UsetServer slow Downloads
 

Ive been pulling my hair out on this for weeks, but after reading some of the articles on here relating to this it seems I'm not the only one.

I'm on a 10mb connection and normally get about 1200kbs download from UNS.

Now I will sometimes get this in the morning time but by evening this slows to about 200 to 300kbs.

UNS say that I've probally been placed in an Ip block for high users, as I've read on here. apparently unlimited use for my £35 does not mean unlimited.

Sky are releasing a 10mb service in my area soon and that might be time to jump ship if NTL are going to do this and not have the courtesy to inform me of their actions.

This has to be illegal?

The Wid

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

LMAO, Its legal for you to download copyrighted material all day long is it ? yet somehow you want to say it may be illegal for NTL to stop you from doing it... Thats just too funny.

I hope sky move into your area soon, thats one less person leeching from newsgroups all the time and ruining the service fcor the rest of us.

bye

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

I am a very very heavy user and i can get full speed off giganews at any time of the day. NTL are not from the information i have been given and from my knowledge of how cable modems work putting users on different ip's for bad users. I can tell you now if they were i would be the first to be put on one.

At the moment Newshosting are so slow i dumped my account with them and signed up with giganews there is also a thread about this HERE and HERE

Now you can chose not to believe me but why is it i can get full speed from giga news and not from Newshosting ?.

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

Thanks for that reply Bill, I think I might give the Giganews Free trial a go, as for the other Guy, not that I should justify myself, I have a 10mb connection because I'm one of those lucky *******s who work from home and make loads of money doing it, I don't own a games console, only listen to classical music and like to watch my movies how they are meant to be watched..on the big screen.

I and the rest of my family do like our TV though and Desperate Housewives Scrubs Lost and all the other good shows are about 1 year ahead of us in the US and I like to download the new episodes as they come available.

So now I don't sit here downloading all day, I do however like to get what I pay for.

Regards

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

Yep, like Bill says, I get excellent speeds from GigaNews - nearly always maxing out my 10Mb, and if it's not at max, it's very close to it.

If you fancy giving it a try, sign-up to their 3-day free trial. You can sign up here http://www.giganews.com/?c=gn359139 (using my account as a referral, but costs you nothing) or at www.giganews.com (without any referral).

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

Indeed i too like my movies and TV shows. Hope giganews works out for you.

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

Why yes, yes it is.

Yes, yes it is although this is a matter of debate and interpretation.

---------- Post added at 20:00 ---------- Previous post was at 19:58 ----------

Also this whole giganews pwns speed anytime of the day is flat out weird. I just signed onto them, I was getting 2mbps from all the speed tests I could, and other news servers. But giganews was running at >10mbits. They have some awesome routing going on. Conversely NTL's routing to the rest of the internet is awful. But that works fine outside of peak times. So why giganews so fast 24/7??

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

are you meaning dl of >10mb/s? possible? how?

signed up with giganews yesterday and can finally get some decent speeds, at the mo im getting not much under 2.5mb/s so a decently sized file eg film or something come in at about 25 mins not bad compared to something like an hour or so from newsdemon, a little bit more expensive than others but although i've only had them for just over a day i think it's worth it.

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

:LOL:

Don't go shouting about it or NTL will slow it down.

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

I'm on the 20mbit trial, I presume that's why? I'll go check giganews now at true prime time and report back in a bit.

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

just nice to be able to make use of hard paid for connection bill, gotta do something other than gaming as er' indoors keeps moaning about:blah:

:D

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

Try this :D

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

OK just tried it, getting 8-9mbit from giganews. And from speedtest.net:

https://www.cableforum.co.uk/images/...2006/11/42.png

Dunno why this is, from speed test in the morning it's always over 10mbits.

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

Believe it or not that speed test will give you different results depending on what proxy you are on

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

Yah, but it's with all sites and speed tests. Not just one. What proxy do you use Bill to get good web speed?

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

Well tonight i have not been as the Manchester south proxy's seem ok :Yikes:. Never in a million years did i think i would be saying that. :LOL:

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

Ditto!

My advice is dump your Newsprovider and sign up for Giganews.

I get 1207kB/s ANY TIME OF DAY :D

---------- Post added at 21:58 ---------- Previous post was at 21:56 ----------

Who mentioned anything about Copyrighted Material???

Every post on Usenet is not copyrighted/illegal material you know. :rolleyes:

---------- Post added at 22:04 ---------- Previous post was at 21:58 ----------

No SSL Bill.

