NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

Having been following a thread on another website recently (http://forum.moneysavingexpert.com/c...num=1101168571) about how NTL are taking existing customers for granted and how to get a cheaper broadband service, I decided to call them this morning to see what I could get.

This is the transcript I posted on the above site, not very positive from NTL to say the least, so it was suggested I post on this forum to see if anyone had any other suggestions?

Quote

"I spoke to the customer relations people this monring hoping to get the same upgrade, as I have been paying £24.99 for the 750K service for about 2 years.
*
Their response was that the only way I could get the cheaper £12.99 new customer rate was to cancel my current contract and start a new one. When I suggested this was more of a pain for them than me, I suggested that there are other sevice providers who can offer a cheaper service (in a hope of getting her to reduce the price), she just said OK, there's nothing I can do thanks for being an NTL customer!!
*
I said to her do yo really want to loose me as a customer (my monthly broadband and phone bill is about £80) and she replied with "thats upto you!!", staggering.
*
Long and short is that I am not getting it any cheaper through NTL, need to start looking elsewhere.
*
Anyone know any cheap ISP's?
*
p.s. I did'nt want to cancel there and then and get the new service as she told me my phone number would change!!!, so might as well find a new ISP and phone company "

Unquote

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

Welcome to the site :)

While I will wait for someone much cleverer than me to answer your post I'll just say that when I left NTL (Although I came back recently) I got BT to port my number over, which was free.

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

1st of all-your phone number won't necessarily change at all. :rolleyes:

2nd-there are plenty of DSL providers that offer a godd service that would be more than happy to take your money.

More info here: http://www.cableforum.co.uk/board/forumdisplay.php?f=63

Why pay money to a company that treats you like that?

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

I have already realised NTL didn't really care for the long term customer. They could do a free month or half price month once you have been a customer for 2 years.

Even loyalty bonus points that you could save up and exchange for downloading music. Any loyalty bonuses would be lost if you was late paying. There are many ways to reward customers for their loyalty.

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

Anything would be better than "No" Kits.....

ntl & customer care-the words just don't roll off the tongue for me.

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

Neil & Kits


So if your "insert isp here and telco supplier" are offering new users a offer then you think you should get that or leave them and go somewhere else is that correct.

This rings a bell as i was reported this morning for not giving a customer a offer that they had heard about. I was fixing a fault at there house and they asked me about a new offer. I said they would not get it as it was for new customers and they reported me for

a. Not giving them the offer
b. Being rude to them "ie read a above"

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

loyalty reward would be nice, I do, however, prefer the idea of a free month, or something like sports or movies free for a month would suit.

the points to download music is not that good, as I do not like to download music from internet, i prefer the actual cd.....

ik

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

Hi Bill,

I think that if I was out of contract with Pipex (for example) & phoned to enquire about current prices as the market (prices) have now changed since I took my contract 'X' months/years ago, I would expect them to at least attempt to keep my business (if they really value it)

If not, I'd be off in search of more value for my ÃƒÆ’Ã¢â‚¬Å¡Ãƒâ€šÃ‚Â£ÃƒÆ ’‚£.

[Edit]-Mark B would be a good person to comment here, as he used to work in retentions I believe.

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

These deals ARE technically for new customers only, however, what region are you in, depending on where it is I will see if I can pull some strings.

Also bear in mind the £12.99 offer you mention is for 3 months only, it's not a long term price.

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

This all sounds a bit like constantly switching credit cards to get the '6 months zero interest on transfers', i.e constantly switching suppliers to get 'new customer' offers. I'd be interested to see what the response would be if you phoned your credit card company and requested the same interest-free period as a new customer.

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

That's opening a can of worms - 'Can I have it too please?'

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

That's because it is very much like switching credit cards (kind of :erm: )!

It all comes down to whether you want to give your hard earned cash to a company that displays such contempt for you as a customer.

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

Don't let the worms out!!!!!

I actually think that what is special offers to get new customers is just for the new customers. I don't mind suggesting offers that might reward a loyal customer of 3 years or more.

But strongly feel t he new customer offers should stay just that.

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

I'm not necessarily interested in rewarding existing customers TBH-If you are getting a good service/product in return for your ÃƒÆ’Ã¢â‚¬Å¡Ãƒâ€šÃ‚Â£ÃƒÆ ’‚£, then you don't really have much to complain about.

If on the other hand, you feel that you are paying too much when you could easily get a better deal for less ÃƒÆ’Ã¢â‚¬Å¡Ãƒâ€šÃ‚Â£ÃƒÆ ’‚£ elsewhere, then I think any company would be bonkers to let you walk away (but this is ntl we're talking about ;) )

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

The Retentions departments do have certain leeway where a customer is unhappy enough to want to cancel. However with all the restructuring in Retentions at the moment things there will change on regular basis.

Orange work the same way...I had to tell them I was thinking of leaving, I suddenly got passed to retentions who offered me a great deal.

We may think it'd be wonderful for a company to offer new customer deals en masse to ALL its customers, but in the real world that is never likely to happen, (except in the cases of former state monopolies such as BT). Yes you'll get odd exceptions but what ntl do is NOT unusual in business and it should not be portrayed as if it is.

At least ntl and Orange often offer you these deals if you are thinking of leaving...Sky just tell you 'no way'.

