Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

I don't know what the revised AUP will say, but I am sure the current one says that no more than 3 devices should be connected to the network.

You appear to be assuming NTL will actively enforce the cap. There is no evidence (at the moment) they will do this. They certainly don't seem to have been enforcing the current cap very actively.

As I said earlier, they may only enforce the new caps in areas where people are getting slow connections, and there are one or two people that are downloading huge amounts each day, That is what they seem to have done with the current cap.

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

Here's hoping :D

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

And less chance of a Sexually Transmitted Disease with NTL broadband! Yay!

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

how's it going to annoy a lot of customers - no one is being forced to change to these new tiers - they will be offered the option for a £25 fee.

A download limit of 5GB for £18 is about what you can expect for that price -it's unrealistic to think you can have both a high speed and a high download limit for £18 a month. Stick with 300k if 5GB is too small.

a)because it would canablise the revenue by offering no incentive to purchase the £25 product and an incentive to downgrade to £18 and

b)no ADSL supplier offers a high speed and a high download limit for that price level.

If you want unlimited GB for under £20 a month you aint gonna find an ADSL supplier offering it unless you opt for 512.


I can see the high volume users being frustrated though - if they dont have the option to purchase more than their allowance of 40GB a month.

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

Gee. You lot cant half MOAN :p:

We would use our Monthly Bandwidth up just by reading this Thread... It's the SAME sob story of "I wont be able to download all the DVD's sell at the Market anymore... Please NTL for a extra £5 let us have Unlimited" :D

NTL offer a GREAT package. (Maybe service is not 100%) but where else can you get the Deal NTL offer??

TV, Phone & B/Band for a Low Cost monthly fee.

SKY & BT & ADSL = Lots more ÃƒÆ’Ã¢â‚¬Å¡Ãƒâ€šÃ‚Â£ÃƒÆ ’‚£ then NTL

I use NTL Analouge, Phone & 750kb for a Great price....

Some here will NEVER be happy (even if they had it for next to nothing.) :Yikes:

If this stays the same I am un-subscribing as I cant be bothered to read the same moans every other post. All Topics are covered. Untill NTL give us MORE info. Sit back, enjoy the service & zip up :p:

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

Hmmm-I have to say that I interpret the announcement differently....

Now to me that says that new tiers are coming for everyone. New customers will get them in Q1 2005, & existing customers have the option of jumping the queue & getting them now by paying £25.00 (which sounds fair enough in the world of supply & demand to me :) )

But I still read it that the current tiers will change to the new ones, it's just a case of when you want it & when you will get it.....:shrug:

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

I got NTL 512K access back in 2000. It was £19.99, then they increased the price to £24.99 and gave me 600K access. Nice !


I too pay 19.99 for 750k as was on original tariff and was one of those that bought my modem so didn't pay the rent on it. I still pay 19.99 though. Tried to upgrade to 1 Meg sometime ago and they wanted to charge me full whack so told them to stuff it as I didn't want another modem or theretically pay rent on one. Got all my terms and conditions out and everything but they still wouldn't have it.

I'll be sticking to the 750k unless they upgrade me to 2 Meg for 19.99. Can't see that happening.

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

I read it that the old tiers will be phased out - you pay £25 to move 'up' in 2005 or get forced to eventually! if you're forced onto a 5GB month allowance from a 1GB daily allowance then you have the right to moan and it would be pretty shoddy in my opinion. but nothing in that statement you quoted indicates people will be forced.

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

Does anyone know what the upload speed will be like on the 2mbit connection ?

30kbs?

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

I think we're saying the same thing...:erm: :D

I think that the current tarrifs/caps/guidelines will be replaced by the new tariffs/caps/guidelines.

I just can't see ntl offering the current range of BB tiers and the new ones just announced together.

So I think that peeps will be forced onto the new tariffs with the new caps/guidelines.

Just my take on it though.....:shrug:

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

And what would you know :p:

I read it as they will offer both new and old to begin with!! then i would opf thought by late 2005 ealry 2006 :Yikes: (ages away) they will only have the new ones!!!

but hey what do i know :D :angel:

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

Good point! :D

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

Is anyone else as bored as I am of this subject now? :shrug:

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

*Puts hand up*

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

and new customers will only have the option for the 'new' tiers. existing customers will be allowed to stay on the 'old' ones until there is such a small number of people left on the those that NTL think they can force them to change. much like they have treated the people on the £5 a month modem discount! :D

whatever the case, in my opinion the new tiers are progress and you cant stand in the way of it. and you also cant offer the perfect product to all your customers - some will have to compromise and move to the £25 option if the 5GB allowance isnt enough or ditch NTL.

