Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

it may be an idea for more of us to register on iii and other investment forums , iii has a 48 hour period between registering and be able to post so my advice is register now then you can post later if required

let them see just how many of us there is lurking in the wings

peter

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

I was thinking the very same thing.

Colin

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

This was a topic of discussion on Badphorm prior to Jim quite rightly stearing the discussion towards things we can control. I can't see what hacking off small-time investors will achieve. Really the only people who pay any attention to these forums are the small investor. Why not write to the larger investors listed in the register of shareholders for the company?

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Well what a shocking surprise (perhaps not!).

On a press note, I mailed Charles Arthur at the Guardian today to point out the issue with the last piece where they said "second trial" by BT instead of third. He says they had a correction for that pending which I think should be live by now.

I also pointed out the Baroness' comments - he was not aware but I have supplied him with links to the records of the debate on line. I think he'll be watching them a bit more closely.

I still find it very distasteful that Phorm are now able to publish on their website: "Phorm praised in the House of Lords". Praised, not. Misguidedly mis-represented, yes - and only because the Baroness was unfortunate enough to meet the alleged brother of the Times journalist ("Alleged," I said, "only alleged!")

Hank

---------- Post added at 21:14 ---------- Previous post was at 21:11 ----------

Well I did not know of that activity he was involved in but this man does sometimes appear to have just a little too much of an interest in what people do, have done, are doing and he seems to want to know more private information about them than would perhaps normally be considered 'healthy' - don't you think?

Hank

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

fair comment but if you look at the size of most of the trades it seems to be the little guy who is keeping most of this together at the moment, if you look at my posts over there i have not been ranting or hacking off but trying to present a reasoned discussion which some have engaged in, question the business model, point out the legal issues etc

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Bold for my comments...

---------- Post added at 21:22 ---------- Previous post was at 21:18 ----------

All the best, don't be gone too long - keep the meter running. Wonder what you will think before replying to the great Customer to Taxi Driver question: "Been busy?" (Yeah, busy like you wouldn't believe!!)

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

I've been trying to find more info about our Mr Ertugrul with little success apart from the way he seems to be able to raise loads of dosh, start up new companies which then soon disappear.
I might be wrong but f'rinstance Life.com doesn't exist as it was nor, of course, does 121media.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

we look forward to the usual cabbie story of "guess who was in the back of my cab" when you get k*nt and give him a rough ride both verbally and and nipping round corners or having to brake sharp :)

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

I have the right to refuse customers and if Kent got into my cab he would be told to get out immediately. He would probably be using his cell phone to photo my ID and use the law books on the front seat to build a behavioural profile of me.

Alexander Hanff

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

The small upward surge in the stocks is based on MADNESS!!!!!

This is the group making the recommedation:

http://www.britishbulls.com/StockPag...Services&TYP=S

This is the basis of their recommendation:

http://www.candlesticker.com/Cs03.asp

SERIOUSLY, don't laugh so much... this is K*nt's lifeline...

These Loons are propping up the Price!!!

:shocked:

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Sorry did his say offered a choice of OPT OUT and not offered a OPT IN, i am sure they been told it`s OPT IN.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

so the next questions are

where does the money come from?

where does the money go?

why has the investment people not twigged any connection like the above?


as to 121media from iii, under news

04-05-07, 121Media completes reorganisation, becomes unit of Phorm by AFX UK Focus

LONDON (Thomson Financial) - Online advertising firm 121Media Inc has become a wholly-owned subsidiary of newly-formed holding company Phorm Inc following a reorganisation, Phorm said.

Each 121Media share has been converted into a share of Phorm, which began trading on AIM today.

note the date was 04-05-07 not a current news item


about k*nt from march 2005 from http://www.growthcompany.co.uk/aim/f...benjamin.thtml

He has already made his mark in industries as diverse as hamburger bars, online dating, voicemail, and micro-gravity flights for tourists (where he charged up to $11,000 dollars for a thirty-minute thrill ride in a MiG jet). His latest venture, online advertising play 121 Media, floated on AIM in December last year, raising £1.72 million at 245p a share. It is looking to tap into the growing market for online 'contextual advertising'. 'I've always valued a new challenge and, over the years, I have developed a 'why not?' perspective, and there is no reason why this business should not be huge,' explains Ertugrul.

