Re: Brexit
 

I was talking about her position being untenable and resigning, but she’s been at this stage like, forever.

Re: Brexit
 

Somehow I can't see that happening.

Re: Brexit
 

Think most of us are glad if its the end of Old Mother Hubbard's crappy deal (for different reasons ;) )

Think Bercow is off her Xmas card list....

Re: Brexit
 

Is Bercow trying to frustrate brexit ?

Re: Brexit
 

I do enjoy a good constitutional crisis.

Re: Brexit
 

Have you only just noticed?:D

---------- Post added at 17:10 ---------- Previous post was at 17:09 ----------

He's most likely off the honours list as well, and if so will be the first speaker in generations not to automatically get a peerage upon retirement.

Re: Brexit
 

Re: Brexit
 

ERG seem happy.

Re: Brexit
 

Their calculation is that the EU won't grant an extension unless there's some prospect of a deal emerging that parliament will back. Any further signs of intransigence in parliament feeds into that view. They may also be calculating that there is a point at which Teresa May will go for No Deal in preference to a drawn out process that sooner or later is going to end in either a referendum, or a general election, or both.

I'm not certain they're thinking straight, but I'm by no means certain anybody is. Bercow, for all his supposed impartiality, clearly thinks that he's assisting the EU in granting a long extension in order to allow a totally different, softer, Brexit to be negotiated. He's dispensed with convention often enough over the last month, it simply isn't credible for him to start using it as an excuse for blocking Government business now, especially on an issue as important as this.

Re: Brexit
 

No, that's the ERG. :D

Re: Brexit
 

How the hell is he allowed to do this?

Re: Brexit
 

It wouldn't be the first time they've miscalculated..Question is what does May do now.

Re: Brexit
 

Because he’s following the rules...


https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-47614074 Loved (?) The Solicitor-General’s comment How would the EU do that, then - mind-reading?

Re: Brexit
 

To be honest I think he is on firmer ground in denying the government the ability to keep having MPs vote on the bill but as Chris has said it's hardly as if he has stuck with convention throughout this process.

Re: Brexit
 

The Speaker of the House of Commons is a bloody powerful individual, it's just that circumstances are rarely so dire as to give the one who holds the office the opportunity to make maximum mischief. Much of what he can do rests on convention rather than statute but the problem there is that just about everything the Commons does is based on convention, and the Speaker is the final arbiter of how convention applies. There is no way to appeal any decision he makes. So if you are saddled with a Speaker who is prepared to pick and choose which conventions he will uphold, there's very little that can be done, short of having Her Maj send him to the Tower to relieve his shoulders of the burden of supporting his enormous head.

Re: Brexit
 

Only when it suits him, the rest of the time he's ignoring them and doing his own thing.

Re: Brexit
 

Well they can vote to unseat him can't they? It's just the Government know they'll lose the vote since the rest of the Parliament is loving it.

Re: Brexit
 

Let's hope that she does just that

Re: Brexit
 

Yes, the weakness of May's government is ultimately what has allowed Bercow to slip his leash. Their only power over him is to deny him a peerage, and I won't be surprised if he's been quietly warned about that already. But if he has been so warned, it doesn't seem to have worked.

Re: Brexit
 

Maybe there's some 400 year old law that can be used to finish him off?
I just can't believe he's playing these games at such an important time in the country's history.

Re: Brexit
 

One could argue it’s the Prime Minister playing games. She knows Parliamentary procedure.

We did want our sovereignty back after all.

Re: Brexit
 

Well, a future government of a different party could still award him a peerage, so not much of a threat...

---------- Post added at 17:45 ---------- Previous post was at 17:44 ----------

Unlike the ERG and the DUP?

Re: Brexit
 

Since when did DUP, ERG chair the Commons or use procedural conventions when it suits ?

Re: Brexit
 

I didn’t say they had.

Re: Brexit
 

I read it as your suggesting that the DUP and ERG are playing games too. ;)

---------- Post added at 18:15 ---------- Previous post was at 18:12 ----------

Unbelievable! Looks like the UK wants the EU to solve every constitutional hiccup it encounters. Not sure if this fully ticks the box of "taking back control". ;)

Re: Brexit
 

Clue, they can’t because they are not the chair and neither have they playing games!