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

What, in dispair of my post, or in agreement? :confused: :angel: ;)

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

not really but I wish you'd get a move on and get these speed increases implemented ASAP so I can then moan about how slow my 3mb connection is and how NTL should double it to 6mb! ;)

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

:LOL: OK, will do. :D:D

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

Both....:angel:

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

you moved to ADSL a year or so ago - are these changes enough to tempt you back to NTL? (assuming you can still get NTL)

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

:rofl: :rofl:

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

go on close the thread i dare you :p:

yeh neil so you coming back to ntl then?!?

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

What b0llocks. Comments like the above annoy the hell out of me.. Why are all high usage users automatically tarred as warez monkeys? :mad:

I don't want a service for next to nothing.. I want clarification of what NTL are going to offer in terms of supporting their ~50K 'power users'. The initial announcements do not include any details about the caps apart from stating that they will exist. Providing NTL don't try charging extorinate amounts for overages (and I don't change providers) I will be more than willing to pay my wack but at present the not knowing is annoying.

I have not hidden the fact that I simply don't beleive in caps. That will not change but as many have stated huge portions of the UK BBand market are going that way. If I have to suck it and see then I'd at least like some detail of what the sucking is going to cost :rolleyes: :D

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

In all honesty (& this is not aimed at any of the quality ntl associates we have post here), but I would never go back to having ntl provide me with any service I'm afraid.....

Having seen what goes on inside, & also at the top, I wouldn't give them a penny again.

Just being honest..... :angel: :)

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

Out of curiosty - what do you use all that bandwith on then?

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

a few points I wish to make.

Although personally for me I like this deal, the 24.99 is looking very sweet now, I think user's at the top end of the scale have a raw deal. We all know 900 gig a month is unacceptable but I think the cap should be more in proportion with the speed offered, I would think for the top tier 50-80 gig cap would be more suitable, and NTL might think about offering unmetered for £10 on top of any package.

Few will know that a company strength is usually by total turnover rather then profit, when BT got themselves in trouble they powered themselves out if it simply because their turnover is so huge, so profitable or not NTL will want to keep all of their customers. Also I believe broadband is the most profitable part of NTL's business and to stay strong in this area they should strive to satisy both ends of the scale, word of mouth is very effective.

Also have to agree on webpage loading points made, for user's who have bursty type usage (web browsing and email), once you hit 1mbit+ their is little difference, sure large pages with flash on will load faster but things like this forum will be like 0.2 secs faster, anyone who says they are getting 3mbit just for their browsing experience either has too much money to spare or is I am sorry to say dumb. Bearing this is mind 3mbit should be packaged up for file downloading, which is why I think a larger traffic cap is more appropriate.

We can talk about whats right and wrong, but which is worse?

1 - NTL and other isp's playing people for fool's who have little knowledge of the internet and letting them pay for a full broadband package just to get email and do a few hours of web browsing at the weekend.

2 - Customers downloading DVD's, games, linux operating systems etc.

End of the day its give and take, both the ISP and customers will grab what they can out of it and usually it balances out and both are happy, when one goes too far then the other becomes upset which is whats happening here. I think NTL have got it right with the first 2 packages but wrong with the top tier.

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

but all companies have bad apples in them! I assume you're referring to the way staff are treated and the redundancies and mis management and over paying various prats was at the top!

I dont think I can appreciate your point of view cos I havent seen what you have.

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

Orangebird, Nice way of saying "I don't beleive you. Please prove that you are not a warez monkey" :D

I use my bandwidth for a lot of uses. Too many to list but a few examples the normal web/email, streaming audio/video, remote admin, video messaging with family/friends, online gaming with VOIP, obtaining game demos (which seem to be averaging ~500Mb these days). The only one that is questionable in legality is the downloading of TV series not yet available in the UK from Usenet. All of the above LEGALLY eat bandwidth.

There are members on this board who know what my home network comprises. Many SME's would love the setup I have. Unfortunately mantenance/updates alone can chew up many MB's a week.

