Re: Coronavirus
 

Give them the chance of a power trip and they'll be all over it ,ask them to solve a burglary and you get nothing .

Re: Coronavirus
 

Age is a major factor in how serious Covid affects people. A doctor on Channel 5 said that 50+ is when the risk heightens and it gets worse the older a person is. A caller asked if a healthy pensioner was at less risk than an at risk younger person and she said no.

I too thought that it could be better to shield at risk groups and let the rest go about their business as normal, but a couple of days ago both Johnson and Sturgeon said that this wouldn't work as the virus would find it's way to the vulnerable by doing this.

Re: Coronavirus
 

They would in normal times, have officers on the streets having to deal with drunken behaviour etc. So not necessarily extra spending or staff required.

---------- Post added at 18:19 ---------- Previous post was at 18:17 ----------

I've shut myself away for several weeks now, because of a localized increased risk. How much longer should I do that, so that others can continue with their selfish behaviour?

Re: Coronavirus
 

'The Week' publication has reported that new research suggests that the virus could evolve and start to circumvent our efforts to stop it spreading via the use of social distancing & hand washing. They did stress that this mutation hasn't made the virus any more deadly than it was before.

https://www.theweek.co.uk/108191/cor...e-mask-wearing

'The Covid-19 coronavirus has mutated to become more contagious and resistant to social distancing and hygiene measures, new research suggests.'

---------- Post added at 18:30 ---------- Previous post was at 18:21 ----------

I've been shut away since March, with no sign of when I can go outside again. The Government sent me a letter saying that I no longer needed to shield from 1/8/20 and promptly stopped my weekly delivery of food! I, along with what's claimed to be 95% of other vulnerable people, chose to continue to shield. I've recently had another letter saying I should shield again; i'm so glad that I didn't stop shielding.

I have come across some elderly people who say that, as they are in their twilight years, they don't know how much time they have left on this Earth and would be prepared to take a risk, rather than risk never seeing their family again.

AFAIK shielding isn't mandatory (yet?), so at the moment it's a choice that only the individual themselves can make.

Re: Coronavirus
 

Agreeing with nomadking on two consecutive days. I'm going to see if I can get a Covid test in case it's a symptom. :D

But yes, you are right that the resource already exists. It's just moving it from midnight/1am/3am. Create a visible presence to get landlords talking to each other. Promote adherence.

Re: Coronavirus
 

Link

The Police may not have named the venue, but it doesn't take much to search and find the likely culprit(s). Somebody even made a jokey post about it on the venues Facebook page. Whether that person knows for sure that it was the venue concerned, is another matter.
At least they didn't fill the place to it's 2,000 capacity.

Re: Coronavirus
 

Ridiculous.

After winning a massive majority and carte Blanche to implement any vision they wanted to the future of the U.K.

It seems their vision is some quasi-Orwellian police state.

Keir Starmer must Be pissing himself, he done nothing, been pretty invisible and now he finds himself ahead in the polls.

I had great hopes for this government, but they’re starting to evaporate.

Re: Coronavirus
 

:confused: It's an example of selfish behaviour. Just look at all the people that have been complaining that restrictions weren't put in place before. Even if you assumed it was 10 per household attending, that is 12 households that are NOW potentially infected. And if some of the guests were from further afield, that will have potentially spread it to a greater area.
Link
In Wales run by ....... Labour.

Re: Coronavirus
 

Potentially, maybe, could be, might be, yadda, yadda.

I was more talking about the penalty imposed.

There are time ps when a government has to use extraordinary powers, I acknowledge that. This is not one one of those times.

The initial wave was brought Under control without the use of draconian powers, the nation cooperated, as they saw the numbers, they saw the urgency.

The numbers now are not there, the NHS is not overwhelmed, People are rightly questioning are approach. So instead of trying again to bring the nation with them, with evidence, with rationale, the government are instead employing the jackboot.

Re: Coronavirus
 

Same/similar rules in Labour run Wales. 60% of the population in Labour run Wales are going to be in lockdown.

