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-   -   Unstoppable migration? (https://www.cableforum.uk/board/showthread.php?t=33698108)

nomadking 10-03-2016 12:14
Re: Unstoppable migration?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Russ (Post 35825985)
So for Luton, an area with an established high Muslim population does it not make sense to tailor menus to the dietary requirements?



Indeed not verifiable. I didn't say I thought it doesn't happen but why did the German in question not provide verified evidence?
The senior German politician had heard from various sources, so there was no single source.
Quote:
CDU parliamentary group leader, Daniel Günther, bemoaned on Tuesday that an increasing number of canteens, nurseries and schools are removing pork from their menu due to religious considerations.
...
Günther told local German newspaper "Lübecker Nachrichten" that at least one nursery in every voting district had stopped serving pork after taking Muslim children into consideration.
Are the areas that have "banned" pork only serving vegan food? That would be the only real solution for them, as if they were merely catering for Muslim children other foods such as non-Halal Chicken also would be banned. The exemption for Halal Slaughter is based on the requirements of those CONSUMING it
Quote:
There are currently around 2,000 SUBWAY® stores in the UK and Ireland, 202 of which are Halal stores selling only certified Halal meats
Note ONLY, not ALSO. If they insist on only serving Halal, they can start up their own Halal only store. Places like Subway are for those visiting the area, eg working or shopping, and NOT usually for those just residing in the area. How many branches are in the middle of housing estates and nowhere near shopping areas or places of work?

Russ 10-03-2016 12:42
Re: Unstoppable migration?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by nomadking (Post 35825993)
The senior German politician had heard from various sources, so there was no single source.
Which make zero difference to the fact he made an emotive statement without any evidence

Quote:
Are the areas that have "banned" pork only serving vegan food? That would be the only real solution for them, as if they were merely catering for Muslim children other foods such as non-Halal Chicken also would be banned. The exemption for Halal Slaughter is based on the requirements of those CONSUMING it
'Banned' or 'removed' it?

Quote:
Note ONLY, not ALSO. If they insist on only serving Halal, they can start up their own Halal only store. Places like Subway are for those visiting the area, eg working or shopping, and NOT usually for those just residing in the area.
You're now deciding who Subway's customers are?

They like any other company have to make location-based business decisions. If the majority of customers in their areas like their food a certain way then they'd be stupid to ignore that, thereby likely losing trade, just so they can make a public statement.

What they won't do is make certain outlets halal-only "in case it offends Muslims" and thereby drive away customers who object to that.

---------- Post added at 13:42 ---------- Previous post was at 13:40 ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by nomadking (Post 35825993)
How many branches are in the middle of housing estates and nowhere near shopping areas or places of work?
I have no idea, do you?

Osem 10-03-2016 13:44
Re: Unstoppable migration?
 
Quote:
German Chancellor Angela Merkel has blamed European nations for "unilaterally" shutting the Balkan route for migrants.

She said this had put Greece in a "very difficult situation" and such decisions should be taken by the whole of the EU.


Austria, Slovenia, Croatia, and non-EU members Serbia and Macedonia have all acted to stem the migrant flow.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-35772206

Is there no end to Merkel's arrogance and hypocrisy?

I seem to recall a certain German leader unilaterally welcoming a tidal wave of migrants into Europe not that long ago. Where was all that 'unity' then?

I think what we're seeing here is the inevitable result of a leader being in power too long and believing they're infallible.

heero_yuy 10-03-2016 14:32
Re: Unstoppable migration?
 
Reminder to invest in shares in razor wire companies. Demand is sure to be heavy. :D

nomadking 10-03-2016 16:25
Re: Unstoppable migration?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Russ (Post 35826000)
Which make zero difference to the fact he made an emotive statement without any evidence



'Banned' or 'removed' it?



You're now deciding who Subway's customers are?

They like any other company have to make location-based business decisions. If the majority of customers in their areas like their food a certain way then they'd be stupid to ignore that, thereby likely losing trade, just so they can make a public statement.

What they won't do is make certain outlets halal-only "in case it offends Muslims" and thereby drive away customers who object to that.

