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-   -   All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down (https://www.cableforum.uk/board/showthread.php?t=33631184)

Hugh 13-05-2008 20:09
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by the-cable-guy (Post 34551295)
not at all you misunderstood me :rolleyes:
Apologies, M'sieu l'homme-de-cable, I can only go on what you type :dozey:
Quote:
VM is compared to other ISPs
which appears to compare VM, a cable tv/isp/telephony company with "other ISPs", internet providers (ISP = Internet Service Provider, just in case ;) ), as SMH was talking about his TV/PVR/BB bundle.

TraxData 13-05-2008 20:26
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stuart C (Post 34550846)
That's the problem with this country. We obviously want good service, but we are not happy to pay for it. That's not specifically a rant against the consumer though. That "pay the least possible" attitude is running through our economy, right from the consumer to the largest companies. It is an attitude that, I think, will ultimately cause us a *lot* of problems.
If most of us could actually afford to live we wouldnt have to adopt the "pay the least possible" attitude.

If you have kids...but are taxed to the hill and back, have bills etc...cant afford TV but really need it (as you do with kids) then you'll try and get it for as cheap as you can.

It's no use applying the "if you cant afford something, dont buy it" attitude anymore.

Hugh 13-05-2008 20:31
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Why not?

Otherwise, it's just keep up with the Joneses, which is a spiral into self-fulfilling more, more, more - if we can't afford it, we don't have it; cable/satellite TV is a luxury, not a necessity (imho).

btw, I have kids, I pay lots of taxes - if we can afford something, we have it; if we can't, we save up for it.

TraxData 13-05-2008 20:33
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by foreverwar (Post 34551326)
Why not?

Otherwise, it's just keep up with the Joneses, which is a spiral into self-fulfilling more, more, more - if we can't afford it, we don't have it; cable/satellite TV is a luxury, not a necessity (imho).

btw, I have kids, I pay lots of taxes - if we can afford something, we have it; if we can't, we save up for it.

I think if you have young kids then having tv is a neccessity, but that's just my opinion.

I am from the view that if you cant afford something then dont buy it.

BUT there is instances where that falls flat on its arse.

Mr_love_monkey 13-05-2008 20:38
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by TraxData (Post 34551323)
...cant afford TV but really need it (as you do with kids) then you'll try and get it for as cheap as you can.
why would you 'need' it for kids?

Quote:
Originally Posted by TraxData (Post 34551323)
If most of us could actually afford to live we wouldnt have to adopt the "pay the least possible" attitude.
Not at all - it seems to be (as Stuart said) something that is ingrained into us - as a culture we seem to be unique in the fact that we think being thrifty when it comes to food shopping is a good thing - rather than worrying about the quality of the food we have we're more concerned about spending as little as possible - the UK has a very strange attitude like this.
I seem to remember reading that we spend less on food than most countries and pride ourselves on it

TraxData 13-05-2008 20:44
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr_love_monkey (Post 34551336)
why would you 'need' it for kids?
Rainy days, most poor parents have to work 24/7 to bring in a steady income, on time off they have to do house work, without tv kids get highly annoying.

Quote:
Not at all - it seems to be (as Stuart said) something that is ingrained into us - as a culture we seem to be unique in the fact that we think being thrifty when it comes to food shopping is a good thing - rather than worrying about the quality of the food we have we're more concerned about spending as little as possible - the UK has a very strange attitude like this.
I seem to remember reading that we spend less on food than most countries and pride ourselves on it
Wasnt ingrained into me at all, nor anyone else i know.

If im to be honest only people i know who adapt the "get it as cheap as possible" par from people who really cannt afford it.

Is "chavs" and lay abouts who dont go to work...just smoke and drink...

the-cable-guy 13-05-2008 23:14
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by foreverwar (Post 34551312)
Apologies, M'sieu l'homme-de-cable, I can only go on what you type :dozey:
:rolleyes:

Hugh 14-05-2008 08:42
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by the-cable-guy (Post 34551528)
:rolleyes:
Apparently the earthquake in China was partially due to the torque-induced precession to the Earth's spin caused by Oscar Wilde spinning in his grave at your riposte above ;)

Or perhaps it was due to one of your previous bon-mots in another thread
Quote:
haha p*sser
:D

LondonRoad 14-05-2008 08:58
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Sad but true. My 6 year old girl is the only one in her class of 29 who doesn't have a TV in her room. Do kids 'need' a TV in their room or do the parents need the kids to have a TV in their room.

