something it aint gonna help never has and never will, if Gary has a issue you need to write to head office log faults all that stuff and you can even pm a mod here and see if something can be done.


*Waits for darthy to get bashed*

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

Not really a bashing, but a comment. Most people will care of the above because in this case it might be the cause of a fault - which is something you would think someone in the faults department might need to check.

In instances such as these, a fault with STM being wrongly applied is a possibility that ought to be eliminated by a support call as and when appropriate. Denying support staff from querying the system inhibits their ability to investigate and diagnose someone calling with the 'constantly STM'ed' saga.

The only circumstance under not allowing support staff to query the STM system is when the STM system is 100% infallable. Can anybody give a concrete statement as to if this condition does or does not exist?

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

The only tool we have that can see if someone is being traffic managed does not tell us when it actually started, and I have never been asked the question as yet "I am I being traffic managed" but I know that day will come and I will endeavour to get them a genuine answer to their query.:)

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

I still can't understand why VM cannot give the customer a webpage they can sign into to view their usage. I never knew how much I was using in a month I was struggling with speeds and yes was hit by the 4 hour slow speeds a few times even though I am not a heavy user.

Have to say it is much easier now on ADSL I actua get the speeds my router can give in peak times I am not seeing any slowdown. If I use over my limits I pay per gig so my speed is never restricted.

Two screenshots of my usage to show what is their to help you stay inside your allowence.

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

14.09.2008 36.73 GB 0.83 GB 37.56 GB
13.09.2008 7.33 GB 0.18 GB 7.51 GB
12.09.2008 10.58 GB 0.29 GB 10.87 GB
11.09.2008 5.71 GB 0.17 GB 5.88 GB
10.09.2008 1.30 GB 0.05 GB 1.35 GB
09.09.2008 0.20 GB 0.08 GB 0.28 GB
08.09.2008 0.39 GB 0.05 GB 0.44 GB
07.09.2008 9.47 GB 0.28 GB 9.75 GB
06.09.2008 4.08 GB 0.19 GB 4.27 GB

last 24 hours as screen shot below

So yes i can tell instantly if i have been ripped off by STM

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

Going on last quarter's results, this would require VM to implement and manage 3,500,000+ web-pages, being constantly updated.

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

Somehow i think thats more than acuiss will ever have to deal with. They only deal with a small userbase.

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

No it wouldn't, it would require them to implement a single dynamic page to pull usage data from a back end database.

The way you've put it makes it sound like they would be individually updating every page which is of course ridiculous.

One web page, one interface to a database which holds usage data pulled from each CMTS. It's not unreasonable and if other cable companies can do it you'd imagine Virgin can. Number of customers is no excuse at all. Once the code is in place, the database prepped and all broadband customers are of course already on a database, and the front end HTML etc built there's very little need for any human intervention at all.

---------- Post added at 22:41 ---------- Previous post was at 22:40 ----------

Which made the stats more expensive for them. Whether they had 500 or 500,000 customers most of the costs would have been similar, apart from storage which is nothing anyway. They split the costs of the implementation between less customers so more expense per customer.

---------- Post added at 22:45 ---------- Previous post was at 22:41 ----------

You've used more in the past day than I have in the previous 4 months :p:

That's cool but some people can't set such things up as they don't have the wherewithall, more to the point why should they? They purchase 'unlimited' broadband they shouldn't be having to go out of their way to ensure they don't hit the limits on it and get throttled.

The least Virgin could do it give us some way of monitoring our usage, though this debate has been going on for years and it's always been a case of 'download netmeter'. Netmeter should ask VM for sponsorship.

To borrow a quote from the newsgroups:

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

They are auto run by scripts direct from BT centrals all ADSL providers have them all come direct from BT centrals.

To implement any form on limitations the ISP should supply a way for the customer to check..

Not everyone can use wht you have infact I tried to use MRTG but the modem has the function required disabled making it fail to monitor..

