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-   -   Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797] (https://www.cableforum.uk/board/showthread.php?t=33628733)

warescouse 26-06-2008 08:14
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mark777 (Post 34584708)
A bit off topic perhaps, but ties in with other posts here regarding 'unusual' behaviour with VM connections.

I'm by no means a heavy net user, the 2 Mbps service does me just fine, and using the speed test link here, that's just about what i've always had.

For the past few days though, it's been around 0.4 Mbps consistently (just tested again).

STM? Probably. Another nail? Certainly.

If they can't afford to provide the service I pay for, they should put the price up and I will decide to stay or not.

And on top of this, they are chumming up with phorm. :(

It's only the thought of paying BT for a line that has stopped me binning VM months ago.
With each speed increase, the average speed at the busiest times of the day seem to go down. When I was on 2M and 3M or maybe it was 4M was the top speed you could pay for at the time, I got 2M 24/7. When the top speed leaped to 10M the fluctuations began and my speed immediately dropped to under 1M at busy times of the day even though mine had supposedly gone up to 4M at the same time. Phorm would introduce even greater performance hits as more and more lost packets of data are bounced around the system.

---------- Post added at 08:14 ---------- Previous post was at 08:10 ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by AlexanderHanff (Post 34584652)
I can confirm that I have been invited by Steve Gibson to participate in a 3rd podcast they are now going to do on the DPI for behavioural advertising issue (Phorm et al). The show is scheduled for Security Now #152 (week after next).

Alexander Hanff
Great news, Steve Gibson has a huge following and the publicity would be good.

tdadyslexia 26-06-2008 08:31
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 
I am getting a 404 from The Register anyone ells getting this? :erm:

[Edit]

It's Back up.

[Edit]

Spoke to soon it's gone again, what is going on? :erm:

C:\Documents and Settings\User>tracert www.theregister.co.uk
Tracing route to www.theregister.co.uk [212.100.234.54]
over a maximum of 30 hops:
1 1 ms 1 ms 1 ms 192.***.*.*
2 10 ms 6 ms 8 ms 10.157.84.1
3 9 ms 7 ms 8 ms midd-t2cam1-a-v108.inet.ntl.com [213.106.238.45]
4 10 ms 7 ms 7 ms midd-t3core-1a-ge-019-0.inet.ntl.com [62.254.64.
185]
5 10 ms 19 ms 12 ms lee-bb-a-so-130-0.inet.ntl.com [213.105.75.45]
6 15 ms 15 ms 15 ms bre-bb-b-so-200-0.inet.ntl.com [213.105.175.26]
7 16 ms 17 ms 16 ms telc-ic-1-as0-0.inet.ntl.com [62.253.185.74]
8 17 ms 16 ms 16 ms linx.edge1.lon.rackspace.net [195.66.226.116]
9 17 ms 17 ms 17 ms vl901.core1.lon.rackspace.net [83.138.138.35]
10 * * * Request timed out.
11 17 ms 17 ms 17 ms 212.100.234.54

[Edit]

It's Back up.

C:\Documents and Settings\User>tracert www.theregister.co.uk
Tracing route to www.theregister.co.uk [212.100.234.54]
over a maximum of 30 hops:
1 1 ms 2 ms 1 ms 192.***.*.*
2 9 ms 9 ms 7 ms 10.157.84.1
3 9 ms 20 ms 9 ms midd-t2cam1-a-v108.inet.ntl.com [213.106.238.45]
4 9 ms 7 ms 8 ms midd-t3core-1a-ge-019-0.inet.ntl.com [62.254.64.
185]
5 10 ms 9 ms 9 ms lee-bb-a-so-130-0.inet.ntl.com [213.105.75.45]
6 15 ms 15 ms 15 ms bre-bb-b-so-200-0.inet.ntl.com [213.105.175.26]
7 17 ms 17 ms 15 ms telc-ic-1-as0-0.inet.ntl.com [62.253.185.74]
8 177 ms 203 ms 206 ms linx.edge1.lon.rackspace.net [195.66.226.116]
9 17 ms 17 ms 16 ms vl901.core1.lon.rackspace.net [83.138.138.35]
10 19 ms 16 ms 17 ms g1-2.aggr1a.lon.rackspace.net [83.138.138.67]
11 18 ms 16 ms 28 ms 212.100.234.54
Trace complete.

NTLVictim 26-06-2008 08:45
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 
Amanfrommars has turned up..we now have an AI poster!

...and it's making more sense than hamsterwheel.

BetBlowWhistler 26-06-2008 09:47
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 
:welcome: aManfromMars - good to see you join the fray :)

It has to be said that you bend my head, but after re-literation occasionally a gleam of meaning is revealed.

I'm worried for my sanity :D

jca111 26-06-2008 10:12
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 
I cant see it mentioned here before, but Phorms trial made last weeks (14 June 2008) edition of NewScientist.

Its only a small box of facts in the Technology Section.

"18.9 million. The number of web pages reportedly injected woth adverts tailored to UK users' habits in a covert trial of the Phorm ad-serving system"

Florence 26-06-2008 10:24
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mark777 (Post 34584708)
A bit off topic perhaps, but ties in with other posts here regarding 'unusual' behaviour with VM connections.

I'm by no means a heavy net user, the 2 Mbps service does me just fine, and using the speed test link here, that's just about what i've always had.

For the past few days though, it's been around 0.4 Mbps consistently (just tested again).

STM? Probably. Another nail? Certainly.

If they can't afford to provide the service I pay for, they should put the price up and I will decide to stay or not.