Stuart 14-05-2008 09:22
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by TraxData (Post 34551323)

It's no use applying the "if you cant afford something, dont buy it" attitude anymore.
You don't *need* any kind of pay TV, even with kids (I count Sky and VM basic packages as pay TV, as you need a monthly subscription).

Even assuming you need TV (and I know people who get along perfectly well without it), then you could buy a freeview box for £20-£30 and just watch that..

Sure, the kids would moan at first, but they'd would actually get used to missing nickelodeon etc. and they will eventually find other stuff (such as reading) that occupies their time.

So, yes, "if you cant afford something, dont buy it" most definately does apply.

Mr_love_monkey 14-05-2008 09:43
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by TraxData (Post 34551346)
Wasnt ingrained into me at all, nor anyone else i know.

If im to be honest only people i know who adapt the "get it as cheap as possible" par from people who really cannt afford it.
So why are the cheapest supermarkets the most popular?

the-cable-guy 14-05-2008 11:37
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
good point.

Hugh 14-05-2008 12:25
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr_love_monkey (Post 34551777)
So why are the cheapest supermarkets the most popular?
You are confusing cause and effect - most people go to them because they have heard you shop at Waitrose...... ;)

the-cable-guy 14-05-2008 12:26
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
roflmao

Mr_love_monkey 14-05-2008 12:52
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by foreverwar (Post 34551861)
You are confusing cause and effect - most people go to them because they have heard you shop at Waitrose...... ;)
I tend to shop at all of them - it catches people unawares....

Hugh 14-05-2008 16:29
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr_love_monkey (Post 34551886)
I tend to shop at all of them - it catches people unawares....
What catches peoples' underwear? (corrected your spelling) ;)

the-cable-guy 14-05-2008 17:24
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
lol here we go again :rolleyes:

BarFly 14-05-2008 21:45
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
cant be arsed to read through 35 pages, a certain website that publishes codes today has posted the following on there website

Quote:
From this day forward posting of any new codes to the discussion forums is prohibited.

Existing posts and discussion threads remain in place, but no updates to code posts or new threads requesting for codes are allowed.

Thank you.
so looks like VM are putting pressure on the right people to stop the flow of these boxes & codes to make them work.

G UK 14-05-2008 22:13
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
It wont stop the hardcore technically savvy unfortunately, but not much will. It will stop many though which I believe is the target which should prove to be easily done.

the-cable-guy 14-05-2008 22:51
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
will it feck & 2bh it aint hard to find these sites. when i was looking for alternatives to the Cable Forum i found a few & i werent even looking for em.

Hiroki 15-05-2008 01:08
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Nah the codes are still up and around on certain firefox extentions.

I don't think vm are really putting the scare on them I think it's more to do with that bloke who got sent to prison for selling/using them :dozey:

the-cable-guy 15-05-2008 01:47
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
2bh if ppl want to hack cable bad enough they'l find away.

Hiroki 15-05-2008 01:53
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by the-cable-guy (Post 34552411)
2bh if ppl want to hack cable bad enough they'l find away.
Well it's been that way for years and with the old analogue sky.

People always want something for free and it used to be just a geeky thing where people who knew enough would be able to do it but now the plug and play boxes have made it easier for anyone with half a brain to do it.

It's interseting to read up about the boxes and for the most part the normal people who use the boxes are expecting the end of them soon enough (nagra 2/3 etc) and the people who make the codes seem to be up for virgins code changes and see it as some sort of challenge to crack their encryption.

In the end as long as I am legal I don't care lol ;)

the-cable-guy 15-05-2008 02:26
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
well i pay for my services, but most ppl want everything for nothing.

Hiroki 15-05-2008 02:38
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by the-cable-guy (Post 34552426)
well i pay for my services, but most ppl want everything for nothing.
True and until Virgin invest it will be that way.

I used to want one as a second box in the bedroom because when I phoned VM nobody could give me a straight answer and I got quoted £5 a month and £15 a month...in the end I just moved the Sky box upstairs

the-cable-guy 15-05-2008 03:07
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
even if VM do sort things out, some ppl will still not pay cuz they can get away with it.

Hiroki 15-05-2008 03:11
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by the-cable-guy (Post 34552439)
even if VM do sort things out, some ppl will still not pay cuz they can get away with it.
True but could you have one of those boxes with the fear that you could be found out at any moment?