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

I absolutely agree, it's just that I never had a good experience with ntl in the 6 or so years I had their services (even before my involvement with NTHW.com)

Amongst other things, yes.

That's true, but even before I saw what went on inside, & the BS that goes on at the top, my experience as a customer with ntl was the worst I have ever experienced with any company, so even forgetting what I later saw/learnt, I could never go back to a company that gave me the 'service' that ntl did.

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

So what will happen if you where to reach the monthly 40GB limit after taking the upgrade to 3Mb service?

Will they stop you using it for the rest of the month, top-up fee the excess or what?

Also, is this limit only going to apply to the downstream, or is that 40GB figure a combined figure for upstream/downstream?

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

Sounds like you need a business connection, not a residential one then.

http://www.business.ntl.com/

IMHO-You are trying to get a cheap connection for non home uses, as you don't want to pay the normal costs that are associated with business connections. :angel:

& I'm pretty sure that D/L those TV series you refer to from Usenet must be illegal die to copyright, but that's for another thread. ;)

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

I'd disagree. I'm not a business, I'm a HEAVY home user. The only non home use is remote admin.

Hence my comments about questionable legality of such :)

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

No, it's not. I would've thought you'd seen enough of me on the boards to know that if I meant that, I would have said it...:)

[quote]I use my bandwidth for a lot of uses. Too many to list but a few examples the normal web/email, streaming audio/video, remote admin, video messaging with family/friends, online gaming with VOIP, obtaining game demos (which seem to be averaging ~500Mb these days). The only one that is questionable in legality is the downloading of TV series not yet available in the UK from Usenet. All of the above LEGALLY eat bandwidth.[quote]

And you do all that everyday??

I honestly think that a lot of bb users see a 'cap' and see red, without thinking about exactly how much you can download with said cap, and rationalising that whilst you may use 2,3,4,5 etc gig on one day, you may then barely use anything on another day... :shrug:

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

And as such, ntl (like a lot of other ISPs), will not continue to subsidise your 'HEAVY' use of bandwidth.

I'm not defending ntl's decision here, I'm just saying that if you don't want the restraints/limitations that your ntl service will soon provide you with, then you need to look elsewhere-such is the power of the consumer these days that you won't find it hard to find something that suits your needs better. :)

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

That's what I was thinking...:scratch:

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

Looking at the business broadband solutions I must be missing something. 1.5Mbit Business broadband for £34.99? I thought home user 1.5Mbit is 37.99 a month?!?

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

If you are using multiple windows PCs, and have access to a windows server, to save at least some bandwidth, you might look in to Microsoft's Software Update Services (http://www.microsoft.com/windowsserv...s/default.mspx). It downloads all windows updates to a cache on one server. You can then direct the auto update service on Windows to look at that server. If you have multiple Windows PCs, it will save some bandwidth as you won't be downloading multiple copies of patches. You can control what patches are installed as well.

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

I have already stated such. Just annoying that I'll need to go through the aggrevation of changing suppliers, having new phone lines installed etc.

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

You are referring to the 'Lite' product from ntl business (whatever that may be?)

I can't actually find anything on the site that explains the difference(s) between the 'Lite' BB service, & the non 'Lite' one...:rolleyes:

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

It wasn't just me then :)

The only difference I noted was one was listed as single user and one was listed as multi user

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

No aggro at all...

1) Ring up BT, ask them to reconnect you. They will handle everything regarding your phone line transfer from ntl (you won't even have to contact ntl about your phone line! ;) )

2) Ring/write to ntl & cancel your BB service (sorry-not quite 'no aggro after all! :angel: ) & make sure that your cut off date falls just after your DSL activation date so that you are not without BB.

3) Choose a DSL provider that suits your (bandwidth) needs-Plus Net/Pipex/F2S all offer 'cap free' DSL products for example.

3) Wait for cap free surfing to arrive! :D

[Edit]-More info here: http://www.cableforum.co.uk/board/forumdisplay.php?f=63

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

http://www.cableforum.co.uk/board/sh...highlight=LITE

From what i understand is that its aimed at small businesses that have low usage :)

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

Nice one Scoob', but I think they should clarify the differences between Lite & non Lite-is there a cap/download guideline limit on Lite but not on Non Lite for example?

