Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Apparently there is a pandemic raging atm, no one will risk there lives for a few poxy daffs ,not sure Eu citizens can get the required vaccines to enter the country for work due to eu oversight and arrogance :)

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Yup, even without Brexit I doubt people would be rushing across Europe for a seasonal job in the middle of a pandemic!

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Anyone UK citizen doing that work wouldn't qualify for a vaccine within the UK plan as far as I'm aware, and I'm also not aware of any country in the world prioritising cross-border work for vaccines.

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

I think what they mean is

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

It's just bizarre the Daily Mail publishing the story on so many levels!

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

They are British daffodils so they need saving....

Wonder what it will be like when the Daily Fail realises Johnny Foreigner isn't queuing up to care for our increasingly elderly population. Or are Daffs more important ? Discuss.....

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Bloody foreigners, not coming over here and picking our flowers, as for the elderly the government only cares about them every 4-5 years or so I guess like the foreigners, they don't care

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Are flower shops open?

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Supermarkets are, which is where we buy our daffs from.

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

What are your thoughts, Andrew? I know you will try your best to be impartial...

:D

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

From my English perspective, this is the deal that the UK government signed up to. We should obviously honour it, and continue with construction. Red tape increases this March and April so we need the facilities built and the bureaucrats recruited to minimise delays between GB and NI.

But I don't live in NI and it might be politically savvy to slow construction down if the climate is not condusive.

Unfortunately, all your predictions about uninvented technologies solving the Irish border situation never came to pass.

Good call. :D

Leaving the EU without an NI agreement in place? This would have breached the Good Friday Agreement. WTO membership by the EU and UK would require have required a treaty-breaching hard border on the island of Ireland.

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

The reason it was banned in the EU WASN'T because it wasn't safe, but because it WAS TOO safe. How is washing with JUST air and water, safer than washing with air AND water AND chlorinated wash?:confused: If a method is found that is even more effective than a chlorinated wash(M&S did trials using liquid air), then automatically the EU would ban it.

If the chicken plants in Poland had been allowed to use a chlorinated wash, then the food poisoning there might not have existed or been a lot less.
Link

The real reason for the EU ban.

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

It was the only deal on offer, and to my mind, the sooner we withdraw from it, the better. The more the EU turns the screws, the more likely that the Johnson government will withdraw.

The EU needs to be careful not to overplay its hand.

---------- Post added at 01:11 ---------- Previous post was at 01:08 ----------

Yes, Theresa’s plan was never viable in the end. I admit to giving her the benefit of the doubt in the early days, but my judgement was misplaced.

I should have gone with my instinct. Lesson learned!

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Never viable? It was a non starter that tied our hands during negotiations and ended us being in the mess we are in.

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

That's not an option without a negotiated alternative in place eg GB also joins the EU single market for manufactured goods.

---------- Post added at 10:17 ---------- Previous post was at 09:54 ----------

WTO membership would require both the UK and EU to erect a hard border on the island of Ireland. That's a fact, not an opinion. Why on Earth did you think that Theresa May and Boris went to all this trouble to negotiate specific arrangements for Northern Ireland? :confused:

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-b...-idUSKCN1NO18I

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

This is a red herring.


I buy all the food in my house, and I won't buy US chicken even it was 99% cheaper than British.


Consumers rule when it comes to buying, look at the sale of EU items which IIRC has plummeted by 50%+.

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Because of the difficulty with consumers buying with cross-border trading, not goods in U.K. shops.

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Ouef...

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

In related news, Sarkozy has just been found guilty of corruption and influence-peddling!

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Sacre bleu!

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

pomfrit Rodney, pomfrit.

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Another classic from the Br'Express:

Then you read the article.

Italian exports to the UK have fallen by 38.3% but UK exports to Italy have fallen by 70.3%!

https://www.express.co.uk/news/polit...-de-castro-mep

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

https://www.ft.com/content/98404792-...f-905afaa91eb8

https://foreignpolicy.com/2020/12/09...uropean-union/

https://www.cnbc.com/2021/01/05/ital...-collapse.html

Italy is the EU’s current economic basket case..........will be interesting to see how willing France and Germany are to bailing it out, bottom line is they have no choice.

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

No comment on UK exports to Italy falling by more than double the reduction in Italian exports to the UK though?

(I'm aware that Italy changes its Prime Ministers more often than we change our sheets. :))

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Because given the current state of the Italian economy, and it’s borrowing, that story is an irrelevance and distraction of little importance.

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

70.3% > 38.3% so the headline without Brexit-coloured glasses would be around the larger figure.

