DD date
 

I'm assuming I can change the DD date - it's currently the 21st, which is a pain. My worry is that it's NTL - should I try changing the date, or am I likely to unleash hell and its minions in trying to do so? E.g double billing, no billing and debt collectors, DD on a different date to the one asked for...

Anyone any experiences?

Re: DD date
 

Should be easy peasey lemon squeezy ;)

Re: DD date
 

I might be needing my DD dates changing Tameside council in their wisdom are changing the way we are paid. so instead of every 4 weeks it will be the 15th of every month. My dates are right at the beginning of the month.

Re: DD date
 

you should be able to call them and ask them, that is what we did and we did not have any probs, I think it depends what day of the week it is and what sort of mood they are in

Re: DD date
 

I'll give it a go on Monday - will report back what happened :erm:

Re: DD date
 

changing dd dates is dependant on which type of account you have,sacm you cannot change as its determined by the date the account is set up,as is dial up internet again not linked with any telephone etc

Re: DD date
 

Leeds area is ICMS so billing dates can be changed easily unless it's a SACM, in which case they can't be changed at all.

Obviously there will be some pro rata billing involved, by moving your bill date you effectively delay the next bill, hence the following one will be larger to compensate for this.

Re: DD date
 

I spoke with the lovely Marge - excellent telephone manner - who told me, as others said, that SACM = "no chance" when it comes to altering DD date :cry: So it's back to raiding the copper jar around the 20th of the month :p: Bloody NTL :(

Re: DD date
 

That's a shame GC - I've changed a couple of times with no problems whatsoever...

I have the same problem regularly with Orange. It's what I think is techically referred to as "A pain in the bum" - I know it sounds a bit uninformed, but you have to wonder why it's so difficult to change the billind date for someone - I've even offered to pay the difference in days service in advance...

Re: DD date
 

Bloody ntl? That's a bit unfair. You're 27, can't you budget??

Re: DD date
 

There are a couple of companies that you can use to manage your finances. They work by estimating your total annual spend and then charging you a twelth of this each month. They pay the bills for you by direct debit so you always get the benefit of DD discounts even if you make your monthly payment by cheque. This also has the advantage of having the same payment each month, ironing out bills such as gas which vary quite a lot through the year.

Re: DD date
 

We managed without a hitch, see I told you it all depends what mood the other person is in!!!!!

Re: DD date
 

Can`t NTL get a billing system in place that allows customers to change their DD date? Every other organisation I have to deal with allows this without exception. I fail to see why NTL cannot do the same. I think "bloody NTL" is entirely fair in this context, if they cannot provide a simple facility that every other company can offer then they are quite simply doing something wrong.

Re: DD date
 

The council don't allow it for my council tax. But, I'm a grown up and can manage to put the money aside until they debit it from my account. It's not rocket science. Will sir be wanting ntl to wipe his ar$e for him next? :rolleyes:
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No it doesn't depend on that at all. Some accounts it's physically possible, others it's not. Nothing to do with peoples moods.... :sleep:

Re: DD date
 

There is budgeting and the obvious annoyance that you can set most of your utility bills to go soon after pay day, but NTL won't let you work like that. NTL for SACM customers is not being as flexible as the competition.

Personally I have a second bank account a lump sum goes in it on pay day and all the DDs SOs etc go out of it and at the end of the month the balance is near 0 when the cycle starts again, easy.

Re: DD date
 

If you are in an SMS billing area then you can change your date.

Re: DD date
 

Then your council is also lacking, as my council *does* allow me to select a DD date. It's a pretty poor defence of NTL if the best you can manage is another example of a slack organisation.

Physically impossible? Is there some sort of large, angry gorilla stopping people getting near the computer. I suspect that what you mean to say is that it the result of either poor vision or indifference on the part of NTL's system planners.

Re: DD date
 

:rofl: :rolleyes:

The system won't allow it. End of. Why can't some people take responsibility for paying their own damn bills?

Re: DD date
 

ntl currently uses three main billing systems:

SMS: date can be changed
ICMS: date can be changed
SABS: date cannot be changed YET.

Later in the Harmony programme the facility will be available. At present it goes off the date your account is created, that date becomes the billing date and DDs are then claimed 19 days later. For those paying by credit card it's claimed on the billing date.

Re: DD date
 

Really, and there I was thinking it was actually the fault of the angry gorilla. Well, thank you for pointing out the bleeding obvious, no-one here was able to fathom that one out for themselves. :rolleyes:

You are completely missing the fundamental point that the system *should* allow this to be possible, the vast majority of other organisations permit a change in DD date. It is just another example of your typical attitude that NTL can do no wrong, even if it is well illustrated that this aspect of their service is sub-par in comparison to other organisations. This is one of the reasons why I refuse to pay my bills with NTL by direct debit.

