new spam filter options
 

New spam options

SPAM OPTIONS

Re: new spam filter options
 

Interesting - maybe I should switch it to tag, or to the webmail spam folder, as my freeserve/wanadoo account has spamtagging/spamdumping, but their tagging is woefully inaccurate, based on spammy looking content rather than untrustworthy paths.

Re: new spam filter options
 

Why do they keep giving us all these extra goodies, but not increase the space ?

10 meg is pathetic these days, and makes their email unusable for me.

ah well..

Re: new spam filter options
 

thanks for that, I just went in & changed options for my accounts.

The default would appear to be 'delete spam immediately' - today in my inbox, instead of the usual 20 or 30 spam messages, there was 1 :tu:

- I have it set to 'forward marked as spam' & will leave it for a few days, to make sure legit stuff gets through, still, but first impressions are good :)

Re: new spam filter options
 

So this new filtering is in place for POP3 not just webmail right? I have been expecting two really vital emails today, and now I am wondering if they have been incorrectly deleted. I've changed my settings now to send through markes as spam, but is there any way of finding out if something has been deleted before that change?

If not, why on earth are these people putting in default settings to delete my mail without even telling me first?

Re: new spam filter options
 

Postscript to this....

I called ntl this morning, who first said they were not deleting mail. Then when pointed to their own website said they "had just had notification" that the new system was in place "as a response to many many customers who said they were having full inboxes with spam". I said I want to speak to someone about retrieving the emails they deleted without my permission, they said they can't contact anyone in the UK.

I'm so angry. These useless people in their Indian call centre know nothing about their system, and do everything they can to avoid actually helping you.

Right now I feel like cancelling.

Re: new spam filter options
 

I altered the option from "delete spam immediately" to "send to webmail spam folder for seven days" after reading this thread. Today I checked the spam folder in webmail and found six messages one of which was a message I wanted and not spam in my eyes. I have now altered the option to "forward to your inbox marked as spam" as seven days is not enough if you are away for more than a week and having to check webmail regularly means that I have more to do now with this NTL spam filtering than I had to before.

Re: new spam filter options
 

Sound advice, I've done the same on my accounts, and will let mashwasher tackle it.

Re: new spam filter options
 

I've been doing some testing this morning, having now changed my settings from delete to tag.

I've sent messages from Hotmail, Yahoo, Easy.com and even my own ntl account. One of the Hotmail messages was incorrectly labelled as spam. None of the Yahoo or Easy messages were. Most (but not all) of my own ntl addresses were labelled as spam.

So it seems that the wonderful ntl spam filter is labelling some of it's own traffic as spam. Clever.

This makes no sense whatsoever, the fact that they have introdiced this without any notice is IMHO negligent. I cannot seriously believe that any ISP would just switch on a spam filter that deletes people's emails without telling them. If I set it to that, fine - it's my look out - but the default setting is delete and they don't tell you it's happening. Crazy.

It is now clear that I have lost emails as a result of ntl's incompetance - and the attitude of the mornic urchin I have just had the displeasure of speaking to only makes my blood boil; he would not apologise, would not report it to the relevant department, refused to take my complaint and even refused to put me through to anyone else, including the cancellations department, saying "We are not a switchboard". To which I replied, "we'll you're certainly not a customer service department", and I hung up. GRRRRRRRRRRRR

Re: new spam filter options
 

NTL have made some serious mistakes here. They should have notified customers of what they are doing and they should not have made "delete spam immediately" the default option. We are lucky that Maverick started this thread otherwise we would not have known anything about it so soon. I do not know whether I have lost any important emails, not knowing when this filtering having started. Poor customers who do not frequent this forum may be losing emails for weeks not knowing of the new filtering. Digital Spy forums only picked up on the subject at 11:40 this morning.

Re: new spam filter options
 

I don't know why NTL bother to have their own email, its the most useless and unreliable system I've ever seen.

Setting spam emails to delete as a default is insanity, especially when training a new system - I don't use NTL's email much (just the odd thing goes there) because the mailbox is pathetically small and it always seems to be down, it looks to me as though they don't really want to give their customers email.

This made me rock back in my chair in disbelief - quite unbelievable !

Re: new spam filter options
 

I never knew about this option, and it was set as default to delete.