Re: Coronavirus
 

It's because we weren't draconian enough and relaxed restrictions too soon that this has come back. Open pubs, restaurants, send kids back to school/uni, encourage everyone back to work, and hey presto, guess what happened next ?

Re: Coronavirus
 

You’re wasting your breath it doesn’t matter what the evidence says some are firmly in the letting old/vulnerable die is a price worth laying for a few points on the stock exchange.

Old Boy in fact still hasn’t answered my question of whether he’d support 50% of the workforce continuing to work from home, as per Sweden?

In fairness to Pierre he came back straight away in support of working from home, even post covid, as more sustainable in the future.

Re: Coronavirus
 

What happened? People got infected, we don’t know if the amount of people infected was more or less than the initial wave.

---------- Post added at 21:33 ---------- Previous post was at 21:27 ----------

Are more dying? Demonstrably so? Also, it’s not about the stock Exchange ( funny how that’s your first thought) it’s about life, and getting on with it.

Absolutely, I do endeavour to be consistent, there is no excuse not to be allowed to work from home if you can, and if you want. As long as performance is not impacted (and that should be easily measured)

It cuts travel costs, building costs, it empowers employees to manage their time and their home/work balance. Done correctly there are no downsides.

Re: Coronavirus
 

Exactly, that's why it would have made sense to do it gradually so we could get some kind of meaningful data.

---------- Post added at 22:15 ---------- Previous post was at 21:43 ----------

This article "Lockdowners v Libertarians" reprises the currrent debate on the forum.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...navirus-divide

Re: Coronavirus
 

Huge own goal here by the Labour Party

https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...covid-measures

You either back the Government and share the blame or vote against it and get all the blame. Covid is the ultimate positioned chalice.

Pierre will, rightly, argue the merits of Parliamentary scrutiny and although I disagree my post above is from a Labour perspective. Not that I’d ever vote for them but this is bad politics.

Re: Coronavirus
 

How would that have worked? It would have made matters a lot more complicated as to what was and wasn't allowed. Too many people are unwilling to stick to simple restrictions as it is.

The problem isn't the activities, but whether an infected person takes part in a particular activity. That might have happened at any stage of the relaxation process, beginning, middle, or later on.

Re: Coronavirus
 

It's both things - 1) someone being infectious and threfore able to transmit the virus 2) the environment of the activity aiding or suppressing transmission to others.

Re: Coronavirus
 

But which environments do you allow? It's impossible to predict which one will lead to an outbreak. Different environments already have different conditions depending on risk. If idiots are going to gather in excessive numbers, no rules are going to stop them. If 120 people are going to gather, when the limit has been 30 for some time, what else can you do? Start jailing them and people might start taking notice.

Re: Coronavirus
 

Parliament's bars labelled workplace canteens so no 10pm curfew.
https://www.standard.co.uk/news/poli...-a4557746.html

---------- Post added at 10:33 ---------- Previous post was at 10:31 ----------

How you enforce misbehaviour is another debate.
To better understand the impact of each relaxation, doing them all at the same time won't help us understand things.

Re: Coronavirus
 

We had a Zoom prayer meeting last night and one of those attending shared that he contracted Covid earlier in the year, positive test and because of his job has access to antibody tests which are now "negative".

My thinking would still be on the lines though that if you get repeated exposure would your immune response grow/remain? Even if reinfected would that trigger a faster and better immune response? If for herd immunity you need repeated exposure how do we manage that?

---
On a lighter note, don't know if this has been shared already. It's a parody on the 1970's info films - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5q7HkxNhnXA

Re: Coronavirus
 

Stop misrepresenting those of us that believe we need to change tack, jfman. My strap line makes my position clear, so even with your dodgy memory, it should be possible for you to retain the information that I have said throughout that the vulnerable should be shielded, not killed off as you keep claiming.

Lockdowns don’t work. I don’t know how many times we have to do this before you finally admit that you are wrong.

You are trying to turn the whole argument around to your warped view that people in business don’t matter. You ignore the fact that every business that fails creates more unemployment and more misery for families struggling to make ends meet.

