18mbps
 

http://www.ntl.com/locales/gb/en/inv...esentation.pdf

ADSL2+ is being trialled by NTL.

Re: 18mbps
 

Nice, probably for Streaming Video over IP :):):)

I think the article alluded to that.

Re: 18mbps
 

I like the sound of HDTV on demand :)

Re: 18mbps
 

When will it be available?????

(fizzing at the bunghole...)

When when when when when?????

Re: 18mbps
 

Sent this to adslguide, but needless to say the nobbers will ignore it as they have some odd reason to slate ntl at every opportunity.

The adsl2+ ntl news would go very nice above the stuff below they posted.

"The comments from a ntl spokesmans were interesting in the item: "BT's network is limited compared to that of cable. With all the other services coming on stream such as video on demand, the question is will 8MB be enough?". One hopes that ntl have noticed that the BT Group is planning to trial ADSL2+ during 2005, with plans to run it at up to 18Mbps."

Re: 18mbps
 

but why would ADSL matter to NTL as their network uses Cable Modems and all that stuff? are they suggesting they will convert their broadband delivery method to ADSL?

Re: 18mbps
 

It seems as though they will be deploying ADSL2+ over their cable network which is stupid as they couldve deployed DOCSIS 2.0 much more easily.

Re: 18mbps
 

Will it have a 1gb per day cap?? :P

Someone had to say it!

Re: 18mbps
 

Mmmmmmmmm 18mbps.... yum

I'll give 'em £40 a month for that, even with a 50gig/month cap :angel:

Re: 18mbps
 

:rofl:

Re: 18mbps
 

It sounds like there could be a switch to DSL by NTL.

The point that has been missed in this thread though is the mention of VDSL2 which can give speeds of 100Mbps.

The other point is that a switch to DSL means different constraints on the system so the thinking behind caps will change.

Re: 18mbps
 

Maybe its just speculation on capability?

After all, after 'the amount' they spent on the cable network why would they dump it? Would it really be more cost-effective to deploy bb over adsl2+, if not in the long run?

Edit: After reading the 'ntl's network advantage' part it could seem so,

Historically....Going forward...hmmm :scratch:

Re: 18mbps
 

Maybe they thought it would cost more to go with DOCSIS 2.0 than using ADSL2+/VDSL2. Moving to DSL gives them better scope for future than DOCSIS unless they think about the unstandardised DOCSIS 3.0.

Re: 18mbps
 

OK let's have that show of hands again.
Who is going to leave NTL and go to an ADSL ISP.

:rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl:

Re: 18mbps
 

OOOOOOHHHHH ME ME ME ME ME ME ME ME !!!!!!!

;)

Re: 18mbps
 

Next they will be encouraging you to download. ;)

Re: 18mbps
 

Not me...

I will not be tempted...

:angel:

Re: 18mbps
 

IF this ever happens it will certainly not be THIS year so it is pointless to even get excited by it all.

When I see things like this I think OOOOO GREAT!!!

But it takes an eterntiy to appear.

Re: 18mbps
 

How fast can they get the existing infrastructure to run? They wil have to upgrade again to compete with 8mb from bt by autumn.

Re: 18mbps
 

BT haven't even started the 8Mb trials yet and if they are successful less than half their customers will be able to get 8Mbps and those that can will find it could drop to 2Mbps at peak times.

Who knows what NTL will be offering in 6 months time? Six months ago would you have thought that NTL would have a 3Mbps tier up and running by now.

Re: 18mbps
 

You love talking about DOCSIS standards both here and on ADSLGuide but don't seem to have followed my advice and actually read the standards. DOCSIS 2 is only relevant to increasing upstream capacity and offers no gains on downstream. DOCSIS 3 kit doesn't exist yet and isn't going to for a while so not really relevant.

Chances of ntl using unstandardised kit are zero, the standards are vitally important.

There's also a lot more to upgrades to DOCSIS 2 than just updating a line card.

Thread as a whole does it say that this will be used instead of the coax network? Anyone who thinks ntl are going to dump the 500+ uBR coax network, not likely :)

Re: 18mbps
 

hmmm... this is NTL, i wouldn't be surprised if it was 500mb per month...

Re: 18mbps
 

Especially after having spent tens of millions of pounds upgrading said 500+ uBR coax network..

Re: 18mbps
 

Even more so when the ubrs are £13,000 each (£65,00 0,000)

Re: 18mbps
 

this is actually quite cunning. for high speeds the BT network is mostly out of reach compared to the NTL network by the stats on that report.

NTL have the upper hand in the current cable modem technology compared to current ADSL but they also have the upper hand in ADSL potential because they are in reach of almost all subscribers for high speeds.

Re: 18mbps
 

Tad more than that, and the sum you did is for 5000 uBRs, not 500.

