Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

good interview,

alex, any milage in contacting isp's like zen etc who have publically said no to phorm and see if you can get any quotes regarding increase sales or enquiries where people have stated they are or will be moving isp as a direct result of phorm being trialed or planned to be implimented?

would be a good info at the demo to have some quotes from the competition on number leaving bt etc as a direct result of phorm to put infront of investors

peter

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

:welcome: oldun to the forums as many would say it is good to see we are not the minority as phorm try to make us sound.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Jason from UKFSN will be at the demo as a guest speaker. He owns UKFSN (an Entanet reseller). Still working on other things with regards the demo at the moment but I will confirm more details once I have them.

Alexander Hanff

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

I left VM because of Phorm there were a few others that moved to Aquis from VM around the same time

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

:welcome: <- for first post here

:welcome: <- for first post anywhere :D

Great article on ISP review btw. Thanks for posting Florence, and nice one Alex. (Florence, why you disable rep? me no able give you thumb up (ass) lol )

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

I second that :D

Anyone else 'lurking', please drop by to say hello, and show that you are with us - the more voices heard; the greater the impact.

:ghugs:

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

People over the pond are starting to get wise to DPI...

Report slams US advert server for "wiretapping, forgery and browser hijacking"

Sound familiar?


https://www.cableforum.co.uk/images/...2008/08/25.png

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Still here.. Hello all and keep up the great work.. !
;)

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

should that not read "PHORM are RUNNING back to the USA"

have you got one ready showing a leg with a nice big doc martin connecting to an arse with phorm written on it and the message "you were warned phorm" or " kicked out by the little man"

or even "kicked in the kent"?
peter

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Confirmed, Meglena Kuneva is in London now...

See agenda here.

"19-20.06 Visit to London "

Can't find any details what so ever anywhere on the face of the planet of the meeting who's attending or what they are meeting about (apart from the original MediaPost source).

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

alex i can't be at the demo, but i have a A4 colour laser here and i am willing to print off a hundred or so colour pages for you and post them to you for the demo, just pm me and i will let you know my email

every little helps keep costs down and publicity up

peter

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

You can still send reps, and she'll see them. The pips just don't display.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

The report referenced in that article is a damned good read http://www.freepress.net/files/NebuAd_Report.pdf

Also mentioned in it is that NebuAd has a UK office - anyone know what they are up to?

Oh oh http://www.nebuad.co.uk/

Pete - maybe you need to add 'and NebuAd are coming to the UK'

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

uhh ohhh..

Ponemon is a merkin outfit, yup that makes them fit for purpose for the UK doesn't it.



hmm one for another day methinks.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

worrying http://www.nebuad.co.uk/optout.html,

"NebuAd is not currently operating in the UK. As soon as we are, this page will give web users the opportunity to opt-out of receiving our services."

seems they may have plans if phorm suceed :td:

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

With how Phorm have been hit perhaps trying to keep their heads down. What was a suprise was the game they used to get the cookies WOW is one game you have to pay to play it so the customer is paying to use the servers and being click spied on for paying looks similar to ISP greed by a few top people signing up without thinking.
Will post a link to that on a gaming forum that should get the younger end asking questions or knowing how half behave raging at the company.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Thanks for giving me a proper laugh out loud moment :D

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Maybe that's why the share price is staying resolutely low - a whiff of competition in the marketplace.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

perhahps pete could even superimpose a pic of kents head on the arse he he the possibilities are endless, come on pete show us some ideas

peter

---------- Post added at 12:47 ---------- Previous post was at 12:46 ----------

are nebuad listed on aim? or anywhere else in the UK?

just done a bit of digging and nebuad is funded by two venture capital outfits in the US, so if they could find backers why couldnt kent?

peter

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Are you sure WOW in this case is World of Warcarft? Reading the report it looks like an ISP -

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Indeed it is. It confirms as I suspected from looking at Nebuad's opt-out, that they also add javascript to the bottom of some pages. Blocking faireagle.com is one option, also sending bogus data in requests might be fun - I guess I'll have to improve Nebuad support in my own FF extension :)

