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-   -   Disabled rights to be strengthened? Let's hope so! (https://www.cableforum.uk/board/showthread.php?t=33627887)

Osem 31-01-2008 10:00
Disabled rights to be strengthened? Let's hope so!
 
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/london/7219097.stm

Delta Whiskey 31-01-2008 11:00
Re: Disabled rights to be strengthened? Let's hope so!
 
Carers save this country millions of pounds a year, they deserve better protection.

nomadking 31-01-2008 11:45
Re: Disabled rights to be strengthened? Let's hope so!
 
The child just has a hearing problem. Why would anyone need a lot of days off?

haydnwalker 31-01-2008 11:50
Re: Disabled rights to be strengthened? Let's hope so!
 
At the moment, I care for my fiance and my employers (the NHS) are very good at letting me have time off to take her to appointments and such-like. I do still wander sometimes if it'll come and bite me in the backside at some point.

In my view, family comes above everything else. I welcome any new laws/guidance in regard to carers' rights.

Osem 31-01-2008 12:00
Re: Disabled rights to be strengthened? Let's hope so!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by nomadking (Post 34480464)
The child just has a hearing problem. Why would anyone need a lot of days off?
"Ms Coleman was already working with the law firm when she gave birth to a disabled son in 2002.

He suffers from serious respiratory problems, including apnoeic attacks - an involuntary halt to breathing."

---------- Post added at 11:00 ---------- Previous post was at 10:57 ----------

I have a close personal connection to a special school and can testify to the enormous problems the parents suffer, not only dealing with the various physical/mental difficulties their children suffer but with the ever increasing pressure put upon them in the workplace. Any reasonable help offered to such people is much needed/deserved and this decision is long overdue.

Taf 31-01-2008 12:01
Re: Disabled rights to be strengthened? Let's hope so!
 
NTL effectively put me out of my job as I have handicapped twins... but I was glad to go once they agreed to the proper redundancy package I was entitled to.

tweetypie/8 31-01-2008 12:06
Re: Disabled rights to be strengthened? Let's hope so!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Delta Whiskey (Post 34480449)
Carers save this country millions of pounds a year, they deserve better protection.
without carers a heck of a lot of people young and old would be left to try and fend for them selves,which for a lot of them would be an impossibility,not nice.

nomadking 31-01-2008 12:10
Re: Disabled rights to be strengthened? Let's hope so!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Osem (Post 34480474)
"Ms Coleman was already working with the law firm when she gave birth to a disabled son in 2002.

He suffers from serious respiratory problems, including apnoeic attacks - an involuntary halt to breathing."
The article originally said just a hearing problem, it was last edited at 10:39 today. This is the reason for my first statement.

Osem 31-01-2008 14:13
Re: Disabled rights to be strengthened? Let's hope so!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by nomadking (Post 34480482)
The article originally said just a hearing problem, it was last edited at 10:39 today. This is the reason for my first statement.
Even so, hearing problems per se are not necessarily trivial matters (especially in the very young) and may require frequent hospital visits etc.

cookie_365 31-01-2008 18:42
Re: Disabled rights to be strengthened? Let's hope so!
 
This is excellent news :)

And hopefully companies thinking of instructing this firm for employment law advise will think again too ;)

Vlad_Dracul 31-01-2008 19:33
Re: Disabled rights to be strengthened? Let's hope so!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Osem (Post 34480417)
It is all very well various groups demanding special rights and priveledges but the fact is that most people operate in commercial environments where such rights actually cost someone else time and money.

That cost doesnt go away.

If someone thinks they have or are granted a right to disappear from work to do something else then;

(a) do they expect to still be paid for the time they are away?

(b) who foots the bill for lost production?

(c) who does the work whilst that person is away?

Speaking for my own work environment, If i have to provide work cover for a person who is off sick,i get paid a proportion of their salary (pro rata) and they loose it. Simple as that.

It seems like the only people in this country who do not have any special claim to "rights" and "benefits" are the ordinary caucasian,heterosexual,long suffering,non complaining male.

Genuine cases excepted of course and all usual disclaimers apply.

---------- Post added at 18:33 ---------- Previous post was at 18:32 ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Osem (Post 34480417)
We didnt hear from the child's father on the BBC news..?

Osem 31-01-2008 22:08
Re: Disabled rights to be strengthened? Let's hope so!
 
Well we all pay in taxes for services/benefits we don't necessarily use directly don't we and since the people in question are by definition the most vulnerable in society I think we all have a duty to help. It may have escaped you but the majority always tend to pay for the minority in one way or another and that's as it should be in a civilised society. Furthermore carers save the taxpayer vast sums of money which would otherwise have to be spent on providing long term care to the sick. disabled etc. If you are ever unfortunate enough to become disabled or to have to care for someone who is you'll have those rights too and I don't suppose you'll refuse the assistance they provide. As for the "caucasian,heterosexual,long suffering,non complaining male", presumably your belief is that they're immune from disability or a life of caring for others. Presumably they never do anything which incurs a net cost for anyone else - I mean there's no such thing as the "ordinary caucasian,heterosexual,long suffering,non complaining male" who leaves his wife and family, fails to support them and in so doing forces the taxpayer to provide.... Course not.....


