Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Proper hard-core seps are republican, for the most part. The GuessNP strategy is to hoodwink large numbers of ordinary voters that they can safely vote for the motion on the basis that nothing much will change, hence the promise to keep the monarchy.

In private, the seps are fuming about this because the real driving force behind separatism in Scotland is not a hankering after the good old days of Rabbie Burns, clans and crofts, it's a fairly hard left, radical urge to build a new nation state from scratch.

If you want to know what a proper hard-core separatist sounds like, read some of the proclamations from the likes of the Scottish Greens; Patrick Harvie is their leader. They're republican, if coy of saying so too loudly. Also see the Scottish Socialist Party, if you can wipe the tears of laughter away long enough to actually read their website.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

So, the Will of the People only counts if they agree with you?

Very democratic.....:dozey:

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

So that would be a no then, independence only on your terms and when it suites you so it seems.

By the way I think you'll find its the other way round you'll be sharing their wealth as they have a quarter of the oil, but I'm sure that's got nothing to do with it.

J

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Well i don't think he will come back on here after the NO vote ;)

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

The majority of Scots think likewise apart from the unionist mob but then again that's to be expected.

Sob in my whisky.

Correct.

If by chance you ever decide to visit Scotland then take a trip up the A9,it's the main route to the highlands,countless deaths year in year out.
I've been down south on numerous occasions,not so much recently though,the roads down south are either 3/4 lanes,the route to the north of Scotland is a bottleneck yet Downing St see fit to spend billions in England on a rail track cutting 40 minutes off a journey,wow,fantastic.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Please stop acting like you talk for the rest of us in Scotland, you don't. You're just some idiot on a forum playing a pantomime version of a Scotsman.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

:confused: this has what to do with independence for Shetland and Orkney?

Somehow your trying to link unsafe roads and capacity problems on roads and trains to independence.

J

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

If you actually took a look in to the real world you will actually find that most folk don't care either way about the royal family.

Leave them be and do their thing.

I am very much of the opinion that Scotland and the rest of the UK needs each other.

Salmonds idea of independance is totally a fantasy. Its not real independance at all. He still plans on keeping ties with the UK and support from the English banks.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Wow!

Just "wow!'

Your contempt for your fellow voters differing views shows you for what you are.....:erm:

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Don't let Jimi bother you. I think he is on the wind up. Who on earth types in Scottish and posts pictures of Alex Salmond?

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Alex Salmond?

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

YE GODS MAN! He has even joined Cable Forum...:erm::shocked:

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

pathetic argument

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Oh no I'm not.:D

It helps if we have decent roads to get us to Orkney/Shetlanid Isles.

:p::p::p:

:D:D:D

---------- Post added at 23:13 ---------- Previous post was at 23:10 ----------

BTW,I see you lot have chased WAD 2002 with all your ranting and ravings on this forum,no chance you'll do the same with me,I can't wait until September 19th when Scotland will be free,boy am I gonna have a field day with all you Hagars.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Again what do roads have to do with allowing Shetland and Orkney to become independent from Scotland.

If they wish are they OK to become independent and take their oil with them.

J

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

They are Scottish,they are under our juristiction,why would they want to leave us.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Think you need to stop watching braveheart haggis

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

:rofl:

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Maybe because they will be poorly presented in the government and be unable to influence policy and decision making.

The same way pro independence supports are claiming for Scotland in the current Union.

Maybe it will start off as devolution for them first, nothing wrong with that.;)

J

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

He's English, don't blame him for not knowing his Scottish history. ;)

The Danish/Norse Crown controlled Orkney and Shetland until 1469 when it agreed to hand them to the Scots Crown as a marriage dowry. However the paperwork wasn't completed properly, leading some of the islanders to attempt to assert Scandinavian land rights. This led to some pretty brutal suppression of the islanders by their Scots feudal masters around 1667.

In truth, if the islanders of the north wanted to, they could create a separatist myth for Orkney and Shetland just as valid as the one being spun for Scotland by the GuessNP. When someone says "They are Scottish, they are under our jurisdiction, why would they want to leave us?" it is just as ignorant as someone in England saying "They are British, they are under our jurisdiction, why would they want to leave us?"