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

But and its a big but some complain for nothing and why should one long term customer have a reduction when the others don't. We all have the same set speeds and for the set speeds we have set prices we all pay.....

You can't reduce one customer coz they threaten to leave if you don't... If one has a reduced price then all do....

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

Errr-Are you sure abou that Mark.....? :erm:

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

That's the whole point...if you TELL ntl you are thinking of leaving for a better deal elsewhere, they will in most cases do their best to offer you something. It depends on the individual circumstances though, many customers are already on good deals and just want a second deal on top...this can't be done, and rightly so.

The whole retentions strategy has been regionalised in recent years so different things happened in different areas. One of the consequences of my job getting flushed down the toilet is that there will be a central, consistent strategy across the two sites that will manage retentions from the new year onwards.

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

If that was customer services, they have no power to offer deals and should have transferred to retentions as the customer was thinking of leaving.

If that was actually a retentions advisor, they want reporting frankly.

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

I wish you lot would cut ntl some slack after all they are a "for profit" company, I know they are no angels but why shold they give you some money off or 1/2 price etc if you do not like it go else where, that was one reason I came to ntl they were (and still are) the cheapest. I have had no faults/problems from them for over 4 years.
And yes I do work for them but if they did not come up to scratch I would go else where.

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

But they didn't......

Either way, it's a darn poor show from ntl wouldn't you agree?

That person was willing to let 12 x £80.00 per month (£960.0 0 per year) just walk away.

Now either that person is a muppet, or ntl have offered her little or no training in dealing with this incident.

Again-an ntl customer gets treated abysmally by a faceless muppet.

<mumbles>No accountability</mumbles>

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

And lose that nice staff discount?

I doubt that somehow.....:angel:

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

If you work them though you will know that in actual fact the company would NEVER say 'go elsewhere', if they said then that's exactly what people would do.

The London & North unit has a set of 'values' by which all staff should adhere. They sound cheesey but if we actually use them and work by them, then the desired standard of service can be achieved.

My new department puts a LOT of emphasis on these values....to the point where annual pay rises and bonuses can be lost if you can't prove you work by them.

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

Because in this day & age, the customer is king, end of subject.

If all your customers went elsewhere because ntl would not flex to the customer's requirements, ntl would cease to exist-fact.

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

I was an ntl customer long before I worked for them....and I would definitely continue to be one if I left.

OK I concede I might have only one set top box rather than three, but I would still maintain all my current services.

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

That does not come into things Neil.
I can still think for myself

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

I'm not suggesting you can't. :)

What I'm saying is that you get your services at a discounted rate (I know how much-I use to get it myself ;) )

It's also much easier for you to get things sorted (was same for me), so you comparing your services to someone who pays full price, & has to go through the normal channels to gets issues resolved isn't quite a fair comparison IMO. :)

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

OK then Neil, I take your point, but please I also have other companys I deal with e.g gas and electric, if they where not up to scratch or to expensive I would go else where or pay them, I would not say to them "I have been a customer of yours for 2 years I think I deserve some money off" its only the lazy people that stay and moan about the cost.

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

Lol treats you like what? they say you cant have a service for half price just because you feel like it? they are priced for a reason Neil you're anti ntl tripe is really starting to grate now you are unbelievably childish.

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

For my part, on the odd occasions I have to have anything done on my account, I phone up through the normal channels from home, this is interesting to see how it gets dealt with.

I realise my account is flagged as staff, but you'd be surprised how many people miss that.

When I moved house recently, I didn't tell the installer who came that I was staff, because I wanted to see how it went, and it was all done very well.

Not everyone who uses ntl has a bad experience. I do get to see both sides in my job.

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

What annoys me is that the customer i was with this morning knew and expected me to remove spyware that had been loaded on his machine when he installed Kazza. He had reported the fault as no BB to get someone out. I told him that it was not my job and that he could be billed for the call out as it is his equipment that was at fault. He then said if i did bill him he would just leave. Then i was asked about the latest offer that his friend had received when joining NTL. He said i want that. When i told him i was just a engineer and that i could not give him that offer i was asked to leave. I received a call later to say he had complained about my "attitude". :mad:

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

That is disgusting and I think perhaps some customers was told explicitly that they join on a 12 month contract with a special offer and its the only one they have and entitled to.

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

I suggest you go back & read it again.

My problem is not what has happened, but the way in which it has happened.

For an employee of any company to say to a customer that they can just go elsewhere is simply disgusting.

Don't try to make my posts out to be something that they are not please.

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

Chill guys everyone can always read more into a post than what is there. Lets not get heated under the coller.

:ghugs:

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

Having read through this thread a couple of points spring to mind:

Pricing of any companies products is based upon a model and prices would have to increase if deviation from the model became widespread.

If a company is to invest in improving its products it will not have the cash to do so if it is constantly giving it back to customers as rewards or bribes.

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

:clap::clap:

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

Another thing that comes to mind is that these new customer offers are for people that will then be locked in a 12 month contract. Existing (long term) customers can leave whenever they want. To me it seems silly to expect that an existing customer can get the same discount as someone who will have to stay with the company for another year.

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

So you only care about the people that are "locked in"?

That's a very short sighted point of view IMO, surely it would be better to offer a customer taking his £960.00 elsewhere some kind of incentive to stay? :shrug:

No customers=no business.