Such a perspective is behind his aim to dramatically increase the two-to-three million people that currently use 121's offering. This is a simple product called 'Pagesense Desktop' that is imbedded in free, popular software programmes (especially file sharing ones) that are downloaded in their droves from the net. Pagesense allows 121 to legally interrogate a users habit and then deliver tailored advertisements on behalf of clients.

does that sound familiar, bury pagesense in a dodgy filesharing app, bury the legal loophole saying you consent somewhere deep in the EULA that no-one ever reads,

hmm, fast forward to present, bury the kit in a dodgy ISP, bury the legal loophole (it's l-l-l-legal honest) as a upgraded privacy clause in the ISP's T's and C's very few people read

anyone see any similarities??

peter

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Ask any marketeer what their understanding of "opt-in" is.

"opt-in" means the tick box says "tick here if you want to receive junk mail"

"opt-out" means the tick box says "tick here if you do not want to receive junk mail"

Now I suspect that someone in BT/Phorm has interpreted the ICOs recommendation to mean that users can be plagued by these interstitian *demands* for consent whenever they delete their cookies so long as the screen says

"Join webwise today, it's fun, free and makes the world a better place, tick here if you agree".

Clicking cancel will opt you out and BT/Phorm hope this satisfies the lawyers.

As a technologist and protocols expert I have to seriously disagree. Opt-in to my mind means a clean connection until I take the action of visiting the BT website and chosing to turn Phorm on.

BT and Phorm to my mind know this is a non-started and are looking, I would imagine, for a compromise which allows them to prove to the ICO that it is "opt-in" whilst actually getting enough customers to make it worth while, i.e. coming up with a fudged definition of opt-in.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

http://www.aboutus.org/CandlesTicker.com

Contact: Ali Ulvi Hicbikmaz

LOL

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

correct me if i am wrong but is it not the profiler that does the cookie checks? if so all traffic has to pass through the profiler and therefore is intercepted whether you accept the new contract or not,

hmm, interesting for those of us who do not intend to accept it, as we will not have given BT permission to do anything different with our traffic i feel some legal letters heading to BT the moment they start messing with traffic

peter

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Have a look at the privacy policy http://www.britishbulls.com/Privacy.asp

They use a firm called Tribalfusion for the pop under ads

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tribal_Fusion_(Ad_Network)

Pop under ads to stop which subvert pop-up blocking software., puts software on people's computers.. hmm now why does that sound familiar.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

I'M STILL HERE.

I just get so angry about how much spin Kent and his mob keep putting on things. He may well think we are becoming less vocal, but I just don't see it like that. I think some of us just feel that there is not much more we can do at the moment and are waiting to see what the ISP's and PHORM do next.

Nearly 15,000 people have kindly taken the time to sign the petition I setup on the PM's website, I would submit that there are more people concerned about this issue than Kent gives credit for, but then it does seem to be in his interests to paint us as a vocal and vociferous minority, and I'm sure if he can get away with it, the next stage will be to try and portray us as a 'lunatic fringe'.

This issue is just so important to me that for the first time in my life I feel strongly enough to consider joining the protest on the 16th July. This might not sound like much, but then I'm just an ordinary bloke (Who happens to work in IT and so understands the impact of this), I've never protested in my life. The thoughts of it even scare me a little, but I don't want to be one of those people who sits on the sofa and complains without at least trying to do something. I've booked the time off work and look forward to getting the details on the protest.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

I'd love to be able to go to the protest, but I've just realised the futility of having a BSc in Microbiology without any lab experience. So I shall probably be flipping burgers in McDonalds or something on the date :(

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Hmm on doing some diggin on Tribalfusion it seems they're linked in with back door trojans, along with their adware/spyware cookies.

http://siteadvisor.hk/sites/tribalfusion.com

Wonder if Kent is calling in favours from his old virus peddling buddies.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Ok, I get a message from my virus software that somone is trying to connect remotely to my PC.

So I check the logs....

I have had over 200 attempts to access my PC, all randomly selected from about 20 IPS*, all trying different ports.

My logs contain a total of 30 attempts IN A YEAR, then over 200 in 4 hours!!! WTF?

Anyone else record anything strange today?

* I've checked the IPs on Ripe, and there are common factors: 1/. about half are within VMs Network 2/. a quarter from Germany 3/. a quarter from the Ukraine

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Ali? You're a pezevenk.

And no I'm not Turkish, but I used to work with a few.:D

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

that was quite tame

http://www.babylon.com/definition/PEZEVENK/English

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Bearing in mind what I could have said in Turkish, yes.:cool:

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Yep, I'm still here, I read every post although the technical details will forever elude me, my skills are not those of IT.