And on top of this, they are chumming up with phorm. :(

It's only the thought of paying BT for a line that has stopped me binning VM months ago.
I was lucky I had a link to half price line which helped was also the reason I moved back when I did, didn't want to mis the half price them VM say they were rolling out Phorm.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BetBlowWhistler (Post 34584787)
:welcome: aManfromMars - good to see you join the fray :)

It has to be said that you bend my head, but after re-literation occasionally a gleam of meaning is revealed.

I'm worried for my sanity :D
Every needs to worry about their sanity once phorm is on the system those connected via it will become brainwashed zombies :D

:welcome: aManfromMars

---------- Post added at 10:24 ---------- Previous post was at 10:19 ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by jca111 (Post 34584797)
I cant see it mentioned here before, but Phorms trial made last weeks (14 June 2008) edition of NewScientist.

Its only a small box of facts in the Technology Section.

"18.9 million. The number of web pages reportedly injected woth adverts tailored to UK users' habits in a covert trial of the Phorm ad-serving system"
With such a large amount bet most are american websites so not really relevent...

Just how much of the customers download bandwidth limit are the phorm adverts going to use?

Will the ISP limit the adverts to small none coloured or flash content which are more bandwidth greedy?

Will Phorm be given freedom to decide how much customers bandwidth they waste with these adverts?

What happens if the customer starts to block advert content?

I can go on :D

Wild Oscar 26-06-2008 12:27
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mark777 (Post 34584708)
It's only the thought of paying BT for a line that has stopped me binning VM months ago.
Not sure if anyone else has posted this .. but ..

It's worth pointing out here that BT are currently doing doing a special offer re. re-connecting your phone line for £29.99 instead of the normal £124.99!! ..

http://www.serviceview.bt.com/list/p...o/SNL21-08.pdf

Notice it's only till the end of June so get in quick if you want it .. also check the conditions ..

Phormic Acid 26-06-2008 13:46
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 
:welcome: amanfromMars

Quote:
Originally Posted by NTLVictim (Post 34584748)
Amanfrommars has turned up..we now have an AI poster!

...and it's making more sense than hamsterwheel.
If so, would that make Hammy an NI poster?

In fairness to HamsterWheel, he did try his best to explain the issue relating to the Phorm shares. However, I think anyone with a dogmatic position that Phorm’s Webwise isn’t a problem, without wanting or being able to engage in the real technical and ethical concerns, is going to get a hard time here.

Dephormation 26-06-2008 14:14
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 
Just received a wallet full of documents from ICO, too many to upload at present.

Summary of info is here

http://www.badphorm.co.uk/e107_plugi...topic.php?6937

There's some significant revelations. I'm still reading through it.

https://www.cableforum.co.uk/images/...2008/07/25.gif

amanfromMars 26-06-2008 14:15
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 
Quote:
without wanting or being able to engage in the real technical and ethical concerns,
.... Phormic Acid #10193

Technical chicanery is such in the Digital Environment that nothing is Impossible which has led to the present impasse/stumbling block/ethical examination of what is now possible on an Instantaneous and Global Scale. ..... and All from just out of the Blue Cloud Hot Zones.

Or am I understating the Big Issue?

Dephormation 26-06-2008 14:44
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 
More info from the ICO folder.

BT letter to the ICO. Includes much of interest.

Florence 26-06-2008 14:47
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dephormation (Post 34584994)
Just received a wallet full of documents from ICO, too many to upload at present.

Summary of info is here

http://www.badphorm.co.uk/e107_plugi...topic.php?6937

There's some significant revelations. I'm still reading through it.

https://www.cableforum.co.uk/images/...2008/07/25.gif
A hypethetical reason why ICO is doing nothing clue might have been mentioned on ISPreview in the reply from Phorm to Alex's interview.

Quote:
3. Misrepresentation of Phorm by using our broadly worded ICO Registration document to suggest the company’s advertising and anti phishing system stores personally identifiable information.

Phorm: Phorm’s advertising and anti-phishing system does not store any personally identifiable information – a fact verified by independent experts including Richard Clayton, 80/20 Thinking and Ernst & Young. We simply show relevant ads to users on an anonymous basis based on predefined advertising channels triggered as a result of their Internet browsing.

Separately, we have registered with the ICO as there is data that all companies handle in order to manage their businesses from marketing enquiries to employee performance reviews. This is entirely unrelated to the operation of the advertising and anti phishing system.

Not only is the Phorm technology a ground breaking step forward in online privacy but it has the potential to radically improve the Internet. It addresses the two biggest concerns users have about the Internet by reducing the amount of irrelevant advertising that people will see and will give them a safer Internet experience with its always on anti phishing protection.

With our technology small websites and ISPs will, for the first time, get a slice of the billions spent on Internet advertising. Last year just 50 US websites got 91% of all the all online advertising revenues while the average user in Japan is connecting to the Internet at speeds 10 times faster than in the UK. The Phorm system will help redistribute advertising money more widely so that Internet users will benefit from a greater diversity of content and from increased investment in better services.
I have made the important part in bold and italics I also quoted everything so noone from phorm could say I took it out of context an misquoted them which they are the best for doing.

davethejag 26-06-2008 14:48
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 
Hi, On a side issue, BBC report on the future of the internet.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/7474889.stm

Dave.

Raistlin 26-06-2008 14:50
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by davethejag (Post 34585017)
Hi, On a side issue, BBC report on the future of the internet.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/7474889.stm

Dave.
Not sure what that's specifically got to do with Phorm, given how complicated this thread is already perhaps you would have been better posting that somewhere else for discussion?

Dephormation 26-06-2008 14:58
Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]
 
Well this just gets worse and worse.

ICO simply took BT's word for it, no investigation, no further evidence, no analysis...

See here.

I'm just gob smacked.


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