I know they say the talkback to virgin isn't there but they can tell where the signal drain is on the network so it's only a matter of time before they go knocking on doors.

I still don't understand why the hackers don't go after sky....lot more on offer there and a lot more money I would've though :dozey:

the-cable-guy 15-05-2008 03:24
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
well it doesnt seem to bother ppl. as for Videoguard its the only system that hasnt been hacked. many think that it has although the keys have never been made public, cuz the hackers are too scared of Sky & their lawyers. however whether this is true or not im not too sure but some ppl think so.

Losttheplot 16-05-2008 16:03
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by the-cable-guy (Post 34552445)
well it doesnt seem to bother ppl. as for Videoguard its the only system that hasnt been hacked. many think that it has although the keys have never been made public, cuz the hackers are too scared of Sky & their lawyers. however whether this is true or not im not too sure but some ppl think so.
I've said before, every NDS Videoguard installation is different. Although various companies use Videoguard, the smartcards are different on every system. Hence only people really in the UK are interested in looking at Sky's encryption.
When backdoors where found in Nagras smartcards, it wasn't in the UK. South America and Spain did most of the work. The backdoors that were found in South America and Spain were then used in the UK as some of the smartcards ROM versions were the same in the UK.

TraxData 16-05-2008 16:13
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by the-cable-guy (Post 34552439)
even if VM do sort things out, some ppl will still not pay cuz they can get away with it.
Not like TV is worth paying for these days anyway.

None stop repeats, very few good shows, none stop annoying adverts etc.

Enuff 16-05-2008 16:43
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by TraxData (Post 34553667)
Not like TV is worth paying for these days anyway.

None stop repeats, very few good shows, none stop annoying adverts etc.
I've been saying that for years... The licence fee increases every year but TV stays the same. But there's nowt we can do apart from get rid of everything in the house that is capable of recieving a tv signal. I wish the bbc would just scramble their channels so that if we wanted to watch we'd pay like we do with VM and Sky. But that wont happen because i'd bet they'd go bust! Nobody wants it.

the-cable-guy 16-05-2008 16:44
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by TraxData (Post 34553667)
Not like TV is worth paying for these days anyway.

None stop repeats, very few good shows, none stop annoying adverts etc.
so that makes it ok then does it ?

TraxData 16-05-2008 16:47
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by the-cable-guy (Post 34553696)
so that makes it ok then does it ?
You realise technically they aint stealing TV as the signal goes to every property...

The only thing illegal is decrypting the channels.

I dont think its right to do it, but i dont care if someone does..to be honest.

I certainly wouldnt pay to watch crap TV.

People who download tv shows are just as bad in that respect...and that's something most of us do...

the-cable-guy 16-05-2008 16:49
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
so your trying to justify it now hay ? stealing is stealing the signal does come your house, but watching pay tv that you having paid for is both illegal & wrong period.

TraxData 16-05-2008 16:56
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by the-cable-guy (Post 34553700)
so your trying to justify it now hay ? stealing is stealing the signal does come your house, but watching pay tv that you having paid for is both illegal & wrong period.
I'm not trying to justify anything.

I'm just sure most of us do worse on a daily basis.

I have more important things to worry about than someone decryption a signal...

You CANT steal a signal that is always entering the house, they are not stealing anything :confused:

the-cable-guy 16-05-2008 16:57
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
yes you can if its a pay tv channel that you havent paid for.

TraxData 16-05-2008 16:58
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Enuff (Post 34553695)
I've been saying that for years... The licence fee increases every year but TV stays the same. But there's nowt we can do apart from get rid of everything in the house that is capable of recieving a tv signal. I wish the bbc would just scramble their channels so that if we wanted to watch we'd pay like we do with VM and Sky. But that wont happen because i'd bet they'd go bust! Nobody wants it.
Actually, believe it or not, they cant give you a fine for not paying a TV license and having equipment that is capable of recieving channels.

I know they like to put adverts up sayin they can...but trust me, they cant.

---------- Post added at 16:58 ---------- Previous post was at 16:58 ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by the-cable-guy (Post 34553713)
yes you can if its a pay tv channel that you havent paid for.
That's not stealing.

The channel is already broadcasting.

