DNS and Nameserver issues
 

OK i'm on the Swansea network and run a website.

Our website has been hosted in the US for about a year but we decided for various reasons to move to a UK server.

So we updated nameservers and waited, as one does, for the isp's to resolve to the new server.

However this was almost a week ago (we updated last Monday) and although every isp on the face of the planet is now resolving to our new server, NTL Swansea isn't.

We are a local focused community on the borough of Neath Port Talbot, Http://www.nptchat.co.uk, so you can imagine that when your local proxy hasn't updated its DNS to reflect your new server, it causes no end of trouble for the poor members of that area.

We've tried a great many things to try and resolve this. Our provider has researched, we've researched but theres nothing forthcoming.

The proxies that are effected are

swan-cache-1.server.ntli.net (Swansea)Ink
swan-cache-2.server.ntli.net [swa/swan]
swan-cache-3.server.ntli.net
swan-cache-4.server.ntli.net
swan-cache-5.server.ntli.net

Ironically

swan-cache-6.server.ntli.net
swan-cache-7.server.ntli.net
swan-cache-8.server.ntli.net

point to the new server.

I've tried a variety of proxies around the UK and Leicester is the only other area that points to the old server.

I've currently implemented a temporary redirect for my poor members and this has, at least for the intrim, restored partial website usage.

I've also tried to contact NTL and boy what a flipping joke. I managed to get through to NTL business who said they were not part of Virgin Media. He said however that the Swansea cache was always causing issue and he really wasn't surprised. I then hung on the telephone and eventually spoke to a Raj (why is it always a flipping Raj ? ) who frankly i couldn't understand too well. I explained to him i think i needed to speak to a higher tech on this issue but he assured me he could help. Several minutes after explaining to him he said he couldn't help and i would need to speak to someone above him (ARGHHHHHHH). He wanted me to telephone yet another number, i'd been doing this since 9am, and i said he could jolly well put me through himself.

So he agreed and did just that, only another Raj came on the phone (a different Raj) and again he couldn't speak a great deal of recognisable English. I again explained the problem and he said he'd pass me to higher Tech as he was just the same as the other Raj. Then, and you'll love this part, i got an automated message saying "we see you need further help. You need to telephone - WHATEVER NUMBER - Calls cost £1 a minute". I was appalled.

So i spent around an hour at god only knows what cost per a minute to tell them they have some issues and just couldn't get anybody with any sense.

So we are now left with a proxy that doesn't seem to be updating its nameservers and members hitting an old site and being redirected to the new site.

Anybody offer any advice ?

Re: DNS and Nameserver issues
 

Interesting..I've just done this on the standard VM dns server for ex ntl area:

nslookup www.nptchat.co.uk
Server: cache1.ntli.net
Address: 194.168.4.100

Non-authoritative answer:
Name: nptchat.co.uk
Address: 194.0.252.3
Aliases: www.nptchat.co.uk

Seems OK

Just tried swan-cache-1.server.ntli.net, and its going to the forum, but not resolving the name, very odd.

> www.nptchat.co.uk
Server: swan-cache-1.server.ntli.net
Address: 213.105.224.11

Non-authoritative answer:
Name: nptchat.co.uk
Address: 72.9.252.210
Aliases: www.nptchat.co.uk

Perhaps a tech from Swansea can pick this up and raise a ticket for you, any takers?

Actually, I got curious and ran your domain through DNS Stuff, I assume you have moved hosting back to the old company?

http://www.dnsstuff.com/tools/dnsrep....nptchat.co.uk

Re: DNS and Nameserver issues
 

Have you tried not using a proxy, as I assumed they [virginmedia] were supposed to be shutting them down anyway?

Re: DNS and Nameserver issues
 

Thanks Toto

i've pretty much given up to be honest and am moving my servers back :(

I can use a proxy to eliminate the issue but that really doesn't help my member now:(

Re: DNS and Nameserver issues
 

Well i'm back trying to migrate my website to another server and yet again every cache, isp and provider has updated and resolved apart from Swansea Virgin Media. As i'm a localised community dealing in just the swansea and Neath Port Talbot areas you can imagine how troublesome this has become.

I've set a temp redirect from the old server to the new server (calling the new servers ip) so at least my members can access the website but why oh why does Swansea not resolve ? Anyone any ideas ?

Re: DNS and Nameserver issues
 

Swansea don't use cache's anymore, this is very strange.

Re: DNS and Nameserver issues
 

No thats true they don't :( But they arn't resolving this domain at all :(

Does anybody know who i can call on this ? Going through that automated telephone system will be totally pointless. Any help appreciated.

Re: DNS and Nameserver issues
 

OK, I see your point.

VM are currently upgrading their whole DNS network, this should be in place by September according to third party reports.