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Doesn't look like it:

Management Team

Robert Dykes, Founder, Chairman & CEO

Kira Makagon, Co-Founder & President

Dan Miller, Chief Financial Officer

Lebin Cheng, Co-founder & Vice President, Appliance Engineering

Mike Matthys, Senior Vice President, World Wide ISP Solutions

Mike Miller, Vice President, Advertising Sales

Scott Tavenner, Vice President, Business Development

Paul Goad, Managing Director, UK
Investors

NebuAd is funded by the premier investment firms Menlo Ventures and Sierra Ventures.

Some names for our PIs to be digging into though....

Seems like most of the US contingent are from a finance / marketing background, rather than the traditional spyware though.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

If Robert Topolski wanders in the forum, give him a pat on the back for an outstanding report. Concise and very damning for NebuAD (and Phorm - this is the model they used during the 2006 trial)

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

So this slipped in under the radar back in January - Nebuad announcing their UK office. Also the MD, Paul Goad came from Tacoda, a click tracking agency.

http://www.reuters.com/article/press...008+BW20080122

Looking at the technologies deployed it looks like both pagesense and nebuad were 99% identical during the BT trials but then phorm moved on slightly to a non-embedded js solution. Would be interesting to watch these two slug it out over patents! Maybe those ISPs who proudly announced themselves 'phorm free' need to be asked whether they are free from all parasites not just phorm.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

look it his official past

http://www.nebuad.com/company/bios/bio_goad.php

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

That could be me.
Answers (assuming I get them) are not due for several more weeks.


Conspiracy theory...

The home Office want ISP's to monitor web-traffic 'in the interests of security'. However the ISP's say they can't or won't do this.
Phorm technology can monitor all web traffic.
Phorm joins up with ISP's and give a cash incentive to the ISP's for the interception of their customers.
The Home Office gets what they want, the ISP gets a cash boost, Phorm makes a tidy profit.
Everyone is happy... well everyone except Joe Public. (Are you still with us Joe?)

Could this be why the ICO and Home Office are refusing to step on BT's toes?
Still think all this Phorm nonsense is just about targeted advertising??

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Bob Dykes was previously on the staff of the Gator Corporation. There's some more about NebuAd in this item.
http://www.dslreports.com/shownews/E...-Service-93375

Lots about Gator, since also called Claria and Gain here
http://www.alanluber.com/pcfearfacto...agatorpage.htm

Gator has/had a long history of install spyware, serving advertising and datamining. They sued a spyware removal website for publishing the removal procedure and forced them to republish an "approved" removal method.
http://www.dslreports.com/shownews/34679

In 2005 Microsoft was found to be considering purchasing the Gator corporation but withdrew.
http://www.benedelman.org/news/063005-1.html

Ben Edelman is a respected researcher on spyware.
http://www.benedelman.org/news/112904-1.html

This is relevant. Apologies for so many links. Both NebuAd and Phorm have long histories and experience in spyware, adware and some of the most offensive installation tactics used.

Can't these people get real jobs like the rest of us?

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Wow that page managed to tickle both Adblock and Noscript!

---------- Post added at 13:47 ---------- Previous post was at 13:45 ----------

Good spot! so they ARE sticking with the scumware tradition then. Sigh.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

From Phorms' press release dated 11th March 2008
"transparent disclosure" <- Oops, they 'forgot' to mention the trials then :) They also made a public statement to the effect that there was no 'undisclosed commercial reason' for the stock price plummet. Possibly technically accurate, but not exactly in the spirit of transparent disclosure is it.

They will only admit to something when they are pinned against the wall. How on earth can they turn around and tell people to trust them?

These people are so ****** up they're almost a parody of themselves. I say almost because parody is funny. Phorm is not.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Wow the more you look at these two companies (phorm, NebuAd) the more alike they are: background, products, business model, PR spin - genuine evil twins!