Line cards are the most expensive bit, that and NPE card, which is 7k or so on its' own without the 4 line cards costing similar or the chassis, etc.

Re: 18mbps
 

Could NTL's exchanges support ADSL/ADSL2?

Re: 18mbps
 

NTL have spent a fortune on the network and will have to continue spending to ensure that they stay competitive. They cannot just stop spending because something better is coming at some time in the future.

NTL need the coax network at this point in time and for some unknown period in the future. There may come a time in the future where it is not economical to retain the coax network.

One possible scenario is that the coax network is used to provide only core HDTV channels and a limited internet service via your television. Other TV channels, telephony and internet may all be provided via IP using ADSL2+ or VDSL2.

I would imagine that NTL are not going to divulge much until they are near to having a new delivery method working. How soon that may be is anyone guess but one thing is for sure. Cable companies are in a much better position to go forward than BT and unbundled ADSL providers.

Re: 18mbps
 

:LOL:

Re: 18mbps
 

The trials were mentioned in the Q4 results yesterday.

__________________

They also mention HDTV

Re: 18mbps
 

I assume that the fact they trialled means they could run ADSL2+ in parallel with the CM network? Or was the trial run in isolation of the current network? Would be damn expensive to exchange all those STB's and CM's. Maybe they'd go down the same route as happened with CM originally and sell/rent the modems to customers, assuming it could run in parallel of course.

Re: 18mbps
 

They won't get rid of the existing local network - at least not for a good few years - I expect the ADSL would run in parallel.

Re: 18mbps
 

The copper loops, would they be the bit that runs from the green cabinet down the road to my house, or could the green box down the road be connected via copper to somewhere else?

Re: 18mbps
 

Bt have not trailed it yet but with a ruling from oftel bt now has to allow exchanges to add to the architecture which has seen ukonline and soon bulldog to offer 8meg now with ukonline going live at major exchanges by the end of may im from near coventry and we are getting it and we are only a town


I cant even set a quote properly someone shoot me lol lol lol lol
Edit (Paul) - Quote fixed.

Re: 18mbps
 

I hope it is parallel it would kind of suck to have only 1 cable provider in the whole of the uk.

Re: 18mbps
 

If they start running DSL in the cabinets then would that mean OFCOM would force them to open it up to competition?

Re: 18mbps
 

Re: 18mbps
 

ofcom is nothing to do with public funds its to do with market share, NTL has a lot of broadband customers, I think so far they have been lucky with ofcom but if they did move over to DSL I am wondering how ofcom would react. Telecoms is a regulated market in both the regulator for fair competition and the government in the public getting a certian standard of service, eg. if BT who are currently regulated decided tommorow to stop all broadband services then someone would probably step in and change the law to so they have to provide it to be allowed to compete in the market. At this time this hasnt need to be done because broadband has been rolled out quite well.

Re: 18mbps
 

Re: 18mbps
 

the BBC has picked up on this with further clarification.....


http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/4355665.stm

i want high speed! :D

Re: 18mbps
 

I never said NTL should be made to share the DSL if they invest their, but ofcom might make them do it. BT will argue they have invested in upgrading the exchanges and have been forced to allow all isp's to sell that service. NTL with over 1 million broadband users will find it hard to argue their point for been excempted.

Ofcom are just their for fair competition not for consumers eg. they have been making BT keep prices higher then they need to be so the competitors using datastream can compete, the > £1 gig traffic prices we seen floating around are due to ofcom, actual cost to BT wholesale is 10-20% of that.

Re: 18mbps
 

They have stopped them selling the service cheaper than they let their competitors have it :D

Re: 18mbps
 

I thought regulation was about protection against abuse of a dominant market position rather than who originally financed the infrastructure.

Re: 18mbps
 

It's about whether or not a company has been assessed to have SMP - Significant Market Power.
At the moment neither ntl nor Telewest are classed as having this as they don't cover enough of the UK, simple as.
They could offer fibre to the arse of everyone in their areas and it wouldn't change the fact they don't have access to enough of the population with their networks to be considered to have SMP.
When they merge no doubt this will be reconsidered but at the moment that's the way it is.

Re: 18mbps
 

Re: 18mbps
 

yeah ignition is right, if ntl rolled out the dsl just in current areas I think ofcom wouldnt do anything, but if they expanded into new areas giving ntl more coverage then ofcom would possibly reevaluate.

Re: 18mbps
 

I don't think it very likely that NTL would cable up any new areas in the foreseeable future.

Re: 18mbps
 

not talking about cabling I am talking about dsl, when NTL released that document about unbundling exchanges it mentioned NTL exapnding coverage with LLU, so it is possible NTL could use this is areas that havent been cabled so they can provide broadband in new areas.