I'm still as choked off about this issue as I was when it first came to my notice in March, and even now I'm astonished and extremely p****d off that BT, my ISP (sorry my ex ISP:)) are still going ahead with it.

I still offer my support to those opposing Phorm/webwise and BTs involvement in it.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Anyone heard any news of the long awaited PIA?

I believe it was expected to be phinished last Friday. Has it phinally been handed to Phorm yet?
I expect if it turns out to be unphavourable that it will be philed away.

Seriously though, the longer it takes the less relevant it is likely to be.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Just a few port scans over the last few days. (On VM). You must be popular! ;)

Have you checked here https://isc.incidents.org/trends.html to see what's hot at the moment?

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

I had the same prolem a couple of weeks ago, when my router detected loads of 'port scans' on all different ports which where all blocked. So I subsequently re-booted my router to get a different IP address and so far no more problems.
They all originated from Shanghai China and was the same IP in all cases.

Colin

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Totally correct but in a nutshell.

If the subscriber chooses nothing, and clicks OK what happens next determines whether it is optout or an optin system IMHO.

If the user does nothing apart from clicking OK and he is still opted out (the status Quo). It is an opt in system.
If the user does nothing and clicks OK and he is automatically opted in.
It must be an Opt Out system.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

More rumour, this received from a trusted friend...

"BT recently asked all their staff from across the whole group (not just BT retail) what they thought of Phorm/Webwise. Not a single person from within BT responded with a positive comment."

Anyone with friends in BT able to confirm?

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Can't say I would be suprised after all thjey will also nmot want the stalking of Phorm on their connection..

I have heard a rumour that it is 90% certain VM will not go Phorm Told my informer if they do now roll out phorm then they are in deep brown stuff. :D

But he agrees we can't ease up on the campaign have to keep pushing or they will retry to stealth it in...

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

I would love to believe it, but I can't see BT leaving themselves hostage to fortune by asking the question in the first place.

Similarly, I can't see them allowing the result to be known if it was asked.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Am I understanding right... that you heard a rumour that there is a 90% chance VM will not roll out webwise, and you told your informer if they roll it out they will be in deep brown stuff?

I must admit, there was talk a while back that VM were going to send letters to all customers about webwise. To date I have received nothing!

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

heard from a vm worker they not happy about it, them and the ones they work with in the support call centre.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

https://www.cableforum.co.uk/images/...2008/08/25.png

Yes, its a bit mischievous. But I thought it was funny. :) Goodnight for now.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

I remind them every week or so that if they turn phorm on, it will get the blame for everything that goes wrong.

It's all coming their way.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Another unconfirmed rumour. I hear that due to adverse publicity, they'll be rebranding again first.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

That is simply brilliant.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

If true, it would be a demonstration of the huge culture clash, when it comes to the ideas of behavioural targeting. The BBC’s Kevin Connolly highlights that it’s not just the notion of privacy that’s different on the other side of the Atlantic. The whole concept of advertising is different too.

The United States of Advertising

https://www.cableforum.co.uk/images/...2008/07/23.png They are a daily reminder of the many ways in which America – superficially so similar to Western Europe – is really profoundly different. https://www.cableforum.co.uk/images/...2008/07/24.png

It’s probably the combination of both of these aspects that explains why Phorm, NebuAd, Front Porch, Adzilla and Kindsight are all American. Ok, Kindsight, formerly Project Rialto, is part of Alcatel-Lucent, so that makes it only half American.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Hi Alex,

Yes I use Internet Explorer v6 & no I will not move to Internet Explorer v7 it stinks, and I don't like Firefox or Opera neither one of them.

Your site is not w3c compliant go to Cynthia Says and run a test on your site, and you will see that your site Faileds the test.

HiSoftware® Cynthia Says™ - Web Content Accessibility Report
Powered by HiSoftware Content Quality Technology. If you have a question about this output please email

Verified File Name: https://nodpi.org
Date and Time: 6/16/2008 7:39:20 PM
Failed Automated Verification

Good look sorting it out, and good look with the new job. ;)

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

I think you missed the part where I said it is just a layup not the final site. The final site will be fully compliant to w3c standards and I will probably use the strict doctype as opposed to the transitional.

So please, I only posted it to give people an idea of how it is going to be layed out, it is not even remotely close to a completed site I haven't even closed the body and html tags in the source, it was an exercise in CSS only; that is why I said it was a sneak preview at the layout.

Ands thanks for the support on the job.

Alexander Hanff

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

lol! That really NEEDS to go live on a website.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Hi Alex,

I tested https://nodpi.org with Cynthia Says not that test site of yours, and as you have seen that it Failed the test.