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Do you have evidence for this?

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Well if we spot an ISP offering this service then it will get the same legla treatment since it is opt-in by default so breaking the Ripa, privacy again like Phorm.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

NebuAd Services Privacy Policy

Information Collection
Our products do not require ISPs to provide us with access to their records regarding end-users’ personal information. NebuAd delivers its services without collecting and using personally identifiable information such as the following:

Email Addresses
Names
Street Addresses
Telephone Numbers
Social Security Numbers ⁄ Social Insurance Numbers
Numbers associated with your health plan insurance or other coverage
Financial information, including credit card numbers, login IDs, passwords, or bank account numbers

While we do not know the identity of these subscribers, NebuAd products do collect and use the following kinds of anonymous information:

Web pages viewed and links clicked on
Web search terms
The amount of time spent at some Web sites
Response to advertisements
System settings, such as the browser used and speed of the connection
ZIP code or postal code

Opt-Out
To opt-out of NebuAd’s information collection and targeted ads, it is necessary to install a cookie on your computer. This cookie identifies that you have opted-out.

If you delete the opt-out cookie, or if you change computers or Web browsers, you will need to opt-out again.


You could be forgiven in thinking they are the same company but with different trading names.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Hmm.. these people are really vague on hard facts when it comes to the business of spying

http://www.clickz.com/showPage.html?page=3628009

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Nebuad looks to be by far the "superior" system if you want accurate targetting information.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NebuAd
It is also live in the US while phorm is still in its trial stages.

If Phorm want to compete I think they'll have to improve the amount of detail they collect.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Looks like we are having a 'Groundhog Day' moment http://www.cableforum.co.uk/board/12...-page-193.html

Probably my fault, sorry :o:

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Perhaps her cabinet members would appreciate some informative e-mails today? Just in case any letters were late arriving. Some of them are bound to be in London with her.

http://ec.europa.eu/commission_barro...cabinet_en.htm

Don't forget to include her PA.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Superior, but the same old antics...
A report from the open net advocacy groups describes the system as a "browser hijack," comparing it with two classic hacker attacks...

http://blog.wired.com/27bstroke6/200...-forges-g.html

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

It stinks don`t it.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Rather than have to find the evil doers, its so much easier if they can "buy" a targetted "campaign" with Phorm. They pick the keywords to be analysed, set up a few channels, then anyone with a profile that causes concern they get a warrant and pull their complete history from the ISP.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

from the article above re nebuad

"Q. In what markets are you strongest?

A. The U.S., but we're in Canada and launching in the U.K.
"

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

ain`t they been stopped over the pond while they get poked about to see what comes out and how legal they aint.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

the NebuAd report was interesting, i wonder when they will start UK Deployments assuming they can get ISP or Co-Location sites (yes you thought we didnt think about that [slightly less effective] option to you ;) ) to Directly peer with the ISPs Internal Networks.

http://www.freepress.net/files/NebuAd_Report.pdf

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

i see people are selling phorm shares again so the price should be dropping again today :) :) :)

and "THEBULLY" has given up trying to bully me

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

I've been following the reports about Nebuad, there were reports early on about user's acquiring cookies when visiting google so it was clear early on that it wasn't entirely passive.


One user mentioned acquiring cookies when he googled from:-

a.faireagle.com
ad.yieldmanager.com
ads.addynamix.com
adtrgt.com
burstnet.com
contextweb.com
doubleclick.net
fastclick.net
nebuad.adjuggler.com
network.realmedia.com
realmedia.com
trafficmp.com



Unlike PageSense, as Nebuad are less sensitive than Phorm about looking at IP addresses, it would only need to occassionally inject script tags into some requests for pages from certain sites, so that it could link the user's current IP address (and the profile built since the last injection) to their unique ID from their faireagle cookie and possibly also to transfer the profile ID to its partner ad-network's cookies.

Only modifying pages from certain sites would allow you to test for and avoid the sort of problems that affected pagesense (such as injected javascript appearing in posts on some forums *).