---------- Post added at 13:42 ---------- Previous post was at 13:40 ----------



I have no idea, do you?
He had been given evidence by others, just not in a publishable form. He is the parliamentary group leader of the CDU, which is Merkel's party.

I suppose you think it that's just chance that pork has been removed from ALL meal options. Especially as the menu changes every few months. If their argument is that it reduces costs, then that explicitly says that it is a deliberate ban. Not only that, the non-pork meat has to be Halal or there is no cost savings and you might as well include pork anyway. Any special arrangements that would have to be made for pork would also have to be made for non-Halal chicken. The excuse given is a COMPLETE AND UTTER LIE.

Are all or even most of VISITORS(ie workers or shoppers) to an area, Muslim. Highly unlikely. Even if they are, they are unlikely to go to a Subway, Halal or otherwise. It is the franchisee insisting on it being Halal, IRRESPECTIVE of who the actual customers are. IT IS NOT the company making the decision.

The point is that there will be NO branches of Subway in a purely residential area. Therefore whatever the demographics of the area, it is immaterial, as the residents are NOT the potential customers.

The exemptions in law regarding animal slaughter are meant to be there because of the beliefs of the CONSUMERS. If it used as a production method for consumers that are non-Halal and non-Kosher, then having the law in the first place is meaningless, as ALL animal slaughter could use the Halal/Kosher method without the religious part.

Chris 11-03-2016 00:14
Re: Unstoppable migration?
 
In fact, it is illegal to sell halal food to anyone whose religious belief does not require it. That law has been flaunted in the UK for years, yet it is still the law. If Subway is operating halal stores, then they are - or should be - for Muslims only.

nomadking 11-03-2016 00:25
Re: Unstoppable migration?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris (Post 35826153)
In fact, it is illegal to sell halal food to anyone whose religious belief does not require it. That law has been flaunted in the UK for years, yet it is still the law. If Subway is operating halal stores, then they are - or should be - for Muslims only.
Didn't realise that. Was suspicious that it wasn't true.
Government Link
Quote:
You must meet all of the following requirements for halal and kosher religious slaughter:
  • it must take place in a slaughterhouse (abattoir) approved by the Food Standards Agency (FSA)
  • it must be done by someone who has a certificate of competence (CoC)
  • the slaughter must be done in a way that follows Jewish or Islamic religious practice
  • the meat must be intended for consumption by Jews or Muslims
Surprised the Animal Welfare Lobby doesn't kick up a big fuss about it.

Osem 11-03-2016 08:19
Re: Unstoppable migration?
 
I was listening to BBC World Service this morning and they interviewed a number of migrants in Greece about the current situation and the new and illegal EU 'plan' to send people back to Turkey. Surprise, surprise, one migrant spokesman said that people would commit suicide or throw themselves off the boats if that were to happen. Already, those groups who're not included in the 'acceptable refugee' category are taking matters into their own hands and disappearing off to take their chances elsewhere. Who on Earth seriously expects anyone to hang around waiting for months in abject conditions for the EU to remove them back to Turkey? What's Tusk going to do about that I wonder? The ineptitude is staggering and it's perfectly clear that the EU has no credible plan. As always they've been slow to react and disunited in both policy and action. Europe has consequently been presented with a migration flood which is irreversible and that's without the impending threat from countless thousands more migrants rapidly building up in North Africa. There's no plan to deal with that either so anyone wondering whether to stay in the EU or not ought to take on board the reality that sooner or later EU members are going to have to absorb huge numbers of migrants. Regardless of any 'agreements', the UK will be pressured to take its 'fair' share regardless of any problems we have dealing with existing asylum claims, unsustainable immigration levels and rapid population growth.

figgyburn 11-03-2016 11:21
Re: Unstoppable migration?
 
The human rights lawyers will be all over this latest proposal like flies round s****.As has been stated on before on this thread they cannot control this tidal wave of people.This is going to be the picture at all border points in the eu(and possibly Calais)for the forseeable future.
http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2016/...6861578423.jpg

Russ 12-03-2016 06:26
Re: Unstoppable migration?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by nomadking (Post 35826038)
He had been given evidence by others, just not in a publishable form. He is the parliamentary group leader of the CDU, which is Merkel's party.
So it's entirely possible that without citing verifiable examples he could be lying or exaggerating?