Good look with it. :)

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

I didn't design that site, it is a standard wordpress template which is why I am currently redesigning it which is taking a great deal of time and effort, that's time and effort on top of -everything- else I am doing. I had an incredibly difficult week last week dealing with multiple things at once, even now I have at least 16 tasks on my task list including the site which all need to be done immediately, so I would really appreciate it if you would get off this wagon you seem to be on criticising me for something I didn't develop.

The wordpress software was used to allow us to put up a site as soon as possible after Chris Williams linked to it in the article he wrote on the protest. This was all extra stuff I needed to do on top of the interviews, on top of the research, on top of the travelling to London, on top of trying to organise the protest, on top of trying to spend time with my son and family, on top of dealing with a serious problem at University in fact the list is endless.

Now I appreciate what you are saying, but criticising me for someone else's work is hardly likely to increase my morale, take some of the weight off my shoulders or illicit a positive response from me. I have given every single day of my life to this campaign since the news came out in February so instead of criticising, a little help would be nice please.

Alexander Hanff

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

>Now I appreciate what you are saying, but criticising me for someone else's work is hardly likely to increase my morale, take some of the weight off my shoulders or illicit a positive response from me. I have given every single day of my life to this campaign since the news came out in February so instead of criticising, a little help would be nice please.

Everyone appreciates the amount of hard work and effort you've contributed to this campaign, Alex. Without you, we wouldn't have got this far.

If you're feeling stressed out and overwhelmed, it's OK to take a break. Have a week off and do nothing but veg. Go to the beach. Lie in the sun. You'll feel refreshed and invigorated when you come back.

The last thing we need is for you to burn out.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Hi Alex,

Right first off I am not criticising you, you have done a great job with the campaign.
I am not on a wagon, as I said I wish you the best of look getting it sorted out, and Alex Stop trying to be Superman, you can only do so much in a day!

Gee Alex as I said Stop trying to be Superman, spend some time with your son and your family.

Sorry but you didn't appreciate what I was saying to you, you are trying to hard to be Superman, get a good night sleep, for goodness sake Alex.

---------- Post added at 02:49 ---------- Previous post was at 02:41 ----------

I agree with you 100%

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Gary, being totally familiar with your postings along very similar lines on the Plusnet Community forums when they were being re-skinned I'd say you are on a wagon.

By all means go after commercial sites if they don't conform to various standards, but expecting sites being run on a voluntary basis by someone who is working for the benefit of all of us every hour available (and more besides) is not on.

You have a choice, either be grateful for whatever Alex provides without nitpicking over things which don't matter, or, if the problems viewing the site with your obsolete hardware and software are such that you can't cope with it - don't visit it!

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

the Fax was basicly a slightly condensed version of the comment on
http://www.theyworkforyou.com/lords/...c=17958#c17958

Monday, June 16, 2008, 4:08:10 PM
Phorm


Dear Popper,
Thanks for your fax. I have received quite a few in a similar vein. I have never received a "Phorm fact sheet" and, as I mentioned, have a number of reservations about them. I will be following up many of the concerns you and others detail.
Yours
Sue Miller
Baroness Miller of Chilthorne Domer
Liberal Democrat Spokesman on Home Affairs
House of Lords
0207 219 6042
07970 411290

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Hi jelv,

I did not appreciate that post of yours one bit, I appreciate everything that Alexander Hanff has done for us!

Ok down to what you sed:

Plusnet Community forums is one thing this is totally different, you have it 100% wrong

First off I am NOT GOING for Alex, Alex made a honest mistake wen Alex said that his site was w3c compliant, and yes I will be going after commercial sites, I have Phorm in my sites.

As I said I am grateful for all that Alex has done for us, as for my equipment is not obsolete, my computer has:
2 Core Processor, plus 2gb RAM
OS: Microsoft Windows XP: Home Edition, Service Pack 2
C Disk: 372 GB total
D Disk: 149 GB total
TFT Monitor 17" with a Screen Resolution of: 1024x768 pixels

Still think that my computer is obsolete?

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Right now ,i feel like my head is going to implode with anger;

Replies from some of the users that are ex telewest say they don't have the cookies,but those that are ex ntl do have the cookies.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Great. Nice one Popper. I think we will have a new and well versed convert on this issue. Shame that she used those words in The Lords though. I have written to Nick Clegg Lib Dem leader and asked how we can get to all their members so they can be given info on the issue. I sent a copy of the fact sheet too. Perhaps we should go to the other leaders too? Hank

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

How often do you clear out cookies?
Is there a date for this being placed on your pc?
Have you visited any of the webwise links in this thread including the one that opts you out of webwise?