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

I do not know about the Orkney Folks but the Shetland folk seem to be more attached and consider themselves to be Vikings and not Scotties. Independence for Shetland and Orkney I say, that will put a dent in the Scottish economy if the Shetlanders keep their oil fields.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Eh??? Considering independence hasn't even been voted on yet, it would be the UK as a whole that would be affected!

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

What if the Islanders want independence from Scotland if a vote for independence is a Yes.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

At this stage that's a tad hypothetical, do you really think that the islanders would get independence?

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Why not if the Scotties are going for it so can they.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

So all the oilfields are within the confines of the islands then?

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Too many mistakes in the joke of a film,terribly directed by an American who's acting in the film was atrocious.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Jimi, do you wear one of those tartan hats and an orange wig.....:D;)

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

:LOL:

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Interesting that you find revisionist history in the movies a joke but are quite happy to stomach and espouse wee Alex's fact free campaign for the future.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

He does and here's a picture of him

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

I'd like to hear "jimi's" views on salmond's "arc of prosperity speech"

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Nope,but I can visualise you prancing around like a Morris dancer.:D:D:D

---------- Post added at 23:19 ---------- Previous post was at 23:14 ----------

What on earth are you typing about you silly little boy.
Cameron is coming up to Aberdeen very soon,Alex Salmond will be 10 miles away,wouldn't it be so nice if Cameron to debate Independence,of course it would,will he,of course he won't,why,simply because Cameron has a yellow streak running down his back.

---------- Post added at 23:20 ---------- Previous post was at 23:19 ----------

You won't hear it but you'll see it because I'll rub it in big time come September 19th when all the results are in.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Course you will...

You appear to be confusing 'something I want to be true' with 'reality.....'.....

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

I have bookmarked the thread and your response so i can see your :bigcry::bigcry: when you lose. :LOL:

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Cameron himself doesn't appear so sure of a "No" vote at the moment. Seems it's anyones game.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Perhaps it'd help if I typed it in Scottish for you, I thought it was pretty clear what I was typing about but if English is your second language perhaps not and you won't be rubbing it in with me, I can't wait to see the back of Scotland.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Polls are still suggesting a No vote but doesn't hurt to be cautious.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

There's a lot hinging on this. The implications of a "Yes" vote are very wide ranging.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

We get a new flag if they say yes?

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Good idea, one with Welsh representation on it would be long overdue.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

For the last time we're not putting a dragon on the flag! :shocked:

---------- Post added at 11:18 ---------- Previous post was at 11:16 ----------

Maybe but again the poll suggest the vote will be No. I think devo-max will be offered if Yes ever looks like winning as well.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

I'm sure we could put a little dragon in the corner to make you feel wanted :)

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Polls are not always reliable as we all know. I sense though that you are probably right regarding a potential devo max offer intervention because there are a lot of people quite literally bricking it over the very possibility of a split.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

If they do that every other English county will want in on the action. ;) :erm: :D

Salmond is busy trying to pull the wool over everyone's eyes, he's wasted several thousand pounds of taxpayers money trying to cover up the fact he lied about obtaining legal advice and he wants anything but true independence for Scotland.

One way or another in the extremely unlikely event of a yes vote Scotland will be in a union of sorts with either the rest of the UK or the EU and will have external forces controlling large parts of its economy and future.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

In the words of John Paddy McEnroe, 'You cannot be:Sirius.'

---------- Post added at 12:11 ---------- Previous post was at 12:09 ----------

Always remember something,Scotland will ALWAYS be on top of England.:D

---------- Post added at 12:16 ---------- Previous post was at 12:11 ----------

Oh you mean the mythical St George,ha yes,:p::p::p:
Psst,did Santa bring you anything at Christmas time.:D:D:D

---------- Post added at 12:18 ---------- Previous post was at 12:16 ----------

Oh really,have you copy/pasted this from FollowFollow?

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Nope. It's clear to anyone with even the most tenuous grip on reality that the SNP will say and do anything to obtain a yes vote and then figure out what on earth they plan to do afterwards.