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

That's crap Neil - associates have to phone CS, the same as any customer does. :rolleyes:

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

Not "crap" at all. :nono:

Yes they have to phone CS, but there is a vast difference between phoning as an external customer, & phoning when you have 'staff' flagged up on your account. :dozey:

I know the difference-I experienced it myself 1st hand.

I'm not saying that's wrong per se, it happens in every business, the point I was making was that the associated that posted wasn't making a fair comparison.

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

why dont people understand that discounts are a marketing ploy to get NEW customers in the hope that they will stay. If you're prepared to go elsewhere after your contracted period has expired then your never going to be a long term customer so why should they bother offering you a free month etc

When you signed up you knew the price and what you were going to get in terms of services. If this hasnt been up to your expectations then walk, if your happy with the services then you should be happy about the price that you are paying. What would one months free BB actually do? well it would give you a short burst of "oh NTL are great syndrome" when in fact nothing has changed.

My view is pay the money and shut up or walk.

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

Neil they do, there's a large programme of retention tools available, that is the company's policy and is indisputable because I used to do the job.

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

Mark-with respect.....

You can't say "they do", because is it clear from the thread starter's post that "they don't"!

The only point that I am trying to make is that any company that lets nigh on £1000 per year's worth of business go that easily clearly doesn't give a you know what, & must have a very arrogant attitude towards it's customers.

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

The discount they offered me (a customer of about 4 years standing with two STBs and 1.5Mb CM (oh and that damned phone line) was free phone line rental for a year - just like new customers. But is was contingent on me locking into BB or DTV for another 12 months, so they have locked in my revenue stream by offering the discount.

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

I think they do.

Because it's better from a business point of view to retain a customer than lose their business.

It may equate to the fact that the market has changed in the last 12 months, & packages/prices have come down too-why should you pay "X" company £1000 per year for their product, when you can get the equivalent package for £800 per year elsewhere?

Do you work for ntl by any chance?

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

And that makes good business sense to me, most companies would kill for that kind of return for such a small outlay.

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

really??

maybe not. i see many of these too.

agreed but if it screws up you cost model then why would you bother? These people are likely to be those that constantly complain, take up CS for no real reason. Im not saying they all do what im saying is how much does it cost to support a person that is in the frame of mind.



:rolleyes: :Yikes: :D No i dont but i do know how to negotiate a deal and its not be whinging and complaining. Maybe that why im an exisiting customer on a reduced rate ;) how did i do that? Well ask for a discount but offer to commit to another 12 months on the services that you have

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

i totally agree, give a discount but lock the customer in

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

I have no problem with that whatsoever. :tu:

It must be a 2 way street in these situations, & ntl/any company should be able to expect commitment back in the form of the customer's repeat business in these situations.

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

I recently complained to CS about the reliability (or lack of) of the email system and was utterly dumbfounded at the attitude of the advisor. When she was somewhat curt and abrupt with me I sarcastically asked if that was how the NTL CS training taught her to respond. She replied that training taught them to 'talk to customers like they talk to you'. So beware, next time you spend an aeon on hold to get through to CS (which is, remember, just a euphemism for 'complaints') because you have a problem, please don't allow yourself to let your annoyance show.

Previously I have been advised that an always-on email service is just a 'benefit' of broadband ie. not intrinsic to the service. Perhaps somebody might want to point that out to Marketing who continue to make a virtue of it in press ads and direct mail.


Anyway, the end result of this call was that I was told I could have a tenner off my bill (which is usually £100-£130 per month) but that I could not complain about the email service again - even though it collapses every time a medium risk virus arises. Frankly I'm not that interesyted in getting money off my bill. I want a reliable service, a point which they continually fail to understand. The contempt with which they hold Home customers is clear from the fact that whilst we may suffer days of email outages, Business customers have a six hour fix guarantee or they receive compensation (quite an incentive to ensure the servers are reliable). Why can't we have the same?

The only reason this godawful company still has my business is because I have two phone lines, TV and broadband through them and to change would involve a lot of hassle. If I still had my BT lines I'd certainly be off like a shot with my broadband business.

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

*Sigh* ntl "training" strikes again. :rolleyes:

No it wouldn't, it would probably just involve a call to BT to get your phone lines transferred (you wouldn't even have to speak to ntl about it :tu: ), & then "just" a phone call to cancel the rest of your services.

Nothing stopping you-why give your money to any company that treats you like that?

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

But there are a lot of people think they should get somethnig for nothing. New customers are locking in for a year but the existing customers that want the discount might not be so keen to lock in for another year and often forget that a new customer will have this added constraint.

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

Agreed (again!)

If ntl were proactive in this area, they would be ensuring that their staff also inform customers of this.

Customer-"My mates just signed up today for ntl BB/TV/whatever, & he's only paying "X" per month, & that is "XX" more than I'm paying for the same product (& have been for "X" years"), & I could also get what I am getting now from different suppliers for less money too"

ntl CSR-"We don't want to lose your business Sir/Madam, & would be able to offer you a reduced rate to prevent that happening, would you be interested in paying "X" pounds per month in return for the same 12 month contract?"

It all comes down to very basic customer care, & it's not rocket science.

Those ntl staff that treat ntl's customers this way should be found & sacked IMO.

