Cable Forum - Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]

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- - Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797] (https://www.cableforum.uk/board/showthread.php?t=33628733)

Wildie

25-06-2008 22:21

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]

well what does one expect from them the clam up wont saying anything when asked or avoid the questions with a question or misdirection.

Privacy_Matters

25-06-2008 22:21

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]

Quote:

Originally Posted by icsys (Post 34584519)

DITTO
I was just about to post the same.

Take a single pro-comment and milk it for all that it is worth.

Personally I feel that Dr Clayton should cite Phorm for misrepresentation.

Ravenheart

25-06-2008 22:23

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]

Quote:

Mr Thomas said he would be taking formal enforcement action against HMRC and MoD - meaning they could face criminal prosecutions if they do not follow the recommendations set out in the reports. Lessons had to be learned from recent data losses and information security "taken a great deal more seriously by those in charge of organisations", added Mr Thomas.

So data losses and information security should be taken seriously. Isn't that what we've been trying to tell him and his department for months?

Wildie

25-06-2008 22:29

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ravenheart (Post 34584525)

the Information Commissioner Richard Thomas has told the Ministry of Defence and the HM Revenue and Customs that if they don't get their act together

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/7472814.stm

So data losses and information security should be taken seriously. Isn't that what we've been trying to tell him and his department for months?

what this lot in power you kidding right, they have`nt a clue, and who voted for this lot. Yes we was a victim of that data loss.

Ben B

25-06-2008 22:38

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]

I know that this is a big discussion about webwise, but when exactly are VM implementing it....?

Ben :)

warescouse

25-06-2008 22:38

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]

Quote:

Originally Posted by OldBear (Post 34584514)

Yes, and it's interesting that they are still trying the same old trick they've been trying for months with regards to Dr. Richard Clayton.

From Dr Clayton's own blog: http://www.lightbluetouchpaper.org/2...ebwise-system/

My bold.

In Dr. Clayton's own words, "Readers are left to draw their own conclusions".

OB

If Phorm had written Richard Clayton stated "...."

followed by the quote I think they could have got away with it, but by saying

In fact, academic Richard Clayton supports our privacy claims stating that: " ...." (Italics mine)

Could Dr Clayton challenge that comment and their interpretation as incorrect?

@Privacy Matters
Sorry made a cuppa in the middle of typing my post and you beat me to it. :-)

icsys

25-06-2008 22:41

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]

Quote:

Originally Posted by popper (Post 34584436)

http://blogs.guardian.co.uk/technolo...om_nebuad.html
"Charles Arthur
With Phorm in the wings, US ISP cancels ad-tracking system from NebuAd

While BT's next ad-serving trial with Phorm is nearly ready to start, Charter Comms in the US has suspended a deal with NebuAd, offering similar services
June 25, 2008 10:36 AM

"

I don't know who xyzzy is but that was a well written comment on the Charles Arthur blog.

---------- Post added at 22:41 ---------- Previous post was at 22:40 ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by warescouse (Post 34584549)

If Phorm had written Richard Clayton stated "...."

followed by the quote I think they could have got away with it, but by saying

In fact, academic Richard Clayton supports our privacy claims stating that: " ...." (Italics mine)

Could Dr Clayton could challenge that comment and their interpretation as incorrect?

Well spotted!. I certainly would! Using the word 'supports' would sugest that the quote has been taken out of context.

Kursk

25-06-2008 22:41

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ben_b (Post 34584548)

I know that this is a big discussion about webwise, but when exactly are VM implementing it....?

Ben :)

We don't know if they are. They haven't said a dicky bird to their millions of customers. Can we have a statement of intent either way please Ben? ;)

mark777

25-06-2008 22:48

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ben_b (Post 34584548)

I know that this is a big discussion about webwise, but when exactly are VM implementing it....?

Ben :)

VM are sitting on the fence. They are waiting to see what happens to BT.

If it all goes wrong, they will take the moral high ground and say it's not suitable for their customers.

If it works (ho ho), they will want to pimp your data too.