Don't you think something as emotive as that ought to be demonstrated as true?

---------- Post added at 07:26 ---------- Previous post was at 07:23 ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris (Post 35826153)
In fact, it is illegal to sell halal food to anyone whose religious belief does not require it. That law has been flaunted in the UK for years, yet it is still the law. If Subway is operating halal stores, then they are - or should be - for Muslims only.
Where does the law say it's just for Muslims? None of the examples I can find state it's for them only.

TheDaddy 12-03-2016 07:36
Re: Unstoppable migration?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Russ (Post 35826374)
Where does the law say it's just for Muslims? None of the examples I can find state it's for them only.
Try the post under chris'

nomadking 12-03-2016 09:12
Re: Unstoppable migration?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Russ (Post 35826374)
So it's entirely possible that without citing verifiable examples he could be lying or exaggerating?

Don't you think something as emotive as that ought to be demonstrated as true?

---------- Post added at 07:26 ---------- Previous post was at 07:23 ----------



Where does the law say it's just for Muslims? None of the examples I can find state it's for them only.
How can you prove what several people have said to you in conversations?

There are numerous PROVEN examples in this country, so doesn't that tend to suggest that his comments could be true.

Russ 12-03-2016 09:34
Re: Unstoppable migration?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheDaddy (Post 35826380)
Try the post under chris'
Quote:
the meat must be intended for consumption by Jews or Muslims
Doesn't say 'only'.

---------- Post added at 10:34 ---------- Previous post was at 10:33 ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by nomadking (Post 35826391)
How can you prove what several people have said to you in conversations?
So if enough people tell you something you believe it?

Quote:
Originally Posted by nomadking (Post 35826391)
There are numerous PROVEN examples in this country, so doesn't that tend to suggest that his comments could be true.
Could be, but he's referring to his own country.

nomadking 12-03-2016 10:22
Re: Unstoppable migration?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Russ (Post 35826399)
Doesn't say 'only'.

---------- Post added at 10:34 ---------- Previous post was at 10:33 ----------



So if enough people tell you something you believe it?



Could be, but he's referring to his own country.
House of Commons Research briefing SN07108 on "Religious Slaughter of Animals".
Quote:
As regards religious slaughter, the Government has decided that in implementing the new
EU regulations it will:35
 Retain existing national rules in relation to religious slaughter [these provide greater protection than the EU Regulation].36 These rules limit slaughter without prior stunning to the slaughter of bovine animals, sheep, goats and birds by a Jew for the food of Jews or by a Muslim for the food of Muslims.
Hansard record of House of Commons debate
Quote:
The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs (George Eustice):
I will pick up on some of the issues that other hon. Members have raised. First, however, I will underline the Government’s position today, which builds on the long-standing position we have adopted in this country. Our position is that we would prefer that all animals are stunned before slaughter, but we recognise and respect the needs of religious communities, so we have always maintained this limited exemption, which is to be used only for meat produced for Jewish and Muslim communities.
There's your "ONLY".

Each individual incident is unlikely to be reported individually. It may not be explicit in nature, just a matter of pork mysteriously disappearing from menus, rather than a statement saying "pork has been banned" or as with Islington Council they could just LIE.

Osem 14-03-2016 08:34
Re: Unstoppable migration?
 
Looks like things are hotting up for Merkel:

Quote:
The party of German Chancellor Angela Merkel has suffered defeats in two of three states holding regional elections, exit polls suggest.

They indicate the Christian Democrats lost support in Baden-Wuerttemberg and Rhineland Palatinate, but remain the largest party in Saxony-Anhalt.

The anti-migrant AfD achieved gains in all three states, exit polls indicate.

The elections were seen as a test of support for Chancellor Merkel's policy of accommodating refugees.

More than a million migrants and refugees entered Germany in 2015.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-35796831

If she carries on with this madness the long term ramifications will be very serious indeed.


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