Train crash near Reading
 

Car on the track

http://www.sky.com/skynews/article/0...158700,00.html

:(

Edit - Sky news are reporting several fatalities :(

Re: Train crash near Reading
 

just watching it on the news :(

Re: Train crash near Reading
 

Strange, no Sky News here, can get BBC and ITV :confused:

Re: Train crash near Reading
 

its on sky news now :( , ppl trapped and dead :( :(

Re: Train crash near Reading
 

I hope all that can be saved, will be... I work in Newbury I may well know some of the people on that train. My brother in law is at the scene helping out right now (he's a copper) I hope his experience from the Paddington crash will assist him :(

Re: Train crash near Reading
 

Very sad news... heard it on radio 1 on way home from fireworks display.

My sympathies go to the families of the victims :(

Re: Train crash near Reading
 

shocking, totally shocking!

Re: Train crash near Reading
 

The state of the railways in this country is pitiful: A 3rd world rail infrastucture in the country that invented the railways. Well, I suppose that's privatisation of public transport for you.

Re: Train crash near Reading
 

no disrespect intended, Swipe, but i think we need to know the extent of this tragedy, before we discuss that. It's for another thread at the moment, I'd suggest.

We should also be grateful that our emergency services are distinctly NOT 'third world' .

My thoughts are with the victims & their families....

Re: Train crash near Reading
 

Its sad.. But it is too soon to say why it happened. According to the BBC, it's unlikely to be a failiure on the crossing. It is more likely that the car was left there, either because it broke down , or deliberately. Which, apparently, does happen.

Re: Train crash near Reading
 

i saw the news flash on BBC. it's really sad

Re: Train crash near Reading
 

Sky were reporting that the car was there as the driver was trying to commit suicide. Not sure how true it is though.

Re: Train crash near Reading
 

If that is true, the driver (whatever their problems) is selfish.

Sorry if that seems a bit blunt, but assuming it's true, the driver may well have solved their own problems, and caused problem (or injury or death) for hundreds of other people.

Re: Train crash near Reading
 

150 people taken to hospital, just seen it on SKY it looks a bad one, lets all hope they all get out.

Re: Train crash near Reading
 

awful news let us all pray from the the familys of the dead and injured

Re: Train crash near Reading
 

it seem it was a car on the track, not sure why. It doesnt seem to be any problem with the actual train or the tracks.

God dam car person, out of intrest what do you have to do if you car breaks down on a train track?

Re: Train crash near Reading
 

get yourself & your passengers out of the car & use the phone provided at the crossing :)

Re: Train crash near Reading
 

:notopic: This may sound thick, but I don't live near a level crossing, but why can't you just push it off? I know, if you can see a train coming, you won't have time, but using the phone will be too late as well. :confused:

Condolences to the families...

Re: Train crash near Reading
 

Is the correct response according to the highway code. However, if you have an intercity 125 coming at you at 2+ miles per minute, there is not a lot of get out time.

In order for the signalman to react to your frantic call and stop the train short of the incident, he would need around 10 minutes notice, or 22 miles distance from an approaching train.

Re: Train crash near Reading
 

I heard about some guy who had a flat tyre and changed it on a railway crossing. ****.

I also think that pushing the car of the tracks may be better, but anyway how often does a car just break down suddenly? Isn't there a few mintues before the car stops

Re: Train crash near Reading
 

Mal, theres one in Clayton, might be worth a detour one day and go across it, very scary...........

Re: Train crash near Reading
 

I don't drive or live anywhere near Clayton :) to know what the train traffic would be like. I would have thought that you could move a car easy enough off the track, the only problem would be if you were unlucky to time it a few minutes before the next train.

Re: Train crash near Reading
 

Well thats the whole point - when the barriers come down, you have nowhere to push the car to (or at least you have to diagonally negotiate a half-barrier crossing) assuming there are enough helpers to attemp it. The barriers come down in response to the approach of a train - in the case of a 125 its coming at you fast, and requires 2-3 miles to come to rest after (if) it has been alerted.

My question would be:
Even in rural areas, why are high speed lines allowed to be broached unmonitored?

Re: Train crash near Reading
 

maybe its time to stop the conspiracy theories and hope that as many ppl as possible come out of this tradgedy as well as possible

Re: Train crash near Reading
 

It would have to be a very odd car breakdown that totally imobilised a vehicle. OK, a car may move forward and stall, and can't be restarted. Possible at a crossing or similar place where a driver has to pull away after being stopped. However, the majority of vehilces, if placed in first gear can be moved forward by then turning over the starter motor.

Someone above has posted the driver is suicidal, and thus selfish. That is exactly waht a suicidal person is, they never have any thought other than for themselves. Those who have to deal with the consequences of their actions, family, friends, are irrelevant to anyone in that state of mind.

