Cable Forum - Virgin Salespeople with Criminal Records

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- - Virgin Salespeople with Criminal Records (https://www.cableforum.uk/board/showthread.php?t=33643157)

Amon	24-12-2008 23:40

Re: Virgin Salespeople with Criminal Records

Quote:

Originally Posted by rogermevans (Post 34703735)

apart from the fact a CRB wouldn have helped there as he wasnt on the register till after that court case

the main problem there was some one silly enough to leave a child with some one they dont know on their own CRBs wont help these people as there are more child sex ofenders not recorded than there are out there

Well here's the thing. This quote from the article below:

Quote:

She said his family had been threatened because of the publicity the case had attracted.

This did make national news. It was everywhere and in all the papers. The same thing being discussed here was discussed by people back then, the fact that checks should have been made. What's not reported in the article I posted was that he was already on the Sex offenders register because he'd done something similar before, twice. The whole debate came up about how many Sex offenders were working in Jobs like that but not just Sex offenders but other types of offenders.

After that happened it all seemed to go quiet. British Gas apologised etc and it was like a media blackout on the reporting of whether companies like that do crminal checks on people who apply for a Job.

There'd be no reason for me to make this up as others remember it also and the news coverage.

Personally I believe this was a major problem that companies weren't following procedures and we had criminals abound, especially sex offenders, working in Jobs where they went in to the homes of Joe public.

I remember The Sun, The Daily Mail and The News Of the World being particularly vocal about it and the whole Sarah's Law issue popped up again because of this idiot meter reader and what he had done.

I believe a CRB check would have shown his previous history. Maybe a CRB check was done and that's why it became the scandal it became.

caph	25-12-2008 00:06

Re: Virgin Salespeople with Criminal Records

Quote:

Originally Posted by rogermevans (Post 34703758)

the line has been draw have a look at above CRB links or here

Not by Virgin apparently. I believe that's the entire point of this thread.

rogerdraig

25-12-2008 00:26

Re: Virgin Salespeople with Criminal Records

Quote:

Originally Posted by caph (Post 34703870)

Not by Virgin apparently. I believe that's the entire point of this thread.

you seem to miss my point the line is these people should not be CRBed they are not looking after children or vulnerable adults

Virgin can check their staff by other methods

to many seem to think the CRB is the answer to everything it is not and should not be

Russ	25-12-2008 00:27

Re: Virgin Salespeople with Criminal Records

Quote:

Originally Posted by rogermevans (Post 34703886)

you seem to miss my point the line is these people should not be CRBed they are not looking after children or vulnerable adults

If my understanding is correct the CRB is for those who are likely to come in to contact with the vunerable as part of their job, not just looking after them.

rogerdraig

25-12-2008 00:31

Re: Virgin Salespeople with Criminal Records

Quote:

Originally Posted by Amon (Post 34703837)

Well here's the thing. This quote from the article below:

This did make national news. It was everywhere and in all the papers. The same thing being discussed here was discussed by people back then, the fact that checks should have been made. What's not reported in the article I posted was that he was already on the Sex offenders register because he'd done something similar before, twice. The whole debate came up about how many Sex offenders were working in Jobs like that but not just Sex offenders but other types of offenders.

After that happened it all seemed to go quiet. British Gas apologised etc and it was like a media blackout on the reporting of whether companies like that do crminal checks on people who apply for a Job.

There'd be no reason for me to make this up as others remember it also and the news coverage.

Personally I believe this was a major problem that companies weren't following procedures and we had criminals abound, especially sex offenders, working in Jobs where they went in to the homes of Joe public.

I remember The Sun, The Daily Mail and The News Of the World being particularly vocal about it and the whole Sarah's Law issue popped up again because of this idiot meter reader and what he had done.