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

as a start i aways point them to this most Informed thread ;)

but yes, we could do with a direct line to help inform them as a collective...

perhaps they could setup an open vBulletin were they can then interact, or perhaps better, a subsection of Cable Forum ;)

seeing we are becoming the "industry standard" in all things helpful ,Open and Informing on these DPI Interception For Commercial Profit facts....and related matters.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Just a quick question to the people on the forum here who are doing most of the hard work :)

Has anybody written a letter, or even an article, for 2600 magazine in the states?

They are very privacy and security minded and their latest issue (spring 2008) has a fantastic editorial about how the US and the UK (with its surplus of CCTV cameras) are sleepwalking into an orwellian surveillance society where people are tracked and monitored through various means, 24 hours a day.

When reading the magazine last week, it struck me how these ideas, which 20 years ago were unthinkable, are now pretty much a reality. They make a point in that by introducing these methods under the banner of protection (be it from nasty people phishing for your data, like Phorm, or from other boogeymen, like terrorists) they soften the blow for when they start to actually use these methods for monitoring civilians. It is very much the thin end of the wedge and this whole campaign against Phorm and its adoption by the big three in the UK will be right up there street.

If nobody has written to them about this, I would suggest doing so. The only downside is that your need to be a subscriber to do so and my subscription lapsed last year :(

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

OT but related,Virgin Media are in the news again and Phorm/NebuAd are also mentioned.

its interesting that the BPI boss Geoff Taylor can get his own BBC column when theres no law to say the ISPs need do what they chose to do.

but we End Users cant get the same chance of a column On the BBC to give our (directly Effected Payed For in full, and in advance of use) ,front line Directly Effected View of this ISP/Phorm Intercepted For Commercial Profit scam.

its in effect Wrong for SOME small (3-5%?)% of End users to use P2p torrents for their non commercial potential Piracy needs(cant use Iplayer/use DRM on their machine etc), BUT its perfectly fine for ISPs like Virgin Media and BT to officially sign "Memorandum's Of Intent" /Contracts with Phorm to Commercially Pirate 100% ,each and every End Users Unique datastreams copyright, and each and every visited website Owners Copyrighted Content for Commercial Gain.

http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post...music-biz.html
"
Cash, not idealism, behind ISP embrace of music biz

By Nate Anderson | Published: June 16, 2008 - 08:10AM CT

Virgin Media, one of the UK's largest ISPs, has agreed to forward British music industry nastygrams to subscribers suspected of illegal file-swapping.

The move has proved hugely controversial already, generating charges of "spying on users" and even a BBC column on how Virgin could just go stuff itself into a trash can.

But left undiscussed is the core question of why Virgin is whoring itself out like this; the law doesn't require it, and passing on letters from the British Phonographic Industry (BPI) won't make an ISP more dosh. Or will it?

BPI boss Geoff Taylor got his own BBC column last Friday to respond to all the criticism of the deal, and in it he gave a hint about what exactly is going on.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

There are lots of reasons to hate Virgin over Phorm, but those cookies are not (yet) reason enough.

They're created by Dephormation to indicate to Phorm a wish to opt out. If you see a UID corrupted with a message like "RespectMyPrivacy" you can be sure its not Phorm.

Whether Phorm take any notice is a different question, and whether the Information Commissioner Richard Thomas would assist if you subsequently found you were being profiled is sadly a foregone conclusion.

So, don't panic. But don't rely on Dephormation either. If Virgin roll out Phorm, its time to move to an ISP who respects the basic need for security, privacy and integrity of your communications.

Pete.

---------- Post added at 09:06 ---------- Previous post was at 09:03 ----------

Why not give it a go yourself...? Its vital that everyone gets stuck in to this. If you need help with an article you'll get it.

Pete.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

pete should'nt you also have a "RespectMyCopyright" and "PayMeMyCopyrightFees"

---------- Post added at 10:35 ---------- Previous post was at 09:30 ----------

just a bump to remind people.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

I'M STILL HERE

I may not be contributing at the moment. However, I am following all developments closely and when I feel I can help I will.

Remember - it's the quiet ones you need to watch!