Re: DNS and Nameserver issues
 

Oh god i can't wait till September LOL :)

---------- Post added at 16:55 ---------- Previous post was at 16:27 ----------

There must be somebody you can report shoddy dns propagation too at Virgin Media ? I know last time i tried i got the right run around though.

Anybody any idea ?

Re: DNS and Nameserver issues
 

Hey There,

VM's DNS servers in Swansea appear to be behaving normally.

Your old authoritative DNS servers are still responding and giving out the wrong answer for that domain. Contact the owners of the servers still hosting this domain and ask them to stop! :o)

old dns servers:
nptchat.co.uk. 86400 IN NS ns2.whsrv5.com.
nptchat.co.uk. 86400 IN NS ns1.whsrv5.com.

new dns servers:
nptchat.co.uk. 84548 IN NS ns578.hostgator.com.
nptchat.co.uk. 84548 IN NS ns577.hostgator.com.

Asking these DNS servers about the server:

adam@myhost>host -t a nptchat.co.uk ns1.whsrv5.com | grep addr
nptchat.co.uk has address 72.249.55.36

adam@myhost>host -t a nptchat.co.uk ns578.hostgator.com | grep addr
nptchat.co.uk has address 74.53.26.194

If the admins of ns1/2.whsrv5.com cease to host the domain, then the new records will be able to propagate correctly. :o)

Any DNS servers that have 'cached' the old entries for your site may have problems until the old authoritative DNS servers cease giving out bogus answers!

Adam.

Re: DNS and Nameserver issues
 

Adam i'm not entirely sure what you mean my friend although i do completely thankyou for responding.

ns1.whsrv5.com is my old provider host but not my domain name holder, they are just a webservice that i pointed to using their ns1.whsrv5.com and ns2.whsrv5.com nameservers. I have changed those dns entries at my domain host side from that to NS ns578.hostgator.com. and NS ns577.hostgator.com because i've moved the website to hostgator in the US (our domain name is hosted with namescheap).

Almost everyone has updated appropriately apart from the Swansea NTL area (causing me a great deal of issue as you can understand).

Who do you feel i should contact mate and what should i request them to do ?

Re: DNS and Nameserver issues
 

dizzy, I wouldn't ask you to do this normally, and you would have every right to question me on this, but trust what Adam says, honestly. ;)

Re: DNS and Nameserver issues
 

Toto i do mate but im not sure how to rectify the problem ?

I'm I reading this right, it it my previous host holding the domain somehow and if so how do i tell them they are doing it and how to rectify it ?

Re: DNS and Nameserver issues
 

I would think you could contact your old hosting company, and ask them to resolve the problem, well I think. :)

Re: DNS and Nameserver issues
 

No probs sir :)

The problem is that your old provider (who held DNS for this zone) still is holding DNS records for it. If you look below, you'll see that i ask your old ISP DNS "who owns the DNS servers?"- and it thinks it owns them. :(

adam@myhost> host -t ns nptchat.co.uk ns1.whsrv5.com
nptchat.co.uk name server ns2.whsrv5.com
nptchat.co.uk name server ns1.whsrv5.com

If i just let my machine resolve it (off the Virgin Media network), it gets the correct servers;

host -t ns nptchat.co.uk
nptchat.co.uk name server ns578.hostgator.com
nptchat.co.uk name server ns577.hostgator.com

NTL, who are they? ;)

This is likely because you accessed your page using the Swansea DNS servers before- so its cached the result. The other caches around Virgins Network are new to the domain-- so when someone tests another cache for you- that cache has never learnt about the old domain- so picks up the new servers immediately :)

The Swansea caches, because they're familiar with the old host, have cached the fact that the old host is authoritative- so they will go there for updates.

In english-- When the "timeout" for your zone comes up for expiry on Swansea caches - Swansea caches will contact your old provider and say "Hey, can i have an update?" and your old provider is saying "Sure, here you go!" and giving them wrong information, when really they should be saying "Sorry mate, I don't do that job anymore- go away!".

hostgator.com DNS servers are fine- you can leave them be- however you should contact your old provider (ns1.whsrv5.com), and ask them to stop responding authoritatively for your domain (as though they own it).

From the DNS record, it says you should email root@wh5.whsrv5.com, which sounds a bit odd. So you could try hostmaster@whsrv5.com, or hostmaster@wh5.whsrv5.com.

nptchat.co.uk start of authority ns1.whsrv5.com root.wh5.whsrv5.com (

I would hope you know the admin of the old host- or at least have access to modify the configs there. :)

Hope this helps, good luck!

Adam.

Re: DNS and Nameserver issues
 

Adam your a star mate. I understand what your saying here and have contacted them to ask them to stop being the authoritative provider for my domain.