I believe a CRB check would have shown his previous history. Maybe a CRB check was done and that's why it became the scandal it became.

did not mean to imply you made it up at all just wanted to see what they had said about checks as i doubt any informed government or police person would have been suggesting they had to CRB these type of people

---------- Post added at 00:31 ---------- Previous post was at 00:29 ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Russ B (Post 34703888)

If my understanding is correct the CRB is for those who are likely to come in to contact with the vunerable as part of their job, not just looking after them.

no just seeing kids is not a reason to have this done see#

http://www.crb.gov.uk/Default.aspx?page=308

http://www.crb.gov.uk/Default.aspx?page=310

and

http://www.volunteering.org.uk/Resou...on/whencrb.htm

caph	25-12-2008 01:49

Re: Virgin Salespeople with Criminal Records

Quote:

Originally Posted by rogermevans (Post 34703886)

Just to clarify, in relation to Virgin not vetting people with a criminal record you stated "the line has been draw have a look at above CRB links". The OP asserts that this is incorrect, Virgin have not drawn a line. Whether this is true or not I don't know, it's just the OP's word.

Also you have stated that I missed your point "these people should not be CRBed". The point you contradicted me on was that Virgin had drawn a line, not that these people should not be CRBed. If you reread your comment you'll see that you never mentioned "these people should not be CRBed".

As for the people being CRBed or not being CRBed. As I stated previously I would not be happy with someone with a recent conviction for unprovoked violence cold calling my home. Do seriously think that this is out of order??? Whether this involves a CRB or not, I don't care, I just don't want someone with a recent history of unprovoked violence visiting me in my own home with the intention of trying to get me to buy something from him. Your obsession with CRB is entirely irrelevant to me.

rogerdraig

25-12-2008 02:09

Re: Virgin Salespeople with Criminal Records

the line i refer to is the one drawn by the law on this which if you read the links you will see

if you want people checked for convictions other than just asking them then the crb systemn is all there is in England and Wales. Scotland has a slightly diferent method

in fact the employer could be breaking the law in insisting these are done

see

http://www.paull-williamsons.co.uk/s...r_Employee.pdf

people seem to be expecting too much out of the system in what checks they think can be done on people looking for employment in these fields

if you are worried about them going into your house then don't let them in

caph	25-12-2008 11:32

Re: Virgin Salespeople with Criminal Records

Quote:

Originally Posted by rogermevans (Post 34703913)

the line i refer to is the one drawn by the law on this which if you read the links you will see

Quote:

Originally Posted by rogermevans (Post 34703913)

if you are worried about them going into your house then don't let them in

Virgin are not drawing a line so you have no way of knowing whether or not you should let them in to your house. Again, the is the entire point of this thread.

rogerdraig

25-12-2008 12:10

Re: Virgin Salespeople with Criminal Records

Quote:

Originally Posted by caph (Post 34703999)

The entire point of this thread is that _Virgin_ have not drawn a line on this. Why do keep repeating that some other body has drawn a line. I don't disagree but it is irrelevent because we are talking about Virgin drawing a line.

Virgin are not drawing a line so you have no way of knowing whether or not you should let them in to your house. Again, the is the entire point of this thread.

virgin cant draw a line in real terms that's my point

as the law stands only certain prescribed jobs and those where the employee has substantial or unsupervised access to children or vulnerable adults can have their background checked for convictions !

what virgin can do and most likely do already is ask people on their application and even then just because some one has an unspent conviction doesn't mean that they should be denied a job

and its really none of the other employees business what convictions other employees have and virgin could get in trouble if it went around telling them about other employees pasts ( which is what the thread started on sort of ;) )

as to your bit about coming into your house that's a whole other thing for that you would need them to change the law but even then it wont make it much safer as CRB doesnt insure they are safe

personaly i would never let anyone unsupervised access to my house no matter what checks they had done to them

and my wife would never invite a salesman in with out me being there ( unless they looked like brad pit and i wasnt arround ;) lol )

see the advice given in these to stay safe :)

http://www.essex.police.uk/advice/v_you_02.php

http://www.sandiego.gov/police/preve...tyathome.shtml

which is good advice to give to any older relatives and to emphasise to children ( young adults ) left in charge of the house on thier own

caph	25-12-2008 16:03

Re: Virgin Salespeople with Criminal Records

Got it, I see what you're saying.

The OP stated "British Gas, Eon, Scottish Power, Npower and Sky ensure that all of their staff have to complete background checking on individuals before they are allowed to visit customers.".

Is this not the case then?