Re: Brexit
 

I think the fact that the Speaker had to remind the Government of the correct Parliamentary procedure just show how past its sell by date it had become.

We have come to a point where we are governed by self-serving idiots with an opposition made up of, well, just idiots.

The political landscape is wide open for a new, centrist, social democratic party led by someone with (some) charisma and no baggage. Pity no such person exists :(

Even if we had such a new party, I doubt if the electorate has the imagination to vote it into power ..

Re: Brexit
 

yes she could of course resign cant see her doing it though

Re: Brexit
 

She won't resign Dave l can assure you.

Re: Brexit
 

Can I formally nominate that to be the Cable Forum quote of the year? :D

Re: Brexit
 

That said in theory few in Parliament should be upset by this since it was rejected pretty strongly, the MPs now complaining about having voted it down last time on the assumption it could be brought back are idiots.

Re: Brexit
 

I think that the Palace of Westminster should be renamed Fawlty Towers :D

Re: Brexit
 

They’re also admitting quite openly to be playing games with the country that would benefit from certainty.

Re: Brexit
 

It's shown them up for what they are and proves Hugh's point in #8822 spot on!

Re: Brexit
 

The chances of a no deal Brexit seem to have shot up.

Re: Brexit
 

I wouldn’t say so. Parliament has ruled it out, May doesn’t want the blame for it and has royal prerogative to extend if she wishes. It’d wind up in the courts, but she’d be on reasonably steady ground. In as far as such a thing exists.

Re: Brexit
 

The way things stand, we are no longer in the EU from 29 March. That is the existing law. And without the EU's agreement to an extension (we've not even made a case for it yet, let alone have it considered), we crash out on that date.

I see no sign yet of an Act of Parliament to change UK law on the matter, so I wouldn't be so sure.

Why do you think Jacob Rees-Mogg has that smug expression on his face?

9 working days to go and counting.....

Re: Brexit
 

Because he's a simple deluded fool ?

Re: Brexit
 

Nope. EU makes a tiny concession, final vote, May loses it, A50 extension enacted, election, BoJo in power.

Re: Brexit
 

Theresa May (arguably) doesn’t have to get an Act of Parliament to change the date. International treaties are the perogative of the Government. It’d be an argument in court, but enough time would pass that we de facto extend, if not de jure. Enough time for her, and the EU, to find a solution.

Re: Brexit
 

He's made £7m since Brexit vote. I would be grinning like that for just a fraction of his good fortune.

Re: Brexit
 

In fact, it transpires that the EU Withdrawal Act contains within it the provisions to extend the 29 March leaving date. The date can be extended by a Minister presenting a statutory instrument before Parliament. It’s a relatively straightforward procedure. Only the government can do it, mind - for parliament itself to change the date would require primary legislation to amend the Act.

Re: Brexit
 

In view of the tight spot TM is in, and the prospect of never getting her
withdrawal agreement accepted by the House, she could ask the EU to agree to a protection period as we crash out of the EU and prorogue Parliament immediately, resuming on 1 April (good date!) to enact the necessary legislation to come into effect at the end of the protection period.

Annoying for some.... :D

Re: Brexit
 

How did that go unnoticed. :erm:

Re: Brexit
 

My predictions:
An extension is happening, come what may.
A second referendum won't ever happen.
No deal won't ever happen.
If Brexit occurs, which I think it will, we will keep close to or in the single market and customs union. No politician let alone the ERG will tell you this but that's what Parliament wants but by the time the negotiations are concluded, the current set of politicians won't be driving things.

Re: Brexit
 

Clue, I count calling a motion of "no confidence" for TM, and having their own "Star Chamber" of lawyers as playing games.

Re: Brexit
 

It would need approval by both Houses of Parliament, however it would be voted upon on a yea or nay basis. It couldn’t be amended in any way.

Re: Brexit Discussion (New thread-Follow First Post Rules!)
 

