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cheekyangus 19-05-2019 17:56
Re: ESPN, BT, Euro, Premier and Sky Sports news
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by cheekyangus (Post 35995183)
I was just combing through DigitalBitRate website and saw some BT Sports Channel stuff that seems new.

First the non-new, C073/Tsid22 has BT Sport 4K UHD, this is the current 4K channel, I'm mentioning this location on the page as this is the existing service.

What I'm drawing your attention to is this...
C052/Tsid14 has BTSport 4K Hidden, BT Sport 4K Slate and BT Sport HD Hidden.

Something new from BT?

It's possible they are preparing to move services, but why labelled as they are?
-----
I just looked at the screen shots that accompany them. The HD Hidden has a BTSport 2 logo, the 4K Hidden shows what looks like an advert for a tablet, and the Slate shows BBC2 HD move (!). Weird, but maybe just tests.
Inactive Digital on the MPEG4 thread has suggested the following
Quote:
BT Sport Hidden has previously been a stream for channel 100, so my guess is that these are for the Champions League and Europa Cup finals
Seems the most likely reason for them. Good thinking by Inactive Digital.

OLD BOY 19-05-2019 19:18
Re: ESPN, BT, Euro, Premier and Sky Sports news
 
Interesting to see how this is developing. The industry is gingerly tipping its toes into the streaming revolution. Still a little way to go yet, I suspect.

http://www.csimagazine.com/csi/Exper...OTT-sports.php

A panel including NBA and NFL Game Pass at SportsPro Live in London debated the future direction of sports streaming, expecting new digital players and more leagues going direct-to-consumer (DTC) to disrupt the landscape even further.

“If you think of OTT as a mature marketplace for entertainment, sports is not there yet but we see two phases on the horizon for the growth in OTT sports,” said Will Staeger of Endeavour Streaming. “We haven’t seen the big streamers like Netflix and Amazon fully step in. I think that phase is coming. How will that disrupt the market? I also think we will see more DTC services from the leagues, that moment is also coming,” Staeger said.

denphone 19-05-2019 19:43
Re: ESPN, BT, Euro, Premier and Sky Sports news
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by OLD BOY (Post 35995403)
Interesting to see how this is developing. The industry is gingerly tipping its toes into the streaming revolution. Still a little way to go yet, I suspect.

http://www.csimagazine.com/csi/Exper...OTT-sports.php

A panel including NBA and NFL Game Pass at SportsPro Live in London debated the future direction of sports streaming, expecting new digital players and more leagues going direct-to-consumer (DTC) to disrupt the landscape even further.

“If you think of OTT as a mature marketplace for entertainment, sports is not there yet but we see two phases on the horizon for the growth in OTT sports,” said Will Staeger of Endeavour Streaming. “We haven’t seen the big streamers like Netflix and Amazon fully step in. I think that phase is coming. How will that disrupt the market? I also think we will see more DTC services from the leagues, that moment is also coming,” Staeger said.
In America but not here as America is not like our sports rights market as all the top premier Sports content will be on Linear TV for many many years to come over here but you knew that anyway.

Raider999 19-05-2019 19:46
Re: ESPN, BT, Euro, Premier and Sky Sports news
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by OLD BOY (Post 35995403)
Interesting to see how this is developing. The industry is gingerly tipping its toes into the streaming revolution. Still a little way to go yet, I suspect.

http://www.csimagazine.com/csi/Exper...OTT-sports.php

A panel including NBA and NFL Game Pass at SportsPro Live in London debated the future direction of sports streaming, expecting new digital players and more leagues going direct-to-consumer (DTC) to disrupt the landscape even further.

“If you think of OTT as a mature marketplace for entertainment, sports is not there yet but we see two phases on the horizon for the growth in OTT sports,” said Will Staeger of Endeavour Streaming. “We haven’t seen the big streamers like Netflix and Amazon fully step in. I think that phase is coming. How will that disrupt the market? I also think we will see more DTC services from the leagues, that moment is also coming,” Staeger said.
Currently, Premier League is funded by the massive amounts linear TV companies pay to secure the rights.