As most users use major search engines and the searches submitted to search engines provide the most valuable data, Google,Yahoo etc are logical targets.

I'm some what surprised that it actually injects a javasript (if that is what it is doing) as I expected it to simply include multiple script tags (src= the site they want to set/read cookies for) to pass parameters and the cookies and use the response to set cookies but return no actual javascript - the same way as the opt-in works.


EDIT: I also wondered if they might take a temporary hash of your google cookie, so they could identify specific users searches where a connection is shared, and would detect if the IP address has changed hands without needing to inject script tags into every google response.

* actually I'm surprised that Phorm overlooked this pitfall, the same issue affected a couple of firewall products that injected javascript to block certain page content and also a proxomitron script some years before.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

So now you can sleep soundly in your bed tonight :)

And because you're not trying to make a profit off selling peoples private data, with a clear conscience too ....probably :)

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

that looks like a nice list to put into IE to block cookies from :)

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

You're using IE???? :shocked: More holes than a Klingon target!

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Ok, it says they don't collect address - but do collect postcodes.... Narrowing a user down to their STREET!!! Then how hard is it to get house number (Electoral Role) and Phone Number (Emmmm - Phone book maybe?)

Pfffft Who they trynna kid?

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

unfortunatley require it for work (sharepoint etc)

tying it down and have it fairy tight, even ff is not perfect

quick question, one i don't know the answer to, it you block sites with host file, i assume that blocks the cookies as well?

peter

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

OK where are the photoshop experts?

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Pete

Could you please leave instructions here to install Dephormation onto FF3.

Sammy

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

:welcome: to the debate XBNM,
Accountant's, and their password protected websites are Unlawfully ISP/Phorm Intercepted for profit too, so feel free to add your trained eye Observations over the projected No'ers , UK regulations, and what not. ;)

anything from a fresh perspective is always welcome, perhaps you and your other professionals (not to forget those "small businesses" you work with every day)can bring a new line of questions to light.

perhaps they might also join CF and contribute if you inform them!

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Any answer to "fairy tight" would get me banned..

However, I have discovered THIS on my travels, can the honourable members on here please tell me what is good/bad/useful about it?

Many thanks.

Oh, and we have many lurkers, please keep your answers as close to English as you can, the easier the description, the further the spread.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Thanks!!

--Robb Topolski (aka funchords)
Hillsboro, Oregon USA

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

:welcome: Robb!

Excellent report... :)

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Charter, our fourth largest ISP here, days ago announced that it delayed trials of NebuAd in 4 markets. The delay is technical and not as a result of the controversy, they say. (Be careful not to step in the pile of public-relations spin.)

--Robb Topolski

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Great piece bud :D

Now if you know of more folk who can swap info on Phorm and NeBuad Stateside, this would be mutually beneficial - and our ideas and uncovered materials could work together to make our causes stronger.

What you think?

:angel:

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

:clap:

Good work... and welcome to our war... :)

https://www.cableforum.co.uk/images/...2008/08/25.png

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Funchords...not one of them there godanm commie geetarrists is he?

I have a yamaha super flighter sf 700, btw..and welcome to our cause!

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

For Sammy

Google cache of FF3 instructions for Dephormation.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Audio Podcasts are always welcome Alexander, but today Video Podcasts are the far better option for wide coverage.

great for the likes of http://current.com/ coverage and a chance to get the comments played on CurrentTV air segments....

the only real problem is a slight investment in some form of realtime Mpeg2 or Divx/Xvid (they still dont sell cheap AVC VGA/D1) USB Hardware Encoders, attached to the webcam that can stream direct to a VLC file/server.

you can do the smaller QCif/CIF video easy enough with realtime software Encoding at 300Kbit/s for instance.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

These do appear to be twins separated at birth. The Wikileaked Phorm results revealed that Phorm used appended javascript there as well. That was a surprise, as I had understood differently.