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

I don't recall mentioning the EUs ban I remember saying I'd watched a programme on American food standards and was disgusted by what I saw and that if we let them into our market our standards would suffer or we couldn't compete

How is it a red herring if the food isn't labled which iirc is part of America's terms, that the stuff isn't labled

---------- Post added at 23:31 ---------- Previous post was at 23:28 ----------

It always seems to be an irrelevance, a distraction or of little importance though...

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Are you the trumpet player in the EU brass band?

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

We don't need VAR to see you're playing the man and not the ball. Try again!

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

The US is our biggest individual country for exports - wouldn't a trade deal help?

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

The US is quite a low-tariff country so a free trade deal that some promoted was never going to deliver too much extra value. The US is just discretely protectionist in other areas like airline ownership where it cites national security to keep overseas companies out.

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Well, I suppose one explanation is that it cannot afford the imports.

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-56262527

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

The risk is normally low handling cash, but in a shop the risk rises, as you could be handling cash from hundreds of people a day, which would increase the risk.

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

The EU looks likely to be taking legal action:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-56285874

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

I can't find the actual figures posted here, but here goes

I believe someone said our exports to the EU had dropped by 70% and imports had dropped 30%.

But that dosen't really meany anything does it. I if we export £500,000,000 and they import £2,000,000,000. surely there loss is bigger than ours

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

The statement from Ireland's Minister for Foreign Affairs Simon Coveney that the EU is: “negotiating with a partner it simply can’t trust” [BoJo's Government] is bad news for the UK. He's a very measured individual.

The Irish have been the least hawkish towards the UK of any EU 27 country. If Frost and BoJo have brought Dublin to this point, then the EU will only take a stronger approach with the UK.

The influence of the Irish on the US should not be underestimated either. The Democrats view the Good Friday Agreement as a great foreign policy achievement and will defend it robustly. And now Ireland is reaching out to the US.
https://www.irishtimes.com/news/poli...rise-1.4501676

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

2019 figures

https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk...ings/cbp-7851/

UK -70% of £294 billion = £206 billion drop
EU - 30% of £374 billion - £112 billion drop

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Yeah ... 'least hawkish' is absolute BS Andrew. Leo Varadkar was absolutely unyielding on Irish border issues throughout the Brexit negotiations. He enthusiastically gave the EU the moral fig leaf it needed to try to use the process to give the UK a punishment beating for daring to leave.

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

On the recent situation when the EU threatened to invoke Article 16, it was Ireland who told them not to.
If the EU and US are backing Ireland, who's backing the UK?

---------- Post added at 14:15 ---------- Previous post was at 14:12 ----------

Really?

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Not you, that's self evident.

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

I don't see what all the fuss is about :shrug:

Does Ireland want to trade with the UK? YES/NO
Does Ireland want a hard border with the UK? YES/NO

Depending on the answers, the EU needs to get its finger out :p:

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Strangely enough, that’s what Mao Zedong use to call the U.K. (in the context of our relationship with the USA).

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Probably not - I thought we were a loyal ally supporting a strategic alliance, working together to achieve a common goal.

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Regrettably, repeating an erroneous statement does not magically make it correct. The UK is in a bit of a pincer movement between the EU and the USA of David Frost's making. If he had asked the EU for an extension I'm sure it would have been granted. The days of the UK being able to boss Ireland around are gone and the boot's likely to be on the other foot if we continue to make large diplomatic blunders like this one.

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

I thought we'd left the EU and signed a trade deal. End of debate. :confused:

Why can't BoJo honour this agreement like a gentleman?

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Yes, that's what I thought . . in fact we DID sign a trade deal, but it looks like the EU lot now don't like parts of it. I'm sure Bojos' isn't the only signature on it either :p:

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

The EU is honouring its side of things. It's the UK that has unilaterally decided to give itself an extension in implementing agreed processes when it should have consulted with the EU.

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Apparently not, it came as a bolt from the blue. If it was going to take 10 months to get the systems in place then the BoJo should have taken up the EU's offer of a one-year extension. But BoJo couldn't resist the concept of implementing Brexit during the pandemic so the negative aspects are not as apparent.

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Probably after a few weeks of pointless discussion that led nowhere, the UK decided to do what it wanted, knowing the EU would either let things go or ring back with different ideas.

Much like ringing retentions on here :D

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Good to see the Br'Express is waking up to some of the issues that fishermen are facing.
https://www.express.co.uk/comment/ex...ndustry-supert

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Trumpeting another EU victory?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6bx5ZsR8P48

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

First the BrExpress, now the Telegraph is waking up to the trading mess that BoJo has got us into. Jeremy Warner, Associate Editor has Tweeted.
https://twitter.com/JeremyWarnerUK/s...93609478094849

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

I suspect you’re reading something into that that isn’t there.