---------- Post added at 00:21 ---------- Previous post was at 00:10 ----------

Who is acuiss?

Somehow I feel you didn't read everything but just a selection of things in the Aquiss customer control panel even allows me to monitor the faults and see what BT engineers have put in as they test, to see which central pipe I am on and if it is near capacity so I can drop ppp and change to another less busy pipe. My profile which is the speed BT have said my router, equipment and line can handle plus more I can even check how often i dropped the internet. All the scripts cost money and take up some server space but all to help me have a better service plus know what I have used...

The best part I dont have to download anything or find webspace to store the information on. It was an eye opener after 8 years of being in the dark with NTL and VM..

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

My god are you now that petty that you pull someone for an "a" instead of a "A"

I ask you this. When you waffled on about you ability to check your usage who did you say provided that facility ?????

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

Sirius, you may have the information to show if VM was ripping you off but if you did get STM'd without actually hitting it and presented them with the information I dont think they'd do anything about it, the attitude I had when I was with them was that if your connection was stm'd then it was correct regardless of what evidence you had.

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

The name is on the screenshots, my signature has the name, just recently I get the impression if certain people post in any thread on here they seem to come under some form of attack. I have the last few times in manners to try to devalue the posts.
Yet i follow the rules, I was only trying to express that if an ISP wishes to follow the limitations route they should provide a method of checking the usage. It is possible if they wanted to do it but they want to limit yet not alow customer access to proof of usage which I fee is wrong. VM have many that don't have the knowledge to set up things like you have so end up just trusting VM. With recent events that is/may not be the best way.

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

I fully agree

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

Not really as if you proof and make a high level complaint you would get further, people are saying I cant check if I have hit the limit, Sirus shows you how to and also there are plenty of bandwidth mointors out there and before you say customer dont know how to use these things, what makes you think they could use there email to check these

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

How does a customer make a high level complaint with VM?How long before ordinary avenues have failed to deliver a result does it take for a complaint to be taken further?And who normally can take it further on the customer's behalf?

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

Uh, I hate to say ask this, but when are you going to realise that you aren't actually meant to USE your VM broadband, its only provided so that you may legally say "Hey, I'm with Virgin Media for my broadband!", for the sheer "Pose power"..

Ok, and now I have made that rather poor witticism..

I note the techs here saying that we should download DU meter, how long has DU meter existed for a games console now? Oh wait, it doesn't. OK. How long has it existed for Linux? (Yes, I know Linux has its own suite of monitoring tools, but they named DU Meter specifically)..

I have a proposition... Not directly linked to STM, but indirectly linked, I guess.

Why not turn network usage monitoring via SNMP on the cable modems, like it used to be, a long time ago. Yes, it really did, back in the time of the Ambit100's and 120's. There used to be a tool you could download, that after a bit of faffing around, would query your cable modem for all kinds of stats, including network usage. Until VM sent a new firmware to the modems, disabling the SNMP capabilities.

Why not restore that functionality?

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

As I remember ambit's where NTL modem what about ex telewest customers?.

Plus VM support windows not linux thats why they suggest using DU Meter, plus you dont have to pose with your crap VM connection you know

---------- Post added at 15:50 ---------- Previous post was at 15:47 ----------

What ared the ASA and OFCOM here for, if people want to make a complaint I am sure if they try hard enough they can take it as far as they like people are just lazy these days and just complain to there mates and think it will get sirted no if somethings wrong sort it until your happy follow it up and kick ass on the way if you have to.

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

Actually, Darth, to be fair, it has to be said that in the 8 years Ive been an C&W/NTL/VM customer, I have only had to phone technical support 4 times, and use the newsgroup support once, and that each time, the problem has been rectified quickly and efficiently.

Although when mom died in 2005, there were problems as I had to get the service moved from her name into mine, and was without internet for almost 3 months, as first they set up a direct debit on HER account in MY name, etc. All kinds of stupid mistakes like that, but thats Customer Services, not Technical Support... In the end, it was sorted out when someone who worked for VM, on another forum (chetnet), emailed me, and took control of the issues...