A few years back fat Alec was singing the praises of the euro and Ireland's economy. Now that's been shown to be a busted flush he is happy the tell everyone he can take all the good bits of the UK and leave the rest behind because it'll just happen.

He has absolutely nothing to fall back on and he's played the labour card of announcing several different giveaways all paid for from the same source.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

St George isn't a myth.

In true English style, I believe he was Turkish.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Why not,after all,England has taken all the good bits and more throughout the centuries.

Did he like kebabs?:p::p::p:
I like Turkish Delight.:D:D:D

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Deep fried?

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Yes being carried by England you mean, Alex version of independence proves that, it's like divorcing your wife but coming home each night expecting dinner and sex.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Not many here in the North East of Scotland, Jimi!! :nutter:

---------- Post added at 16:00 ---------- Previous post was at 15:58 ----------

A bit harsh considering we have quite a lot of Scottish posters on here who are against independence!

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

It's nothing personal and certainly nothing to do with anything anyone here has said, I've been campaigning/ advocating for Scottish independence for many years, imagine my horror when I discovered English people don't get a vote!

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

The young seem to want independence and in the some cases there are many grandparents that will be using their vote for what their grandchildren want. I asked my in laws and my parents as to why they have made this choice to use their vote that way and they simply replied we have had our future ... the future is for the young ... I know my son and 16 of his close friends will be voting independence, I still do not know ... I still am in opinion of we are better as one ... ;) much to my son's horror ...

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

I've seen a few mock referendum results from schools now and with one exception, following a campaign within the school and a series of debates, the result goes NO with about two thirds of the vote. The same has been the case at a couple of universities.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

I honestly do not think Scotland will leave the UK, but who know's. :)

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

English elitism is a very real and tangible problem.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

My experiences with visiting Scotland were not so good last time, I wonder how they'll change if this all goes through.

I'm not expecting everyone to be the same the next time I do (which I hope will be later on in the year).

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

That's a great idea,I might just give it a try.:)

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

---------- Post added at 01:33 ---------- Previous post was at 01:29 ----------

[/COLOR]Please do not judge Scotland on your last visit .... or the Scottish people....

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

I did, apart from the dinner and the sex bit it worked out fine

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

I think it's even further divided to a Southern elitism.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

I found the Scottish people lovely the last time I went there. I really like them :)

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

I think it's further divided into a East London elitism. Bloody Shoreditch gits.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

My bloody T just went flying across the carpet,thank you so much!!!:mad::D

---------- Post added at 15:03 ---------- Previous post was at 15:02 ----------

http://www.thelondoneconomic.com/201...ish-and-short/

Some call it the dismal science.##But, of all the referendum’s controversies, economics arouses the nastiest emotions.

[ADMIN EDIT] - you have already been told once, do not post links and entire articles. Do one or the other.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Dont you worry I'd never do that :)

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Attribution is everything....;)

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Yeah they sound exactly the type of nutter that should be in charge.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Okay Hugh,to keep you happy I'll post the counter post,its from the same link as above.
In all honesty,I wonder what we,as a population of just over 5 million people have,which England is so determined for us to stay in the union,this clown is basically saying Scotland will have no mates,BIG deal !!!


By John Close

MOD EDIT: Last warning. You have been told twice now post a link no need to quote the whole article.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

To be honest both articles are absolute drivel.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Aye okay then.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

FAO Hugh.
I've just popped intae a few football forums,Scottish ones.
Here's the findings,you can check out the brilliant Independence thread they have on jamboskickback.co.uk. you don't need a login tae browse the thread.

So far on JKB the results are as follows.

Yes 161 (53.1%)
No 105 (34.7%)
Undecided 37 (12.2%)

On Hibs.net the latest poll is...

Yes.66%
No 24%
Undecided. 10%.

Pieandbovril.com

Yes: 273%
No: 43%
Undecided: 27%

Celticminded.com

Yes. 76%
No 13%
Don't know.11%..