Giganews offer that now for a extra $5, you dont want NTL spying on your downloads now do you? ;)

---------- Post added at 22:06 ---------- Previous post was at 22:04 ----------

Me too, these Linux Distros seem to get bigger and bigger every week dont they? :p: :p: :p:

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

It's not illegal. They have clauses in their terms and conditions that enable them to take action against heavy downloaders. When they do, the action taken does not (AFAIK) include a range of IPs for heavy users.

However, the situation with Newshosting appears to be that their connection with NTL is slow, and rather than doing something about it, Newshosting are blaming NTL.

Giganews actually has a dedicated link to NTL, which is why they are able to offer high speeds reliably.

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

Yeh right; so you are trying to say its possible to max out a 10mb or 20mb connection for so many hours a day .. every day .. i smell something and its not the wife cooking!

Lets take an example ...

Fedord Core 6, 3.28gb for the dvd ISO download, on a 10mb connection that wouldnt take all that long.. Just exactly how many times do you need it ? .. now lets say you want to try every major linux distro .. thats maybe 10 - 15 dvd's you need. So there's maybe 3 days of your connection used at most. -
( i moan about it but ... ) All you people moan about slow speeds, then you sit there and saturate bandwidth all day long..

Can't have it both ways, either accept that there is only so much bandwidth in the world and limit yourselves, or dont moan when you are forcefully slowed down or stopped from pillaging it all.

Frankly you are lucky i dont get to make the decisions .. if i did you people using 200gb+ of bandwidth a month would be looking for another service provider.

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

You don't have to limit anything, you have to choose when to use the bandwidth. Like outside of prime time. And as I keep saying over and over, it's not illegal to download copyrighted material

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

So why do people get prosecuted for it?

I'm exempt from copyright laws if the music I download is for work purposes - I use the radio station's licence. If it's not illegal then why do I need the licence?

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

If it's not illegal to download copyrighted material, why are the various companies that create the movies, music, software, spending so much effort of closing down sites that provide these downloads? If the legality was above reproach then the sites wouldn't be able to be closed.

Or are you saying that the person who breaches the copyright rules is only the uploader, not the leecher?

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

Is it not UPloading that they are done for ?.

---------- Post added at 09:15 ---------- Previous post was at 09:14 ----------

It seems to be that way at the moment. I might be wrong but i think all the RIAA and MPAA attacks have been on uploaders

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

I suggest you take a peek:

http://mp3.about.com/od/isitlegal/a/riaalawsuits.htm

Look near the bottom where it completely dismisses your foolish notion that downloading copyrighted material isnt illegal.


in fact i'll make it easy for you:::

"To be as specific/technical as possible, downloading copyrighted material without expressed permission is illegal. Such music must be purchased in order to be legal. "

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

Every now and then we get the It's wrong brigade come along. I just ask you one thing are you totally squeaky clean in EVERYTHING you do in your life. I bet you have done something wrong.

So what gives you the right to come on here and lecture someone about what is right and wrong .

And as you have a beef about what people download. If i was to fill my bandwidth with LEGAL downloads all day i take it you would be happy with that as its legal or do you just dislike downloading full stop

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

They work by people not knowing their legal rights and not having the capital to fight. They work against people's fears. In the US they sue single mums, dead people, students etc because they know they cannot fight it. They pick on the weak, helpless and ignorant. Fortuntely recently they picked on a millionaire who plans to take their invitation of a court date.

In the US, for example, the DMCA's safe harbor provisions are abused. US webhosts and are compelled to remove sites, to protect themselves from damages claims. They are effectively using blackmail to use ISP's/SP's as a proxy for enforcing IP law. Even if they're not entirely in the legal right. They publically make weak cases for suits to impact on stock prices and through backdoor channels.

Also the PirateBay is a good example of how MPAA have extra-jurisdictional reach without being in the legal right. Why? Big money.

Your radio station has probably hired a law firm. It is in their duty of care to you to provide good legal advice. Getting a licence is good advice for the above mentioned reasons. It covers them completely. It is also for commercial use ('work purposes') so that probably impacts things even more.

A good analogy in everyday life is the power of attorney. It does not need to be witnessed by a solictor, however most power of attorneys are. They charge, sometimes, hundreds of pounds to sign a document. Why? People want peace of mind. Even though it is not a legal requirement.

[/quote]

Ca-ching! Even this isn't entirely clear cut though. There's some good legal arguments to save your ass from getting sued. Causation is a big one and I'm sure if I was a millionaire my army of lawyers could think of some more.

Also to my knowledge Directive 2001/29/EC does not effect any of this atm. Directives can have Direct effect of course, but I haven't investigated this further. I don't think it does have Direct Effect though.