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

Well the likelyhood is BT or Sky or an ISP wont treat you any better in my or a number of peoples experiences. In my experience BT (and Sky) are some of the most useless muppets around...........and a recent 'respected (ie not the Daily Rag 'Mirror)' survey indicated they are even worse at customer service than ntl!

On the Issue of Pipex mentioned earlier, I recently rang them to ask if they would upgrade my 512k service I use from another location as they now offer 1mb capped for the same price, I asked If I could have 1mb uncapped for the same price instead as I used their service for over a year, they said no, I wanted to diconnect but they had already taken 3 months payment and would not refund it and will not refund, I wont be disconnected for 3 months now............GREAT SERVICE.

ntl are no worse no better, there really is no point in moving it will be no better in the long run (except in a few cases), all comms companies are an utter nightmare to deal with. The hassle of moving far outweighs any potential gain in service you may recieve (unless you salivate at the prospect of red buttons or recording repeats to watch again again again, then Sky+ is probably a good move)

How many existing 'loyal' Sky customer can get Sky+ for £99.99?
Do loyal Sky Customers get their equipment moved to a new property for free?
Do BT not charge loyal customers to reconnect if a line has never been connected to their property (ie new build that has had cable previously, or old build where the line has been 'chopped')?

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

I'm not quite sure what you mean there. :confused:

Pipex offer 1 meg for £33.99 per month from memory, & 512k for £23.44, so why do you think they offer 1 meg for the price of 512k? :confused: :confused:

I also can't understand why they have taken 3 months payment when you are now out of contact & on a rolling monthly payment? :confused: :confused: :confused:

If you pay via DD, then just ring your bank, & invoke the DD Guarantee.

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

So what reaction would you expect if you asked British Gas, BT, Powergen etc etc for the same a free month? Loyalty bonuses? You want cake and eat it too? No chance business is business take it or leave it.

:erm:

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

You're missing the point a bit here.....:angel:

It's that "take it or leave it" attitude that loses customers for any company.

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

Deep joy. Another 'bash ntl thread' for no good reason other than operating in a way the most companies do.
TBH, why would ntl want to keep a customer, if they're not making any profit? :shrug:

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

:tu:

exactly OB - But people on here don't seem to understand that, they seem to think that ntl are a charity :rolleyes:

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

Most companies would not treat their customers like the 2 posters here.
Please read the thread again & tell me if you think that the CSR's responses were acceptable.

If ntl don't want to keep a customer that spends £80.00 per monjth with them because they can't make a profit from that, then ntl are in bigger trouble than they realise.

OB-Why can't you just accept my point that these people were treated in an attrocious manner & ntl (or any company that spoke to customers like that) do not deserve that person's money.

Don't make this thread out to be something it's not-we are discussing the manner in which these wage paying customers were spoken to & treated by ntl.

[Edit]-Or perhaps you feel it's ok for those CSRs to deal with ntl customers in that way? :shrug:

I know I don't......

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

The point that is being missed is that someone has to bear the cost of any subsidy, incentive, bribe, or whatever you want to call it given to customers.

Who bears the cost?

The customers that don't get a reduction in price. They either have to pay an higher price because the cost of these incentives are factored in to their price or suffer the effects of the company having less cash to invest in the infrastructure and services.

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

lol...chill neil ;)

Is it not the case often that people think they are being delat with badly when they don't get what they want?

for example - I had a customer complain about me the other day because I was not able ot offer an evening appt, even though the company i work for does not offer that. they said my attitude stunk and i didn't know anything about customer services. When in fact my attitude was no different to all the happy people i speak to all day every day, bad news is hard to execpt for some people, especially when they expect to get something then are told no you can't have it :angel:

morale of the story from my point of view is don't ring a company threatening to leave unless they give you a new offer!! As sometimes companies are not going to give you what you want.

hope that all makes sense, kinda posting between calls at work :disturbd:

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

You can take the customers of any large company and find a few customers who say that they have suffered a similar response from the CS department. NTL are not unique here. You tend to find that a customer who doesn't get his/her own way can give a very much embroidered version of what happened during their exchange with the customer service agent. I have spent hours watching and listening to till point CCTV tapes following customer complaints and have found the complainants version more often than not is far from the truth of what actually happened.

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

You're taking what a couple of staff said to a customer, which I can tell you quite categorically they should not have done, and presuming that to be the policy of the entire company.

You must remember that for the last 18 months my entire job has been retaining customers. I *know* how important the company consider this to be, I have sat in on meeting after meeting after meeting where the latest retention strategies were briefed out, where ideas and feedback were asked for, where managers drummed it into us how we must NOT just let customers go, I'm the one who has had calls monitored and scored and had managers point out everything I could have done to save that customer but didn't.
So please, don't tell me ntl don't care about retaining existing customers, because I know full well that they do.

As for individual staff telling people they can 'take it or leave it', if it's that blatant they should go, however, do remember things get twisted. There are many customers who ring up month after month wanting discount after discount after discount, there comes a point when these people have to be told, 'sorry, but we can do no more for you in this regard'. Usually when I tell a customer that, I get a complaint made against me about me 'bad attitude'. So please try and see the other side of the coin. No company should routinely bribe its customers to stay by throwing money at them...there's a lot more to Retentions than that.