I want all my mail, even spam, as I will let my application deal with spam.

I don't want ntl to decide what to delete, and what not to delete, as it may not delete the correct things.

Bad touch NTL

ik

Re: new spam filter options
 

With the return of sunday support, and reponsetek I thought NTL were worthy of a green rep or two. However with the sloppy way this spam filtering was activated I feel a red red would be more appropriate. Sadly people tend to remember the red rep occasions more than the green ones. Somebody dropped the ball there at NTL, spam filtering was an excellent chance for some good PR gone begging due to botched rollout.

Re: new spam filter options
 

Thank you Maverick. I was waiting for a contract letter from Nigeria. NTL had obviously deleted it. My new employer now thinks I'm a lazy so & so who can't be bothered to read my mail or worse, a complete idiot who loses mails.

Is there anyone on the forum who may be able to get an email generated for all NTL cutomers to warn them of this nonsense?
__________________

Ian, why not get a Gmail account?
The inbox is currently 2434 MB and is fully searchable so you would have time for a seven month trip before that filled up!
I have some invitations to join if you would like an account.
And unlike the free Hotmail account it allows you to use Outlook or Thunderbird etc to retrieve your mails.

Re: new spam filter options
 

They should have made the default option to be 'flag & forward' & made it the customers choice if they wanted 'delete immediately' - I agree NTL have missed a chance of some kudos for a good idea, due to the poorly communicated implimentation.

Re: new spam filter options
 

Absolutely right, and I've repped accordingly - thanks Mav.

Agreed. Aside from the fact that one day in and the system is already giving too many false positives (including mails from it's own servers) it is NOT up to ntl to decide on what email I want to receive.

Irrespective of whether I delete spam messages before downloading or reading them, what ntl is doing is the equivalent of my postman throwing the loan and double glazing junk mail in the roadside bin before putting it through my letterbox.

One day I might just need some double glazing (and the loan to pay for it) - and besides it would be illegal for postie to do that.

So why do ntl think it's OK for them to do exactly the same? Does this breach some sort of rule/contract? I'm in the mood for a fight :)

Re: new spam filter options
 

Hello all,I am in work later this afternoon I wiill e.mail the relevant department and make them aware of this problem.

I will post back later with any info.

Re: new spam filter options
 

Havent ntl: been removing spam since November 2004.
Isnt this just a higher level of removal but this time giving the option to keep everything which wasnt there before?
There was no chioce before....now there is......

Re: new spam filter options
 

I'm not sure they have been removing it - but they have certainly been collating it. Every time I reported fresh spam to SpamCop ntl's name came up on the list that would get a message as "intermediary interested in the handling of spam" - so I presume that they have been teaching their spam filters what to look for....

....and then setting it to random ;)

So does anyone know the legal score of purposefully deleting my emails without my permission? Data protection act maybe? Anyone?

Re: new spam filter options
 

In the last couple of days i have recieved no email instead of the usual 20
spam messages
I think i have lost some wanted ones too
Is this becasue Ntl have introduced some new spam filters ?
how do i retrieve all my lost messages
__________________

it looks like i need to change my settings
im using pop3
i cant find my password to log onto web mail
you can get it emailed to you
it never arrives
is it bieng deleted as spam if so im in a catch 22 situation
how stupid are NTL

Re: new spam filter options
 

Not getting email replies from NTL is nothing to do with the new spam filter. They just don't reply. (At least not to me) Sent yet another request to them today but really do not expect an answer. I guess it must be Corporate Policy!

Re: new spam filter options
 

:LOL: I just tried the 'email my password' option and sure enough - no email. I have my spam setting at 'flag & forward', so it isn't being deleted ;)

Re: new spam filter options
 

I'm not sure they have been removing it - but they have certainly been collating it. Every time I reported fresh spam to SpamCop ntl's name came up on the list that would get a message as "intermediary interested in the handling of spam" - so I presume that they have been teaching their spam filters what to look for....

....and then setting it to random ;)

All the above is correct the spam filters have been running for some time at a low filtering setting for the spam server to recognise known or suspected spam the level of spam detection has now been raised.
Legitimate e.mails should not be getting deleted I would advise everyone for now to do as homealone has suggested in selecting the setting of the Spam filter to 'send to webmail spam folder for 7 days' .