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

I don't think he's doing that - from his post all he appears to be doing is pointing out where the other fella was wrong :shrug:

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

1) Wrong jurisdiction.
2) It doesn't completely dismiss anything. There is no legal argument made on the page. It just says "downloading is illegal" There is no reference to jurisprudence from case law or statute. Not saying there is no argument to be made for the case in the US. But about.com isn't where you'll find it.
3)This is a load of huff too. If I pay a dodgy kid down the street to download music, it's not legal. He doesn't own the copyright.

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

If that is the case then i stand corrected. However the whole area of copyright when it comes to music and video is not as clear cut as it's made out to be and i do know of one legal get out which i told you about if they came hunting me.

BTW i don't download music :)

And anyone can throw links about http://www.slyck.com/story1340.html

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

Bill, I don't think anyone is discussing morality here though. Because the moral case for IP law is even weaker and malable. Purported IP theft doesn't deprive anyone of their goods, it kills millions around the world due to expensive drug costs and it is only considered theft because big money has more legislative and judicial influence than democracy.

If we took a referendum on the question of suing people for downloading films/music I cannot see us loosing. I mean the latest estimates show millions are doing it, even more will think it's a waste of police and court time when there are 'real' criminals out there.

The market demands VOD. However, the incumbants cannot decide on how to supply it, how to get around the IP problems, technology. So the market takes it through other channels, IMHO.

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

I agree. I stand corrected, Not had enough coffee yet. However my question still stands to those that complain about downloads "Is it ok to fill your bandwidth 24/7 with legal downloads, Is that any different than illegal downloads to the network" ?

That's why i agree with traffic shaping between certain hours. It allows a level playing field at peak times but allows for downloading at times that will not affect the majority of other users. However that traffic shaping must be done correctly or it just makes a whole mess of your connection.

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

It's a weak defence indeed. And I'm not sure why consumers want big corporate firms who act like criminals most of the time to beef up their profit margins. And I too agree with QoS (traffic shaping) controls. Whining about traffic shaping between 5pm-12pm has no merit. But if they introduce it 24/7 it's just a method to boost profit, while breaching our contract (as I set my arguments in this thread

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

:LOL:

You know my feelings on it as well. I only download out of normal hours.

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

Copyright, Designs and patents act 1998 C 48

26.—(1) Where copyright in a work is infringed by a public performance of the work, or by the playing or showing of the work in public, by means of apparatus for—
(a) playing sound recordings,
(b) showing films, or
(c) receiving visual images or sounds conveyed by electronic means,
the following persons are also liable for the infringement.

and @ BillC:
No i am not some puritan, i never professed to be either...

But MY service is affected by people downloading illicit amounts of 'files' You yourself have been complaining about slow downloads, yet remarkably you are one of the large contributors to the problem... You say that you download only in the wee hours and not during primetime - good for you; My simple point was that people eat stupid amounts of GB bandwidth and its just not cricket ! ;)

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

I understand where you are coming from However what if all that bandwidth used was legal, What then ?

And BTW my slow speeds were down to the ubr needing upgrading. I was on a Oversubscribed card, That means sales had over sold that card. :) It had nothing to do with people downloading.

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

We dont all sit here downloading the internet all day long you know, just a few that abuse the service.

Please dont tar us all with the same brush, no one has mentioned how long they download for at all on this thread unless im going blind and need glasses? ;)

---------- Post added at 11:17 ---------- Previous post was at 11:14 ----------

Exactly how do people know the bad performance in their area is down to people abusing the system, and not a technical problem with the Network??? or its just completely knackered and needs upgrading etc.

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

My downloads will last about 2-3 hours in the wee hours of the night. but i have to admit that is most nights. I use Newsleecher and that has the ability to arrange a download for a certain time and to adjust the amount of bandwidth allocated. I tend NOT to use Bittorrent as it has a detrimental affect on upload in my opinion

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

You need to re-read this thread, never have i said that all nntp traffic should be stopped, and never have i said they 'all newsgroups users are at fault'

So no i didnt tar you at all, and if i did it would have been quickly followed by feathers :D

Maybe i had better repeat myself for you..
#
Can't have it both ways, either accept that there is only so much bandwidth in the world and limit yourselves, or dont moan when you are forcefully slowed down or stopped from pillaging it all.

Frankly you are lucky i dont get to make the decisions .. if i did you people using 200gb+ of bandwidth a month would be looking for another service provider.

First we had slow connections, then we got fast ones with a useage cap, now we have faster ones with traffic shaping...

Note the trend, bandwidth is not free and the more we use as a group the more NTL will have to impose restrictions and or increase prices.

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

I highlighted public

c.48 relates to public performance.