What has working at home got to do with your argument? Clearly, this is a balancing act and I have always taken the view that working at home should be embraced more. However, we also need to be cognisant of those in the catering industry, who will go out of business if they don’t get back their custom from office workers.

There are no easy solutions to this. Hopefully there will be a vaccine, but I fear that we will be waiting for longer than some people expect.

To be as clear as I can be, what should be done is as follows:

1. Cease all lockdowns and let the virus travel freely amongst the healthy population.

2. Advise the vulnerable and elderly to shield, but do not make it mandatory. Provide guidelines to assist them and their families to understand what is being recommended. Advise against family members visiting vulnerable relations unnecessarily. Ensure that grocery delivery slots are available and ensure council staff with their volunteers are available to help those who cannot organise this for themselves.

3. Lockdown the care homes, stop agency workers working for multiple establishments and have an isolation area for new residents and those suspected of having the virus. All hospital discharges of vulnerable patients should be subject to a coronavirus test.

4. Sporting events should be re-opened and all restrictions on weddings, funerals, pubs, restaurants and the like relaxed.

5. Get the NHS and dental surgeries back to normal ASAP, by resuming the services that have ceased. The deaths and sheer misery that have been caused by closing down these services is totally unacceptable.

If this is done properly, the COVID deaths we can expect this winter should be no more than we would normally expect in from flu in a year. And that, my good man, is unavoidable.

Re: Coronavirus
 

And what do we do when that causes more cases of 'Long Covid', some of which will be previously healthly people?

https://www.bmj.com/content/370/bmj.m3489
https://www.independent.co.uk/life-s...-a9679876.html

Re: Coronavirus
 

Understand what exactly? Activity X isn't somehow better than activity Y. In one area an infected person may do X and not Y, whilst in another area, an infected person may do Y and not X. No knowledge gained.:rolleyes:What needs to be understood is, how is the virus still doing the "rounds".

The spreading is going on before any relaxation of anything. It has to be passed from one person to another, and another, in a chain of infections. It's not something that lays dormant for months on end. There are only short windows of opportunity for it to be passed on to somebody else.

Re: Coronavirus
 

BBC treats Covid like a second Great Plague – its coverage is suspiciously anti-Boris

every BBC bulletin is loaded with the latest twists and turns on a virus which is already a spent force — including its twice-a-night “bring out your dead” tally of casualties, now statistically tiny.

In wartime — which, in a non-military sense, is where we are — their coverage would be considered defeatist, a threat to the nation’s moral fibre.


https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/127853...-common-sense/

Re: Coronavirus
 

You're joking :D:D:D

It's the Boris Broadcating Corporation with imminent lockdowns leaked via Laura Kuenssberg whom many now term Downing Street's second spokesperson.

Re: Coronavirus
 

We'll soon have an app for that.

Re: Coronavirus
 

we wring our hands and start crying "what do we do, what do we do"

Re: Coronavirus
 

How would you lockdown a care home? Consider that staff have to be able to enter the care home to look after residents. Relaxing the lockdown creates greater risk of staff contracting the virus, if they're asymptomatic they go to work they then transmit the virus to potential multiple residents. what happens if those residents then go to hospital? potential asymptomatic or symptomatic transmission would run rife.

What you are proposing would basically bring the NHS to it's knees.

Re: Coronavirus
 

For Old Boy that last line is probably the plan. Increased privatisation.

Re: Coronavirus
 

The NHS and dentists are back to normal now aren't they?

Re: Coronavirus
 

I work in the healthcare sector and most care homes are in lockdown and have been for considerable time, when the countrywide lockdown was removed, care homes were not, relative visits were heavily restricted, they had to phone prior to a visit to book a visiting slot of half n hour and visits were confined to communal gardens, the relative had to be alone and they are not allowed to hug or touch their relative.

Now there are local lockdowns all over the place, care homes have gone in to full lock downs again, no visitors at all. Obviously homes cannot shut down to the staff, someone has to look after the residents.

Staff have to wear facemasks throughout their shift, any resident displaying symptoms is temperature checked, put in to isolation and tested.