Anyone who believes a legit e.mail has been deleted as spam contact tech support the more evidence there is the better.

I know this is not ideal and I am not defending the way NTL has actioned this in anyway.

It would have been better if a warning was given a week before the filtering was increased and set the option to not delete for 7 days as the default,the powers that be have been made aware of a possible issue.

Re: new spam filter options
 

Spam filtering is supposed to make things easier. Altering the spam option to "send to webmail spam folder for 7 days" means that you have to check your email in the normal way and also check it again through webmail to see if messages have been accurately marked as spam. For myself I can't see that this new spam filtering system is going to be of any help.

Re: new spam filter options
 

I don't think you can Mike. All of the people I've spoken to today have ended up saying that (with varying degrees of politeness).

I have recieved a reply, which I will not go into detail about as it's a one to one email, from a senior individual in the ISP side. He ignored the part about getting my deleted mails back (among other things)...so I assume that it's not possible.

Thanks for this good info Maverick. The problem with using user submitted data (such as SpamCop) is that I don't highlight emails that are legitimate, only ones that are not. Therefore by adopting the method they have, this system is already fundamentally flawed before it's begun and is likely to produce a far greater number of flase positives than a tagging of all mail system.

I don't have a problem with this, false positives are a way of life in spam filters of every kind. The problems are that there is no way of 'teaching' the system that it got it wrong and second is that it deletes things without asking or telling you. Even a digest once a week would be a good idea telling me the senders of blocked mails.

I agree completely. This is another ntl half-assed idea, which from what I can make out cost a bomb. It had the potential to be a great system, but becuase of poor implementation it's another white elephant. Did anyone see the episode of the Simpsons with the Monorail?

Personally I think they would have been better off doing a deal and buying every customer a copy of Mailwasher - which gets it right far more often it seems.

Anyway...moving forward here's what ntl should do IMHO (I should send them an invoice for consultancy for this gem of common sense):

1. Change the default setting NOW. Set it to either label all as SPAM or to no filtering.

2. Send an email to customers. They manage to send me their own marketing SPAM informing me of products I already have, so why not use that system to tell me how to use their spam filter?

3. And this is the biggie....THINK! Prior preparation prevents a poor performance.

Write this in GIANT LETTERS and stick it on your office walls. Using a tiny bit of of inteligence before flicking the switch will prevent a whole bunch of fallout afterwards. It doesn't take the a MENSA member to work out that people might want to know that you're going to delete their mails without asking. Duh.

4. Make the cheque for £1000 payable to..... The Common Sense Consultancy Co. ;)

Re: new spam filter options
 

tagged as 'spam' and forwarded, as usual, will work, I am sure, I am getting very few messages that don't get caught, that way ;)

Re: new spam filter options
 

I thought something had changed when I checked my email this morning to find only 2 messages instead of the normal 20 - 30.


If this filter is anything like the one used by Wanadoo, then it just doesn't work. Over 75% of legitamate email was being flagged as ***SPAM***. If Wanadoo had done the same as ntl & just started deleting suspected spam without telling me, I would have lost a lot of wanted emails before realising!

It's not as if ntl had accidentally chosen the wrong option, as they are actually boasting that they are deleting suspect spam! :mad:

Re: new spam filter options
 

I know and the line from them is that "no filter system is 100% perfect".

True enough but no sane thinking company would implement a system that deletes people's emails without at least letting them know first. Someone's head at ntl needs to roll for this situation. But of course ntl's style is to reward faliure.

The worst thing is, of course, that most of ntl's customers still have no idea that this is going on. They have all probably lost legitimate email over the last 24 hours and becuase of ntl's stupidity and arrogance they have no clue.

If anyone reading this knows people on ntl's email, send them a link to this thread so they can make an informed decision as to how to let them process their messages properly.

Re: new spam filter options
 

I'm glad i looked into this! just noticed a lack of emails today and yesterday then googled and found the forum!

surely customers should have been emailed before the switch on (so they'd still get thru :p: ) and told them to set their preferences so no email would be lost.

still, i think they should be commended for finally doing something about it.

the auto deletion was probably to ease the load on their servers!

thanks to everyone for the info!