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

really :rolleyes:

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

About as realistic as Salmond's economic predictions... :D

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

If the Scots vote for independence can cable forum start a Scottish branch then no one needs to see jimi's rants and useless info. I've tried ignore but people keep quoting him makes the feature a bit redundant oh and just so you know jimi I'm all for whatever the majority of Scots vote for couldn't care less either way anymore a sentiment I'm seeing more and more from many people I know. Wouldn't want you to think I'm commenting out of panic you might leave the union.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Salmond's economic predictions........ Now we know where he gets his economic predictions from :D:D

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

This is just a wild guess, but I don't think you can call Hibs and Celtic websites the most likely places to get unbiased opinions regarding independence. If you want to look fair, I think it's only correct that you should show some figures from Rangers sites and possibly some masonic lodges.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Impossible tae post either,although I'm on FF it requires a certain amount of posts before anyone can access the den,as for masonic,I know the results but its a secret.:D

---------- Post added at 22:41 ---------- Previous post was at 22:29 ----------

Straight from the man himself,well done Tommy Sheridan.


http://youtu.be/h6GsEKrCvgw

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Oh look, a model citizen, when did he get out the nick then?

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

January 30th 2012.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Thanks Gary,

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Yawnnnzzzzzzz.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

I'm just on my way back from Edinburgh.

The campaigning hasn't really started in earnest, I didn't see anything on view from either side.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

http://m.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-...itics-26147783

Ooops. Back to trying to explain how having a currency controlled by Europe is better than one controlled by the UK or preparing to launch an economy based solely on bartering fried food, haggis and whisky.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Is it a definitive "No", that's the real question here. Most things I've read about this since yesterday talk about "Unlikely" and scaremongering.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Sounds fairly conclusive...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotlan...itics-26163637

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Yes, I read that earlier. Balls, however, is apparently to make a statement at a later unspecified date and he has, frankly, been wooing the Scots for months reassuring them of his committment to The Edinburgh Agreement and making noises about what he'll do for Scotland if / when he becomes chancellor. Suspicious? Me? Never.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

If a large enough group listen to ed balls and believe what he says a lot of villages are going to want their idiots back.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

The message is clearly co-ordinated by all three UK-wide parties to close off any lingering hope of monetary union between rUK and sepScotland. On the one hand, the official Treasury report sets out what would have to be put in place to make a Sterling currency zone work, and on the other hand all the parties who are likely to have a say in it have given their political response to the technical assessment, which is (unsurprisingly) that the United Kingdom does not wish to have a formal currency union with a foreign state.

Only the most deluded seps actually thought a Sterling zone was possible, and even then only since their high priest Alec told them to think so, because his earlier prophesies of Scotland's prosperity lying in monetary union with the Eurozone proved less than watertight.

And, let's not forget, the Scottish electorate are not fools, and polls show that most of them had already concluded for themselves that a Sterling zone was not likely to be on the table in the event of a 'yes' vote.

So: a separate Scotland will either have to resurrect Pound Scots, with or without Sterling peg, or else use Sterling as a substitute currency. All of these have risks. Personally I think once the minds of the voters begin to concentrate on how they're *actually* going to vote in September, this one issue will bury the Guess camp more effectively than any other single question.

---------- Post added at 19:12 ---------- Previous post was at 19:08 ----------

Be as suspicious as you like but don't take Ed Balls for an idiot. He's an English Labour politician who knows that his chances of future high office are much better with 50-odd Scottish Labour MPs sitting in Westminster than without them. There is absolutely no way he is going to do anything to make the SNP's job easier here.

The pre-briefing that has gone on over the past 24 hours is quite stark. Whoever is responsible for it has been able to point the BBC, the Grauniad and the Daily Wail (all of whom seem to have been at the front of the queue for handouts) not just to the conclusions of a report by Treasury officials, but also to forthcoming comments by the Treasury spokesmen of all three main parties.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Interesting article following up on this by Angus Armstrong, director of macroeconomic research at the National Institute of Economic and Social Research.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotlan...itics-26161046

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

"An idiot" is about the last (yet possibly most endearing) thing I'd take Ed Balls for.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

He's a bare-knuckle politician. He's not going to do anything to jeopardise the electoral advantage Labour derives from the Union. He will do anything to shore it up. Making concessions to nationalists that strengthen their case for separation won't figure in his calculations, but making concessions to the disaffected West-of-Scotland traditional Labour sympathisers who gave the keys of Bute House to Fat Alec in 2011, will do so.