---------- Post added at 21:08 ---------- Previous post was at 21:07 ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vlad_Dracul (Post 34480701)


We didnt hear from the child's father on the BBC news..?

and your point is?????........... Presumably he's also an "ordinary caucasian,heterosexual,long suffering,non complaining male".

Delta Whiskey 31-01-2008 22:27
Re: Disabled rights to be strengthened? Let's hope so!
 
I had a very understanding employer, so was able to reduced my work hours enabling me to look after my parents who were both dying from lung cancer (they both had been smokers). I worked all the shifts no-one else wanted, very early mornings, late nights and weekends so I could be there during the day. Six years of 24/7/365, I'm not complaining, I did what I had to do. Spare a thought for those who are still out there doing it right now.

Osem 31-01-2008 22:31
Re: Disabled rights to be strengthened? Let's hope so!
 
.......and how this country relies on people like you. :tu:

jkat 01-02-2008 10:51
Re: Disabled rights to be strengthened? Let's hope so!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vlad_Dracul (Post 34480701)
Speaking for my own work environment, If i have to provide work cover for a person who is off sick,i get paid a proportion of their salary (pro rata) and they loose it. Simple as that.
do u get a proprtion of their illness/dissabilty as well? whats the company called "bloodsuckers anonymous" vlad ? :D

Vlad_Dracul 01-02-2008 11:19
Re: Disabled rights to be strengthened? Let's hope so!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jkat (Post 34480955)
do u get a proprtion of their illness/dissabilty as well? whats the company called "bloodsuckers anonymous" vlad ? :D

Noper. The situation is that If one of my colleagues goes off sick and cover is required to do their work/hours then they lose a proportion of their pay and I get it.

The company is a major international blue chip company with a name/brand that would be instantly recognisable to all !

Its the modern way you see and i expect that many employers will be adopteding similar practices.

---------- Post added at 10:17 ---------- Previous post was at 10:15 ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by cookie_365 (Post 34480667)
This is excellent news :)

And hopefully companies thinking of instructing this firm for employment law advise will think again too ;)
And presumably employers thinking of employing anyone who has a higher than normal carer workload will think again too..?

---------- Post added at 10:19 ---------- Previous post was at 10:17 ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Osem (Post 34480788)
Well we all pay in taxes for services/benefits we don't necessarily use directly don't we and since the people in question are by definition the most vulnerable in society I think we all have a duty to help. It may have escaped you but the majority always tend to pay for the minority in one way or another and that's as it should be in a civilised society. Furthermore carers save the taxpayer vast sums of money which would otherwise have to be spent on providing long term care to the sick. disabled etc. If you are ever unfortunate enough to become disabled or to have to care for someone who is you'll have those rights too and I don't suppose you'll refuse the assistance they provide. As for the "caucasian,heterosexual,long suffering,non complaining male", presumably your belief is that they're immune from disability or a life of caring for others. Presumably they never do anything which incurs a net cost for anyone else - I mean there's no such thing as the "ordinary caucasian,heterosexual,long suffering,non complaining male" who leaves his wife and family, fails to support them and in so doing forces the taxpayer to provide.... Course not.....


---------- Post added at 21:08 ---------- Previous post was at 21:07 ----------




and your point is?????........... Presumably he's also an "ordinary caucasian,heterosexual,long suffering,non complaining male".
I shall clarify. There was no sight of a father for the child nor any indication or implication that a father was available. Obviously there is a father for this child somewhere and so it would have been helpful if he had been available to comment on what his role is in the childs upbringing.

Osem 01-02-2008 12:10
Re: Disabled rights to be strengthened? Let's hope so!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vlad_Dracul (Post 34480963)

I shall clarify. There was no sight of a father for the child nor any indication or implication that a father was available. Obviously there is a father for this child somewhere and so it would have been helpful if he had been available to comment on what his role is in the childs upbringing.
All of which has exactly what to do with extending rights for the disabled and those they depend on?

Vlad_Dracul 01-02-2008 13:50
Re: Disabled rights to be strengthened? Let's hope so!
 
It is loosely connected in that the father, be he estranged or not, has a legal and moral duty to look after his child and render whatever assistance is necessary to the mother of that child in support of her parenting.

If such support was available then it may well be that this lady may not have had this issue with her employer in the first place.

Of course the presence or not of a father in this matter is speculation at this stage.

It may be useful to consider that whilst the EEC is busy bestowing all sorts of rights and privileges on individuals and groups,along with the associated costs on others who are not the beneficiaries of such rights and privileges, the tiger economies are forging ahead. They have lower cost bases and if we do not remain competitive, then there will be penalties for an even wider group of us in UK plc to pay.