Re: new spam filter options
 

I noticed my spam Outlook Junk Email folder was completely empty today so I looged into webmail and set it to tag instead, who knows whats been deleted from my inbox already. I don't use ntls email servers much anymore after they blocked my main email acount for a week.

Re: new spam filter options
 

having set it to tag, i'm finding it pretty reliable so far :tu: its picking up the same as mailwasher, and some spam that mailwasher doesn't, and vice-versa!still, don't like the idea of auto deletion though!

Re: new spam filter options
 

Thank you Maverick
for the heads-up about this latest enterprise from NTL.

I have been in and set my 'Spam' to forward marked as spam.
Which in my opinion is how it should have been anyway.

I will do what i can to inform others,
but it won't be much.

Cheers, John :)

Re: new spam filter options
 

NTL's spam software is working ok IMHO it's stopped 90% of mine this last week, no good mails have been blocked only the spam ones. Yesterday only 2 spam mails got through, not bad to say I used to get in excess of 60 per day.

Re: new spam filter options
 

I've been in and turned all of the SPAM filtering off, and told it to deliver my mail unmarked/unchanged/exactly the way it is.

Re: new spam filter options
 

I was concerned that I was receiving little e mail or SPAM when I noticed the announcement about the SPAM filter.


Went in and turned SPAM filtering off as I have efficient software to do that job (necessary with ntl e-mail accounts) and am still getting little e mail or SPAM.

Maybe nobody loves me???? :shocked:

Re: new spam filter options
 

I suspect it may not be worth sending NTL any email complaining about how they set this up; they probably will have them filtered and deleted as SPAM by the new SPAM filtering system :rolleyes:

Re: new spam filter options
 

I changed my settings, for a couple of email accounts, to filter and mark, and so far it has been 100% effective with no false positives.

One thing I noted was the change to the settings did not appear to happen immediately. Someone in the know might like to comment on this but it is possible that changes only get uploaded to the servers doing the filtering on a timed basis (as it common practise with some other systems like this I have used.).

APS

Re: new spam filter options
 

How do you know for certain that no wanted emails have been blocked?

Re: new spam filter options
 

They probably did send an email, but it got marked as spam and automatically deleted :dunce:

Re: new spam filter options
 

Totally agree with you. I'm doing my nut :mad: I've lost a few emails that I know of. The ****ers :fit:

Re: new spam filter options
 

Thank you for the heads up..I too would rather leave it to let cloudmark sort out what is spam.it does it much more efficiently than the ntl filter would appear to.

I'm wondering If I've lost any email notifications from my yahoo groups. :rolleyes: I shall have to check.

Re: new spam filter options
 

Just a quick thank you to all who have repped me for this thread,

Many thanks Maverick. :)

Re: new spam filter options
 

I'd be interested in knowing if anyone who has turned off the ntl SPAM filter now gets more mail.


I turned it off on 31 July and am still getting virtually no SPAM through...this worries me, is the filter really cabable of being turned off????

Re: new spam filter options
 

I've had my option turned onto move spam to webmail folder, and for the past seven days the Brightmail server has not made a single mistake. And geting 20-30 spams a day, that's a pretty good statistic.

Because Brightmail collects data on spam from all the organizations that use its system, ntl have come in at the right time, as there should be less false positives.

Given the PC experience level of the majority of ntl subscribers, this is just the kind of thing they have been looking for.

I suspect that those who are not happy with nl's decision to add spam filtering will do well to go to a non filtered service such as G-Mail, bigger mail storage and more options.

Well done ntl, a good and reliable spam filtering service thus far.

Re: new spam filter options
 

SORTED


I was expecting that logging on to the main account turned off SPAM on all accounts...not so, you need to change each one individually

Re: new spam filter options
 

Thanks for the reminder.

I have 3 other ntl accounts, apart from the main one. It just didn't occur to me to change the other accounts as well!

Doh!

Re: new spam filter options
 

Luckily, I've changed the spam options to 'flag and forward' 'cos today I had my first false positive. A friend who works for the Environment Agency sent an email from work advising all her friends and colleagues of a change of email address. It got flagged as [Spam?].

:nono:

Re: new spam filter options
 

Possibly to do with the number of recipients?

Re: new spam filter options
 

I have been finding in e-mail tests that between 30-50% of e-mails are now being bounced back when they are valid.

These are e-mails from one of my own accounts to another.