First post - how best to connect another pc to the internet
 

Hello all - just joined today so please be gentle :)

I am using a W98 PC to access the internet via ntl 1mb broadband, a cable modem and a usb connection as the pc has no ethernet port.

Although I know this not recommended, it has worked fine so far as I have no other usb devices attached to this PC. I now, however, want to connect another, newer, PC (WXP sp/2) in a neighbouring room so that we can access the web from it too. Being a novice at all of this I am hoping there's an easy way to do it such as just loading the ntl installation software on the new PC running a 5-10m ethernet cable from the modem to it and then firing it up. Our PC usage isn't all that great and we have no need to download large music or video files. I've looked at wireless routers but they seem to offer a rather complicated and expensive solution to the problem.

These questions will probably seem silly to most of you but, as I said, I am a total novice at all of this, so please be patient :) :

1) Can this be done and if there are several types of ethernet cable, which type do I need?

2) If it can be done, can I then just leave both PCs connected to the modem at the same time?

3) If I can leave both connected using both the ethernet and usb ports on the cable modem, will both PC's be able to access the web independently at the same time?

4) If not, will I be able to access the web from either pc by just unplugging the relevant usb/ethernet cable from the modem so only one PC is connected to the web at any given time?

5) In doing any of this will I have to reconfigure anything or involve NTL customer services?

Sincere thanks in advance for any advice/feedback offered!!

Osem


Ps - I did notice the forum for network/router issues but wasn't sure if this thread fell into that category as I don't really need the 2 pc's to be connected to eachother. In fact I'd much rather they weren't for various reasons. If I have posted this thread in the wrong place however please accept my apologies :)

Re: First post - how best to connect another pc to the internet
 

You could simple connect the newer PC to the cable modem with Straight through CAT5 Ethernet cable. (also known as patch cable) but this would create issues as you'd have to unplug the USB and power off the cable modem, then power it back on to be able to swap between USB and ethernet depending on which pc you would be using.

A good thing to use would be a wired router and an additional Ethernet card in your Win 98 PC. Network cards aren't expensive at all, i picked one up for around £2.50 just 2 weeks ago, but the wired router may st you back between £15 and 35 depending on what you want from it.

Re: First post - how best to connect another pc to the internet
 

2 wireless cards would probably be best for you, set in ad-hoc mode,but it would be better if the "PC (WXP sp/2) in a neighbouring room" were the master machine ( the machine that connects to the cable modem and also acts as the bridge to the other machine).

you didnt say if the WXP machine has a built-in network card, if it does than you can eather swap machines over,or buy a long rj45 straight through network cable, anything upto 100 meters will work so no problem getting to another room.

or move the cable modem to the other room.

win98 can work as the master bridge machine if you run something like wingate, but its easyer with the xp built-in stuff but not as secure, win98 will crash a lot more ( i know as i ran 95/98 tcp/ip set to a null serial cable as my network , ohh what fun, but it worked....)

Re: First post - how best to connect another pc to the internet
 

Thanks for the replies guys! There's never a simple PC related question is there? :)

Re the cable solution - hadn't realised I'd have to power up/down as well as unplug cables! Drat! :)

The newer XP/PC is in another room and the cable is not long enough to move the modem in there so I thought a long ethernet cable from the modem in this room to it might be the ideal answer and avoid a router. Possibly not then :(

Don't really want to mess about with upgrading this PC to be honest but the new PC is equipped with a 'fast ethernet network connector' - whatever that is.

Any other thoughts anyone?

Cheers :tu:

Re: First post - how best to connect another pc to the internet
 

:welcome: to the forums.

It is not reccomened to switch between USB and ethernet as each time you would need to turn off the modem before switching the cables.
You can also NOT use both the Ethernet and USb ports together on the modem as that will not work.

If I was you I would buy a wireless broadband router. Make sure it is not an ADSL one. They cost about £30-50
Your new PC would connect to it through it's ethernet port or a wireless card. Up to you.

Your Windows 98 machine with only USB ports then has a few options.
You could buy a USB wireless card that plugs into your USB slot and communicates with the router.
Alternatively, if you have a spare PCI slot in your PC, stick a £8 ethernet network card in and connect by ethernet to your router. OR Put in a wireless PCI card.