One of the reasons that I focused my report on the packet injection and forgery is because Phorm not only did it also, but when they switch to redirects they are going to have to perform an even more complicated series of interception and forgeries.

Packet forgery is the "smoking gun" in the Comcast case, our huge "Network Neutrality" controversy in the USA. Evesdropping and packet forgery strikes at the heart of the sanctitity of private communications and the end-to-end model that makes privacy and security work on the Internet.

If these two companies are linked somehow, what one does, the other will eventually do. If Phorm is going from spoofing the end of a HTTP/TCP conversation to the middle of one, eventually so will NebuAd. It will be seen as an even more severe intrusion onto the integrity of the network link, and hopefully stop it before its tried.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Is this the kind of thing you were looking for?

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Both bad guys hitting the mainstream media in the US (at last)

http://bits.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/0...-your-privacy/

Oh confusing - page is headed June 19 but article dated April 8 - still interesting though.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

This vulnerability apparently also affects Firefox 2 so watch for anything unusual.

http://neowin.net/news/main/08/06/19...-in-firefox-30

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Sweet! (only one face though?) :p:

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

:welcome: Robb and we need to thank you for such a good report on both but Phorm the most since this is the present battle.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

There has to be a link? The technology seems to have forked from a common approach. The Gator and 121 architectures are so similar. The spin is the same. The victims are the same....

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

:welcome: Robb. Excellent report. Good to see you here.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

its pritty useful infact, in effect a hosts file is very much like a phonebook, you want to talk to a website/person you look them up in the Hosts file/phonebook by name.

now your local hosts file, just like your phone book is the very first thing you check, and if you cant find the name there,or dont have one, you use your ISP given DNS server/ring Directory Enquirys.

now instead of always using the ISPs DNS or the DE to find the right No, you make your own local Hosts file/DE that will always be the very first thing your browser uses to lookup and find the No.

for the bad sites, whatever that might be, you dont use the real No. in there, you replace it with a local Ip adress false No instead.

so any time www.badWebsite.com is referenced by any webpage, instead of going to the real webside IP address, it now gets sent to the local IP 127.0.0.1 ,and so cant access any of the content on that bad sites pages ,you are not connecting to it, so it cant send you anything.

as an example of forcing a URL look up to direct to somewere else.

if for instance you have a hosts file with this in it

87.106.129.133 www.cableforum.co.uk

that would work and send your browser to CF, as its the right current IP No.

However if you instead had this IP No. in your hosts file.

91.186.24.166 www.cableforum.co.uk

no matter how many times you tryed it, you would not get to CF but rather www.CableHell.co.uk instead.

the names are the same But the browser now thinks 91.186.24.166 IS CableForum not CH.

just as
127.0.0.1 www.cableforum.co.uk

wouldnt go past the local machine, never mind make it on to your LAN or the wider WAN/ISP

direct IP No.s always override the website name as found in any DNS list, be it the Hosts file or an ISP/3rd party DNS server.

---------- Post added at 18:20 ---------- Previous post was at 18:16 ----------

just a small point Pete, its a capital A in NebuAd

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Florence kicking herself? It's not just Florence LOL, I've nearly broken my left shin having just logged in after 2 days away!

Can I just post an "I agree" type of post? I agree with all but one of the POV posted here recently. I could not credit that anyone can say they have read the whole thread (let alone the whole forum as pointed out was actually claimed).

Now I am, really, no bully. It does not take a bully to express a completely opposing view to what was posted by the antihanff member. I think we would do well to encourage the posting of views that oppose the vast majority of us. It generates debate, and more to the point, debate we will win time and time again, not because of bullying and not because of unacceptable language, but because the facts, when presented well just speak for themselves... :)

Hank

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Try a page refresh, and look back a few posts. I've tried to make it a bid more catchy too...

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

LOL, ;)

NebuAd and Phorm , its just not cricket.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

That is the kind of function creep we will read about in times ahead of us if these evil scums manage to get their feet under the table.