Care staff are tested weekly, all positive cases follow isolation procedures.

Re: Coronavirus
 

Far from it. If you had health issues, you’d know. It’s an absolute mess.

Re: Coronavirus
 

I was asking the question. Is it mainly GP's surgeries that haven't returned to normal service?

Re: Coronavirus
 

Obviously these health conditions would be co- morbidities with Covid. Having them turn up at GP surgeries with every idiot and their dog with a cough, petre dish child, or other ailment probably not the best idea right now.

Re: Coronavirus
 

Although there are discussions currentley underway to get Dentists back to work as normal it isn't as easy as it seems.

My Dentist is hoping to resume a full servise in the near future but the logistics of being able to ptotect the other dentists, dental nurses, other staff and the patients is proving logistically difficult and a very costly exercise.

NHS dentist are for the most part still only able to carry out basic examinations. At the moment full PPE , waiting rooms only used if full social distancing can be applied, major cleansing of the treatment room after each patient and no drilling or use of the water jets. If emergency treatment is needed the NHS will still have to refer patients to an Emergency Dentist that can undertake the treatment they need if their dentist hasn't managed to comply with all the guidelines

My dentist can carry out checkups,X-rays and prescribe antibiotics if needed but can not yet undertake the corrective treatments, in my case a crown spit fron top to bottom 2 days after the Dentists were told to shut up shop in March.

There are dentists in the private sector working but they charge far higher rates than those working with NHS patients.

If you want to go crosseyed trying to make sense of the latest guidelines have a look at this COVID-19: Guidance for the remobilisation of services within health and care settings.

Infection prevention and control recommendations
https://assets.publishing.service.go...F_20082020.pdf

Re: Coronavirus
 

There are very many people with extremely serious illnesses and others in need of checkups because they are prone to potentially fatal medical illness who are being ignored, and deaths are increasing as a result. You really cannot believe that prevention of deaths of COVID patients is more important than preventing deaths of other patients. That is just ludicrous, as is the whole idea of continuing lockdowns.

Elderly residents in my area have become worried, depressed and desperate because they cannot get the medical attention they need, and your brilliant solution is more of the same. Which, unfortunately, will not yield a different result.

The increasing number of local lockdowns in the country tells you all you need to know about the futility of this policy. It’s time for a different approach. jfman ‘s doomsday solution has clearly failed.

Re: Coronavirus
 

Chris Whitty and Patrick Vallance 'SHOULD have been sacked' - Staggering Commons outburst

CHRIS Whitty and Sir Patrick Vallance have been accused of "scaremongering" over coronavirus, as an enraged Conservative MP claimed the Chief Scientific Adviser and Chief Medical Officer to the UK Government should have been sacked from their respective roles.

https://www.express.co.uk/news/polit...use-of-commons

Re: Coronavirus
 

Ratcheting the health service back up to full strength is one thing. Opening up football stadia, conference centres, etc is an entirely different kettle of fish.

---------- Post added at 20:12 ---------- Previous post was at 20:05 ----------

I don't recall him asking for Dominic Cummings to be sacked when he regaled us with his lockdown adventures. :rolleyes:

Re: Coronavirus
 

The houses of parliament bar is not required to shut at 10 p.m.!!!

Re: Coronavirus
 

Haha it's not my policy Old Boy, I'm not a policy maker after all. There is no other approach, nor has there ever been one. People with serious illnesses can't afford for Covid to run right through society uncontrolled as the idiots advocate.

Interesting you caveated working from home by promoting the dying trades linked to city centre working. Sounds awfully socialist to try and restrict rational choices for businesses to abandon offices in the current climate. That's capitalism after all - if you offer a service nobody is wants or needs you go out of business. There's no balancing act under pure capitalism.

Re: Coronavirus
 

it is as from today https://www.theguardian.com/politics...confirms-covid

---------- Post added at 20:31 ---------- Previous post was at 20:19 ----------

He didn't scare the country shitless though did he, that graph was like the launch curve for a ballistic missile:rolleyes::rolleyes:

Re: Coronavirus
 

Not even close.