Yes, it would require programming changes to their billing systems, but a well organised company would have done that while they were making other major upgrades to the system. But since NTL don`t actually seem to be capable of managing the debacle that is their internal systems I guess we really shouldn`t be surprised.

Re: DD date
 

Incidentally, direct debit dates are not some prescribed right. Even if you have an agreed date with a company, the company can simply notify you (by the normal monthly bill) that your next payment will be on a different date and there's nothing the customer can do other thanc ancel their direct debit altogether.

The point with Harmony and DD dates is that it's known it needs adding, but the company has focused on making sure Harmony customers have a fully working provisionable service first. To have messed about coding the DD change facility in while there are still stability issues for some customers would be irresponsible.
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See my other comments, it's a known issue but is low on the list of priorities. There isn't an infinite pot of money to throw at this, things need to be prioritised, and I'm afraid specifying DD dates is considered very low when set against the other issues.

I appreciate it's inconvenient for some people but at the moment it's not a major focus. People who are really unhappy about it will need to consider changing provider if it's really that big an issue - that's the free market economy. ntl will lose far less customers this way than if they sorted the DD dates issue but left loads of people with unreliable, unprovisionable services.

Re: DD date
 

This may be so, but it is such a fundamentally obvious bit of functionality to have it is almost unbelievable that it wasn`t present from the off. Typical poor foresight on NTL's part and another wonderful example that they fundamentally can not grasp the concept of customer service.

Re: DD date
 

No company in the world is perfect, if they were they'd be the most successful ever!

What it's worth looking at, however, is what consumers would like as part of an ideal service.

It would seem in this case, flexible direct debits is something that some people would like. Rather than disupte this concept, wouldn't it make for sense to look at why it can't be done rather than to make rather personal accusations about people's abaility to handle their own money?

I like to think I can budget quite well, but I have been caught out in the past by Orange being inflexible with their DD dates. This doesn't mean I don't deserve to own a mobile phone, or that I can't be trusted with my salary, it just means one month I miscalculated. If I was able to shift that DD to the day after I got paid then those calculations would be a lot easier. I want to enjoy my money, not worry about it. The point of DD is to help that.

Re: DD date
 

As I wasn't sure which service Greencreeper had that needed the DD date changing thats why I offered to ring him. As it turned out it was on a system that couldn't be changed, nothing to do with what mood I was in, the direction of the wind or whether Greencreeper was wearing underpants :rolleyes: Going by some comments in here once again I really do wonder why I bother trying to help (nothing to do with Greencreeper, we had a nice chat)

Re: DD date
 

TBH, Orange are far worse IMO...

They only offer you you a limited range of dates (something like 10 different days a month) and thats it, I'm being charged an extra £3 because the best they can offer is about 5 days before I get paid!

Yes we are sorting out our finances so that it can go back on DD (or more likely a standing order due to various companies messing up DD's) but as we have been bad at doing this up to now, it don't get fixed over night.

Re: DD date
 

That's the point, it's only SOME people.

If hypothetically your company has enough in its budget for ONE project out of two that are needed, and one of those projects would benefit ALL customers and another would benefit ONLY A FEW, then any sane company will go with the one that gives the most benefit.

That's the harsh reality of this situation. As usual, some people are trying to make out that it's some sort of cock-up when in reality it's a deliberate decision that's been made.

And as with the cap threads, people who need DD dates to be flexible assume that EVERY SINGLE customer feels the same way, when the reality is that most don't even mention it.

Re: DD date
 

Wow, you have the luxury of having your DD taken around 25 days after you get paid. ;)

Re: DD date
 

The system DOES allow it becuase they have changed my DD date for me :)

I am also on SACM. them telling you they wont change it is BS (granted it took them along time to do it but it DID get done)

OB you really dont have a clue do you.....NTL have a obligation to change your DD date for you if you would like. Its not a case that they CANT because as I said mine has been changed. If they say they can't I would pack up and leave as its unacceptable for a company the size of NTL not to be able to provide such a service.

We don't want to hear your NTL licking anymore OB

Re: DD date
 

Ben, sorry to disillusion you but for Greencreeper it can't be changed :rolleyes: On some accounts it CAN be changed but not for this account. I don't talk BS and ask if you have worked these systems that we're talking about or work for NTL??? It's not a case of WON'T, it's a case of CAN'T.

Re: DD date
 

A valid point, but it isn`t one that NTL apply universally. Somewhere along the line the extra content that comes with the broadband service (I`m not talking about that thing you pay a bit extra for, the standard stuff) is being paid for. I`m not particularly interested in that, so by definition only some customers are. NTL however consider that a worthwhile investment.

Re: DD date
 

Broadband is a core product that the future of the company largely depends on, therefore I can understand funds being targetted at that.