I'm sure others here have considered that Phormscum and NebuBad will be on their bestest behaviour at the moment. The early stages require them to try and slip in under the radar as quietly as possible. They are looking not to raise too much awareness about their infiltration and hopefully not setoff any tripwires (failed already). The aim of the exercise is to creep into the networks with a minimum of fuss and to wave potentially huge wads of cash at their creedy nieve host ISPs bases. They buy off the outer defense perimeter with gifts and promises of great benefits (i.e. buy off the likes of Simon Davies with paid work that will tie his hands, buy off gullible politicians and critical journalist with PR psychology and hospitality sweetners). They do under the table deals with authority, government officials and regulators.

Eventually when Kent Ertugrul has done his best PR psychology lying work and splashed a bit of cash around the hope is that the insidious spying network has got a green light to be installed across the board and all the paperwork has been rubber stamped (we can see that the HomeOffice and Police have already tacitly colluded with BT/Phormscum in allowing this). The next stage is to catch as many victims in the spy-net as possible and this will be achieved through public apathy, public misunderstanding, campaigns of deception in collusion with national media outlets doing their hardest to look the other way, and a process of osmosis.

Eventually once the hard struggle of slowly strangling the opposition has been effective they (Phormscum/NebuBad types) can move up a gear and start altering the system in unopposed way 'we' fear would eventually happen. This is when the dark forces in government will start to look for a bit of payback for helping these filths to get their shiity system through the door in the first place.

If you need an example of how these kind of things are done just go back 15 years and imagine what kind of things were thought up with regards surveillance everywhere. Now we have it 'ALL' ... CCTV, License plate recognition cameras, DNA databases, ID databases (early days) and all the laws and paperwork to harmonise the complete system. So if you don't understand or don't believe in mission creep you only have to look at the evidence of what has been happening regarding this technology abuse over the years. Now add Phorm spying via ISPs, the system is ripe for this kind of abuse to go ahead relatively unchallenged.


Start learning about PGP, Secure Private Networks, SSL/TLS and start telling your friends and family about it too.

;)



Note: Regarding creeping into the networks and what this actually looks like from a analogy point of view - David Attenborough did a fantastic natural history series about "The Private Life of Plants" in one of the episodes Attenborough covered the parasites of the plant world. The Borneo Stranger Fig (a member of the vine family) is a brilliant example of Phormscum on British networks. The Stranger Fig sends out tiny tendrils to search out its victims. Once a victim is found (a healthy tree) the tendril shoots up the tree and thickens out, eventually the Stranger Fig totally embraces the tree with its vine and strangles the tree to death, by this time the Fig is so massive and has put down so many of its own roots that when the dead tree within collapses the Stranger Fig has the structure to stand alone without support. And the life cycle process continues as the Stanger Fig network of vines strangles all the victims in the forest.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strangler_fig [ wiki LINK ]

images of the Phorm parasite Stranger Fig network [ Google image LINKS ]

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

I read things like,

Charter Will Monitor Customers’ Web Surfing to Target Ads

https://www.cableforum.co.uk/images/...2008/07/23.png Mr. Dykes said that the company also examines other information about users’ computers in order to identify when an I.P. address is changed. But he declined to explain what that information is and how it is used. https://www.cableforum.co.uk/images/...2008/07/24.png

And, I thought the best explanation was that an ISP’s DHCP servers would pass on changes of IP address, the other information being the MAC of the modem or similar. If the whole process is bootstrapped using a tracking cookie, then, fundamentally, it’s a cookie tracking system. NebuAd and Mr Dykes are far more opaque than Phorm. I agree that NebuAd are Phorm’s evil twin. Phorm may be wrong, but at least they’re trying. Richard Clayton found them very trying.