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

It was entirely acceptable IMO. The CSR explained to the customer what he could do to get the discount he wanted, and he didn't like the answer, then threatened to leave. The CSR said it's up to him, which it is.. - I can't see what so unacceptable about that? :shrug:




But if he got his discount, ntl wouldn't be getting £80 a month, would they.... :rolleyes:

Because I don't think he was treated attrociously at all. He didn't get what he wanted and got the hump. And you're being melodramatic. :dozey:

I'm sorry??????!! Maybe we're reading different posts, but from what I can see, the post was about an existing customer not getting the same deals a new customer would, being told by the CSR he couldn't get the deal he wanted, then the customer threatening to leave, and the CSR telling him in a perfectly civil manner that that was his choice, and then the custiner throwing his toys out of the pram. I do believe it's you making the thread out to be something it's not. :dunce:

I don't think customers being treated shoddily by CSRs is at all OK - but neither do I think that just because I don't get or hear what I want all the time, that I've been treated badly. Which is what IMO seems to be the case here. :td:

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

No they weren't, but what you've done Neil, again, is taken this and stated that it is the company's official policy and that therefore every single customer is treated like this.

It simply isn't the case, and it's actually offensive to me personally, given that Retentions was my job until two weeks ago, to suggest that it is.

Please differentiate between one member of staff apparently giving a poor service, and the national policy of the company as a whole, because at the moment you're not doing.

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

:clap:

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

So who "bears the cost" of a CSR that openly lets a customer (who invests £960.00 per year) just walk away?

The existing customers do of course!!

Whatever way you look at it, & whatever way you dress it up, losing customer's business in this day & age has an affect not only on the business, but also the existing customers.

Loss of revenue is not a good thing for any business.

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

The problem is (IMHO) that there is a danger of setting a precedent.

If everyone was to call and say "give me this special offer or I will walk" and NTL did this, then NTL would be making a loss on all fronts.

NTL, like any other company, will give people reduced rates to get them to join, once they have joined, they are likely to stay, and the price goes up to the standard rate.

In this case, it sounds like the CSR did not follow procedure and put the call through to retentions, however, the meat of the discussion seems ok to me - if someone is threatening to leave, and you cannot accede to their demands, then they have the right to change suppliers, should they wish to do so, that is their choice to make.

the wording may or may not be exact, however what is often missed in these transcript type discussions, is the tone in which things were said.

"I'm sorry, there is nothing more I can do for you" can be said in such a way as to be seen os "go away, I can't be arsed to help", or "I really wish I could help you, but I am unable to do so".

The fact is that someone wanted a discount that new customers were being offered as an incentive, and was refused that discount - they were given an option - cancel, then sign up again - but declined it.

We cannot always get what we want, and sometimes it is easier to moan about the person, rather than admit that you tried (no harm in trying, after all :naughty: ) and failed to get a discount.

Just remember - you probably got some kind of incentive when you joined, so you really should not complain that others get one when they join.

As ever - just my opinions - feel free to ignore or disagree :angel:

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

Right, I'm paying NTL around £1500 a year for the services they provide. If they're not making a profit out of me then they shouldn't be in business, end of chat. But for that £1500 I expect delivery of products and service, not notoriously fragile servers and equally notoriously bad customer service.

And retaining existing customers is far cheaper than recruiting new ones. So treating your customers with decency and respect is an investment; it will return greater profitability in the long term.

NTL certainly do not operate in a way most companies do. I have longstanding trading relationships with many companies who manage to treat me with courtesy and respect. Companies who when things go wrong, acknowledge it and fix it. In crass marketing terms this is called turning an 'ouch' into a 'wow'. NTL turn an 'ouch' into a 'life threatening injury'. They are inept.

The sad thing is that when the products work, they're great. But when they don't (which happens far, far too frequently) NTL just don't know how to deal with it. Let's just hope the planned new CS regime which they're currently trumpeting (and using as an excuse for current service levels) is more than a load of hot air. Then perhaps we won't have cause for another NTL bashing thread.

Finally Neil, I take your point about switching back to BT. But I'd still need to get lines re-connected, pay a broadband installation fee etc. Then there's the telly (I'd gladly get rid but the kids would lynch me). What I want, and I'm sure everyone else does, is to deliver what they promise in their marketing. Then we'll be happy and they'll make money.

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

Here we go again....:rolleyes:

How many more times do I have to point out that when I say "ntl treats it customers badly" I am not referring to all staff??

I know that their are plenty of customers who are perfectly happy with the treatment they receive from ntl. :tu:

I am only referring to the muppets that have been referred to by the posters in this thread.

:banghead:

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

But you're not Neil, you're saying that this is the policy of the company, when it isn't.

Any member of staff that thinks customers leaving is unimportant shouldn't be in the job, and I know their managers would say the same thing.

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

:clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:

Fair point, but BT would reconnect you for free, & most ISPs are doing free/discounted activation on their BB products (such is the market today)

Sky do free installs on their DTV packages, & Freeview is just a case of plugging in the STB normally, but I do totally take you point that you just want the service that you are paying for from ntl. :tu: :tu:

Great post BTW. :)

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

I beg to differ - where in this thread have you stated that it's a singular case?

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

So why is this attitude still present within ntl?

You know as well as I do, that this must be the oldest complaint aimed at ntl over the years, & yet it is clearly still happening. :shrug:

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

OB - for once I think that this is quite a level headed discussion on customer service and not NTL bashing (though this does go on here far to frequently).