On the other hand, the company's future definitely does NOT depend on the ability to change DD dates.

Also a change to DD dates would be programmed by the Harmony team who aren't involved in Broadband prodct development at all. Unless they are free to do it it can't get done regardless of funds.

It's a low priority so it won't get done until it's considered neccessary, or there's spare funds available to do it. The Harmony team are tied up with far more important matters at present. Once that's all resolved I daresay it'll get done...it's certain;y on the 'roadmap' to be done at some point.
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SACM accounts CANNOT be changed. End of story.

Please don't argue black is white with people who know the facts.
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LOLOLOL another fictitious 'obligation'.

Go and read the DD regulations and find me the paragraph that states a company is *obliged* to change a DD collection date if the customer asks.

Re: DD date
 

Broadband yes, the extra content that they supply is not. I`m having to contribute to the fact that NTL licence sports coverage, as one example, from ITN. I`m not in the least bit interested in that, and since it is a service that not all customers want then, going by your argument, it should be dropped.
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Should have been a basic part of Harmony in the first instance, it is the ideal time to do it if they are upgrading their billing systems at the moment.

Re: DD date
 

??. The homepage is an integral part of the service. Broadband Plus is an optional paid for extra.

I agree, it should really have been there to start with, the problem is that Harmony already existed to provide the off net service, they didn't quite build from the ground up, they built onto something that was already there.

I am not disputing though that the facility does need to be added, and hopefully soon.

Re: DD date
 

But why just because I want NTL as my cable ISP (oooh who else could I choose) I don't want NTL as my home page.
Is the ntlworld.com site a profit centre or a cost centre at NTL, afterall it sells advertising space etc so should be able to support itself!

Re: DD date
 

Perhaps a homepage of some type is integral, containing information that is specifically NTL related such as network status. However, licencing content from a provider such as ITN is not. At the end of the day, money is still being paid out for this "service" that I do not want rather than being redirected to useful, core functionality that I would benefit from.

Re: DD date
 

This is another of those ridiculous circular arguments in the making.

The DD change system is not essential to the service. Very few people will consider that an important deciding factor when choosing a provider. Please note that just because two or three people WOULD think that way on this site, that doesn't mean all three million customers (or however many there are) feel the same way.

Whether or not you use the homepage, it remains an integral part of the service. Totally different budgets anyway. The DD system will come out of the Harmony budget and even when the funds are allocated the Harmony team have to be free to actually do it...it's not a small job and if it goes wrong everyone's service will get messed up. It's not like the company can ask the ntlworld portal team to do the work!

Re: DD date
 

I dont care what all of you think and I dont care if you work for NTL either :) I am telling you that my DD was changed and I am on a SACM! End of!

So..

Is complete BS! because mine has been changed...please enlighten me...

Re: DD date
 

You you you you!

YOU are not every single customer are you?

On the same basis *I* couldn't care less whether a DD change facility is there or not, therefore nobody else ever will and therefore the whole idea could be scrapped. :rolleyes:

Again, the vast majority of customers DO use the homepage otherwise they wouldn't bother spending any money on it. :rolleyes:
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The only way to do it is to completely close your old account and open a new one for you on the required date. I have in the past done this for specific customers in specific circumstances.

Very time consuming and leads to all sorts of pro rata billing issues and interruptions to service.

Please don't accuse me of 'BS' since I am in a position where I would know 100%. There is *no* DD date change facility in Harmony.

Re: DD date
 

Well there is because I have had it done and you have NOW told us how its done. It might be time consuming but hey if thats what the customer wants then thats what they GET! Jesus, customer service to you people is like trying to get blood out of a stone :rolleyes:

Re: DD date
 

Excuse me Ben, but you said you got your DD changed. BUt you didn't. You opened up a new account which happened to have a different DD collection date. Takes BSer to know one... :rolleyes:

Re: DD date
 

What was done was not a move of the DD date but a closure of the account and the opening of a new account. This means in some cases new email addresses, definitely a new account number, and definitely loss of all webspace - not an acceptable way of doing it to most people, and it can take an hour or more to do. You also need specialist systems access and specialist skills because if you get it wrong the customer has no service.

Re: DD date
 

No, but I`m addressing the point you made that NTL shouldn`t invest in services/facilities that *all* of the customers do not want. It's a little rich to get on your high-horse when I`m merely using your own arguments to demonstrate that this is not a consistent policy within NTL.

That's pretty much what you said earlier on in a more roundabout manner.

Got any evidence to support that claim?
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I`m glad that you've finally confirmed just how seriously we should take anything you say in future.