They are just descrambling, yes it's illegal, but it isnt stealing.

the-cable-guy 16-05-2008 16:59
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by TraxData (Post 34553714)
Actually, believe it or not, they cant give you a fine for not paying a TV license and having equipment that is capable of recieving channels.


I know they like to put adverts up sayin they can...but trust me, they cant.

? you not paying ya tv license now aswell then ?
That's not stealing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TraxData (Post 34553714)
The channel is already broadcasting.

They are just descrambling, yes it's illegal, but it isnt stealing.
its both actually ;)

TraxData 16-05-2008 17:01
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by the-cable-guy (Post 34553717)
? you not paying ya tv license now aswell then ?

---------- Post added at 16:59 ---------- Previous post was at 16:59 ----------



its both actually ;)
I dont watch TV.

I dont watch anything by the BBC (or listen), therefore ihave no need for a license.

You can report me if you like, i know the law very well and trust me they have nothing to stand on.

Why would i pay my tv license when i dont watch tv? :D

LOL you have alot to learn, it's not stealing.

the-cable-guy 16-05-2008 17:04
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by TraxData (Post 34553720)
I dont watch TV.

I dont watch anything by the BBC (or listen), therefore ihave no need for a license.

You can report me if you like, i know the law very well and trust me they have nothing to stand on.

Why would i pay my tv license when i dont watch tv? :D

LOL you have alot to learn, it's not stealing.
? so why are you a member of a forum for cable tv then ? even if you dont watch the BBC's channels you still have to pay a tv license.

TraxData 16-05-2008 17:07
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by the-cable-guy (Post 34553722)
? so why are you a member of a forum for cable tv then ? even if you dont watch the BBC's channels you still have to pay a tv license.
Lol..common misconception.

Wish i could find the old thread @ cablehell.

You'd know just how little they can do about you not having a license.

I dont watch an UK TV...at all, none what so ever.

So no, i dont have to pay any tv license, thankyou very much

the-cable-guy 16-05-2008 17:13
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
if you watch any tv channels UK based or not, the law states that you have to pay a tv license.

TraxData 16-05-2008 17:17
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by the-cable-guy (Post 34553727)
if you watch any tv channels UK based or not, the law states that you have to pay a tv license.
WRONG you only need a licence if you watch LIVE transmissiong so you are perfectly ok to have a TV for console games and watching dvds, no licence needed. Just in case you don't believe that you will find it in the very small print at the TV Licensing website!

Quote:
What if I only use a TV to watch videos/DVDs/as a monitor for my games console? Do I still need a licence?

You need to notify us in writing that this is the case and one of our Enforcement Officers may need to visit you to confirm that you do not need a licence.

Please write to us including your name, address and the reason you believe that you don't need a licence at:

TV Licensing
Bristol
BS98 1TL
Quote:
Q:- Do I need a television licence if I only watch programmes received by satellite?

A:- Under the Communications Act 2003, you need a television licence to receive or record television programmes. This applies if they are received by a satellite, cable or land based transmitter. If you are watching any satellite service, controlled from within or outside the UK, you must have a television licence.

You may have been informed, in the past, that a television licence was not required if you received television program services from outside the United Kingdom. This was changed in the Communications Act 2003, and if you are using your TV to receive or record television programmes broadcast by satellite from outside the UK, you are now legally required to have a TV licence.
I dont use my tv for that either ;)

Russ 16-05-2008 17:26
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Back on topic please - this thread is not about the requirements regarding a tv licence.

harryboy22002 19-05-2008 12:50
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by TraxData (Post 34549719)
What makes me laugh is the posts on there say they are just complying with the law...LOL.

Wouldnt be because VM contacted them and demanded it be taken down (with the hosting company) would it ? ;)

some of them would report an old age pensioner for dropping a gig but in the street[lol]

---------- Post added at 12:50 ---------- Previous post was at 12:41 ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr_love_monkey (Post 34551336)
why would you 'need' it for kids?



Not at all - it seems to be (as Stuart said) something that is ingrained into us - as a culture we seem to be unique in the fact that we think being thrifty when it comes to food shopping is a good thing - rather than worrying about the quality of the food we have we're more concerned about spending as little as possible - the UK has a very strange attitude like this.
I seem to remember reading that we spend less on food than most countries and pride ourselves on it
if you fall into debt and the baillifs arrive at your door -they are not allowed to take your tv if you have children in the house [educational purposes] -that is why you need a tv for KIDS...