The exact cause of this "accident" (in quotes because these things often have an identifiable and thus potentially forseable and so preventable cause), at this time is speculation. On that basis it is unfair to band about claims of car drivers being at fault at this time.

My sympathies to all victims.

Re: Train crash near Reading
 

It was half barriers so if they were on the correct side of the road, there'd be nothing blocking their exit from the crossing.
The cause will come out eventually, and as MGP said, we can't really start blaming the driver without all the information.

Sympathies go out to all involved

Re: Train crash near Reading
 

You are absolutely right - I have failed to state my sympathies which should have been my first point in involving myself in the thread. Its a terrible disaster, and to be honest I am sickened when I read of these things.

I was not apportioning blame, the point really is that there should not be unmonitored crossings of ultra high speed rail lines - in the event of an inadvertant stall, breakdown or wilful blockage, there is precious little time or rescource to prevent a catastrophic collision.

Re: Train crash near Reading
 

very true :tu: , hopefully some good will come of this in respect to unmanned crossings

Re: Train crash near Reading
 

Thats one big tragedy.
I hope those injured are OK.
Best of luck to them.

Re: Train crash near Reading
 

According to the newspaper this morning, there were four deaths - all people in the car.

Re: Train crash near Reading
 

It was me who said that. I wasn't actually saying that was the cause. It's one possible cause, but at stated above, the crossing should have been monitored. They seem to have CCTV everywhere else, why not have it where it might save lives?

Re: Train crash near Reading
 

There are CCTV monitored level crossings - usually on busier roads. AHBs, like in this incident (and of course open crossings which have no barriers at all) are used on lightly used roads, which this certainly was. It's difficult to think of a use of CCTV that would make a difference - possibly a device to alert if the crossing is blocked would be better (bearing in mind that signalmen have more to do than watch a bunch of TVs).

There are lots of level crossing accidents every year, usually resulting in a dead road user, but there is a serious one about every 20 years (1968, 1986, 2004).

Casualties are now six - car driver, train driver and four others, probably on the train, considering that the normally excellent Mk.3 coaches suffered serious damage, which needs to be examined urgently, considering the train wasn't travelling at full speed.

Poor old Great Western has now had three serious HST accidents in seven years, only one of which was their fault, and all with the first class section at the front of the train bearing the brunt of it, which I suppose is lucky as it's generally less used.

Re: Train crash near Reading
 

True, I was possibly oversimplifying. An automatic monitoring device would be more useful.

One thing people need to remember. Despite the well-publicised train accidents in recent years, the amount of people killed or injured on trains is a fraction of those killed or injured on roads.

Re: Train crash near Reading
 

I would have thought moving the car so that the front or rear was facing the train would be better than having it side on? The car would be able to move, absorbing some of the force of the impact.

Re: Train crash near Reading
 

Casualty figures now at seven, also this would be the fourth HST accident as there was a FGW train involved in another level crossing incident in Worcestershire a couple of months ago (a number of deaths - but all in the minibus that was on the crossing)

My sympthies to everyone involved

EDIT Greencreeper: why would the car be anything but side on to the tracks? If they wanted to push the car or crank it out on the starter (only possible with manuals) they want it pointing the right way.

Re: Train crash near Reading
 

I was thinking in terms of "what if the vehicle couldn't be moved clear of the tracks", and also for those contemplating suicide it might be better for those on the train if their vehicle isn't side on.

Re: Train crash near Reading
 

We do not know yet why the car was stationary on the crossing. But it seems there is a reliable witness, an off duty police officer, who accordgin to ITV news at least, was trying to use the level crossing phone to warn signal staff there was a problem. However there was never going to be enough time. Rail signals are effectively automated as far as automated corssings go. Once the barrier is down the light goes green, and the train continues.

The oddity of this particular collision is that the train derailed. That appears very unusual looking at statisitics. It appears road vehicle versus train on corossigs is happens many times a year, but only the vehicle occupants die as trains usually stay on the tracks. As the ITV report I saw said, yet again this is a road accident that has involved trains.

Ultimately the only way that we are to prevent level crossing incidents is to remove them. But is the country prepared to accept and fund the cost of doing so? We would have to remove each and every crossing as to say one part of the network is a higher risk than others would be impossible, as the vehicle being stuck could happen anywhere any time. In most cases as there is no alternate viable route so building bridges or underpasses would be necesary, but especially in built up areas the space to do so may not be physically available. I don't think there is an easy answer.

Yes we wish for safe railways, but the "surprise" and newsworthy nature of the rail accident is a bit odd to me. The railways, per head of person carried per mile, per casualty beats death and injury statistics on the roads. Yet we have an outcry on rail travel accidents, because of the "novelty" of it (and perhaps that serious accidents cause mass causualty), but largely take for granted road incidents.