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

Thats because you download high def material like Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets eh Bill? :Pumpkin:

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

Indeed. :)

I have never hid behind the Linux lie

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

I don't pretend to be a lawyer, I dont pretend to know everything... why do you pretend that taking things that are not rightfully yours is legal?

The sheer fact of the matter is that its theft; and you wanting to try and be biggerer and clevererer than everybody else on the forums makes no difference to that FACT.

And to drag this post back on topic i reiterate, download whatever content you like, just dont start to moan when NTL limit your capability to download your apparent 'legal' content.

You are a leech to the community; seems to me you want to Steal digital data for your own use, and to hell with other users on the network that have to put up with slow downloads etc etc.

I have made my point on this thread and will no longer bother to continue with the argument. NTL set out terms and conditions;; they can change said terms and conditions legally;; and if you dont like the changes they make to their terms and conditions go find another supplier.

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

When we're having a discussion about what is 'rightfully' mine it's a moral discussion. When we are having a discussion about what is legal, it's a legal discussion, that is axiomatic and you don't need to be a lawyer to undersand that. I'm not.

Now you are saying what us usenet downloaders do is illegal and that it's hurting the network. This, frankly, ****es me off. It's not illegal and you have no proof it hurts the network. Now your moral compus compels your heat to bleed for the media cartels, who themselves are corporate criminals/lawbreakers. That's your moral choice. Please don't confuse legality with morality. Writing it's a FACT doesn't make it a legal truth. It just shows your grasping at straws.

I appologise if I have come across to be 'bigger' than anyone. But I just laid out my arguments without personal insult.

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

Your blinkers to the real world really are annoying...

The reason people pay for newsgroup access is for the binaries, else they would use the free newsserver that ntl provide. Time for you to come out with other rubbish reasons like "ntl's retention isnt as good" etc etc.

and as for the ludicrous 'i have no proof that it hurts the network', you really need to rethink that...
Go look at contention, the cost of bandwidth, maximum throughputs of all the equipment on ntl;s network. Go look at the total amount of bandwidth at telehouse or telecity. The look at the amount of people taking bandwidth from it all. Then come back to me and tell me how people downloading masses of content does not affect other users.

I am not compelled to fight any corner apart from my own; any from where i am sitting it seems that greedy a***holes who just want to download everything available to them are ruining the service that i pay ntl for.

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

I've been using the internet since the early Nineties, back then I had a 28.8k modem, paid by the minute and in those days it took 30 minutes to download a 2mb file.

Then Broadband came along, downloading got quicker, but that was a by product of what was meant to give me faster surfing, now because of the "Burst" method of delivery of information that Cable uses, 2mb B/Band doesn't load a web page significantlly faster than 10mb.

Howvever, NTL sell this service to me by saying i can download "at least" 75gb a month and now says in there advertising I can download in excess of this if I wish.

If I was downloading web pages and txt emails I could never in 10 yrs fill 75gb.

It would be very expensive to legally download in excess of 75gb of material, so why use this usage as a main selling point, because, I think, downloading is to an extent an accepted part of modern culture and corparations will cash in on this by selling the service to enable you to do it, then prosecute you if you do! I sort of feel what its like to be a smoker!

I for the main part download TV episodes, not all, but mostly. This in itself is not legal, but then its not strictly legal to record an episode of corrie on your VHS tape recorder under your TV.

I also subscribe to Sky online movies, which allows me to legally download as many movies a month as I like at about 900mb in size.

Back in my dial up days, bandwidth was a major issue, as the americans woke up and started work, the Internet would slow to a crawl, Broadband was to bring the end of all that, and it has, Bandwidth is now managed and sold between corparations and end users.

10mb seemed to be a new ceiling, now we are on the brink of 20, 25 and even 30mb home broadband.

Why do we need it, we all know why the majority need it, your just damned if you do.

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

Since when have you been privy to the internals of NTL's network.

And just one other point while your in cloud cuckoo land. I pay for my service as well. I will ask you again what are you going to do with those that are downloading 24/7 from sky movies for instance which is legal. Come on you know NTL's network how much will that damage it.

I download for 3 hours a night after midnight are you honestly saying that affects you.

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

My 'blinkers', what because I exposed your non-sensical reasoning?

Of course it is. And yes, retention is an issue. I pay for giganews cause it's 90 days. Some pay for only 45 days, some even 20 days. What has this got to do with anything? If NTL supplied me with decent retention for binaries I'd use them for sure. And I prefer to use google groups for text.