Central 19-05-2008 15:14
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by zinglebarb (Post 34524145)
why do people insist on calling them chipped boxes iirc there has not been a chip since the analogue days
I think its because of the reason you said above. People used to call them chipped back in the day and just got used to it.

---------- Post added at 15:14 ---------- Previous post was at 15:11 ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by TraxData (Post 34524205)
Not fixed, i think you'll find the keys change 3 times/day, so the max they get chans on is for 3 hours, you'll know that if u search those sites as well.

No need to change recievers/cards, it the encryption system thats changed, but of course, you already know that.
I might be thick or not know the process but surely if the key changes 3 times a day the max they would get channels for is 8 hours? :confused:

TraxData 19-05-2008 16:23
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Be* (Post 34555478)
I think its because of the reason you said above. People used to call them chipped back in the day and just got used to it.

---------- Post added at 15:14 ---------- Previous post was at 15:11 ----------



I might be thick or not know the process but surely if the key changes 3 times a day the max they would get channels for is 8 hours? :confused:
Worded wrongly.

But if i explain what i mean i'd be breaking CF rules :o:

Losttheplot 19-05-2008 17:59
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by TraxData (Post 34555515)
Worded wrongly.

But if i explain what i mean i'd be breaking CF rules :o:
I don't think it will be against CF rules to say the ECM keys change every 10 seconds or so on every encrypted service, the ECMs are not stored on the card they are sent in the transport stream. However as well as the ECM keys theres a Master key which is stored on the smart card, and its that Master key which is being rolled.

Its the way encryption works and is not a secret!

TraxData 19-05-2008 18:03
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Losttheplot (Post 34555576)
I don't think it will be against CF rules to say the ECM keys change every 10 seconds or so on every encrypted service, the ECMs are not stored on the card they are sent in the transport stream. However as well as the ECM keys theres a Master key which is stored on the smart card, and its that Master key which is being rolled.

Its the way encryption works and is not a secret!
I know that, but that's not what i meant ;)

the-cable-guy 19-05-2008 18:12
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Losttheplot (Post 34555576)
I don't think it will be against CF rules to say the ECM keys change every 10 seconds or so on every encrypted service, the ECMs are not stored on the card they are sent in the transport stream. However as well as the ECM keys theres a Master key which is stored on the smart card, and its that Master key which is being rolled.

Its the way encryption works and is not a secret!
you'v got it in one there ;)

Enuff 19-05-2008 18:23
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Are the boxes still going down?

the-cable-guy 19-05-2008 20:01
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
from what some ppl having been claiming no.

coyle04 22-05-2008 10:37
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Do you think the new software application that Virgin has rolled out will affect the dodgy boxes in the near future?

the-cable-guy 22-05-2008 11:45
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
? how will a software update effect a non VM receiver ? cuz thats what most hackers use.

golden boys 22-05-2008 16:39
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
if people can get these services for free why not. virgin are the biggest bunch of crooks and the worst company i have ever had the misfortune of dealing with if people stop putting money their way, fair play. Let them enjoy the free cable!!!!!!!!!

the-cable-guy 22-05-2008 16:50
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
while VM are @£$& that doesnt mean that ppl should steal, two wrongs dont make a right.

golden boys 22-05-2008 16:54
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
its not stealing it initiative

Druchii 22-05-2008 16:55
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by golden boys (Post 34557746)
its not stealing it initiative
No matter how you wrap it up, it IS stealing. It's also, by a short stretch, foul of the rules of the use of this site.

the-cable-guy 22-05-2008 17:00
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
well said :D

golden boys 22-05-2008 17:06
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
im just saying fair play. theses services are totally overpriced for what you get especially the charges virgin charge

shawty 22-05-2008 17:11
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by golden boys (Post 34557733)
if people can get these services for free why not. virgin are the biggest bunch of crooks and the worst company i have ever had the misfortune of dealing with if people stop putting money their way, fair play. Let them enjoy the free cable!!!!!!!!!
Because its stealing. Can I steal your car for free because I dont want to buy it off you?

the-cable-guy 22-05-2008 17:12
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by golden boys (Post 34557754)
im just saying fair play. theses services are totally overpriced for what you get especially the charges virgin charge
no matter how you try to justify it, you cant its stealing plain & simple.