Therefore, I don't think the service itself is crap, on the contary, I find it stable, and suits my needs adequately, although others obviously dont agree with me. However their customer relations policies do appear to be designed to drive loyal customers away, however, those are issues for other forums.

With regards to your comments about ambits and ex-telewest. I have to admit I know nothing about the ex-Telewest systems, but since the SNMP was working on the actual customers CM, and not the UBR, why could that not be reimplemented?

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

I think you took my query the wrong way..I really must remember to include smileys at all times...I wasn't attacking I was wondering how patient people need to be before trying to escalate an issue like this...and how much proof they need?:erm:

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

Dont get me wrong Usage status would be great but there is 3rd party software which can do this, people just have to be bothered to sort it themselves as Virgin havent done this and from what I can see wont

---------- Post added at 16:29 ---------- Previous post was at 16:28 ----------

sorry didnt meant to come across like I was attacking your post

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

Sorry Darth but after having had to deal with customer/tech support and getting nowhere I gave up and got in touch with the ISPA, I had departments telling me I'd got in touch with the wrong dept and handing me all over the place but I never actually got to talk to somebody who could help, I asked if I could speak to a manager only to be told that no, I couldnt speak to one but they could phone me back, that never happened and why should somebody have to phone the ISPA for something as simple as this.
I had bandwidth software running on my pc and when I told them that there was no way I should have been stm'd I got asked if I ever turn off the dsl modem because the modem logs might have been in error. So even if you do have proof that you've been wrongly stm'd you'll either get shoved from one incorrect dept to another and never get to speak to somebody who can/will sort it out.
The tech guy even said, it says in the logs you're stm'd and theres nothing we can do about it.
It's depressing to be honest, for you cable guys by the time you're finished on the phone sorting it out the 5 hour limits probably gone off.

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

The DSL never had a definite STM they just STM'd you if you were in the top 5% of users unfortunately. Be that 100GB/month or 1GB/month if you're in that top 5% on Virgin.net you get nailed :(

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

Thats why I made sure I only browsed the web/played games during peak times, any downloading I did was outside those hours but trying to argue your case just runs up the phone bill so I gave up.

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

I can say with some certainty that the STM on Virgin.net always works out some way north of 30GB/month - or at least it has been in every month I've indulged in heavy downloading. I've never had my line 'managed'. I suspect that the top 5% of Virgin.net users are probably *very* heavy downloaders indeed.

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

One guy at Tech support said that if you download around 5gig a week you would fall into the top 5% and get STM'd, that week I'd downloaded just over 7gig, and all of it in the morning, well outside stm time. I was not a happy chappy :(

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

going on some of the replys here am i to understand that you will now be traffic managed if you download and go over your cap at any time of the day ? i was under the impression that you could download as much as you wanted between the hours of mightnight and 4pm in the afternoon was it, if you went over your limit (depending what line you have) you would then be traffic managed for aprox 4 hours..

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

Daytime STM was added a few months ago.

The new hours are (note im only doing the limits for 20Mbit)

10AM-3PM 6GB Download

4PM-9PM 3GB Download

And it's 5 hours down to 5Mbit

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

ok thanks, best not download to many xbox360 demos then when i get in from work :S lucky i only use the PS3 for bluray.

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

BUT what about the homes with multiple users, what, the account hodler has to access x amount of PC's and add up all the figures?
And then as somebody said, gaming consoles that these "monitoring tools" cannot be installed on...

Also while I am on the subject, I have more than 1 PC in my home, and a central sever which backs up computers at different times of the day & night over the network, so the information that gets backed up also counts on these "monitoring tools" - DU meter & Netmeter and the like, so how accurate would these tools be? not very at all!

just trying to add more as I agree that virgin SHOULD supply something to show how much you have used!