Balls' speech will rule out a Sterling zone in the event of a yes vote but I expect there to be bribes a-plenty contingent on a big fat NO.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

As with every debate there are many takes.

"Scotland would not need permission to continue using the pound despite the Chancellor's view on the issue, and could continue with the currency in the same way countries like Panama and Ecuador use the US dollar, Sam Bowman from the Adam Smith Institute said today."

This will prove interesting whatever the outcome.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Of course that could happen. And the BBC and other news outlets have worded their reports accordingly.

What is under discussion here is what the SNP says it wants, which is a formal currency union, and what all of the people they would be negotiating with have said, which is that they will not agree to a formal currency union.

All currency options are not equal. The Euro idea was the SNP's favourite because they *knew* a Sterling zone would render their cherished independence from Westminster effectively meaningless from the moment they gained it. Sadly for them, the Euro has shown itself risky, precisely because it lacks many of the checks and balances the UK Treasury has said would be necessary for a Sterling zone to work. The SNP has since been talking up a Sterling zone because they're trying to make the best of a bad job and because they know the Scottish people won't want a newfangled currency in their pockets.

Pointing out that Scotland could continue to use Sterling without rUK's permission is to completely miss the point. To give them their due, the SNP aspires for Scotland's economy to operate on a far higher level than any of the international minnows that are frequently cited as examples of economies that use a substitute currency. Sterlingization of an independent Scottish economy would be disastrous. Why would any large business located in Scotland choose to remain there, in the knowledge that Scotland had no central bank and therefore no means of rescuing its own economy in the event of any serious financial difficulties arising? The SNP might as well hold the door open and invite any and all businesses who wish to, to up sticks and move south where there would still be a powerful, fully functioning central bank that has proven its ability to keep the money flowing no matter what.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Some people in Panama may disagree with you....

http://www.sovereignman.com/expat/a-...ncy-wars-6161/

btw, it will be amusing if the SNP use a libertarian think tank to back up their arguments... :D

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Not my argument to disagree with :D.

Interesting take all the same.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Apologies - some people in Panama may disagree with the libertarian polemicist's take on things..... ;)

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

UK Chancellor George Osborne is live on Sky news at the moment explaining the governments position on the pound and should there be a yes vote in Scotland

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

The seps are in meltdown this morning. The over-riding impression is of denial mixed with suicidal defiance.

It is always good to be reminded that the SNP is a small-time, regional political party stuffed with third-rate amateurs and fronted by a gambler with a big mouth.

Re: Will Scotland Leave the UK?
 

Listening to a few people on the radio who seem to feel this announcement is tantamount to 'bullying'. This of course is what the SNP want - they'd quite like Scots to get all angry with the 'auld enemy' and vote accordingly. I heard one guy claim he'd hitherto been a 'no' voter because he believed that Scotland was stronger within the UK but is now going to vote 'yes'. Why? This isn't exactly a big surprise is it? Does this announcement suddenly mean they will be worse off in the UK or is he just spitting his dummy? This sort of emotional reaction to events is really very stupid but it's exactly what Salmond's Tartan Twits are relying upon. They're happy to promise populist stuff they can't deliver knowing they can then shout 'bullying' when it's made clear they won't get their way. I'd have thought most people would see through that sort of tactic but hey ho, there's nothing like a bit of nationalist resentment to fog the brain is there...

Anyway, at what point do such people want to be told the reality they're facing and what's at stake? Before they vote or afterwards? By all the parties concerned or just the ones with the message they want to hear? Can you imagine the furore if all this had been kept quiet - they'd then have been whining that they'd been deprived of all the facts by those nasty bullies in Westminster.

Really, what do these people expect? That they can walk away from the bad bits of the UK, look after themselves and be true Scots but keep the bits of the UK they quite like. Sorry but it doesn't work like that and these voters better be very sure that putting their future into Salmond's hands isn't something they can just undo if they feel like it at the next election. That's why it's so important that the realities are made clear. This clearly is a case of "damned in they do and damned if they don't" and frankly anyone who falls into the trap of voting on that basis deserves to suffer life under a party that's making it up as they go along and a leader who wants to have his cake and eat it.