shawty 22-05-2008 17:13
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by golden boys (Post 34557754)
im just saying fair play. theses services are totally overpriced for what you get especially the charges virgin charge
Then you dont recieve the services then. I dont steal Ferrari cars because they cost to much, because at the end of the day, they can only do 70mph legally.

golden boys 22-05-2008 17:15
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
of course you can no problem

shawty 22-05-2008 17:17
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by golden boys (Post 34557762)
of course you can no problem
Thought that might of been the answer.

the-cable-guy 22-05-2008 17:17
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by golden boys (Post 34557762)
of course you can no problem
you clearly dont have any common sense then do you :rolleyes:

golden boys 22-05-2008 17:17
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
what your all saying is if this was offered to you for free you would not take it? you would rather pay the costs each month?

shawty 22-05-2008 17:17
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by golden boys (Post 34557768)
what your all saying is if this was offered to you for free you would not take it? you would rather pay the costs each month?
Free if it was legal, some of us have morals.

the-cable-guy 22-05-2008 17:18
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by golden boys (Post 34557768)
you would rather pay the costs each month?
yes i would as im not a thief, stop trying to justify it you cant :dunce:

golden boys 22-05-2008 17:23
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
i aint trying to justify it im pointing out that most people would take it other than shawty who is just the most honest person in the world and would never take anything that was free as they are perfect

shawty 22-05-2008 17:26
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by golden boys (Post 34557774)
i aint trying to justify it im pointing out that most people would take it other than shawty who is just the most honest person in the world and would never take anything that was free as they are perfect
Ill think you find that most people would rather pay for it. I think you will find also that many people on a site like this will also know how to be able to get cable for free.

the-cable-guy 22-05-2008 17:29
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by golden boys (Post 34557774)
i aint trying to justify it im pointing out that most people would take it other than shawty who is just the most honest person in the world and would never take anything that was free as they are perfect
? whats it got to do with being perfect ? if you see a car thats unlocked with the keys would you just drive off in it ? its the same principle & you are trying to justify it cuz you keep going on about it.

---------- Post added at 17:29 ---------- Previous post was at 17:27 ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by shawty (Post 34557780)
Ill think you find that most people would rather pay for it. I think you will find also that many people on a site like this will also know how to be able to get cable for free.
good point as iv already said its not hard to find sites that give you keys, i found some without even looking for them. however as you said most ppl on TCF pay for their services & rightly too.

farsite 01-06-2008 18:10
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Raistlin (Post 34524456)
Code:
vmAction()
    if boxBeingUsedByThief {
        locateHouse()
        removeBox()
        grabThief()
        while thief != blackAndBlue {
          beatThief()
          }
      }
      else {
          giveGoodService()
      }
SYNTAX ERROR Line 01 MISSING {

harryboy22002 04-06-2008 14:45
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sirius (Post 34547077)
Indeed you are.
no- YOU

Mr_love_monkey 04-06-2008 14:51
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by harryboy22002 (Post 34567360)
no- YOU
That took you a long time to come up with...

Sirius 04-06-2008 16:35
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by harryboy22002 (Post 34567360)
no- YOU
You have to be joking. It took you all that time to think up a 3 letter retort :rofl::rofl:

My kids could have done it far quicker than that. :LOL:

Stuart 04-06-2008 16:37
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by golden boys (Post 34557762)
of course you can no problem
You can only drive above 70mph legally if you happen to own (or have access to) enough private land.

Quote:
Originally Posted by golden boys (Post 34557754)
im just saying fair play. theses services are totally overpriced for what you get especially the charges virgin charge
Fine. The services are overpriced. Go for Sky or Freeview then. Freeview is free once you pay the licence.

BBKing 04-06-2008 16:55
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
You can only drive above 70mph legally if you happen to own (or have access to) enough private land.
Or if you drive for the emergency services.

Stuart 04-06-2008 17:01
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by BBKing (Post 34567446)
Or if you drive for the emergency services.
True, but even then you are only supposed to do it under Blue Light conditions..

frogstamper 04-06-2008 19:59
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by golden boys (Post 34557768)
what your all saying is if this was offered to you for free you would not take it? you would rather pay the costs each month?
Why do you find that so hard to believe? you really shouldn't judge others by your own standards.