If Warner claims that the VAT regime between the UK and EU is more complex than that between the UK and the USA, then that’s a specific complaint about the way HMRC is handling the transition to new UK-EU arrangements, or possibly a complaint that the EU is being obstructive,* not a cry of repentance over Brexit.

If you follow the Torygraph’s editorial trajectory over a period of time you can see that it likes Brexit and dislikes the EU as much as ever. It just absolutely hates Boris.

*Which would be another piece of evidence demonstrating we’re better off outside such an organisation

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Warner is claiming that since Brexit,
- HMRC is apparently clueless on new VAT rules
- there are now new charges
- it's easier and less costly now to import from the US, which the UK has not free trade deal with. Doesn't sound like we've got a good deal or implemented it well. The Buck stops at the top.

The Telegraph has paid BoJo millions as a columnist over the years. I'm surprised to hear it now hates Boris particuarly as he's delivered Brexit.

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Apart from some bloke shoving it on his twitter, are there any more links to this?


. . . or is it (again) just some random social media opinion that fits your . . . :p:

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

My ongoing endeavours to find good Brexit news and maintain my balanced approach to the subject have unearthed this. ;)
https://www.standard.co.uk/reveller/...t-b923155.html

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Jeremy Warner is Probably not "just some random social media opinion"...;)

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Has he published it then, with facts and figures as proof, or just passing his opinion on social media?

:D

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

I don't think that's good news, try again

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

it is if you're a duck.

---------- Post added at 08:23 ---------- Previous post was at 08:18 ----------

Brexit LIVE: Give us more fish!

minister claimed the country was being disproportionately hit by the Brexit quota reshuffle.

https://www.express.co.uk/news/polit...-boris-johnson

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

That is good news. Hate the stuff anyway.

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Not everything is doom and gloom. Teesside is getting a offshore windfarm plant that will create 3,000 new jobs.

https://www.gazettelive.co.uk/news/t...giant-20052856

There's also a major European manufacture moving to Teesside from the EU due to Brexit.

https://www.gazettelive.co.uk/news/t...sside-19984673

That is just me looking at my local area. This thread would make it seem like Brexit was the worst thing in the world, clearly not.

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Great to see some economic rejuvenation in this part of England. :)

Whilst I'd like to add them to the Brexit benefits list, I think the factory making wind farms is unrelated to Brexit and may be the same company as the one identified in the second article. We'll see, but I'm very pleased for the area.

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Teessides been going to get a lot of things over the last 10 tears not many if any came true.
Like the daily flight from teesside to london first flight canceled not enough passengers.
Freeport was coming to teesside when maggie was in charge.

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Slightly unfair to criticise the Loganair flight for being cancelled due to low passenger numbers whilst we're in a national lockdown....

There's been a lot of changes in Teesside in the fourteen years I've lived here, it's slowly improving in many ways. But, significantly more is needed. the freeport & wind turbine stuff is a great start.

The loss of the once hoped for snow centre (bridge to nowhere) is very unfortunate & I do wish they would stop with all the plans to build office blocks everywhere...

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Just seen this on the news about our decreased exports to the EU January just gone:

https://www.theguardian.com/business...-business-live

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Whilst I'm all for bashing Brexit it has to be justified, How much of this can be attributed to Brexit? And, how much is due to the ongoings of the past year?

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

I agree with you on that, enough empty office space in town.
I've lived in Gusborough all my life, I worked at ICI, my brother at BS most of our industries are now gone. Don't think the freeport will come to frution, sorry thats my opinion.

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Wasn't particularly bashing Brexit as I wasn't over concerned which way the referendum went. IMO there were both good & bad points with staying or leaving. Freedom of movement was my main bugbear, so i'm glad that's stopped. If we need foreigners to come here to work, it's now up to us who comes and on what conditions. Any fruit picking that isn't being done should be done by the asylum seekers that we're keeping, this way they are able to give something back and aren't taking jobs from British citizens.

I don't know if it's pandemic or Brexit related, probably both. The later bulletin said that it's too early to tell whether this decrease will continue or not.

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Our doctor was swamped by Poles last time I was able to leave the house. I do hope that Brexit now means we are no longer sending Child Benefit for their kids living in Poland whilst cuts are being made to the benefits of disabled people over here.