Hopefully they'll understand the issue and respond accordingly so that i can finally get a resolve to this situation.

I'll let everyone know the outcome as its an important lesson to learn and thanks every so much for the indepth and plain english explanation of what is happening. Above and beyond mate and you have my thanks.

Re: DNS and Nameserver issues
 

Here, here.:clap:

Re: DNS and Nameserver issues
 

Don't thank me yet, nothings working ;)

Good luck sir, let me know how you get on!

Thanks,

Adam.

Re: DNS and Nameserver issues
 

Oh no Adam you deserve my thanks mate because you identified the problem. With that knowledge i now have the tools i need to try and get it resolved :)

Re: DNS and Nameserver issues
 

Great first post's there from Adam and I actually learnt something, sure beats the slow speed threads! lol :D

Re: DNS and Nameserver issues
 

Well my response from my provider was as i figured it would be :( It isn't them at fault (as always). They've been nothing but trouble for months, what with hotmail and yahoo mail issues, slow access speeds, inadequate support staff who don't read tickets properly, server being down for around 4 days (again) and now this issue with DNS. Heres the response.
Thae last time i tried moving away from this provider i waited over a week and my domain still didn't propogate :( Is there anything else i can do as clearly they are not going to do anything themselves ..

I still have an account with them currently that is redirecting any traffic to http://www.nptchat.co.uk/ to our new server by IP, i.e. http://74.53.26.194/~weplycom/forums/ which at least allows my members to find and use the new server. This is so incredibly frustrating and just proves that going with a bad host is a very very bad idea.

Any further help would seriously be appreciated and i really really thankyou for all the help so far. You guys have been fantastic.

Re: DNS and Nameserver issues
 

Dowh! - their DNS servers are still quite clearly giving out bad answers.

adam@myhost>host -t a nptchat.co.uk ns1.whsrv5.com
Using domain server:
Name: ns1.whsrv5.com
Address: 72.249.55.37
Aliases:

nptchat.co.uk has address 72.249.55.36

How do you control the DNS for your domain- do they update it for you, or do you have a control panel? If you have a control panel- there should be some option for removing that domain from DNS. If they control it, then you need to go back to them and demand they stop hosting DNS for a domain they do not have any control over.

Quote the evidence- their DNS server is still giving bad answers, and it must stop. They're the chaps in charge- to hand it over properly they need to stop answering. :) (its not difficult..)

Of course, Virgin Media could restart all the DNS servers in Swansea, which would flush the cache, and as a side effect fix your issue (because they would forget who's authoritative for the domain). But this would give less than optimal service to other users in the area while the DNS server re-learn popular hosts! Not a good solution to fix an issue with just one site, which could happen again tomorrow with someone elses!

We really need to attack the underlying issue- hosting providers need to cease holding configurations for domains they no longer host... :o)

Adam.

Re: DNS and Nameserver issues
 

Hi Adam and thanks again for contacting me mate, its really appreciated.

My domain name is hosted at namescheap.com and i do have a control panel. I've updated the nameservers, pointing them to hostgater and nowhere is the wiredhub nameservers listed anywhere, this is what baffles me.

Whats really baffling however is that its only Swansea that hasn't and refuses to change. We have members on BT, AOL etc and that changed for them, allowing them to hit the new server using the nptchat.co.uk domain name.

I just don't no what else to do and being a local focal group based around Neath Port Talbot (where most members use the Swansea Cache) its really really causing MASSIVE headaches. If i'm not careful google will penalise us to for duplicate content and its already effecting advertising revenue. :(

---------- Post added at 10:45 ---------- Previous post was at 10:38 ----------

One thing i wonder is if i delete the account from there completely in the cpanel control panel, will it then resolve ? The one worry i have doing this is that my members hitting the old server would then hit a dead website and not be pushed to the new website if that didn't fix the issue :(

Re: DNS and Nameserver issues
 

Looks like i finally have what could be a resolve to the issue.

I've asked support to delete just the DNS entries for this domain, this may hopefully force Swansea VM to update their cache.

Again thanks for all the help via PM and publicly guys. I'll let you know if this resolves it. Wish me luck :)

Re: DNS and Nameserver issues
 

Hi
I'm in the Swansea area and have had trouble like this for weeks.

I have to use a proxy on some sites and not use a proxy on others.

Causing a bit of a problem my side aswell.

Re: DNS and Nameserver issues
 

Yes i still think some of the troubles lay with Swansea but you just can't speak tio anybody who handles that infrastructure about it :(

Re: DNS and Nameserver issues
 

Can you give a bit of detail about what the problem is? I don't see any issues with Swansea... the issue in this thread is due to a hosting provider not correctly handing over authoritative DNS for a domain- which is causing some DNS caches to have troubles updating...

Adam.