As for Ethernet cables, this is the type of cable you need when connecting computers to a router.
Ethernet Straight Cable, see HERE

Re: First post - how best to connect another pc to the internet
 

TVM Halcyon :)

OK got another question. If I connect the other pc by ethernet, do I need to obtain a new setup CD? The NTL online help/support section seems to imply this but I have the setup CD obtained when we first got connected late last year. Will this still be OK?

The other PC will only be used for occasional internet use so I suppose I can live with unplugging leads, rebooting etc. until our usage clarifies itself and then make a longer term decision about siting both PCs, routers etc. We often turn our pc and modem off anyway as they aren't in constant use.

Given the above, presumably the process for connecting the new PC will be as follows: switch off this PC, remove usb cable from modem, load setup disc into new PC, connect the extended ethernet cable between it and the modem when told to do so, power up and follow and remaining instructions.

Yeah I know this is simple stuff but I've never done it before :)

Cheers guys :tu:

Re: First post - how best to connect another pc to the internet
 

if you are connectivg via ethernet, you won't need the NTL cd at all.

Re: First post - how best to connect another pc to the internet
 

Ahhh - that sounds suspiciously easy Stuart C :)

So am I right in thinking that if I decide to take the cheap, short term, Luddite option and retain my usb connection to this PC and connect to the other to the cable modem via a long ethernet cable, I won't need any setup CD. The only downside will be that I will have to uplug cables and reboot the modem each time I want to swap PCs. Maybe I can live with that for a while :)


Cheers

Re: First post - how best to connect another pc to the internet
 

No - you must choose one or the other, as Halcyon said:

Re: First post - how best to connect another pc to the internet
 

Thanks very much for the reply The Norm.

Slightly connfused here - what I understood Halcyon to say was that the USB and ethernet connections can't be used at the same time. I will not be doing this as I would only have one pc connected to the modem at any given time - either via ethernet or via usb. So in order to
switch from one PC to the other I would need to switch off the modem, unplug the current connection to it, plug in the other connection and switch back on. If this is correct I can live with the slight hassle factor for a short while because we will only be using the other PC for occasional internet use until we decide on a final solution to this problem.

Thanks again.

Re: First post - how best to connect another pc to the internet
 

Yes this is correct - sorry, I misunderstood you.

Re: First post - how best to connect another pc to the internet
 

NP The Norm - I'm always misunderstanding myself lol

Cheers!

Re: First post - how best to connect another pc to the internet
 

like i said in #3 get yourself 2 wireless cards pci or usb , set them to ad-hoc made, stuff a long rj45 cable into the xp machine and use that as the master machine.

or goto your local hardware shop and ask for parts to extend your cable, some cable coax, 2 screw on connectors [the same as the one connected to your stb] and a female to female [or is it male i forget?]
adaptor to join it all together and move the CM into the same room as the xp machine , about £4.

you never need to mess about with powering down,repluging,powering up etc,etc.

you can always pull these cards as you upgrade your machines and usb2 wireless makes it so easy to do.

http://www.allcomputers.co.uk/prodcat.asp?CatID=15
£13.19 Mercury Wireless G USB AdapterWireless
or get the cheaper 11g pci cards if you like, dead easy to install into a spare pci slot,install a driver and a wireless client app (if you dont use the xp installed app), run the wireless networking setup in control panel and away you go, done......

Re: First post - how best to connect another pc to the internet
 

I don't think the NTL T&Cs allow this.

Re: First post - how best to connect another pc to the internet
 

No, they do not, as it introduces noise on the network and any damage caused will make you liable for the charges.

Re: First post - how best to connect another pc to the internet
 

OK guys - thanks so much for the feedback to date but you should know that when peeps tell me any problem involving a PC is going to be easily solved I get worrried....very worried :)

Anyway, just to summarise then. My preferred Luddite solution is OK (just)and I don't need any NTL disc to get my new pc connected to the modem via ethernet.