Personally I have had nothing but good service (and pretty prompt call answering times) in the last 18 months or so.

That said I don't really use them as an ISP, more of a connection. All the ISP stuff is i-web :) .

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

Depends on what services you have, and how long you've been a customer...

I agree entirely. But IMO, the starter of this thread didn't receive 'notoriously bad custoner service' - they had their bluff called.

I still don't see anywhere where the customer was treated without decency?

In your experience, which is of course not acceptable. I have had two issues regarding my ntl service, one for dial up, which the tech couldn't help me with, one with my phone line which they did. Both times, the fact there was a fault with the service, was acknowledged even though they couldn't pin point it there and then, and an engineer then came out and fixed it:shrug:

I'm assuming you're an ntl: Business customer - do you have any issues you want to pass to me to send on for you?

Again, it's wrong to generalise. My issues were fixed OK, my services have not failed since and IMO, it was all dealt with OK.

I am very acceptong of threads where ntl have done wrong, and they deserve a bashing. I am NOT accepting of 'bashing' threads because of nothing more than a customer having a whine because they didn't get what they wanted.

<snip the rest>

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

I have seen both sides of the coin on this one.

Yes, ntl like most large companies treat long term customers like s**t when it comes to special offers and deals, I think ntl has gone a complete cycle on this issue.

In the past ntl used to bend over backwards giving away free service to grumbling customers, that couldn't go on and CS were eventually stopped from giving out free service willy nilly to any joe public who complained, after word got around that it was easy to get something for nothing out of ntl.

The ones that suffer now are honest customers who have a real problem!

Too much money was thrown away by CS to customers they had on the end of the phone complaining, rather than listen to technicians/engineers who had visited the customer and found no fault. ;)

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

Neil, every company has good and bad employees. A good employee in this case will fight to keep a customer. A bad one won't.

A friend of mine is seriously considering leaving T-Mobile. He is a long term customer (he joined One-2-One as it was then 1 day after it launched), but is considering leaving as he changed tarrifs a year ago, and where as he was getting 300 minutes a month free, they cut it to 200 and told him the extra 100 minutes a month was a year long bonus. His complaint is that he was never told that when he was sold the new tarrif.

Now, when he phoned, T-Mobile didn't offer any kind of retention package, and basically told him to go to another mobile company.

When he left NTL two years ago, the retentions department fought tooth and nail to keep him, even offering free TV & Phone for 3 months. This was worth a hell of a lot of money, as he had the complete TV package, and had all Sky Sports/Movie channels, and all the Channel 4 film channels, basically every every non-premium channel, and most of the premium ones). Sadly, they couldn't offer the one thing he wanted, broadband, as it was not available in Lewisham then (that was actually the reason he was leaving).

True, NTL doesn't always offer packages like this, and also true, it does make financial sense for them to do so (after all, it costs a lot less to offer someone free BB/Tv/Phone for three months than it does to lose them as customers), but the grass isn't always greener. Other companies do fall short too..

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

Orangebird, I think you inhabit an alternative universe to many of the rest of us living here in NTLworld. It may be wrong to generalise but why do you think NTL has such a bad reputation for customer service? Is it just a figment of our collective imagination? And the problems I suffer with the email system are not unique to me. I think you'll find very many of us have the same issues (check the Service Status archive)

No I'm not an NTL: Business customer. I have two phone lines, TV and broadband through Home. So the profit should be tidy. I've considered switching to Business so I can at least have a service guarantee but they refused to waive the installation fee. They offered to reduce it but, given I'd be paying an extra £5 a month, why should I also pay for installation in the hope of getting the service that Home should be delivering anyway?

I should point out that I really don't have an issue with Tech Support who are usually very helpful and often disarmingly honest (one once admitted to me they'd told mngmt not to launch a system because it was full of bugs and lo, it repeatedly failed). But CS is appalling - has been since day one of my becoming an NTL customer (many years ago incidentally) when I enjoyed a 1 hour plus wait to be put through to a stroppy advisor who failed to get my my new digital TV service working.

I take your point that enticing marketing deals are targeted at new and not existing customers and that, in normal circumstances, this is a legitimate tactic. But when you're failing to deliver good service to existing customers, taking on new ones is not necessarily a good move. It can be plain bl**dy stupid. If you check the number of registration faults on the Service Status page you'll see that new customers are getting swiftly inducted into the NTL way. Resources being used to build the client base would be better targeted at retaining the existing one. They should get the servers functioning properly before they try to increase traffic with new custom. And while service is poor, existing customers are quite right to question why funds are being focused on potential customers.

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

No, just a universe that I know doesn't revolve around me.....

It is wrong to generalise. Email has been completely rubbish and ntl have acknowledged that, so I'm not sure what your point is?

Depends how long you've been a customer really.

If you're really that unhappy, and can't get resolution with ntl - why do you stay with them? And no, before anyone jumps on that comment, that's not a rhetorical question accompanied by attitude, it's a genuine question.

It's all down to personal experience. I have never had to wait an hour to get through to CS, and I've never encountered a stroppy CSR. And I'm aware that other customers don't have that experience. But the difference is, I acknowledge that, and others don't, and frankly, that's what really p1sses me off.