Re: Coronavirus
 

Now JFman May accuse me of being in an echo chamber, but this article ( it’s a 5-10min read) Sums up where I am at.

I’m not at the conspiracy theory threshold, but I have deep concerns about government at the moment, and Labour are doing nothing to keep them in check.

https://www-spiked--online-com.cdn.a...of-reason/amp/

Re: Coronavirus
 

Why would Labour do anything to intervene? People voted for Boris, for better for worse, in 2024 we can reflect on how well he has done at the ballot box.

You’ll be unsurprised when I say I don’t agree with much of that article but there’s little value in going over that again.

Re: Coronavirus
 

The job of the opposition is to hold the government to account, even with a large majority, especially with a large majority. To blindly advise that That is not holding anyone to account. That is abdicating your responsibility as the opposition. In fact it has fallen on Tory back benchers to your job for you.

Re: Coronavirus
 

While a noble notion as you portray the reality is this far out from a General Election the best thing they can do is quietly support the Government with constructive criticism. If Boris makes a mess of it he carries the can, if he’s right you get to say you supported. In 2024 we will know one way or the other.

Force Boris out and you could lose to Sunak who washes his hands of Boris ineptitude.

There’s no political advantage to be had by being proactive here. Governments living out a slow dying death suits the opposition.

Re: Coronavirus
 

How does the "not a prediction" graph compare to actual cases?

https://www.cableforum.uk/board/atta...3&d=1601324582

Re: Coronavirus
 

Given the additional restrictions, and problems with testing, this is to be expected.

Re: Coronavirus
 

The "example scenario" was "If doubling occurred every seven days what would it look like?", and the actuals are because we changed what we were doing...

Re: Coronavirus
 

Restrictions largely ignored. Obviously businesses have shut at 10pm

But apart from that, the rule of 6 and pretty much every other rule has been ignored, and I can guarantee the the new rule of no houses mixing will new equally ignored.

Re: Coronavirus
 

Not around here...

Re: Coronavirus
 

Reversal of the return to work is another major factor.

While obviously some are ignoring the rules (we are a society that generally lacks common sense and trust of experts) I doubt they are even a significant minority, let alone a majority. Every single avoided human interaction reduces the chances of spread of the virus.

I’d (genuinely) like to see statistical analysis of adherence to the rules.

Re: Coronavirus
 

I can’t speak for everyone, as you can’t, but certainly just down the road from Leeds in Calderdale These have been my personal observations and of that during Eid and throughout.

I happy the people of the main city have been more compliant.

Re: Coronavirus
 

Loads of people I know who were set to work a day or two in central London have now had that option removes and so are complying with the rules.

Re: Coronavirus
 

It’s not work that is the issue, evidence seems to show infections are more prevalent at home than outside or at work.

People at home just don’t give a toss what Boris is saying, or care for his totalitarian oppression.

Tackling this pandemic will not be successful by stepping on the neck of the U.K. population with the jackboot of government oppression, complete with making it illegal to visit aunt Judy.

The U.K. is policed by consent. Government should not put the police in a position that would undermine that.

Re: Coronavirus
 

I'm not sure how home could be less safe than commuting for an hour into central London and working there. You will encounter far more people and the proximity cannot be easily avoided.

You may be pleased to hear that the Liberal Democrats are supporting the Brady amendment.
https://news.sky.com/story/coronavir...-laws-12084613

Re: Coronavirus
 

Sorry by at home I meant family gatherings at home.

Obviously not The nuclear family by themselves.

Re: Coronavirus
 

Re: Coronavirus
 

You would think these public figures would know better! :td:
- Boris Johnson's father has said he is "extremely sorry" after being photographed shopping without wearing a face covering :dunce:
- Jeremy Corbyn has reportedly apologised for breaking the rule of six by attending a dinner party with his wife and seven other guests. :dunce:
https://news.sky.com/story/coronavir...-mask-12086468

Re: Coronavirus
 

Re: Coronavirus
 

Corbyn's taking the mickey and Johnson Snr has form (inessential trip to Greece breaking lockdown rules, and buying a newspaper after his grandchild was born in April again in breach of lockdown rules).