Re: DD date
 

have to agree with marge,you cannot change the dd claim date on a SACM its predetermined by the date the account is set up,the only way to change it currently would be to set up a whole new account so dont know what account Ben has or how it was altered,it is possible to change the DD draw date in sabs but only for legacy customers who have migrated over to sabs

Re: DD date
 

<snips out all the bull>

Stop complaining mate. Here people are trying to explain how things are done yet all you can do is moan moan moan. Get a life :)

They might implement it in the next upcoming downtime (dreading it)

Re: DD date
 

Yes. I deal with customers all the time. I know what they want and what they don't want. It's my job to know. And I can tell you that the vast majority of broadband customers use the homepage and its content. The vast majority also couldn't care less about their DD collection date, as long as they know how much is coming out and when.

If someone really has sorted you a new DD date on a SACM then it's 100% certain that they have gone out of their way (possibly in their lunch break as I often ended up doing) to do this for you. Frankly given your attitude you should have just been told to lump it. People wonder why some staff won't go 'the extra mile' well here's one poster who is a brilliant example of why some don't.

Re: DD date
 

I toddle off to work, have an awful day, come home depressed, and find war has broken out on this thread.


Well I can yes, which is why I wanted the DD date moving so that it's around the same date as all my other DDs. It just means that I have to put £20 to one side and remember to move it back into my current account before the money is debited otherwise, thanks to the bank's definition of "customer service", £20 becomes around £42


Who are you scrotnig? Your use of language is indicative of a high-level of education and managerial status. What you doing here with us peons :D


[edit]
If it's in a database, it can be changed. You just have to execute the right SQL statements and hey presto. First you must bribe/seduce/blackmail the password out of someone :D

Re: DD date
 

Yup, war in this thread was declared at 13:57 hrs BST.
You are right, it is always preferable to have the lot going out around the same time. I do that (apart from my SACM bill which comes out at the 'wrong' time! I don't want a new account doing as I am tragically rather proud that my SABS account starts with a '1' which makes it REALLY old and quite rare! It's an old offnet account that's been converted over the years to do other things. It currently also provides both a SACM *and* an unmetered dialup on the same account, which is quite rare as well. Ok, I'll get me coat!)
I am an enigma!
Yes but it ain't that simple. There will be lots of different tables interacting with each other. You only have to look at the havoc you can cause in vBulletin executing a command directly in the database if you don't know what you're doing. Doing it in SABS would probably bring half the company down.....

Re: DD date
 

Oh the temptation to press that disconnection button tomorrow :naughty:

I will be so pleased when the option to change DD dates is available and people like Greencreeper and Scotnig can be satisfied, I deliberately waited on the install date for my SACM so the DD date would be the beginning of the month :erm:

Re: DD date
 

I'd just get it reconnected again! :angel:

Personally the date is no big deal, I just budget for it. If it could be moved I would get it moved, but I've got a working account that does what I want it to so I am happy with that.

It even sends me paper bills of course!

I do agree that the functionality should be there though, the sooner it's done, the better. I might try some digging next week to see if anyone will tell me when it's likely to be done.

Re: DD date
 

Actually. based on past performance, the management of NTL don't need any of the billing systems to bring the company down..

:D

Re: DD date
 

Very true.

They should just phone Barclay Knapp and tell him there's this company they want to buy that's worth £50,000 . Barclay can then buy it for £43,000 ,000!

Re: DD date
 

Yes I know - I've been there :disturbd: I've sure the billing system is carefully documented though, and subject to rigorous change control procedures :Yes:


:idea:

Re: DD date
 

So once again you are throwing about claims for which you do *not* have evidence. Hearsay and anecdotes aren`t going to cut it. Simply claiming "I know" hardly constitutes a meaningful argument, but I`ve noticed that is the strategy you tend to adopt all the time. I strongly suspect that what you "know" is what has been passed down the line for you to "know", don`t make the mistake of thinking you're in a position where you'll be handed facts.

Re: DD date
 

Hold the front page. I went to this URL: http://www.ntlworld.com/ and thought I'd have a go at "Payment Changes". It lists my DD and has a link to add a new DD. So, if I add a new DD and delete the old one, would that work??

Also, is there a way I can find out what speed broadband I have? The NTL site starts at 1MB but I'm sure mine is 300K. I'm confused.

Re: DD date
 

I have to agree with you there Dr Wadd!!!!!:cool: :cool: :cool:

Re: DD date
 

You will know quite well that I work for ntl but that I'm not able to disclose certain things as with any job.

Suffice to say that the number of customers concerned about DD dtaes is minimal.

Having said that, I agree it's a facility that needs to be added.
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I love the way people who don't work for the company think they know everything then tell people who DO work for the company that they know nothing.

The pair of you carry on in your little bubble, those of us that know the facts will carry on dealing in those, rather than accepting one person's opinion constitutes the opinion of all customers.

Re: DD date
 

<greencreeper lifts head above parapet>

I see hostilities have resumed. So, any answers to my questions?