Does that make sense? :erm: :D

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

wierd isnt it! you arent seeing things though - that's the current structure.

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

Most days. The internet is the main relaxation medium for both myself and my sons. Even my partner is spending more and more time online due to the crap thats being broadcast on the TV (how many repeats can you watch!).

Unfortunately I know what my usage is (and I know that I am outside NTL's current guidelines before anyone screams such :D). I use a Linux firewall/router with full traffic graphing and thats showing a monthly average for the last three months of ~70GB per month.

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

good point - but how about going out instead? Reading a good book?


Please don't take offence, but that is a ridiculous amount for a residential service. :shocked:

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

yeh you made sense :D

from what i can make out by looking at their website is the 'lite' service is for small businesses only. with no limits what so ever, what do they class as a small business though? :disturbd:

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

The jump from Cable to Adsl isnt so bad.

I made the jump to Adsl ages ago i pay £39.99i nc vat a month for a 2mb connection without any download restrictions (usage unlimited) 3 month min contract. :)

Probably a topic for another thread but it would be interesting to see just how much an NTL customer heavy/light user uses in a month & then see what the difference is between the new restrictions (see just how much people will have to cut back/change the way they currently use their NTL connection)

Obvously if you subscribe to an alternative news binary service than NTL or a gamer then your going to be using your alocated restriction alot faster than those customers that dont subscribe to extra services.

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

When people go from the 300K service to the 1MB service, is there any way to pay slightly more than before (but not as much for the 2MB service) for extra bandwidth? Or would I just need to ring up NTL to have it turned up to 30GB for about £5 more each month?

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

Nothing beats roaming the streets in the evening with the wife and kids in the drizzle. And as for reading, isn't that what the internet is for? Now NTL is limiting it's use for text only websites...

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

Now that is a bit over the top. The 1MB service for ME may be, but not for other people (For me since I use the internet a lot, and I'm on 300K).

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

I'm sorry, I didn't realise the lack of imagination some members have.... :rolleyes:

No, ntl is not limiting it's use for text only websites, it was MPO. And who the hell reads books online? It's bad for your eyes anyway. :rolleyes:

Grow up and reply constructively or not at all. :)

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

rubbish, utter rubbish!!

most users will not be affected by the new guidelines so your above statement is Rubbish!! (IMO :angel: )

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

But surely this is only the start? If bandwidth costs are sky rocketing by this time next year we'll all be sitting on 1gbit connections with a 20mb a month usage limit. People are making out anyone downloading 31gb a month is the spawn of satan, the real issue is NTL's infrastructre. The more customers they attract with these news high speed deals, the less everyone else will be allowed to download.

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

Check out Force9 ADSL service. They have a premier and lite user package for thier home users. I feel most ISPs will use the same format. The premier user will pay for example £29.99 for 1mbit connection, unlimited download. The lite user will pay £14.99 for the same connection with a 1 gig per month download limit, but you can increase it up to 10 gig, but the price goes up with each gig.

I feel it's inevitable and soon all ISPs will be placing a download cap of some sort :(

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

I am in the same position in that i am a heavy user and know how much i use per month :Yikes: . I will move to the 3 meg service and "I dont know the full details so don't think this is what will happen"if they introduce some form of hard cap i would hope they will allow me to

A. See what i have used.
B. Inform me when i am close to my limit.
C. Allow me to pay more for the extra i use. If i use it then i should pay for it.

At the moment this is all guess work as the full info has not been released so i for one will wait and see what happens :scratch:.

Therefor as this seems to be a :notopic: cap thread i will go put my feet up and watch from the sideline. Untill we get back on track.:disturbd:

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

Force9 / Plus.net ya.

My one concern about plus although I've heard a lot of good things about them is that since they switched their buying method from BT they are running their network bloody close to the wire now:

http://www.plus.net/support/adsl/adsl_utilisation.shtml

Bear in mind that last week they added another 155Mbps.

I was considering their services, 2Mbps, no limits for £40 a month is a good deal, I'm just rather nervous about how viable it is and how close to its' limits they are running their connectivity. They lose a single 622Mbps circuit from BT and it's congestion city, they lose a single 155Mbps and it's marginal :erm:

In ntl's case core network is more than capable of supporting twice the load it currently does, and very few users see congestion, the uBRs as a whole have a lot of overhead free now due to the big upgrades that have been done.