Re: Coronavirus
 

Article has link to video.

Can he defy El Gov. and not enforce a lockdown? Can he instruct the local police and officials not to implement the rules?

Interesting times ahead.

Re: Coronavirus
 

They do know better because they think they're better than the rest of us, if the government want the public to follow the rules they need to come down as hard as legally allowed, as publically as possible or they might as well say just do what you want

Re: Coronavirus
 

Trouble is another well-known figure flouted the law earlier on and got away with it.
As someone commented in the FT today about Cummings but it applies to others in power, these people know they broke the law, they know that you know that they broke the law and they know that you can't do anything about it!

Re: Coronavirus
 

Coronavirus: Tougher rules for Liverpool, Warrington, Hartlepool and Middlesbrough - but one mayor vows to defy them

Tougher coronavirus restrictions are being imposed on four new areas - but one mayor says they are "damaging" and he will not accept them.



The rebellion is underway don't stand too close to the fan.

https://news.sky.com/story/coronavir...-them-12086656

Re: Coronavirus
 

He's independent of political party so I guess he is protesting and hoping it will help his popularity, whilst knowing that the Government has the ultimate power here.

Re: Coronavirus
 

Police say Boris Johnson's dad Stanley will not be fined for shopping without face mask

https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politi...=breaking-news

---------- Post added at 18:30 ---------- Previous post was at 16:54 ----------

Coronavirus: SNP MP Margaret Ferrier apologises for travelling on public transport after positive COVID-19 test

The SNP's Margaret Ferrier said in a statement there was "no excuse for my actions" and "I apologise unreservedly for breaching COVID-19 restrictions by travelling this week when I shouldn't have".

"On Saturday afternoon, after experiencing mild symptoms, I requested a COVID-19 test which I took that day," she said.

"Feeling much better, I then travelled to London by train on Monday to attend Parliament as planned.

"This was wrong, and I am very sorry for my mistake.

"On Monday evening I received a positive test result for COVID-19.

"I travelled home by train on Tuesday morning without seeking advice. This was also wrong and I am sorry. I have been self-isolating at home ever since.



https://news.sky.com/story/coronavir...-test-12087104



words fail me.

Re: Coronavirus
 

Rules are for proles so the elite can lord it over them. :rolleyes:

Re: Coronavirus
 

She should resign

Re: Coronavirus
 

Before she's sacked!

Unbelievable that she should have got the train back home after a positive result. :dunce:

Re: Coronavirus
 

I did that this morning when I nipped to the shop for milk. It was a mistake, nothing more, nothing less.

Re: Coronavirus
 

I suspect you're not the PM's father nor have you previous form for apparently flouting the covid rules.

Re: Coronavirus
 

I don’t think it was Corbyn’s fault, to be honest. Diane Abbott said he was well within the maximum number allowed. :D

---------- Post added at 19:49 ---------- Previous post was at 19:47 ----------

She could have walked after all.:rolleyes:

---------- Post added at 19:55 ---------- Previous post was at 19:49 ----------

Christmas will be interesting. People round here have no intention of keeping to groups of six for Christmas dinner. I don’t think they have enough inspectors to catch anything more than a very small minority of the population and I dare say that not many will want to work on Christmas Day!

Don’t the police need a warrant to come into your premises without permission?

Re: Coronavirus
 

She has had the whip suspended. By the far the worst example of COVID rule breaking from a politican we've yet seen.

Re: Coronavirus
 

Or stayed at her 2nd London based home. Or more importantly remained in Scotland in the first place, when she had symptoms.

Re: Coronavirus
 

Or...

She could have self-isolated in her London accommodation, in line with Government guidelines...

Re "entry into premises" - https://www.college.police.uk/Docume...egislation.pdf

I would imagine Schedule 21 might get invoked quite frequently...

Re: Coronavirus
 

That’s just a boring answer! :p:

Re: Coronavirus
 

:D:D:D
We know a song about that, don't we children?