Again, I ask you, if your service with ntl is so hellish, why have you persevered for so many years? :confused:

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

Orangebird

Email is rubbish and NTL have acknowledged that? Not to me they haven't. And even if they did, when are they going to do something about it (I did say other companies acknowledge and fix). As I said before, why put additional strain on the servers by trying to attract new custom when they can't deal with existing traffic?

A universe that doesn't revolve around you? But it's about personal experience and as you're all right Jack everything's hunky dory? I acknowledge that you're happy with CS. Good for you. But very, very many of us are not. The fact that the collective personal experience is not a good one is more telling than your own seemingly remarkable good fortune.

If you'd read my previous posts properly you'd see I've been an NTL customer for many years and my assumption that they make a tidy profit from me is based on the fact that they must have recovered their capital expenditure some time ago. Why am I still with them? Well, if you'd read my previous posts properly you'd know; it's a real hassle to change because - and I admit this was foolish - I get so many services through them. Perhaps you'd like to give your opinion on whether I should pay for the privilege of getting a service guarantee by switching to Business (and therefore presumably a decent level of service).

So, as you say you can pass on messages to NTL: Business for me can I take it you work for them? Could this and your happy CS experience be in any way connected (see Bill C's post)? If you are on the NTL payroll why not take on board the legitimate criticisms being raised in what was rightly described previously as a level headed discussion. Nobody's having a go at you personally (beyond suggesting your experience may not be shared by many of us) so chill out mate.

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

No, they won't acknowledge to you personally, but they do publish service status etc.

They bring on new customers because email is not intended to be the main attraction of their products.

I could out the same back to you - 'I've had problems so it must all be crap for everyone?

No, I don't think you should pay, purely because you're a resi customer, not a business customer. I think if you're that unhappy, you should bite the bullet and change provider. With companies falling over themselves to gain new business, I'm sure most of the leg work and hassle would be taken away from you by the companies you choose to change to? :shrug:

I work for ntl, but not for the Business Unit.

Not at all - employees do not have any priviledges or quick routes over non-employee customers, from install of services (which can take between 6-8 weeks), and I certainly don't know of any magical phone numbers to get me to the front of the CS phone queue.

Heed your own advice. I do take on legitimate critism, every day on this forum. I also try and help out where ever I can is a customer needs help because of bad service. What I don't accept is p1ssing and moaning because someone couldn't get what they wanted and their threats to leave made to look foolishly empty. Yes, my experience of ntl CS maynit be so common, but think about it, we're on a website that was created for p1ssed off customers, (nthellworld) not those who are actually happy. I do not like you insinuating that just because I work for ntl that I q-jump over full paying customers, or that I accept sub standard service and let the little things go by, because I don't. :td:

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

To right sky refuse to budge on this and the best advise they offer is to cancel your existing account and open a new one in a different name otherwise it will cost £199

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

They recently sent me an e-mail Advertising the need to increase speed!

After reading through I notice its the same price but includes a 5gb cap, I asked why as a customer of over a year I cant have an uncapped service for the same price, if they are so keen for me to upgrade.

They have taken 3 months payment because I pay Quarterly via credit card in advance, which they claim the 'cant' refund :confused: ummmmmmmmm likely story :rolleyes:

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

Fact of the matter is though........

Will BT be any better............mostly likely not.

In my experience and the discovery of a survey from a trusted independant source they have the worst customer service EVEN worse than ntl. The BT Connect mail servers certainally used to be (a year ago anyway) more shakey than ntls!

Will Sky be better?? Possibly not? Certainally they are as pathetic as anything I have ever experienced right up to senior level.

Freeview........well theres noone to complain to on that so who would all the moaners cry to.

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

But that's not "not budging", it's offering an alternative way so that the customer can get what he/she has asked for.....

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

And it is still present in every damn customer service centre in this godforsaken country including you precious BT and Sky lest we not forget :rolleyes:

The thing you are missing is this is NOT just and ntl problem its an industry problem.

Every company I have every dealt with (except the small local ones) have had some excellent staff who go out of their way to assist you, and some utterley pathetic staff who have absolutely no intention of helping you.

ntl are not alone.........its not ntl that arent interested in long standing customers its every big company.

(If I was unfortuante to once again be a Sky Customer) If I rang up Sky Customer 'Disservice National 0870' trying to get a cheaper offer on my TV, or a cheap installation when I moved (of a acceptable quality) It would cost, Sky would not budge even if I subscribed to every package and was giving something like £50 a month........wheres the difference? It would all end in cancellation! And trying to blag it by siging up under my mrs or dogs name to get a free install :rolleyes:

Try ringing the majority of ISPs and they will do nothing.........if you can get it cheaper elsewhere theyll let you.........and BT again wont care, they will try and delay your exit (in the hope you get bored) passing you pillar to post (every regional call cetre with a dodgy accent in the UK) but wont offer 'deals'

So the fact that ntl 'do' offer rentention offers to some makes them better than most of their competitors.

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

Surely you could do that with NTL?

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

You'd like to think so.

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

Access to the Service Status link has been demoted to a tiny link and its content is now rapidly archived. Can't think why. If email is not intended to be the main attraction of the product then they should drop it from broadband marketing. Simple as.