I am quite sure that there are plenty of parents who manage to look after their children and keep in work. Plenty of them have more than one child also I'll wager.

Osem 01-02-2008 14:20
Re: Disabled rights to be strengthened? Let's hope so!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vlad_Dracul (Post 34481034)
It is loosely connected in that the father, be he estranged or not, has a legal and moral duty to look after his child and render whatever assistance is necessary to the mother of that child in support of her parenting.

If such support was available then it may well be that this lady may not have had this issue with her employer in the first place.

Of course the presence or not of a father in this matter is speculation at this stage.

It may be useful to consider that whilst the EEC is busy bestowing all sorts of rights and privileges on individuals and groups,along with the associated costs on others who are not the beneficiaries of such rights and privileges, the tiger economies are forging ahead. They have lower cost bases and if we do not remain competitive, then there will be penalties for an even wider group of us in UK plc to pay.

I am quite sure that there are plenty of parents who manage to look after their children and keep in work. Plenty of them have more than one child also I'll wager.
And what if the father isn't around or is himself unable to offer support to his disabled child for whatever reason? Even if he is around, if he is unfortunate enough to have a similar employer to his partner's he'll also be deserving of and a beneficiary of the new rights provided won't he.

Unless I am missing something this lady did want to work and tried her best to obtain felxible working arrangements by which to continue doing so - it was her employers who were found to have acted wrongly in refusing her requests.

I'm afraid the implication of much of what you post is that the disabled and those they depend upon should simply have to get on with it and of course you continue neglecting to acknowledge the vast amount of money carers actually save the taxpayer by doing the decent thing and not placing the entire financial burden on the state.

jkat 01-02-2008 15:36
Re: Disabled rights to be strengthened? Let's hope so!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vlad_Dracul (Post 34480963)
Noper. The situation is that If one of my colleagues goes off sick and cover is required to do their work/hours then they lose a proportion of their pay and I get it.

.
so how does it work, do u for instance fight it out amongst your selves (in your own time of course) who does the extra work and the winner works longer hours or do u manage to fit the extra work in your normal working day?

Vlad_Dracul 01-02-2008 17:23
Re: Disabled rights to be strengthened? Let's hope so!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jkat (Post 34481075)
so how does it work, do u for instance fight it out amongst your selves (in your own time of course) who does the extra work and the winner works longer hours or do u manage to fit the extra work in your normal working day?
It works like this.

Our group or team knows what their allocated duties/hours of work etc are for about 6 months ahead.

If a team member goes off sick, the manager will decide if the duties/hours/shift the sick person would have done actually requires covering.

If it is decided that cover is required, then another person will be apporached to cover those duties. It may be that the duties that require covering include more honorous hours/shifts/nights/weekends etc so a person who is just on a week of days might be approached.

Each team member submits documentation every week relating to hours worked etc

There is allocated space on the docs to indicate what cover you provided.

Equally the sick person has space on his sheet to indicate where cover WAS provided for his abscece.

All docs go off to GHQ for processing.

End result,a sum of money moves from coveree to coverer.

Strangley, people are not as sick as they once were...

If it operated in your (anyone reading) work environment, do you think sickness levels would reduce?

Hugh 01-02-2008 17:56
Re: Disabled rights to be strengthened? Let's hope so!
 
Could you just clarify, please?

The money that is transferred non-attendee to covering person - is this basic salary, or overtime/shift allowance/piecework allocation/etc?

shabbychic 04-02-2008 14:37
Re: Disabled rights to be strengthened? Let's hope so!
 
my OH is my carer (although we now sell antiques online part time) but before i was well enough to do this, his boss had no sympathy whatsoever.
and it proves how much money carer save the country by my own experience.

OH got asked to go for an interveiw to be retrained (if you dont go they stop your allowance)
whilst there the interveiwer basically said to him

"okay, we suggest you keep on being you wifes carer, but once she's give up the ghost, just get in touch, and we'll sort out some training for you to begin a new career" :shocked: LOL!

dilli-theclaw 04-02-2008 14:40
Re: Disabled rights to be strengthened? Let's hope so!
 
Indeed, I can't help but get the feeling that some people on here and in general would much prefer the disabled to be put down.

Osem 04-02-2008 16:10
Re: Disabled rights to be strengthened? Let's hope so!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jefferson T (Post 34482724)
Indeed, I can't help but get the feeling that some people on here and in general would much prefer the disabled to be put down.
Yes - pretty pathetic aren't they!

and no doubt they'll shout long and loud when they're old/infirm.

shabbychic 04-02-2008 16:12
Re: Disabled rights to be strengthened? Let's hope so!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jefferson T (Post 34482724)
Indeed, I can't help but get the feeling that some people on here and in general would much prefer the disabled to be put down.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Osem (Post 34482795)
Yes - pretty pathetic aren't they!
oh well,
at least i know when i do pop it, my OH will end up in a good job :D


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