Re: Coronavirus
 

She's also reported herself to the police. It will be interesting what action they will/will not take.

Re: Coronavirus
 

Can she be fined both in England and scotland for breaking the rules in two different countries.

Re: Coronavirus
 

I would guess so :shocked:

Maybe one force will decline to follow up on account of the other handling it but theoretically she broke two different laws in two different countries.

Re: Coronavirus
 

I would think travelling from Scotland to London while having symptoms would've breached Scottish law.

The return journey after recieving a positive result would've breached English law.
Of and in itself that is two different possible chrges.

Re: Coronavirus
 

Looking at this article, she only reported it after being found out or forced to own up(eg being asked "why aren't you in London", and possibly had to be told to report it by the SNP's Westminster leader. "Will be" is future tense.
All the people who travelled on the same trains(s) are going to be pleased at having to self-isolate for 14 days.
Link
Wouldn't that also apply to those in the House of Commons?

Re: Coronavirus
 

Re: Coronavirus
 

At least he was:-
1) Not travelling on public transport
2) Not meeting anybody, ie he was self-isolating.
3) Was acting purely in the interests of a young child, who might have found themselves with 2 incapacitated parents.

Re: Coronavirus
 

We can't assume "purely" and self-isolating doesn't mean driving 300 miles! But compared to catching a train to Scotland his behaviour was saintly.

Re: Coronavirus
 

Well I couldn’t give a toss about the SNP person. Same way I didn’t give a toss about Cummings, or Kinnock or anyone.

We’re now a week into the sudden rise of infections.

One the attached images shows a definitive second wave of infections.

The second attachment shows the deaths. By this time next week if the death rate hasn’t rapidly shot upwards by at least a factor of 10 then there is an obvious disconnect between infection rate and death rate compared to the first wave.

It will be argued that there was much less testing first time around. Which is right.

But then I would suggest then that the “infection rate”: is the wrong metric on which to use them “whack a mole” strategy, as it is obvious the infection rate does not correlate to death/ hospital rate.

For judging whether to put extra restrictions on an area must surely be on the capability of the area to manage hospital cases. If the hospitals can not handle any more Covid cases, close the area down.

But if there is plenty of capacity, crack on.

Re: Coronavirus
 

I strongly suspect that you are right.

Not neccessarily. The police can enter without a warrant in some cases e.g. if they have reasonable suspicion to believe that a crime is currently taking place. They are entitled to enter public houses at any time day or night (but not private living accomodation). Any letting rooms can be inspected unless they are currently occupied by guests.

---------- Post added at 23:01 ---------- Previous post was at 22:45 ----------

What I don't understand is how the Government could give lockdown instructions to the devolved nations. They have their own Parliaments which are now deciding on Covid rules, so it must be a devolved power, but the PM was able to ,rock down the whole of the UK last March :confused:

---------- Post added at 23:22 ---------- Previous post was at 23:01 ----------

Well, any law is only as valid as the number of people who respect it and are prepared to obey it. Rightly or wrongly, a lot of people are now flouting the restrictions out of ignorance, confusion, political protest or fatigue.

I had a phone call last week from the office that deals with anything I need whilst shielding. Unusually, I was asked questions about my experience of people wearing masks or not, complying with the restrictions in my neighbourhood or not etc.

I mentioned this to a friend who (along with his partner and two sons) are also getting paid to take Covid 19 tests every week for a year and he has received a similar phone call. I wonder if the Government is trying to subtly find out if people are taking any notice of them??

Payments for Covid 19 tests by the Government (for selected people) are as follows:

Swab nose and throat tests every week- £50 for first test, then £25 per subsequent test for each family member. In addition a blood test is taken once a month- extra £50 for first blood test, then £25 for each subsequent test per family member.

This is scheduled to last for 12 months, so it's a nice little earner for my friend as between him and his family they will receive £6420 over the year and this may be extended.

Ironically, he told me that he'd have been prepared to do it for free to know that him & his family were free of Covid. Now, imagine all the other people being paid to take tests and it won't be an insignificant sum, but what the heck, it's only taxpayers money and/or Government debt that will meet the cost!!!