Your post is confused. You criticise me saying that I'm extrapolating my personal experience to say NTL CS is crap. No mate, I said the collective experience suggests NTL: CS is crap. You go one to say you're good experience may not be so common. Precisely. Out here in the real world surveys, the letters etc ie not this forum, reveal widespread disatisfaction. Ask yourself this. Do you really think NTL has a GOOD reputation? If not why not? And how bad must a company be for people to bother to create a site like this. And how bad must it still be to have such an active subscriber base? Still, as you seem to think your employer is so good, how about setting up NTLisreallyjollygood.com and see how far you get.

Interesting to note that you, as an NTL employee, think I should switch provider. Doesn't this take us back to another point on this thread? You don't work in CS do you.

The suggestion is not that you queue jump but that once you're through your account is flagged as staff. My you are touchy on that point though aren't you.

I'm sure it must be very upsetting seeing the company you work for being so comprehensively criticised but trust me, there is just cause. Keep taking the pay cheques and the head in the sand.

Ciao!

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

Which, correct me if I'm wrong, is what Toshni was told by ntl??

So, it's Sky being helpful in this scenario, but ntl behaving 'attrociously'????? :rolleyes:

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

Yes, but it's the attitude & approach that followed that was the problem.



No, you will notice that there was no "take it or leave it" option quoted there.

Again-it comes down to the damn poor attitude of some of the people that ntl employ that leaves a bad taste in the mouth of it's wage paying customers.

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

Agreed. :shrug:

Really? Have you spoken to all 3 million customers to find out? :o

On this ite, no it's not common...

People? ONe p1ssed off customer who happens to be very good at web design...

As the old saying goes, if you enjoy a service you'll maybe tell one person - get a problem, and you'll tell ten. I can';t be arsed to work out the percentage of customers who complain on this site compared to the amount of customers ntl have, but I'm guessing it's a single digit, with a few decimal places.

Where did I say ntl are 'good'? I think their products are, but I do know some people have a terrible time with the as far as their CS experience goes, which is why I help on here when I can. :shrug: I have no interest or will to set a site up, thanks all the same. If I don't like a service I receive, I get rid of it, rather than spend the next x number of years still paying them for a service I'm not happy with.. :dunce: :dozey:

My thoughts are regardless of who your current service provider is. If you're not happy, go elsewhere. Simple as.

As Mark B said earlier, the fact that I'm staff doesn't come into it when you ring CS. Even the CS staff don't notice half the time..Not a touchy subject for me, but one where you seem to have trouble comprehending when it comes to my responses.

Not really, especially when the critism is deserved. You seem to have problems absorbing anything I've said previous posts. Things do go wrong at ntl, and critism is definitely deserved at some popints, but IMO, it wasn't deserved judging by the post that started this thread.

I'll take the pay cheques thanks, and although my head isn't in the sand, I'll let you think it is. If you're head is stuck where I think it is, sand is preferable. Have a lovely life :wavey:

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

Oh, right. So you reckon, that if I called Sky (as an existing customer), and wanted to upgrade to Sky plus and said I'll leave if they don't give me the same deal as a new customer, that they'd say, 'OK then, have it'?

No. :rolleyes:

Neil, you don't know how Toshni was spoken to, all you know is that he didn't like what he heard. There's a big difference in being treated badly, and simply throwing a paddy because you didn't get what you wanted. :mad:

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

Orangebird, I have trouble absorbing your posts because they're so confused and contradictory. And I'm tired of having to reiterate my points to you which is a remarkable reflection of the sort of conversations you have with CS.

Let's keep this simple. I'll ask again. Do you think NTL has a good reputation? If not do you think this might be a teensy weensy bit related to the quality of service.

The thread is called "NTL Not interested in long standing customers" and my sole point is that if they were they would do something about the reliability of product and the quality of CS. I've already stated that I understand why they loss lead to attract new custom and that this is, in normal circumstances a legitimate marketing ploy. But whilst there is unacceptably high levels of disatisfaction among existing customers (and no clearly I haven't polled 3m people but I do see NTL appearing with monotonous regularity in Consumer columns and propping up CS surveys), that should be the priority.

I have nothing further to add because there I can only make the same points so many times before accepting I'm not going to get through to you.

Do take care now.

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

Exactly, but when Sky say this, Neil proclaims they are being helpful and proactive. When ntl say the same thing, Neil says they are treating their customers atrociously.

I'm afraid that, much as I like Neil and respect what he does, he is helplessly biased in this situation and could almost be Defiant or UDT in disguise.

It's hopeless trying to persuade him otherwise.

In his defence though, he has had a series of very bad experiences with the company so I can understand him feeling as he does.

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

Mark-I am not biased, & fully appreciate the peeps have the same probs with Sky/Pipex etc-our very own Bifta & Ignition had hell with Pipex!

ntl did say the same thing Mark, but followed it up with a totally non caring attitude, which kind of defeats the object IMO.

As I'm sure I said earlier, I don't aim this at ntl in particular, but any company who doesn't fall over themselves to keep a customer is A) not very customer care focused, b) not very loyal to their customers, & C) very short sighted.

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

Perhaps you would care to name one large corporation which actually does care about long serving customers?

:erm:

Re: NTL Not interested in long standing customers
 

Sky still do go a little further though and in events like this have been known to apply a 6 month viewing discount to long standing customers so that they can have sky world half price at £20.50 which covers the extra you would have to pay also increasing their revenue after that 6 month period