Phorm managed to get a test of PageSense up and running without injecting cookies, by seeding the cookies through an advert delivery system. If, once NebuAd have tied an IP address to a particular cookie, the system is passive, I have to wonder at the need to inject packets at all. Could they not seed cookies through their advert delivery system, as Phorm did? NebuAd’s system will notice any IP address change as soon as one of their adverts is requested.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Alexander - on this page: https://nodpi.org/2008/06/18/material-change/

I'm not seeing any content after the banner at the top (I have tried reloading/refreshing - no joy)

Hank

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

With the new law just passed in Sweden, the Swedish authorities have said that anything encrypted will be treated as suspicious. They have one of the top 500 super computers in the world ready for key breaking. Computer power and storage is so immense now that current encryption is nothing for those governments with the money and interest to break it.

And if you send something today they can't decrypt, then most likely they will store it until they can.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Not sure if this been posted as the thread moving quickly again and i cannot keep up.
http://www.fudzilla.com/index.php?op...=7996&Itemid=1

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

It is working fine here, anyone else having the same problem?

Alexander Hanff

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

works here

Bluecar your best friend over at III has something to say and err it must hurt them to say it.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

If that's the case then I'm just the sort of person who would then encrypt everything...even if it's just a shopping list. I'd encourage everyone else to do likewise. I'm a little bloody-minded and can be an awkward so-and-so if irked. Filling the net with encrypted fud would, if nothing else, make me smile when they finally decrypt the email to my mrs asking her to get some milk from the shops on her way home from work:D

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

I don't think anyone should worry too much about super computers trying to break crypto systems. It is far easier for the police to kick a door down and apply the thumb screw technique rather than waste time trying to break an impossible to break cipher. Btw the simplest method to break the private key problem is to break into a vulnerable operating system and plant a trojan, that is far more likely to happen.

BUT and it's a big but... Anyone with nothing to hide should not worry about what super spook agencies like NSA may or may not do. Simple encryption will stop Phorm or casual and organised profilers dead in their tracks. Phorm are looking to parasite an easy problem to crack (plain text with layer 7 DPI)

It would be interesting to hear what thoughts 'Relakks' managing director has to say about these developments.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Working perfect on my Aquiss connection.

A good find looks like the advertising seat is heating up for those who sit inside the ISP network leeching off others.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Oh and just to make things a little bit harder for them i.e. impossible, change your keys regularly, and that way they can spend years of time enjoying themselves trying to break each differently encrypted shopping list and odd postit note :D

Face it, the money they will save in electricy costs alone from the futile decrypto efforts will mean they can station a permament van-Eck monitoring system outside your home. Lookup our old Cambridge Uni friend Ross Anderson for more details.

http://www.cl.cam.ac.uk/~mgk25/ih98-tempest.pdf [ LINK to nice Ross Anderson research paper on van-Eck and Tempest ]

http://jya.com/emr.pdf [ LINK Wim van Eck's research paper ]

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Not sure if I mentioned it before but there was a nice article on lifehacker about encrypting your emails using Thunderbird and PGP

Might come in handy if you'd like to try it out :)

http://lifehacker.com/software/top/h...ail-180878.php

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

I can see a new business opportunity..(feel free to steal it :) )

Get BT to host a nice big computer for you which you can offer as a VPN endpoint practically within BT's network, make sure it has a lot of CPU, RAM and bandwidth.

Sell the service to BT customers who want to ensure their privacy as your machine is the other side of the profilers :D

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

you mean this one ?
http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post...ance-bill.html
"Swedish Parliament passes "Big Brother" surveillance bill (Updated x2)"


it didnt pass, its been sent back apparently.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Now you've done it!

Hear that scratching sound? It's the BT forum watchers taking notes.
That idea will be in a BT powerpoint by monday morning and approved by management that afternoon as a means of screwing the customers both ways.

"BT Broadband. Now with free barrel to bend over!"