Re: Coronavirus
 

Power to decide their own covid response was given to them after the initial lockdown.

Re: Coronavirus
 

It’d also be argued that treatments are better and care homes less exposed.

Infection rate alone is a bad metric to use. The direction of travel, who is getting infected, testing capacity and success or otherwise of contact tracing all have to be considered.

A random figure like say 10,000 cases a day wouldn’t be awful if we had high confidence we were finding and isolating them and their close contacts quickly. With testing capacity to make those available to those who need them quickly.

10,000 cases a day when it’s taking a week to get test results, many can’t book tests and we’ve a low confidence in track and trace is a different kettle of fish.

Scenario 1 can very quickly go out of control.

Re: Coronavirus
 

Delays in the government-funded testing programme mean schools both state and private are now going private for testing. Despite the £10bn the government's spent on it.
https://www.ft.com/content/74843919-...b-dddd93bce2b9

Re: Coronavirus
 

Me thinks the Corby/Johnson Snr incidents are not really a problem. Yes they break the letter of the law but may not break the spirit of the law and even to the letter the infringement is pretty minor. (Maybe Johnson Snr asked if he could enter without mask and shop was empty. So the dinner party had 7 or 8 people instead of 6, it's a bit like driving at 75 on the motorway in good conditions/light traffic etc, yes it breaks the law and you can be stopped but it's not what the law is really intended for.

We shouldn't need such precise laws for Covid, it should be enough to have them as enforcible guidelines and the police with ability to use discretion and handle accordingly where needed. But the plonkers would just keep push around the boundaries in more "dangerous" ways.

Re: Coronavirus
 

A certain Mr Trump seems to have caught it ... :D

Re: Coronavirus
 

Good straightforward US article on home-testing.
https://www.wsj.com/articles/beat-co...nion_lead_pos9

Re: Coronavirus
 

Although this video has been produced as a result of Mr Trumps admission to hospital it is a pretty good run down by Dr Mike Hanson who specializes in (and is board certified in) internal medicine, pulmonary disease, and critical care medicine.on the treatment of Covid-19 in hospital.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ekOB...ctorMikeHansen

Thanks for the link go to our old friend Ignitionnet.

Re: Coronavirus
 

And they won't be close to going back to normal for a long while l suspect.

Re: Coronavirus
 

It's slightly complicated as at outset there was broad agreement, but how the lockdown was implemented and legislated for ended up in public health regulations, which relate to devolved powers.

How things like the furlough scheme are implemented are reserved, so for all 4 nations what is viable to do is to some extent determined by the purse strings in London.

I think technically had lockdown restrictions been implemented by the Civil Contingencies Act it could have left more decision making in London.

Other things like foreign travel are reserved, but who should quarantine is in health legislation therefore is devolved which creates a quirk. So the Scottish Government can't formally advise against international travel - although their First Minister is on record discouraging international travel - but not the power to legislate for it but can legislate for quarantine upon return.

This is distinct from Foreign Office advice against international travel (to some countries, or indeed all countries). In March 2020 when Dominic Raab announced this it has some legal standing, and immediately invalidated many travel insurance policies for trips after and made it clear to British nationals that they may not get the level of consular assistance overseas if required.

Re: Coronavirus
 

I wasn`t allowed to say anything until this point, but it's now okay for me to share that I have volunteered for vaccine trials for Covid-19. It's important that we all do our part to beat this virus.

The vaccine is the one that has been developed in Russia. I received my first dose this morning 08:00 am, and I wanted to let you all know that it’s completely safe, with иo side effects whatsoeveя, and that I feelshκι я чувствую себя немного странно и я думаю, что вытащил ослиные уши. чувствую себя немного странно.

Re: Coronavirus
 

Hmmmm, which google translates to

:erm:

Also, you cannot possible state it is perfectly safe and has no side effects after just 9 hours.

Re: Coronavirus
 

He'll have copied and pasted it from facebook or somewhere.