Re: 18mbps
 

I thought this thread was about ADSL2+ on NTLs infrastructure. :)

NTL are going down the LLU avenue in non cabled areas which is another story altogether.

Re: 18mbps
 

yes I am talking about ADSL2.

Was it said that this will only be in cabled areas?

Re: 18mbps
 

NTL will take advantage of any available technology whether it be on-net or off-net. The ADSL2+ trials were on NTL infrastructure which can support ADSL2+ at 18Mbps and beyond to the 95%+ homes that are under 1km from the fibre network. BT local loops only have around 5% of homes within 1km and therefore performance will degrade beyond this distance. This gives NTL an enormous advantage over current day xDSL providers.

Re: 18mbps
 

Yeah on this point BT are in trouble, NTL have a better fibre network putting most customers within reach of the high speeds.

Re: 18mbps
 

So when do we get it??


No really, an answer from someone working for NTL would be great on this. How far off is this?? 6Months? 1Year? More?

Am I asking to much? Hehehe.

Re: 18mbps
 

You are soooooo asking for a "Coming soon" reply :)

Re: 18mbps
 

this was just a trial this speed was achieved through copper lines, however whether the speed of 18mbps is achievable in multi user application remains to be seen.

the financial prospects for NTL to be competative and become a leader in providing services such as 'high speed' internet and 'on demand' functions such as also HDTV are mammoth, achievable, but the company needs to realise this is a big oppertunity for itself, it just depends on how much investment is required to get the nessecary kit to customers, modems, boxes, to feed the signals for HDTV or a modification to standard 'cable' modems..

lets hope NTL dont sit on this one!

Re: 18mbps
 

will it mean that customer services will get better, will it mean less complaints, will it mean less outages and will it mean less email problems with ntl

Re: 18mbps
 

There is a new article on the register saying that NTL will be offering 24 Mbps ADSL2+ to its cabled homes:
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2005/03/22/ntl_adsl2/

Re: 18mbps
 

hmm Bob thats nice reading there mate...just hope that NTL will do this before BT sets up their ADSL2 as it would mean that NTL would for a change have the better and faster service.

we'll see how this goes and what NTL will do...for say a 18mbps connection I wouldnt mind paying the extra few quids that are needed, the 1 thing I do hope that this kind of change would bring is higher upload speeds.

Re: 18mbps
 

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2005/02/16/ntl_bt_assault/

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2005/02/14/bt_upgrade/

Re: 18mbps
 

With their speculation of BT making ADSL2+ available towards the end of the year, makes the timescale to speculate on this happening interesting...

Re: 18mbps
 

There is an article on Digital Spy stating that NTL are trialling HDTV VOD over ADSL2+:
http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/article/ds20194.html

Re: 18mbps
 

Anyone else getting excited??

I hope this is not going to be an age off in coming. After being behind the rest of the world for so long it finally seems as thought we are making some headway.....

Re: 18mbps
 

This year should be a good year. Very exciting indeed.

Re: 18mbps
 

my only concern is WILL NTL act upon the results of the trial, i imagine that HDTV or 'media streaming' services will be high on their list of uses, so is economic viability, i really wish we would see better and higher speeds of broadband.

Re: 18mbps
 

We'll just have to wait and see. Telewest always lead NTL in the speed race when it comes to the top tier.

Re: 18mbps
 

What was that rumour I heard about Telewest @ 8Mbps by the end of the year? :D

Re: 18mbps
 

Let me just have a think about which of them beat the other by 6 months to 1Mbit :scratch:

Always is 'always' a dangerous word to use ;)
__________________

Not true, they are trialling 10 in the second half of the year, nothing has been mentioned about potential product launches though.

Re: 18mbps
 

Ahh, thanks for that. :) Thought it might have been my imagination running wild again with those sorts of speeds AND ntl paired together! :erm: :p:

Re: 18mbps
 

Sorry to urinate on your bonfire some more but nothing has been said about the ADSL2+ being trialled for anything other than delivery of HDTV as yet. I don't know anything about it but would ahve thought that's how it'll stay even if it becomes a live product, no chance of the uBRs being made redundant that quickly, there's tons of them.

Re: 18mbps
 

NTL completes ADSL2+ broadband trials

http://www.pcpro.co.uk/news/72650/nt...nd-trials.html

NTL has completed its ADSL2+ broadband and TV-over-IP trials, which began in March.

The cable franchise has demonstrated that its existing copper network is capable of supporting both broadband connections up to 18Mbps and HDTV (high-definition television).

The first commercially available ADSL2+ services are on-track for 2006, with BT and Easynet also conducting trials.

The technology has a theoretical upper limit of 24Mbps, though speeds around 18-20Mbps are more likely.