OK, then a couple more 'simple' questions if I may:

Will I be asked to enter any settings, data, addresses, whatever when I connect the new PC to the modem for the first time and try to access the net? If I will be, what are they and where do I find the information?

Secondly, just to clarify for my simple brain, in order to swap internet access between the two PC's will all that's required be to switch off the modem, unplug the current connection to it (say the usb lead to this PC), plug in the alternative connection (the ethernet lead to the new PC) and switch it all back on again? Bearing in mind you guys are all to be found here, I really don't want to get stuck in no-man's land and find mysef unable to access the net at all because I've done something stupid and don't know how to fix it.

Don't suppose you guys have a free, non web based, 24/7, "get Luddites out of bother" support service do you ??? :)

Ps there's a round of virtual pints behind the bar for you all :)

Re: First post - how best to connect another pc to the internet
 

Hi guys - just an update on this. Well I finally bit the bullet and .........



........"computer says YES!!!!"...........

It works...... YIPPEE!!!!!!

No hassle with ethernet - no disc needed, in fact no input needed. Couldn't have been easier.

So I have access to the net via 2 pc's (albeit not at the same time) and all I have to do is unplug 1 lead and plug in the other when I need to swap.

Thanks for all the help everyone and apologies a) for this tardy thank you and b) for being a luddite git in the first place lol

Osem.

Re: First post - how best to connect another pc to the internet
 

Errr - don't you need to rebot the cablemodem as wel for that to work? Same MAC addresses and all that?

If you get yourself a router, you won't even need to sawp the cables!

Re: First post - how best to connect another pc to the internet
 

he doesnt want to spend on extra's (#4)to get this going or he could have done it as per #3 real easy.

CM===win2000/xp=X=win98
or
CM===win2000/xp=wireless/adhoc=win98
or
CM===wireless/router===to all machines in the house
or
CM===win2000/xp=nullX-serial=win98 (slow but works)
or get some (techy)wingate type software and have win95/98 as the first/master machine instead of win2000/xp.

wireless pci cards or wireless usb2.0 sticks in adhoc mode would have been easyest, as already said, but not as fast for transfering files from pc-to-pc as 100/1000 pci cards would be......

for any future readers, download,burn and boot a linux livecd and check that your main machine can connect to the net and then you can use that as your emergency bootdisk to come here and ask question if you messup the setting etc,simple....

1:
'===' equals straight through rj45 cable
'=X=' equals cross over rj45 cable

2:
you can replace the CM==='to what ever' with normal USB cable if you must/want

3:
CM equals stand alone Cable Modem or the inbuilt stb Cable Modem, but its far esyer with the stand alone one.

Re: First post - how best to connect another pc to the internet
 

Well aware of that - as I said in my first post I didn't want to go down the router route :) as we don't need to access the web via both machines at once and there were possible problems getting my old W98 usb only pc to work via one. Yes we do need to reboot the modem when switching PCs but since we always turn it off after using the PC that isn't any hassle either. A simple soultion to a simple problem - exactly what I wanted :)

Osem

Re: First post - how best to connect another pc to the internet
 

indeed Osem, the readers need to be aware though, that the so called wall wart power supplys that come with the stand alone modems are VERY prone to failure with lots of pluging in and out weather thats at the mains end or even the low voltage DC end that plugs in to the modem.

but you might be lucky and get 12 months out of them before they fail so might not need to call out NTL:tw to replace them to often.

as for the win98 USB , i cant say for sure but a simple null-USB cable might also work, i cant say yes, as i have never tryed that option unlike the others above than i have tryed and worked with.

Re: First post - how best to connect another pc to the internet
 

Thanks for that very helpful feedback Popper. Tend only to unplug once a day but would obviously prefer not to have a problem and this modem is now almost a year old !!!!!!!!!! :disturbd: :disturbd: :disturbd: Is it possible/permissible to purchase a better power supply from Maplin or somewhere and use that or would doing so break NTL's T&C's?

Seems odd though that, given the standard and often repeated CS advice to unplug/plug in modems every time there's a problem, NTL should provide power supplies which apparently aren't up to that job. Still there's nowt as queer as cable companies is there? :)