Just a comparison of one to another. I'm very not convinced that Plus is viable in the long term, their profit margin is tiny, and they are shortly to move all their users on home 2Mbit from the 20:1 contention BT network to the nominal 50:1, which is currently showing oversubscription in 10% of BT's exchanges (better than the 15 - 20% it was a fortnight ago).

I'd also like to take this opportunity to mention why BT aren't offering 3Mbps as a business service, and are only now getting around to offering a home version of 2Mbps - their network can't handle it. They backhaul over 90% of UK DSL, and their network simply can't handle the extra load right now.

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

Now i have heard it all :rofl:.

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

No offence taken. That is your view. Most people would also think that my home network is ridiculous but apart from working in IT its also my hobby (an expensive hobby granted but a hobby non the less).

The fact that I hold a senior IT role in the Internet department of a major UK corporation/content provider does mean that I have a very tech savvy family. My youngest son, 13, could run rings round some of the IT techs I work with meaning that we are not the average net using family and our usage is accordingly higher.

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

With all due respect, the bandwidth dynamics of a major UK corporation, which doesn't have an access network as such, and those of a cableco which runs its' own access network and can't add bandwidth to that network or segment it just by adding a switch and some CAT5/6 runs are two very different things.

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

You need to get a better monitor or glasses (no offence :D). I find reading on my IBook as easy as reading a book and I do read online (OReilly bookshelf for example). I have a wireless network in place so I can read anywhere in the house (although reading on the IBook in the bath is a problem :D).

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

Bandwidth costs are not skyrocketing at all. Usage allowances, caps, or whatever you want to call them are there to enable most users to enjoy a satisfactory internet experience for most of their time online. The mechanics of it are that each user is sharing a UBR card with many other users. There is a fixed, finite amount of bandwidth available on thet UBR card that all these users have to share. It only takes a relatively low number of users who try to max their downloads and uploads 24/7 to create problems for all other users on that card. It is no good saying that users can have unlimited bandwidth for a slightly higher price because the maths still stay the same. To provide extra infrastructure to cater for everyone having an unlimited service with little deterioration to their service would increase the price of the service quite substantially and then the ones complaining that the cap was too low would be saying that the price was too high.

It's quite simple really. NTL are offering a service at a fixed price for you to use within the guidelines that they set. For me and the majority of NTL customers they are offering a damn good deal that nobody else is matching. If the deal doesn't suit your requirements then shop around for one that does. I would advise waiting to see how this develops as we do not know what will happen when you have used up your allowance. Wait and see.

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

Seen as you are not an average family with your usage, maybe you need to go to not an average ISP for your connection ;)

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

I wasn't trying to compare the two (and in all honesty I'm not involved in that area of the companies IT). I manage and maintain the corporate internet sites which are co-lo'd away from the main corporate network. I was mearly trying to point out that my family and I don't fit into the "wheres the any key" type average family.

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

I'm sure he'd show up some of ntl/IBMs IT staff too.... :erm:
IMPO though, 13 year old children should be running round fields playing sports etc. :)

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

Very good points which I have reiterated previously. I just wish NTL had divuldged more details instead of making a marketing release and leaving the detail to be guessed at:)
OK point taken. I'll shut up now :)

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

With even more respect I'd suggest that should your fears come true you should seek service elsewhere. Major ISPs necessarily cater to the "where's the any key" type average family, there are a few ISPs intended for heavier usage, they tend to come with a quality of service or price tag to match though!

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

With all due respect, this thread is just going round in circles, with the same points being made and questions raised over and over again. Is it not possible to suspend the thread until more info is released? This would avoid interested people like me having to read through several pages of repetetive posts each day, in the hope of finding some NEW information.

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

The problem is that NTL and good communication sometimes seem to be (to badly paraphrase Douglas Adams) a total mismatch of concepts, much the same as the Suez Canal getting up and popping out for a cup of tea.*

*Yes, I know that is not exactly what is said, but I cannot remember the exact quote and I can't find it on the web.

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

Hmm , I leave the thread for a bit, and it ends up as yet another round in circles "CAP" thread. :afire:

This is not about the cap - if that is your issue, then look at other threads that are about the cap.
(sorry but this bugs me when I read page after page of "great Higher speeds and a cap means I will have to upgrade" :afire: )
This is about NTL announcing higher speeds for their customers, for the same price as the current speed. :clap:

My only issue is the £25 "admin fee" which I will happily pay on the assumption that new customers will have to pay some form of installation fee.