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

and dont forget ,you (the quiet ones ;) )can also send your messages via the central House of Lords fax machine to the Peers that bothered to attend and speak on the "Data Protection" Lords Debate last thursday

http://www.theyworkforyou.com/lords/...8-06-12a.724.5

read the transcript, make your comment there in the thread so we can all see it, and make your points both there and on Fax paper directly.

for a Fax directly to the House, simply right click open, the peers name in the transcript , click "send a message to" and fill in your details and comments to have it sent to the entral House of Lords fax machine....

simple and direct, but try and keep it concise as we dont want to iritate, but rather inform them and show the feelings, perhaps influence amendments in our favour etc.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

I would suggest that the posting on iii is made out of pure arrogance.

'pops up telling you that the system is on, and giving the option to opt out' ... Bring it on.

'Virgin Media and TalkTalk are in full pre-launch preparation mode' ... we shall see!

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

did you find out that info Pete?,
did the FIPR say they didnt know about it, and are still uninvited?.....

i cant see anything about it on the FIPR site,
or the http://www.openrightsgroup.org/ for that matter.


perhaps some of the Lords were asked to attend this meeting.

---------- Post added at 12:20 ---------- Previous post was at 12:04 ----------

Hehe, its amazing what compulsive Gamblers and their bookies will say to try and get the money flowing again.

http://www.iii.co.uk/investment/deta...ail&id=4073466
steadyasshegoes said:
"1. "Absolutely on track" at Phorm's end - reflecting the public 'heat', and understandably, ISPs are taking additional time to make sure they don't screw up - re: security and legality issues.

2. BT expected to launch "probably" within a week... or a few days thereafter.

3. Feeling pretty good on the recent PR trends in favour of Phorm - a positive editorial in last week's Economist, and earlier in the FT, plus a supportive speech in the House of Lords, plus recent supportive conversations with the Information Commissioner. And, a reduction in frequency of anti-Phorm blogging activity.

4. Kent expects the vocal minority to continue to become less and less vocal, and even more so once full service is launched.

5. As we assumed/understood, BT will launch first, with a press release accompanying the first 'interstitial notice' - i.e. the screen that pops up telling you that the system is on, and giving the option to opt out. Full roll-out across its customer base will be in a matter of days or weeks, but not longer. Virgin Media and TalkTalk are in full pre-launch preparation mode.

6. Once BT has launched, other announcements for other countries are expected. Country CEOs being recruited.

7. Publishers still totally on board - including the Guardian (whose journalist has been particularly vocal).

Conclusion: At last, positive newsflow does seem to be in the pipeline. We reiterate our Buy recommedation."

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Found an article I thought might be useful:

http://nakedlaw.typepad.com/naked_la...bad-phorm.html

Doesn't say anything we haven't seen before but it is written by a qualified technology lawyer! :)

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

nice find there Rryles, a qualified technology lawyer is aways good to have onboard.

as is a QC and a few Lords MPs,MEPs etc ;)

do we have any QC "with a view" of all this reading the thread...

please feel free to register if your one of the many guests reading, and make yourself known, your "general View" on these matters would be most welcome here in public.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

I suppose until the next trial starts, how it works and who will participate is all speculation?


After extensive searching I too am unable to find any details of the EU online privacy hearing other than the news article already previously linked to..
http://publications.mediapost.com/in...&art_aid=84603

I imagine that it is a 'closed hearing' as details of the venue are not being disclosed.
As seems to be the norm... it is a US media site that leaks the 'limited' information.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

miss the quote

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

I found out about the meeting here. and had a brief word with friends at FIPR. They told me they were unaware.

I hope they are going to get an invite. I've also recommended in a letter to the EC Commissioners that they should talk to FIPR (or even me) when they visit.

I hadn't thought of ORG... :doh:

I bet they would be interested too.

Pete

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Hi guys I'm still here and attempting to do my li'l bit in raising awareness through satire and parody. I'm really worried about the surveillance society and "database state", praise David Davis and am against anything like Phorm.

My latest piece takes a satirical look across all these issues.
http://www.thespoof.com/news/spoof.c...dline=s1i37079

If you like it, please Digg it up and pass it round to raise awareness of these issues I feel really strongly about.
http://digg.com/political_opinion/Tr...und_up_killers

Mods note I hope you dont mind posting the links. I don't get paid for these and neither does any other writer on the site, I get no reward whatsoever for traffic I'm just trying to raise public awareness.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Thank you for link I read and dugg it :)

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Hee, hee....sorry, still laughing..just got this;

"Hello there,

We’re really proud of our broadband service. And because we want it stay ahead of the competition, we're always looking for ways to make things better. So we'd like to hear your opinions on our latest ideas.