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

Which I agree they should but a router can do this a Sirus pointed out and if you have a network you can use a router to do this netmeter and likes of this are only really good if you have one pc more than one pc or gaming console then a router can do this, as your more likely to have a router if using more than on pc/console

Re: Pathetic excuse.
 

IF every router could do it (and I know mine cannot) and people transfer files between PC's by network, how do you think them files are transfered??? yep you got it, it goes through the router, so your point STILL is not valid, as say I transfer a 3GB file from one PC to another, that 3GB WILL show up as data, one computer will be uploading the data, while the target computer will be downloading it from the uploading computer, you think that internal network bandwidth (pc-to-pc) is not counted??

This is why my DU Meter shows my monthly usage around 300GB just on 1 computer alone, without the others around the house!!!

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You need to monitor the WAN port on the router, not the LAN port. That way only traffic that goes onto your internet link will be counted.

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I knew mr broadband would help with the my post lol

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Abit of a ****take having to do all that though.

Glad i dont have to put up with issues like that :p:

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But STILL, some if not most routers do not support this, so then what can we use??

It is down to virgin to provide measures so we can check this information!

With the phone package, they dont charge people for calls WITHOUT showing the important information so we the customers can check, such as date, time, number called, duration and cost of each call etc, and yes we even have the choice for FULL itemised billing, so if they can apply this to the phone package, they can easily apply it to broadband! But like has been said somewhere above, they are now saying they cannot as their STM model is a joke and a lot of people have been hit with STM without even using their connections, yes there is a fault with it, and this is virgin's way of denying all liability for problems with THEIR STM model! Its the typical VM BS of lying & even having the cheek to blame US the customers that put the phat bonuses in their pockets for sitting on their useless (often fat) backsides as they cook up even more ways to screw its PAYING loyal customers over yet again!

Point prooved, enough said! This will be my final word on the matter as nothing anyone can say will make me change my mind!

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Quite agree.

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and now think of your happy place and breath

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do not patronise me, I have my oppinions and you have yours!

Not everyone has a router that can do what yours can!

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Ok *rolls a joint*...ok i'm going to a pretty place where the flowers grow, i'll be back later :p:

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I see someone needs a hug and a happy pill, come on dude I was playing around, trax pass the joint to stev.

Sorry mods will get back on topic now

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Yes let us do so. ;)

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So you would be happy to pay for a version of itemised billing on your internet traffic? Or has VM stopped charging for that on the phone bill? Or do you expect that for nowt?

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Most likely for nowt like all customers expect

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Wrong you set it to monitor the WAN port only

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So if we the customers had access to such information, wouldn't that mean it'd finaly be possible (at last) to establish the true percentage of customers falling foul of stm on a daily basis?

Coincidence?? hmmm..

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Yes exactly my point :) :)

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It suits VM to STM more than they should it saves them money, to supply the customer a way to see what is being used is one way the customer could prove they shouldn't be SMT'd. Will dig around but almost sure OFCOM did say if limitations were in place customers had to have the ability to see their usage supplied by the ISP.. But it was a long tinme ago I was in this discussion so will need to dig about. Mind one waay to perhaps make this happen would be if large numbers of VM customers complained to OFCOM about being SMT'd without the ISP allowing them access to usage and their own downloaded software said you hadn't used enough to be smt'd.

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VM can just say routers and 3rd party software can tell you how much you have used

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You didn't answer my question I see.

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So you keep regurgitating. However, in the context of Florence's post that response is too far off the mark. If the statment she made was correct about the ISP having to supply usage data, then the line of "go get the data yourself" frankly is not good enough.

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The big problem is if your 3rd party software said you shouldnt be stm'd and you were and rang up virgin to complain they'd just turn around and tell you that your monitoring software must be in error. If they did show usage rates on a web interface there would be no uncertainty and we could put the old "stm'd out of hours" to bed once and for all. While we dont have access to the figures that VM are holding we can't argue a case that you have been wrongfully stm'd.