I cannot see them going DTC for years if not decades as it would be a huge leap into the unknown - bearing in mind they would have

Production costs
Advertising costs
Revenue collection costs

I am sure someone could be bothered to do the maths, but surely they would need millions of subscribers to earn as much as they do now - couldn't really expect more than £25pm per subscriber or people wouldn't bother.

jfman 19-05-2019 20:07
Re: ESPN, BT, Euro, Premier and Sky Sports news
 
At that price point you are talking 5 million subscribers at £25 a month just to cover the cost of the rights for the EPL. That’s ignoring VAT plus other expenses, and no content two months of the year. It’s a big risk.

denphone 19-05-2019 20:17
Re: ESPN, BT, Euro, Premier and Sky Sports news
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jfman (Post 35995417)
At that price point you are talking 5 million subscribers at £25 a month just to cover the cost of the rights for the EPL. That’s ignoring VAT plus other expenses, and no content two months of the year. It’s a big risk.
Ad one they will never make as Amazon and Netflix know the business numbers will never add up.

OLD BOY 20-05-2019 08:37
Re: ESPN, BT, Euro, Premier and Sky Sports news
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Raider999 (Post 35995414)
Currently, Premier League is funded by the massive amounts linear TV companies pay to secure the rights.

I cannot see them going DTC for years if not decades as it would be a huge leap into the unknown - bearing in mind they would have

Production costs
Advertising costs
Revenue collection costs

I am sure someone could be bothered to do the maths, but surely they would need millions of subscribers to earn as much as they do now - couldn't really expect more than £25pm per subscriber or people wouldn't bother.
So in your opinion, Sky has more resources available to it than Amazon? Think again. If Amazon want to do this, they can.

denphone 20-05-2019 08:45
Re: ESPN, BT, Euro, Premier and Sky Sports news
 
You simply have no ideal what Amazon's business model is based upon apart from that is very clearly based on the business numbers adding up and they do not add up for the Premier League TV rights as they never have and never will.

Amazon's outlays on big sporting rights have always been based on purchasing American sports rights as America's potential captive audience is far vaster then ours.

OLD BOY 20-05-2019 08:48
Re: ESPN, BT, Euro, Premier and Sky Sports news
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by denphone (Post 35995421)
Ad one they will never make as Amazon and Netflix know the business numbers will never add up.
It would draw people into the Prime service, which streaming services encourage. Amazon is more a retail company, but they have used their app to bolster their sales side of the operation.

Additionally, if the Amazon app was also on Sky (it's already on BT and coming soon to Virgin Media and Talk Talk), they could reward these companies for bringing in new business by advertising their services and encouraging their subscribers to sign up.

It is not just a question of cost against the number of existing Prime customers - it is much more complicated than that. Just remember that BT have to pay out for Premiership packages and yet Virgin Media has a wholesale deal for BT Sports which has resulted in no increased cost to viewers on Full House and VIP packages. Who would have expected that prior to the BT Sports launch a few years ago? I bet you didn't think that would happen, did you?

cheekyangus 20-05-2019 10:58
Re: ESPN, BT, Euro, Premier and Sky Sports news
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by OLD BOY (Post 35995445)
It is not just a question of cost against the number of existing Prime customers - it is much more complicated than that. Just remember that BT have to pay out for Premiership packages and yet Virgin Media has a wholesale deal for BT Sports which has resulted in no increased cost to viewers on Full House and VIP packages. Who would have expected that prior to the BT Sports launch a few years ago? I bet you didn't think that would happen, did you?
Given there's a precedent, why not? Setanta did the same thing, back when Full House was XL. Six channels according to this article from July 2007... https://www.theguardian.com/business...digitaltvradio

muppetman11 20-05-2019 11:03
Re: ESPN, BT, Euro, Premier and Sky Sports news
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by OLD BOY (Post 35995445)
It would draw people into the Prime service, which streaming services encourage. Amazon is more a retail company, but they have used their app to bolster their sales side of the operation.

Additionally, if the Amazon app was also on Sky (it's already on BT and coming soon to Virgin Media and Talk Talk), they could reward these companies for bringing in new business by advertising their services and encouraging their subscribers to sign up.