Quote:
i aint trying to justify it im pointing out that most people would take it other than shawty who is just the most honest person in the world and would never take anything that was free as they are perfect
I'm sure Shawty has his faults, but obviously theft isnt one of them.

hoggie 04-06-2008 21:56
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Talkback chip.

the new one is rather good.so chipping isn't worth it:D

TraxData 04-06-2008 22:16
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by frogstamper (Post 34567591)
I'm sure Shawty has his faults, but obviously theft isnt one of them.
Off topic but look up theft in the dictionary, recieving cable TV is not theft, it's just illegal.

The Signal is always going into the house, so you cannot steal it ;)

Stuart 04-06-2008 22:39
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by TraxData (Post 34567787)
Off topic but look up theft in the dictionary, recieving cable TV is not theft, it's just illegal.

'cause I was bored, I looked it up. Merriam Webster's Dictionary of Law specifically includes services in it's definition of theft.

OED defines theft as the act of stealing, but defines stealing as taking something without permission. It does not define what that something is..

Either way, it is illegal, whether you define it as theft or not.

Hugh 04-06-2008 22:39
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Oxford Dictionary
theft

• noun the action or crime of stealing

steal
• verb (past stole; past part. stolen) 1 take (something) without permission or legal right and without intending to return it

TraxData 04-06-2008 22:41
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by foreverwar (Post 34567809)
Oxford Dictionary
theft

• noun the action or crime of stealing

steal
• verb (past stole; past part. stolen) 1 take (something) without permission or legal right and without intending to return it
And there's my point, your not taking something, the signal is there, your just decrypting it and as i and stuart have pointed out, it's not theft, it is illegal though :)

shawty 04-06-2008 22:48
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by TraxData (Post 34567812)
And there's my point, your not taking something, the signal is there, your just decrypting it and as i and stuart have pointed out, it's not theft, it is illegal though :)
"take (something) without permission or legal right and without intending to return it"

You are taking that signal, decrypting it without permission on an illegal basis and not intending to pay for it, its theft, no matter what way you look at it.

TraxData 04-06-2008 22:52
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by shawty (Post 34567817)
"take (something) without permission or legal right and without intending to return it"

You are taking that signal, decrypting it without permission on an illegal basis and not intending to pay for it, its theft, no matter what way you look at it.
Nope, it aint.

As you said, your decrypting the signal, your not taking it anywhere, the signal is already going into the house, the only illegal thing your doing is decrypting the signals, which is not theft, no matter what way you look at it.

How can you steal a signal to which is already being transmitted to the house/any box you may have? you cant.

shawty 04-06-2008 23:02
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by TraxData (Post 34567822)
Nope, it aint.
Yes it is.

Quote:
As you said, your decrypting the signal,
Illegally, its not yours. Your stealing the signal to decrpyt it.


Quote:
your not taking it anywhere,
And? You dont have to take it anywhere to steal it.

Quote:
the signal is already going into the house
And, its still theft or stealing if you are decrypting that signal to watch TV services without inteding to pay for them.

Quote:
the only illegal thing your doing is decrypting the signals,
You mean stealing cable? You do not have permission to view it so therefor have to steal it.

Quote:
which is not theft, no matter what way you look at it.
It is theft, your taking and tampering with something that is not yours without intending to pay for it. Just because a signal is going in or not doesnt make no difference.

Quote:
How can you steal a signal to which is already being transmitted to the house/any box you may have? you cant.
You can, by decrypting it illegally without inteding to pay, there for you are stealing a service from a cable company.

Stuart 05-06-2008 00:17
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by TraxData (Post 34567822)
Nope, it aint.

As you said, your decrypting the signal, your not taking it anywhere, the signal is already going into the house, the only illegal thing your doing is decrypting the signals, which is not theft, no matter what way you look at it.

How can you steal a signal to which is already being transmitted to the house/any box you may have? you cant.
You are not taking anything physical, you are stealing a service. The OED does not define stealing as taking something physical and Merriam Webster specifically includes services in it's definition of theft.

homealone 05-06-2008 00:46
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Does it really matter whether you call it 'theft' or 'unauthorised use of services' - the principle is the same, whatever label you put on it ?

frogstamper 05-06-2008 01:20
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by homealone (Post 34567960)
Does it really matter whether you call it 'theft' or 'unauthorised use of services' - the principle is the same, whatever label you put on it ?
Thank you homealone, that was the point I was originally making, at the end of the day you would be taking without permission something your not entitled to.