That's not proof, rather supposition. An NTL employee has just stated that his area was slow because of oversubscription. I get great speeds from giganews 24/7 but not other sites. It obviously has multiple causes, however I'm not privy to that information. And if NTL's contention ratios are too high, it's their own damn fault for oversubcription and advertising a service they cannot provide. Not for users exercising lawful use of their internet service.

Anyway, I'm out of this thread. You simply have gone from saying it's illegal. I proved you wrong. Then you cited about.com. Wrong jurisdiction and wtf about.com? Then you cited a statute that pertained to public viewing. Then you argued it's so obviouslly a legal 'FACT' that downloading is illegal, requiring no proof and confusing morality and the law. Now you're talking about usenet retention.

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

Back to the point of the thread which is where i started ...

People excessively using bandwidth causes a degraded service for all, i dont need ot prove it as anyone with an ounce of common sense understand it - no service provider has unlimited bandwidth.

@Bill:
Get the hell off that horse you are climbing up on; I already basically agreed with you when i said 'goo on you' for downloading in the wee hours. At this moment in time you downloading at 5am means nothing to me. AND whilst i am thinking about it ... I never claimed to know the exact specs of NTL;s backbone and equipment .. i simply was demonstrating that its a finate number that as a group we as ntl customers will exceed if greedy ****s like you constantly download. So climb back out of your **** and realise it.

---------- Post added at 18:03 ---------- Previous post was at 18:01 ----------

Sorry son but you proved nothing. Show me your proof that its legal.

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

You can always tell when someone has lost the plot in a thread . Their post is full of *** and ******* and sometimes ***** :) and no real substance.



So some simple question for you. SON



If NTL are traffic shaping between 6 and 12 and that traffic shaping is there to slow down p2p and give priority to HTTP traffic, Therefor allowing the average user priority HOW CAN WE BE AFFECTING YOU. ? How can it slow down your surfing ?

And if its one thing i cannot stand is being swore at when i have had the decency to keep it CIVIL. Grow up

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

Did you maybe consider misconfiguration of the traffic shaping server ? Did you maybe consider cpu usage at 100% so the server decides to drop packets? For someone who works for NTL you dont seem to think much....

You can always tell when you are talking to an undertrained sales person....

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

Sales person.:LOL:

Now i have been called lots of things but not salesman :rofl:

You don't have a clue who i am or what i do, But let me give you a hint i was heavily involved in Broadband for NTL for 5 years.

As per the other posts of yours you just cannot seem to get the facts right.

---------- Post added at 20:28 ---------- Previous post was at 20:24 ----------

issue what you want. Its not me acting like a kid and swearing at other users

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

Bill you are boring me now; you have very selective reading and refuse to accept that everything isnt rosy on the network.

If you know anything about networking you will understand that a misconfigured traffic shaper will cause mayhem, you should also know where packet loss comes from.

You are deliberately trying to assasinate my character becouse i have spoken out about heavy downloaders ruining other users internet access - Which you are one of.

and as my final dig at you personally, i see you didn't deny that you are undertrained :D

With regards to the swearing, i apologise for it but i needed to convey a point, and the words in my head were not so easy to translate, and knowing that the site would block them anyway i decided to use them - that way you would get the idea of what i was saying.


I am done with this topic now; but be warned that every time i see somebody moaning about slow newsgroup access i WILL bring the point up again.

and a personal note to BillC:
As an NTL employee you really should be ashamed of yourself; you know damn well that if every customer on the network was to download 200gb + a month it wouldne be long before it all went pear shaped. And if you dont know it then i suggest you go and find out.

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

And you are boring the rest of us.

When you learn how to speak to people properly then come back and if you speak to people face to face the way you do on the internet, im sure you must like hospital food! :D

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

I always tell it the way it is, face to face or not. Thanks for asking.

And for your information i have never tasted hospital food, and am very unlikely to but again thanks for your concern. :D

Maybe if this thread bores you so much you should go read another ?

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

I have the other usenet Post :D

http://www.cableforum.co.uk/board/sh...6#post34152586

Completion is the problem on that thread tho, not speed! ;)

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

I have a rule, I don't feed the trolls and as you are now in that class i will no longer be feeding you.

Re: UsetServer slow Downloads
 

You know, it's going to be amusing when ntl users are downloading ITV at some point in the future, all evening and night, high def, high bandwidth, and the peeps downloading compressed avis are going to start to get cross... :)

IMNAL but I happen to know that on the trollish point (aimed in both directions) on whether downloading copyrighted works is illegal, unauthorized distribution in the UK is unlawful, usually actionable in civil law.

It's academic tho; I download heavily, podcasts, video podcasts, content-rich websites, vids, animations. That's all perfectly lawful. Additionally, in my experience, there's no throttling of binary newsgroups. ;)