We’ve put together this short survey about a new 'online storage' service we've been considering. We'd appreciate it if you could spend five to ten minutes filling it out to help us find out what you think. We promise to use your answers to help us make it the best it can be.

If you’d like to take part, you’ve got until the 27th of June to fill it out.

To get started, just click below. Thanks for your help!"

ooh..proud of our broadband service.....ha...hah, ooh me ribs...

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Unless they do the online storage using https then it would get phormed when you access it..

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Good point I'll put that in...along with the fact that file transfer will be too slow because of the 24/7 capping, and the fact that I won't be a Virgin customer anyway if they introduce Kreepy Kent's little piece of poison.

I'm going to have fun with this...:D

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

have fun with it we did with the BT one, the comment box was very handy:)

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

it didnt take them long to swing the PR quote did it.

funny how they forgot to provide the http://www.theyworkforyou.com/lords/...c=17958#c17958 links to the debate with its fully Open comments, or include the "poorly equipped for this debate" quote.

but we are making sure they get better equipped with the facts PDQ ;)

we also have quotes from Baroness Miller of Chilthorne Domer,and are sure to get a few more soon ;)

lets see if they also PR those quotes on the Phorm Blog ;)

http://www.chiark.greenend.org.uk/pi...ne/084893.html
James Firth said:
> Baroness Miller of Chilthorne Domer:
>> Mass data collection and retention is not the sole domain of
> government.

>From Phorm's own website:

Phorm praised in the House of Lords
http://blog.phorm.com/?p=22

Baroness Miller, a champion of consumer rights as regards data protection
who has called for tougher penalties for those who mishandle data or commit
data breaches, spoke about Phorm as an authority and expert in the field;
she pointed the Lords to the recent Economist article on Phorm and says we
are a company that is "on the cutting edge of what can protect the
public"...

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

OK I have been doing some more work on the AdWords campaign today and will be making a few changes to existing articles and creating a few new articles on the NoDPI web site to make the site more cohesive with AdWords.

The first article is an update on the petition:

https://nodpi.org/2008/06/17/petition-update/

Alexander Hanff

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Just curious, I wonder if Baroness Miller knows her details are being used to endorse a product on a public web site?

We need to start putting together some catchy slogans for banners that we can use on the 16th July.

As this thread gets a lot </understatement> of posts can I suggest we have a separate thread dedicated to the Protest?

Some slogans for starters (apologies if these have already been posted. If they have let me know and I'll edit for credits).

. Web wise?
.. Web lies
... Web spies
They know *everything* you do online

BT Introduces...
Nineteen Eighty PHORM

Prosecute BT for secret trials !

Why is uk.gov letting this happen?

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Just a little point. I'm not sure the general public will understand the term "uk.gov". That's just my opinion.

I like "Nineteen Eighty PHORM" :)

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

" . Web wise?
.. Web lies
... Web spies"

Cough.:D

But they do get buried quick on here, don't they?:shocked:

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

OT BR, function creep again
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/06/17/eu_pnr_warning/

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Well spotted. Might send them a letter to thank them for looking at this and giving it web space (not they have any commercial interests OC).

Perhaps they will even consider doing some work on it to emphasise their credentials as defenders of the rights of the public (if they are not too busy ...perhaps)

Hank

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Well we need someone since 80/20 can't be relied on to protect the public privacy and privacy international is no help to us. Kent is a typical sales man economical with truth calls in favours from the disreputable and cons those who should know better.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

just informed more people of whats going on, on different forums none IT related places of the e-petition and they started to sign it also links to all the info they need to make a informed choice.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

should that not be

. Web Wise?
.. Web Spies
... BT Lies

Peter

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

found it, back on page 489..theres more somewhere.




---------- Post added at 17:57 ---------- Previous post was at 17:32 ----------

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Just looking at site stats for http://www.DoNotTrustWebwise.org.

Browser Summary section...

1. Firefox, 2. IE... down in 15th place "Kent Ertugrul is a C*nt".

LMAO

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Hey! What a good idea: Added 'Stop Phorm/Webwise Spyware' to my user agent string.

Firefox users, do type: about:config in the address bar and search for 'agent'.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Or, for Firefox users, install the User Agent Switcher add-on

http://chrispederick.com/work/user-agent-switcher/

and you can have multiple UA strings to choose from...

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

https://nodpi.org/events/

Can people let me know if they think I need to add more or come up with any suggestions for changes please.

Alexander Hanff

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

The BT guy I'm working with hasn't got it, but that's not to say such a survey didn't got out. He says many people feel strongly internally about Phorm so I'm guessing if such an email exists then someone would leak it at some point.