Thought I'd have a quick look back on the first couple of pages of this thread to see what we were all talking about back in Summer 2018 given that today marks another milestone in the process. These three quotes, each anonymised to protect the innocent, stood out for me.

Re: Brexit
 

May...

'This Is a Large Crisis'. A large crisis requires a large plan. Get me two pencils and a pair of underpants.”

We need a Lord Flashheart type to sort this mess out. WOOOOFF!!

Re: Brexit
 

Indeed, but it still needs agreement from the EU27 and much like Speaker Berclown threw his oar in today, the EU27 might want to see a bit more of a discernible difference of what is on offer. The deal, as they so strongly assert, is non-negotiable. So as Parliament keep voting it down (and if they do a third time) why would the EU be inclined to extend, i suppose an extra 3 months would help prepare for no deal.

We are at an impasse. Parliament don’t want the deal, EU wont change the deal.

Re: Brexit
 

Not Liechtenstein! What next - Vatican City?

Sometimes it hard to tell the parody accounts from the real ones...

Liechtenstein - population 28k (slightly more than the Leeds Council ward I live in)
Iceland - population 340k (slightly more than the population of Wakefield)

(btw, the Norway/Iceland deal is a roll-over/continuation of the deal the EU negotiated, so well done for what, exactly? Getting what we had before?).

Re: Brexit
 

When do we get the unicorn?

Re: Brexit
 

No, because he is at least £7 million to the better since Brexit day thanks to his Dublin based investment funds.

Re: Brexit
 

Snap! :D

Re: Brexit
 

Not to defend him or anything but the numbers of him making £7 million are a bit dubious.

Re: Brexit
 

If something's dubious, it should be called out. And you've done so in this thread and recently in the global-warming thread and doubtless many others.

But in this case, the calculations come from the renowned Channel 4 Dispatches Team. And thanks to UK disclosure rules, the original documents can be viewed easily and at no cost.
https://www.channel4.com/press/news/...ndum-according
https://beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/c...filing-history

Re: Brexit
 

The company itself doesn't really have investments(less than £50,000). It advises and manages investments for OTHERS. It's income comes from fees, and as such regardless of the outcome(profit or loss) of their investment advice or management, they earn fees. If any of their advice yields a profit, then the only real outcome is an increase in their reputation.

Re: Brexit
 

So, no matter if the client wins or loses, they make money...

He still made £7 million.

Re: Brexit
 

The insinuation was that he has profited from uncertainty, or that he profited from investing in the EU, or both. The first is incorrect and the second is irrelevant. JRM has never called for sanctions against the EU, he has simply argued that the UK is better off not being a member of it.

But he went to a public school and talks posh so he’s a soft target for straw man arguments like this.

Re: Brexit
 

The 1st is not incorrect at all, as the pound has fallen in value since the referendum, and as SCM is a heavy investor in developing markets. this will have helped profits increase (for obvious reasons)

He's a soft target because he's a nasty piece of work.. his voting record on things such as benefit increases pays homage to this

oh, and this

https://www.theguardian.com/politics...acob-rees-mogg

Re: Brexit
 

Aren't they usually 2 and 20 ie 2% fund management and 20% of any gains?

---------- Post added at 08:10 ---------- Previous post was at 08:09 ----------

Wrong, we're explaining why he's happy.

Re: Brexit
 

I don’t because it isn’t. So stop it with this silly argument.

---------- Post added at 08:21 ---------- Previous post was at 08:16 ----------

You haven’t explained anything of the sort and Chris isn’t wrong actually, this is a strawman argument. Time to move on with the immature and pathetic character assassinations just because they are Brexiteers. :rolleyes:

Re: Brexit
 

Just got my new passport delivered - excellent service, 8 working days from application to delivery.

Re: Brexit
 

That's because no one wants to leave the uk so passport offices have nothing to do.

Re: Brexit
 

I gave an instruction earlier to get back on topic / move on. So why I have just had to delete two posts going on about him after my request ?

How JRM legitimately earned his millions is not the topic.


There seem to be issues posting in this thread. I’m putting it down to it’s sheer size and posts. Posting in other threads seems fine. So I’m closing this one now, I have started another.