Unfortunately, if phorm goes belly up, or BT withdraws first, it's going to be really difficult for them to claim that high ground. They will just look stupid.

And if BT and Phorm end up in court, you can bet VM will also be looked at up close, but that assumes HMG withdraws sponsorship of the project.

So to answer your question, i'm afraid you will have to wait and see, but don't forget to let VM know if you don't like the idea. :)

OldBear

25-06-2008 22:59

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]

Quote:

Originally Posted by warescouse (Post 34584549)

Totally agree.

I've posted a comment to Richard's blog pointing out to him that Phorm are still posting this one paragraph as his support for their system. Hopefuly he'll see that and maybe ask them himself to stop doing it.

Maybe one of you chaps might want to post a comment to Richard's blog mentioning it, too.

OB

Dephormation

25-06-2008 23:01

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ravenheart (Post 34584525)

the Information Commissioner Richard Thomas has told the Ministry of Defence and the HM Revenue and Customs that if they don't get their act together
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/7472814.stm

So data losses and information security should be taken seriously. Isn't that what we've been trying to tell him and his department for months?

Those losses, while careless, were supposedly accidental.

The use of Phorm spyware in 2006/7 was secret, illegal, deliberate, and intentional.

From that article;

Quote:

"The two discs had still not been found, he added, despite searches by both police and HMRC staff, but there was no evidence of any fraudulent activity as a result of the loss."

So while prosecutions follow against careless civil servants for non-fraudulent error (presumably not the politicians responsible for leading the departments)...

Quote:

"[Alistair Darling] "apologised unreservedly" to everyone affected by the data loss and said the public were entitled to expect government departments would protect their personal details. "

So is the Information Commissioner saying we aren't entitled to expect commercial enterprises like BT to protect the personal information of their customers, or respect their right to privacy and security? Even when they break the law intentionally?

The man must go.

Richard Thomas, the door over there, with [EXIT] over it.
https://www.cableforum.co.uk/images/...2008/07/25.gif

isf	25-06-2008 23:10

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]

Quote:

Originally Posted by warescouse (Post 34584493)

I just read the 4th response page from Phorm re: Alex Hanff interview. It's the same old regurgitation of out of context quotes and misinformation. I really think Phorm PR are scraping the barrel if that's the best they can do. Are they stuck on a hamster wheel! Not only are their PR efforts monotonous they are becoming very boring. I suppose you can only squeeze so much juice out of a lemon!

Corporate verbigeration, such compulsive misrepresentation has gone a long way to making our case for us.

So here's to Phorm's PR lackeys; you've done a great job guys :beer:

AlexanderHanff

25-06-2008 23:12

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]

Well I guess I should have expected this sooner or later. Someone has added https://nodpi.org to Spam Cops spam lists because Entanet mentioned the protest with a link to the site in one of their partner newsletters.

I have been in communications with the party who filed the report and advised them to remove it. Apparently they don't want to receive Entanet newsletters any more so they feel the appropriate course of action is to pick one domain out of the entire newsletter and add it to a spam list as opposed to just unsubscribing from the newsletter.

If NoDPI.Org goes offline in the next 24 hours it is because we have not managed to resolve this issue. Our hosting provider take spam very seriously and have threatened to suspend our service should the issue not be dealt with within 24 hours.

Personally I think this wreaks of malicious intent, there is no way I can see a logical argument for reporting a single URL from a newsletter to a spam list as a valid or natural reaction to not wanting to receive the newsletter. One would expect the party to simply unsubscribe from said newsletter as opposed to taking offensive action against a single entity mentioned within the newsletter.

Needless to say the matter is being taken very seriously and Entanet have been contacted as well to help resolve the issue.

I apologise if there is any downtime.

Alexander Hanff

Florence

25-06-2008 23:19

Re: Virgin Media Phorm Webwise Adverts [Updated: See Post No. 1, 77, 102 & 797]

Quote:

Originally Posted by AlexanderHanff (Post 34584598)