If, however , by paying the £25 I am not tied in to a 12 month contract, then I don't care whether new customers have to pay for installation or not...

Why can't people just be pleased that NTL are going to be providing one of the fastest services available in the UK.

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

Just because you are pleased with the news, doesn't mean everyone has to share your opinion. :)

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

to be honest though i am suprised about the amount of negative reaction when we still only know half the story :erm: seems strange thats all, as on the face of it, it will benefit alot of users

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

I'd also question wether discussion of the cap is off topic in this thread due to that fact that Caps appear to be a significant part (for some) of the new speeds.

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

I wouldn't argue with you either m8. :)

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

To be honest, caps are the only thing that can be talked about. If all that NTL was doing was increase speeds for the same price there would only need to be an announcement and a number of "well done NTL" posts. Although there would probably be a few members that would consider they were being hard done to if the new speeds were completely uncapped. :)

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

On a different note (to my recent kill the cap posts) for users troubled by the £25 fee. I'd expect that for 750K STB users a box swap out will be needed unless you already have a Samsung box?

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

39 pages, and i THINK this is the first post to spot THAT one!

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

Do I get a prize :D

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

:beer:

Best I can do.

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

Nice spot. I have my original Pace 1000 box taht I got in January 2000 and would be loathe to loose it - but there you go.

I suspect you are right and thats why ntl are charging a blanket £25 - as a shed load of people with STBs will need the new Samsung.

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

Oi, that should have been mine. :) http://www.cableforum.co.uk/board/sh...&postcount=201

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

Sorry - I did post earlier about the repetetive nature of this thread - compensation?


:beer: :beer: :beer:

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

hmm I cant help thinking you are being repetetive in your moaning about this thread being repetetive!
:D

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

You are correct - give that man a clap on the back ;)

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

Also, I can't spell repetetive!

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Tell them you want a SACM, it can be done, that way you'd keep your trusty old box!:D

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In my case, my Pace box, on the old 1MB service, used to drop the connection at least one a day, requiring a reboot of the router and/or the STB nearly every evening. Since I got the Samsung, I have had ZERO dropouts. Well pleased!

Re: [Now Official] More ntl speed changes
 

Or repetitive even :p

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Ah yes, NTL's catch phrase :D (with the emphasis on 'wait' ;)).




More like the service is about 10%. There's no point offering cheap fast speeds if the service is crap. I'm much rather NTL charged more to be honest and use the money to invest in the network.


As for 5Gb cap on 1Mbps, that's dead easy to break through without having to resort to "dodgy" downloads, particularly with more and more legitimate on-demand media content which will run into 100s of Mb per download, e.g. BBCi's service, and things like linux ISOs, game demos such as Star Wars Galaxies which is a 2Gb download and then there are the daily patches, legit game downloads by Steam are fairly chunky. Even more so if the cap counts both downstream and upstream (especially if you run a web server or use RemoteDesktop/VPN).

And then you've got home networks with multiple PC users, PS2s and Xbox's all consuming bandwidth with legitimate content.

Personally I think the solution is to offer tiered caps and/or PAYG elements if you go over the caps. You want a bigger cap, pay a bit more. Seems fair enough and would be in competition with the likes of PlusNet who offer a similar service. Given the low prices NTL are talking about I'm sure NTL can match PlusNet's uncapped prices if not beat them, or at least offer sufficiently high caps at a price to keep everyone happy (so long as they can keep modems from rebooting all the time).



There's an article on it here...

http://bbs.adslguide.org.uk/showflat...1425869&page=0

Of particular note...
"If you look at Plusnet's Bandwidth Utilisation graphs, this shows that they are not exceeding available capacity. To put it into perspective, although it may look a little bit "full", there is over 150Mbps of spare bandwidth at peak times; this is more than some ISPs run their whole business on! "

The important thing is that it's a BT problem and could effect any ISP, it's just that PlusNet's success has meant they have hit it first, but as they have far more investment they have the capacity to cope.