It is not just a question of cost against the number of existing Prime customers - it is much more complicated than that. Just remember that BT have to pay out for Premiership packages and yet Virgin Media has a wholesale deal for BT Sports which has resulted in no increased cost to viewers on Full House and VIP packages. Who would have expected that prior to the BT Sports launch a few years ago? I bet you didn't think that would happen, did you?
I remember you predicting that Netflix when it launched in the UK would obliterate Sky for the rights to the movie studios. How did that go ?

The Sports leagues are more likely to dip their toes in the water with OTT direct to consumer in territories they have smaller financial returns to see the viability before looking to launch elsewhere.

Raider999 20-05-2019 11:46
Re: ESPN, BT, Euro, Premier and Sky Sports news
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by OLD BOY (Post 35995440)
So in your opinion, Sky has more resources available to it than Amazon? Think again. If Amazon want to do this, they can.
I never mentioned Amazon - I referred to DTC which to me means the Premier League themselves setting up a method of controlling all facets of coverage.

The risks of not getting enough subscribers is huge - I suspect the experience of Eleven Sports will have been a big warning to anyone thinking of doing so.

You seem obsessed with Amazon!

I am sure they have the funds to do it should they wish to, just don't see it happening in the next 5 years - my opinion as you have yours.

---------- Post added at 11:46 ---------- Previous post was at 11:44 ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by muppetman11 (Post 35995467)
I remember you predicting that Netflix when it launched in the UK would obliterate Sky for the rights to the movie studios. How did that go ?

The Sports leagues are more likely to dip their toes in the water with OTT direct to consumer in territories they have smaller financial returns to see the viability before looking to launch elsewhere.
Totally agree with that - overseas money being the cream on the rather large home market cake

jfman 20-05-2019 11:49
Re: ESPN, BT, Euro, Premier and Sky Sports news
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by cheekyangus (Post 35995466)
Given there's a precedent, why not? Setanta did the same thing, back when Full House was XL. Six channels according to this article from July 2007... https://www.theguardian.com/business...digitaltvradio
Indeed. Setanta, ESPN and BT all held Premiership rights and did a wholesale deal with Virgin. It’s easy money from a subscriber base unlikely to take the standalone service.

---------- Post added at 11:49 ---------- Previous post was at 11:47 ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by OLD BOY (Post 35995440)
So in your opinion, Sky has more resources available to it than Amazon? Think again. If Amazon want to do this, they can.
Sky have the customer base from which to return a profit.

Resources is not equivalent to a business model.

OLD BOY 20-05-2019 12:45
Re: ESPN, BT, Euro, Premier and Sky Sports news
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by denphone (Post 35995442)
You simply have no ideal what Amazon's business model is based upon apart from that is very clearly based on the business numbers adding up and they do not add up for the Premier League TV rights as they never have and never will.

Amazon's outlays on big sporting rights have always been based on purchasing American sports rights as America's potential captive audience is far vaster then ours.
We'll see, Den, we'll see. I know that nothing will shake you from that view until it happens. I would just like you to contemplate that Amazon's resources are far greater than Sky's so if Sky was able to go for the Premiership rights, so could Amazon. If they have the will to do it, whatever their justification, they will just do it and they will outbid Sky.

---------- Post added at 12:45 ---------- Previous post was at 12:37 ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by muppetman11 (Post 35995467)

I remember you predicting that Netflix when it launched in the UK would obliterate Sky for the rights to the movie studios. How did that go ?

The Sports leagues are more likely to dip their toes in the water with OTT direct to consumer in territories they have smaller financial returns to see the viability before looking to launch elsewhere.
It's too early to say, given the Sky currently holds the rights to most of the film studios. The crunch will come at the end of those contracts.

In the meantime, though, something has changed. Some of the film studios are now contemplating a direct to customer approach. The launch of Disney + later this year is an example of this (already happening with the launch later this year of Disney +).

So I do believe that I am being proved right on the films moving away from Sky and onto streaming, but they will not necessarily go to Netflix.

muppetman11 20-05-2019 13:03
Re: ESPN, BT, Euro, Premier and Sky Sports news
 
Oh dear OB that's the funniest way ever of saying you were wrong.

The movie studios may go direct to consumer not on a third party streaming service so nothing like you suggested but nice try.:D

Politics could be the job for you.


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