Sirius 05-06-2008 06:48
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by homealone (Post 34567960)
Does it really matter whether you call it 'theft' or 'unauthorised use of services' - the principle is the same, whatever label you put on it ?
That's the problem here. There are those here who defend this thieving to the hilt. Wonder if there the same lot that think the criminal should not be punished as hard as the victim.

Stealing cable service is just that stealing and for that you should be up before the judge. NO If's NO But's.

Makes me wonder WHY some here defend this stealing so hard ?.

TheDon 05-06-2008 11:40
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stuart C (Post 34567937)
You are not taking anything physical, you are stealing a service. The OED does not define stealing as taking something physical and Merriam Webster specifically includes services in it's definition of theft.
The OED and Merriam Webster mean nothing when it comes to UK law though, and although TraxData is making his point badly, he is right.

The theft act is VERY clear on the definition of theft.

Quote:
A person is guilty of theft if he dishonestly appropriates property belonging to another with the intention of permanently depriving the other of it; and 'thief' and 'steal' shall be construed accordingly.
The key part is bolded. When you use an illegal box you are not permanently depriving VM of any property, therefore it isn't theft. It's the same as why copyright infringement isn't theft (no matter how much the riaa will tell you otherwise) as long as you're not physically depriving someone of something then under UK law it's not theft.

That's not to say it's not illegal (is it) it's just covered by different laws.

Stuart 05-06-2008 11:56
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by homealone (Post 34567960)
Does it really matter whether you call it 'theft' or 'unauthorised use of services' - the principle is the same, whatever label you put on it ?
True..

Kymmy 05-06-2008 12:27
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Sections 125 and 126 of the Communications Act 2003 (dishonestly obtaining an electronic communications service).

I think that might point you in the right direction especially as TV/Radio/Internet is covered under that act.

Kymmy

PS...full text for the act is at http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2003..._20030021_en_1

---------- Post added at 12:27 ---------- Previous post was at 12:07 ----------

Actually my mistake... The previous act covers Internet only and not broadcast services, which instead is covered under Fraudulent reception of transmissions which is sections 297, 298 and 299 of the Copyright, Designs and Patents Act 1988 (c. 48)

Kymmy

TheDon 05-06-2008 12:58
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kymmy (Post 34568191)
Actually my mistake... The previous act covers Internet only and not broadcast services, which instead is covered under Fraudulent reception of transmissions which is sections 297, 298 and 299 of the Copyright, Designs and Patents Act 1988 (c. 48)

Kymmy
Indeed, and that's where you can see why there's a huge difference between it being theft or not. Theft carries a maximum sentence of 7 years, Fraudulent reception of transmissions carries a maximum fine of £5,000.

I doubt as many people would use these boxes if they knew that if they got caught they'd possibly be doing hard time rather than just having to pay a fine that will be nowhere near as high as the maximum.

Ignatius 05-06-2008 13:25
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Interesting discussion

Does this mean that if NTL intercept my communications with web sites and use them for their own benefit (ie providing them to a third party at an agreed price so that adverts can be targetted at me) that this can be classed as unapproved interception of communication, and can, under the same argument, be considered theft? (or "fraudulent reception of transmissions")

just a thought

v0id 05-06-2008 13:34
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stuart C (Post 34567439)
Fine. The services are overpriced. Go for Sky or Freeview then. Freeview is free once you pay the licence.
Freeview is free once you've paid for the equipment.
You need to buy a licence whatever service you subscribe to ;)

carol_s 05-06-2008 18:15
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheDon (Post 34568174)
........as long as you're not physically depriving someone of something then under UK law it's not theft.........
They are depriving Virgin of income - which could be construed as theft (at least in my eyes)

danielf 05-06-2008 18:22
Re: All Chipped Cable Boxes Going Down
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheDon (Post 34568174)

The theft act is VERY clear on the definition of theft.

Quote:
A person is guilty of theft if he dishonestly appropriates property belonging to another with the intention of permanently depriving the other of it; and 'thief' and 'steal' shall be construed accordingly.
The key part is bolded. When you use an illegal box you are not permanently depriving VM of any property, therefore it isn't theft. It's the same as why copyright infringement isn't theft (no matter how much the riaa will tell you otherwise) as long as you're not physically depriving someone of something then under UK law it's not theft.

That's not to say it's not illegal (is it) it's just covered by different laws.
Does that mean if you dishonestly appropriate someone else's property, but you have the intention of giving it back (say in 25 years), it's not theft?


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