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Excuse posting again; minor tweak...

https://www.cableforum.co.uk/images/...2008/06/29.png

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

They made some last minute changes and it was passed:

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/06...den_now_legal/

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Great post thank you BeeVee. Time for all to come from the shadows if only to say you are here. Please.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

I have been one of the lurkers here for several months now. This campaign has got me spitting nails. Have been telling everyone i know about it and even got a reply from David Cameron after asking what he could/would do about it. Finally snapped this morning and cancelled my BB from virgin and going with adsl24 as of next week.
Thanks to everyone who has kept this alive and maybe see a few of you as the BT agm

mantis

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

so if and when the thing goes live and opted in, and i get phished and my bank a/c and id stolen whos fault would it be seeing they claim it`s a anti phishing feature this dpi.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

hi mant1s,nice to see you come out of the shadows, what was your question(s) to david, and what was Cameron's reply?

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

What if the problem turns out to be the profiler leaking your data, I believe Phorm has gifted that to the ISP.

So the ISP would be responsible not Phorm?

Don't forget Steve Gibson should be commenting on Phorm & similar technologies tomorrow.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Still doing the same thing. Closed browser and started a new window. Odd. It loads the top left eyes image, the navigation tabs, the right hand navi (donations button, calendar etc) but nothing in the big white space in the centre (under the "Where will you be on July 16th" banner)

It just hangs with "Waiting for https://nodpi..." in the status bar and the green progress bar hardly moving at all.

This page loads no problem (all the text - absolutely fine - no delay): https://nodpi.org/2008/06/17/
This page does not load the body text at all, just hangs: https://nodpi.org/2008/06/18/

Anyone on BT Broadband not having this issue? Using IE 7.0 browser - Vista.

:(

Alex: Great article on ISPreview :)

All: I got my letter back from the Home Office this week (my MP sent it on to Stephen Timms)

It looks very similar to the one already received by another member here - from the same Baroness Shriti Vadera, Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Business & Competitiveness. Not very reassuring at all and it repeats the Phorm spin...

"Many web pages, including for example search engine results pages, include advertising which may or may not be of interest to the customer. Phorm enables the ISP to replace these advertisements with others that are relevant to the customer's recent web browsing. This potentially means less irrelevant advertisements for the user and better targeting of their advertisements for the advertisers, for which opportunity they would pay their ISP."

(Clearly this is a standard reply as it does not answer the questions I posed in any detail at all)

"[We] can assure you that the Government is committed to ensuring that people's privacy is fully protected."

(By doing sod all when a national telecomms company interecpts their communication without their permission and without a warrant from any courts or legally permitted agency?)

"The ICO has published its view on Phorm on its website and I enclose a copy here."

(version 1.3 18/4/08)

She goes on to say that the HO has advised ISPs on how the use of Phorm might be affected by the RIPA. She says:

"RIPA does not in itself mean that all applications of Phorm necessarily contravene the act."

Now I think I agree on that. Not ALL applications of Phorm would necessarily contravene the act. No - quite right...

Phorm could write some nice little spyware type program which users would have to install. That would not break RIPA would it...

Go back where many think you came from K*nt, back to your "roots" LOL. Then we can all get back to our day jobs and I can finish decorating my house instead of this. Until you do, my house can wait!

NO to interception; interception using Phorm IS illegal under RIPA.

Hank

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Ok something else to look into here - if Phorm is implemented, and you are a victim of a phishing site; Then I am sure that they MUST take FULL responsibility.

Ok guys - Anyone with better legal knowledge regarding this, in regards of which legislations would cover. I would not image the Fraud Act, unless it can be established that Phorm would be part of the Fraud. However, your views on liability in regards of cases where Phorm could be conceivably negligent under the law; and how would this be dealt with under the Act, or relating Acts.

I think this is another part of the preparation we need in place, to provide as much support to the public.

I will look up what I can over the next few days, but laws regarding fraud are not my strong point.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Hank , go grab a Slax LiveCD, Burn and boot that CD on your PC to see if its the OS or a problem with your BT connection.

at least that should give you some clues without need to re-install anything on the HD.

http://www.slax.org/

works for most generic PC hardware using Ethernet iv used, although iv not tryed it on BT kit or NoDPI Https