Anyone offering?!

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Presumably this is from VM? via email?
Is it for selected customers as I haven't received anything.

What is with this government? Are they never satisfied?

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

intersting comment, i assume the strong feelings are agianst, but for what reason,

1:-see bits of the network being outsource to trusted partners?

2:-put under pressure to provide systems internally that provide income like phorm

3:- being told by trusted partners how to configure the network for them and lower security

peter

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Brown is paranoid

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

I'll ask but I'm almost sure it's an idealistic view as a networks expert like myself that this is such a cludge, at the edge of what the protocols allow (HTTP, cookies), filthy implementation (redirects), additional bottlenecks and points of failure to the network.

It would be interested to know how less technical people in BT feel about it!

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

The page will also end up in lots of strange places. Many Windows applications that embed Internet Explorer to fetch and render HTML content will end up showing the interstitial page. This will happen with Windows Media Player. It could even happen during an attempt to acquire DRM rights. The following are the relevant headers from a sequence of such HTTP requests. Long argument lists have been replaced with an asterisk.

GET /15478/live/reflector:48642.asx?bkup=48685 HTTP/1.1
User-Agent: Windows-Media-Player/11.0.5721.5145
Host: mfile.akamai.com

This is ok. It's a different user agent.

POST /services/WMLicense?* HTTP/1.1
User-Agent: Windows-Media-DRM/11.0.5721.5145
Host: man.channel4.com

This is ok. It's both a different user agent and a POST.

POST /services/WMLicense?* HTTP/1.1
User-Agent: Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 7.0; Windows NT 5.1)
Host: man.channel4.com

This is ok. It's a POST.

GET /player/console/drmConsole.html?* HTTP/1.1
User-Agent: Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 7.0; Windows NT 5.1)
Host: geo.channel4.com

This request might be replaced by the interstitial notice page. While Phorm could code their layer-seven switches to avoid certain instances of this and the sort of problem suggested by oblonsky, there is no general solution. It’s as intractable as avoiding all web-based email.


As well as the interstitial page having the potential to cause problems, the redirection process needed to copy a Webwise UID cookie into other websites’ domains causes a fundamental change in the nature of web browsing. The website that a person is actively trying to reach should be a first-party website, with first-party cookies. After the redirections, it becomes a third-party website, with third-party cookies that may get blocked.

I won’t argue that, on many occasions, Webwise’s trickery will pass off without hitch. However, even with a 99.9% success rate, every one million page redirections would equal one thousand problems.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Hi All, I received the e-mail from Virgin Media (below) a couple of days ago ref. a query about my bill, unfortunately my query was not about my bill, it was about a TV "Smart Card"! However I did take part in the survey and took the opportunity to make them aware of my feelings towards Phorm!

Dave.



Hi, xxxxxxxxxxxx

Thanks for getting in touch with our team recently about the query you had with your Virgin Media bill. We hope that things are now sorted out for you.

In fact, that's what we're writing about. At Virgin Media, we want to make sure we give you the best customer service out there. So we'd really like to find out how things went for you when we dealt with your bill query.

We've put together a few quick questions about how things went, and we'd really appreciate it if you'd take the time to let us know your thoughts. It shouldn't take longer than around one minute to complete.

By finding out exactly how things went for you, we'll be able to understand the things we're getting right, and if there's anything you'd like us to do better. And we promise to use your feedback to make improvements where we can.

If you'd like to take part in our survey, just click the web address below. Or you can simply cut and paste the entire web address into the web address box of your internet browser.


xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Thanks very much in advance for your help.

Yours sincerely,

The whole team at Virgin Media

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

And the web address is?

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

Probably customer specific, maybe containing identifying information, and therefore not to be posted here.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

I have received an e-mail from the author in response to my comment. She promises to get in touch shortly. Will keep you all posted.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

I did not add the Virgin web address as I thought that it was directly linked to my phone call which if you click on it now seems to have been the case!


http://survey.ccsurvey.com/virg0701a...634252554acuyg

Dave.

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

I'd recommend that the best route to the main entrance is from the barbican tube, but go right to the end of Beech street and turn right as per the map. The other routes involve going through the labyrinth.

Is it worth staying until 5?

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 

I've updated the Flyer to include addresses for the House of Commons and BT on the back if you want to print it two-sided. I've also included a few small suggested amendments:
http://www.inphormationdesk.org/Phorm_Flyer.pdf

And I've updated the Factsheet, again with a few small amendments:
http://www.inphormationdesk.org/Phorm_Factsheet.pdf