Originally Posted by AlexanderHanff (Post 34510168)

Hey maybe Phorm should take a leaf out of Comcast's book, clearly they have worked much harder on accessing profiling data judging by this:

http://gizmodo.com/369379/comcast-wa...your-cable-box

Lets see how long before VM decide to try this as well.

Alexander Hanff

Originally Posted by Chris U (Post 34509817)

I'd be interested to see that small print, do you have a link ??

Originally Posted by lucevans (Post 34510248)

Chris - It's mentioned on page 2 of the E&Y Privacy Report, in Section II of the Management's Control Description, which can be found at http://www.phorm.com/user_privacy/EY_Phorm_Exam.pdf

(I tried to copy the relevant section into this post, but it seem that either Phorm or E&Y is not keen on people being able to quote that report - it's a protected pdf that defies cut and paste!)

Originally Posted by lucevans (Post 34510248)

Chris - It's mentioned on page 2 of the E&Y Privacy Report, in Section II of the Management's Control Description, which can be found at http://www.phorm.com/user_privacy/EY_Phorm_Exam.pdf

(I tried to copy the relevant section into this post, but it seem that either Phorm or E&Y is not keen on people being able to quote that report - it's a protected pdf that defies cut and paste!)

Originally Posted by AlexanderHanff (Post 34510258)

....." § Once the system purges this data, it is not possible for us to release it, either accidentally or deliberately."

Alexander Hanff

Originally Posted by OF1975 (Post 34510264)

Thats the key statement for me. To put it another way, for the 14 days before the data is purged, it is possible for the data to be released accidentally or deliberately.

Originally Posted by AlexanderHanff (Post 34510271)

Its the "research" part of "research and debug logs" which concerns me. They clearly stated in one of their oh so honest "Answers to Questions" statements that it was debug logs only pertaining to server information. WTF are research logs and WTF do they contain and WTF have these guys not been exiled from the UK yet?

Alexander Hanff

Originally Posted by AlexanderHanff (Post 34510258)

Protected my ass :) Just don't use an Adobe PDF viewer (the default PDF document viewer in Ubuntu works fine):
Alexander Hanff

Originally Posted by AlexanderHanff (Post 34509971)

If Phorm had any common sense they would drop the UK market like a hot stone, this controversy has lost them tens of millions of GBP in share capital over the past 3 weeks.

They would be better off concentrating their efforts on the US, who are bound to lap this up given their existing and historical stance on privacy.

At least that way their share price -might- start to recover ;)

Mind you I am waiting for them to launch in the US so EFF can take them and their partners straight to court,

only the federal government are allowed to use illegal wiretaps
(well they aren't really according to the Senate Oversight Committee or whatever they are called, but Bush like to think he is immune).

Alexander Hanff

Originally Posted by Sirius (Post 34510325)

This has been posted by a BT rep on the BT webwise Beta site.



So they are still going to force there user into a OPT OUT.

VirginMedia i hope you don't do that or i can see you losing plenty of customers, Me being one of them.

Originally Posted by PhormUKPRteam (Post 34510114)

Seeing as there aren't really separate threads in this discussion, thought this might be of interest to the main group here,
...
Today's ICO survey
(http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/7304455.stm) on data protection highlights why the Phorm system is actually an improvement in online privacy.

Originally Posted by popper (Post 34510081)

been there, done that, got no answers to the questions put....

generic answers are such fun....
and this ones not been mentioned in a while.

1. If you are a customer of BT Retail (or of any other BT divisions e.g. BT Business) , Virgin Media or Carphone Warehouse Talk Talk, or any other company that thinks to profile your data for advertising , then you might like to write to them quoting the very clear The Data Protection Act 1998 section 11:
2. 1. 11 Right to prevent processing for purposes of direct marketing
   2. (1) An individual is entitled at any time by notice in writing to a data controller to require the data controller at the end of such period as is reasonable in the circumstances to cease, or not to begin, processing for the purposes of direct marketing personal data in respect of which he is the data subject.
   3. (2) If the court is satisfied, on the application of any person who has given a notice under subsection (1), that the data controller has failed to comply with the notice, the court may order him to take such steps for complying with the notice as the court thinks fit.
   4. (3) In this section "direct marketing" means the communication (by whatever means) of any advertising or marketing material which is directed to particular individuals.

Originally Posted by lucevans (Post 34510379)

So, that being the case, what do you reckon to the following DPA notice?:

"Data Protection Notice

I write regarding the intention of Virgin Media to implement Phorm’s system known as “webwise� on your broadband network. I have studied the available information on the technical functionality of this system, and I do not want it to be applied to my internet connection. Please note that I am fully aware of the opt-out system requiring either the placing of a cookie on my computer or the blocking of access to certain domains, but I reject these methods for the reason outlined below:

Despite the offer of an opt-out to prevent me receiving targeted advertising from this system, it is apparent that my web browsing data could still be mirrored to, and analyzed by, Phorm-supplied hardware within your network. Although assurances have been made by Phorm that if I opt-out of the system, no data pertaining to my web browsing habits will be passed from that hardware to Phorm or it’s associates, no assurance has been given that the mirroring and/or profiling of my data will not still take place within the Virgin Media network, and this is unacceptable to me.

According to Phorm, the mirroring and profiling hardware that they supply becomes the property of Virgin Media, so that being the case, I would like to draw your attention to Section 11 of The Data Protection Act 1998 which give me the right to require you to cease, or not begin, processing my data for the purposes of direct marketing.

I hereby inform you that I exercise that right, and prohibit you from routing, mirroring, processing or profiling data traveling to or from my internet connection using any equipment supplied to you for the purpose of operating the Phorm system.

In the event that you receive this letter before the webwise system has been implemented, then it constitutes my standing instruction to you to not begin processing my data in the way outlined above in the future."

---------- Post added at 23:38 ---------- Previous post was at 23:32 ----------



I think it unlikely they'd risk running a covert trial after the heat BT have been getting over their's last July - but who knows? It's even less likely they'd roll it out system-wide without the one-time "welcome/opt-out" screen that Kent Ertugrul keeps banging-on about.... also, I've been clearing my cookies out a lot over the last few days to see what was being dropped on my system, and I haven't seen any recurring UID cookies appearing....