Last time I was in London, I saw EU migrants living in the subways and aggressively begging (bordering on intimidating & mugging people). At Marble Arch they were defecating in local parks. Even my cat buries it's waste, but these didn't.

They routinely defrauded our social security system when I worked for them to get around the rule that was introduced to try and stop them coming here and signing on straight away for JSA.

These are some of the reasons I don't want FOM & hope we've got rid of them.

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

How did you know they were EU migrants? (not, say, from Syria, Afghanistan, Somalia, Libya, Turkey, Albania, Bosnian, Serbian, or other non-EU countries).

Also, you can’t sign on for JSA unless you have an NI number, which you can’t get unless you’re "legal".

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

There was a programme on BBC1 around the same time. It showed the police moving them on from the area because they were making a nuisance of themselves by living in bushes in parks etc. Everytime they moved them on, they made a nuisance of themselves elsewhere. When moved from there, they'd move back to the original place, so it was a thankless task. These people tended to come from poorer countries & used everything they had to get a flight here to 'make their fortune'. This tended to be crime, benefit fraud, prostitution, shoplifting etc.

There were calls to make it a condition of EU migration that one had to have a job & accomodation in place before coming, i'm not sure how far Cameron got with this. I'm guessing the EU blocked it like they did his efforts to curtail their rights to claim benefits.

They were from Romania, so were legal and able to get a NI number. However, it's not difficult to obtain a NI No if you're not entitled to one. Thousands of illegal immigrants have been issued with one when they shouldn't have been and they are available to buy on the black market. These are usually obtained by people pretending to be a deceased child that has come of age or by stealing someones identity who has emigrated abroad.

Sometimes the DWP will issue temporary NINO's (you can tell these because they always start with TN followed by six digits that represent the date of birth that the person is or is claiming to be). These don't show up on the computer system, so can be abused.

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

"No similar falls with rest of world "is concerning and can't be sugar-coated.

However, let's be optimistic, expect the losses to be made up in February, and hope we can put down January to stockpiling and teething troubles.
https://twitter.com/pmdfoster/status...998466/photo/1
https://www.ft.com/content/55f116d8-...a-94be4d379db0

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Thank you got this information - however, you didn’t answer the question I raised about this statement How did you know they were EU migrants,or were you just assuming?

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Yeah, our hospital is swamped with foreign Doctors and nurses too. Its outrageous they come over here and provide healthcare.

And those Poles, all they do is build our houses.....

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Controlled economic migration is a fantastic thing. It can, and will, continue. It allows us to plug skills gaps without increasing local populations beyond the capacity of services that councils and health authorities plan on a decadal (or longer) basis and can’t easily or quickly change. Most of the plumbing and heating work done in my house over the last 15 years has been done by Poles and Czechs. It can be difficult to get anyone to come out to this remote spot so I’m grateful for their willingness to graft for a living.

However, *uncontrolled* migration within the EU was socially unsustainable, which is why our democracy inevitably rejected it at the first genuine opportunity. The large number of Eastern European beggars on the streets of British cities are testimony to the fact that if you can’t control immigration, along with the economically useful immigrants you simply end up importing other countries’ social problems.

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Those payments were down to our own governments rules, nowt to do with being in the EU.

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

You would be mistaken - this actually happens in EU countries, the U.K. choose not to enforce it.

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

I didn't know that they were Romanian at this particular spot until it was covered on the BBC1 programme. I was surprised to see the BBC criticising immigrants.

---------- Post added at 15:49 ---------- Previous post was at 15:45 ----------

Those that plug gaps in healthcare were (and still are) welcome.

It's the ones that come over & claim benefits or take unskilled work from those that that need a job that were the problem. This also drove down wages for those that werd able go find work, often resulting in increased benefit expenditure.

---------- Post added at 15:50 ---------- Previous post was at 15:49 ----------

Exactly.

---------- Post added at 15:56 ---------- Previous post was at 15:50 ----------

Yes and no. These payments were not intended for this purpose, however, because the EU forbid our Government to treat foreign incomers any different, they had go pay them.

I think that this was one of the reasons why Cameron introduced the Benefits Cap & limited income related payments for children, in all but exceptionally circumstances, to only two.

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

Incorrect. EU nationals moving to the UK could not sign on and start claiming benefits.

Cameron introduced the benefits cap as it's popular in the Conservative Party and ticked the austerity box.

Re: Britain outside the EU
 

They couldn't sign on for any unemployment benefits straight away as that was stopped. Instead they claimed and/or abused the in work benefit system eg Working Tax Credits, Housing Benefit, Council Tax Support or claimed income related benefits related to sickness, children, retirement, disability, retirement etc.