Re: Train crash near Reading
 

That's what I was meaning. The car is trapped between the barriers - what do you do? Waste precious time trying to stop the train by using the emergency telephone, or move the car so it's end on and not side on? Like a previous poster said, a high speed train takes several miles to come to a stop, so there's a point at which a crash becomes inevitable and the only option left open is to try to maximise the changes of the train staying on the track.

Re: Train crash near Reading
 

Sorry, should have said 'with passenger fatalities'. Normally of course, the victims of level crossing accidents are in the vehicles.

We've got safe railways - no passenger deaths last year, for instance. Since Ladbroke Grove we've got TPWS, which would have prevented it, we've got Network Rail taking maintenance away from cowboys like Jarvis which would have prevented Hatfield and probably Potters Bar, and with any luck we've got a realisation that mucking about with the structure of the railways to put profit first does nothing for the safety of passengers.

Replacing all level crossings isn't going to happen, too expensive for the accidents prevented (as I said, about one serious one every twenty years). Much better to invest in better junctions, better signalling, better train driver training and target the most dangerous level crossings (where the amount of road traffic has increased for instance) and *get the people who pay for the roads* to pay for them. Why should the already cash-strapped railway pay to prevent road users killing themselves?

Also it's worth remembering that trains have been derailed and people killed at bridges over railway lines, too, after cars and lorries have been driven off the bridge.

Actually, I don't think AHBs are interlocked with the signalling, the bigger crossings generally are. It's not usually convenient with modern signalling distances to have a signal at each LC - particularly in flat areas like the Kennet Valley where there are lots of LCs. Also, the amount of time the barriers are down is about 30 seconds (this is for the benefit of road users, who complained about the time taken to close the old swing gated crossings). This isn't enough time to avoid delaying the train, which will be about a mile away at 125mph, a bit closer at 100mph, which is well beyond the point at which it would be seeing yellows and having to slow down.

Re: Train crash near Reading
 

the whole country is run by pressure groups kinda p!isses me off people die its a sad fact of life all the people that come out the woodwork and say blah blah shoudl remove the crossings etc yes its a sad event but train deaths are low and there isnt a lot you can do to stop someone in a car driving onto the track even if it was maned with a huge barrier u can still drive through it ...

sad event yes but put it into perspective. flying chips probably cause the same amount of deaths each year ... all day on local radio its all i have heard wouldnt even raise a mention if it wasnt local i bet :(

Re: Train crash near Reading
 

**Update**

It turns out one guy from my office was on the train, he suffered severed tendons in his hand. His brother-in-law, who was with him, dislocated his hip. They both had to wait 4 hours to get to hospital as the more seriously injured were most likely taken first. I've heard unconfirmed reports that an 8yr old girl, daughter of a family connected with one of my colleagues, was one of those killed :(

Re: Train crash near Reading
 

Yes, it's true, this was reported on GMTV this am. :(

Re: Train crash near Reading
 

Yeah

http://www.guardian.co.uk/ufton/stor...346227,00.html

Sorry mate :(

Re: Train crash near Reading
 

Half barriers are fine, they stop people getting onto the track by accident and if a car wants to get on there on purpose they can do it no matter what

Re: Train crash near Reading
 

Sorry to hear that S1lver :(

I must admit I cringe when I see people letting their kids roam all over the trains while its in motion, I can't help imagining them getting seriously hurt :(

Re: Train crash near Reading
 

s1|ver, sorry for your news..

But, to put this train accident in perspective (bad though it is),

AFAIK, deaths by rail are in double, not quadruple figures..

Re: Train crash near Reading
 

Car deaths are much higher than rail deaths

Re: Train crash near Reading
 

The mum died as well, They must have been in the same area

Re: Train crash near Reading
 

This is always the problem.

You can have as many safety systems as you want, but if someone wants to do something that they shouldn't - they will do it, no matter how many safe guards, warnings, guards, you put there.

You just can't compete with human nature/stupidity..

Re: Train crash near Reading
 

The Police officer was on the tracks trying to get the driver to move up until the last moment when he got out of the way moments before the train hit.

Thats one brave police officer :tu:

http://www.thesun.co.uk/article/0,,2-2004520756,00.html

Re: Train crash near Reading
 

gawd...

He must have trouble walking most of the time - to do that you'd have to have balls the size of melons.

Very impressive, and brave

Re: Train crash near Reading
 

The BTP deputy chief constable denys this. I would agree more with what he says as there wouldn't have been enough time to even say hello after the barriers were down (and he was at the phone trying to contact the signalman to stop the trains!)

Re: Train crash near Reading
 

Thanks to everyone for their support, to be honest it's hit the Newbury residents the hardest.. even though I crossed the exact point 24 hours earlier on my way home, it still seems a bit surreal that something like that could happen so close to home.
I was praying that everyone would be in work when I got there this morning, as that train is a very popular one for shoppers going into Reading and London.