Personally I find it a bit unnerving, but if there's nothing that Virgin can do then I suppose that's just the way it is.

rogerdraig

25-12-2008 21:56

Re: Virgin Salespeople with Criminal Records

Quote:

Originally Posted by caph (Post 34704077)

they might well do if they can justify it some of those especially the gas enginiers can demand access to a house whether or not an adult is there though its very rare that they do but that could put them in the sort of position that could require crb

but as the site from the law firm points out it has to be shown it is needed

don't get me wrong i don't say that you or other as customers are wrong to want people sent to you to be safe

but i cant see at the moment a way they can do that

personaly i think that cold calling should always be done in pairs and that they should never enter a house with just one person in with out it being logged at an office level

that way there is protection for both parties as its know they are there who they are and why

i seefrom the other side too the other day ( not from virgin ) a girl called trying to sell something as it happens i was just on my way out but she would have been willing to come in to go through what ever it was , i could see no one else close if i had been some one of questionable motives it would have been easy to take advantage of that situation

Gavin78

03-01-2009 21:15

Re: Virgin Salespeople with Criminal Records

I work for the NHS and although I dont work with really really sick people I do work with sick people e.g. Dialysis

I did have to have an enhanced CRB and was also asked during interview for the job about any convictions "spent" or "unspent".

I had to supply 2 forms of ID like tv licence and utility bill also something like original birth certificate not a replaced one and or passport, valid driving licence or marriage certificate.

They also needed 2 referee's so that they could get some individual background information.

Of course this is not VM its the NHS but the same can apply even if its not an Enhanced check they could do standard checks which the "Other relevent information" would be missing.

I do see the persons point of checks, if I understand the sales bit he says that these people do door to door sales, so in that respect they are all classed as vunerable people.

If we are talking sales over the phone then perhaps its not such a problem, although I suppose if they are dealing with it like the do in banks from what I understand they wont employ anyone with CCJ's or anyone that has been declared bankrupt because they are dealing with money.

Chris

03-01-2009 21:20

Re: Virgin Salespeople with Criminal Records

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gavin78 (Post 34708831)

Of course this is not VM its the NHS but the same can apply even if its not an Enhanced check they could do standard checks which the "Other relevent information" would be missing.

A standard check reveals a lot less, and as VM Salesman is not an Exempt position, the employer is not entitled to know about spent convictions - so many of the sorts of people the OP was worried about would get through anyway, being under no obligation to give details of spent convictions even if asked.

TBH it would hardly be worth VM asking for it, especially as they would be under pressure to pay for the check to be done.

Gavin78

03-01-2009 21:47

Re: Virgin Salespeople with Criminal Records

I once applied to work for an Agency under the terms of employment I had to pay for the CRB check myself, it was then refunded once it had come through and all was ok.

I never seen or heard of any issues with VM on anything like this but how far do you go would CRB checks apply to engineers as well, the list goes on.

Nidge

05-01-2009 09:01

Re: Virgin Salespeople with Criminal Records

Quote:

Originally Posted by Virgin Salesman (Post 34699146)

Hi Guys

Dont quite know how to put this but I am aware of people who are working within direct sales at Virgin Media (who visit customers in their own homes and have access to bank details etc) who have Criminal Records for fraud, theft and violence.

I do not want to report this to my manager but was looking to you for some advice on how the management at Virgin Media can be made aware of this?

Most companies who employ people who work in direct sales require all new recruits to undertake a criminal reference check before they are allowed to sell - Virgin dont! I am aware of only a few with criminal records who work in my team but this could be many more salespeople across the country.

I feel we have an obligation to look after customers and ensure that the salespeople visiting them are the type of people you and me would want in our houses.

Any advice? please help.

Whats wrong with people having convictions from years ago?? You can't hold something against a person for something they did many years ago, this was the reason why the rehabilitation of offenders act came into force, any conviction which was 5 years ago is classed as spent, more seroius convictions are 10 years before they are classed as spent.

I've got a conviction on my record for something I did over 25 years ago, I've got nothing else on my record since, I'd hate for this to hold me back from gaining employment.

My recent job requires me to access the main DHL Depot at East Midlands Airport, I have a CRB clearance which allows me to go airside. When the CRB came back they didn't say anything about the conviction 25 years ago.

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