So far with a month on the service I've not seen any problems and I've had 100% reliability (never seen that on NTL), and vastly better ping times with no packet loss (haven't had the luxury zero packet loss on NTL for ages). Just browsing web sites is amazingly fast compared to NTL. I put it down to the zero packet loss, low pings, no transparent proxies and better backbone connectivity (or generally better infrastructure).


I'm not so convinced "very few" users see congestion. NTL seem to need to do resegmentation on a frequent basis and there are many UBRs which seem to struggle. Though one of the problems is few users realise what their problem is, most resorting to either putting up with it or attempting to phone NTL and when they eventually get through, get treated to the "all users are dumb, it must be their PC" routine. In my experience it takes a lot of complaints for NTL to even remotely believe there may be a problem somewhere.

Remembering that congestion is a little different with cable. It's less of an issue at the fat-pipe end and far more at the UBR end, especially in the upstream channels which is where there are major problems.

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I guess I am totally out of touch, too much time spent reading this forum instead of getting out more. :D

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Sorry, Plus buy their capacity from BT, BT deliver what Plus ask for. Plus are running their network to the extent where loss of a single BT link will cause congestion. BT's balancing issues not withstanding I was referring to how little overhead Plus have and how marginal they are running their network.

LOLOL @ better infrastructure. ntl have the best core IP network infrastructure in the UK bar none. Wonder how many feet of their own fibre Plus own. Last I checked ntl owned about 7,500km of the stuff and managed a further 2,500km.

Sorry I'm really quite amused, comparing ntl's infrastructure to Plus.net's is like comparing Dell to your local PC shop.

I used an ntl modem in Southampton a week ago and was astonished at how fast and responsive the browsing and pings were. Both the browsing blew my 2Mbit ADSL away (this was 1Mbit cable) and the pings were nearly 10ms faster than mine.

150Mbps of spare capacity is great I guess, considering it's considerably under 10% of utilisation. The loss of ONE fibre link and ONE central pipe and the majority of their customer base will experience congestion. Their service is running really close to max, regardless of how many ISPs run with 155Mbit not many run their capacity that close either. >90% is really really close to the mark, most ISPs would consider their network oversubscribed running that close to max.

I did mention in private that the issues that caused your substandard performance had been resolved and were a fault. As you've kinda brought this into the open I'll say again they are fixed. 99.99% of users see no packet loss and pings unmatched by an ADSL ISP without living next door to their datacentre. Plus give you the sub-10ms pings to LINX I used to see from Hampshire?

I have reports of uBR ports showing congestion, though you obviously seem to know better than me perhaps mine are wrong and you have the correct version.

No there aren't major problems. Upgrades to 3.2MHz wide upstreams along with the massive uplift prep resegmentation program have all but eliminated these issues. I could count the number of ports classed as badly congested on my fingers and toes NATIONWIDE.

I really really really wish I could stick the report on a website just to show you how little fact there is in what you are saying, sadly I can't for confidentiality purposes. Either way a lot of people have worked long hours and damn hard to get the network into the condition it is in at the moment and are still banging capacity in to keep it good and prepare for the extra speeds coming soon.

By the way, while you are comparing ntl and Plus.net, most of ntl's Points of Presence could carry Plus's entire network traffic with room to spare to collect a couple of other medium size ADSL ISPs up while they are at it. Be fair and compare ntl and BT, the only other ISP in the UK with a network comparible.

I'm not saying Plus are pants, I am saying they run their network to the wire, that would make me a little concerned about using them.

Ah to be able to just order more capacity from BT and let them worry about it rather than having to worry about an IP network, an RF network that can require tens of thousands to upgrade a few hundred homes. :rolleyes:

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Now who does that remind me of....:scratch: ;)

ntl have run their network(s) 'to the wire' for yonks m8.

Where there has been little or no cash (for several years in fact-except where the cash was available as bonuses to directors etc), so let's not forget that. :angel:

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Several hundred thousand customers throughout the years will disagree with you there mate :)

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When will people stop accusing ntl of having a sub-standard network?! There is nothing WRONG with their network. Contention is a DESIGN FEATURE, if it goes slow, you are experiencing it. Infact, ntl have one of the best core networks in the country as far as shifting IP data goes. The only other on the same league as them is the Joint Academic NETwork, and both are well over-specced for the amount of data they carry. I believe telewest have a similar topology and speed, but on a smaller scale.

Stop moaning, do the sums, and get a life. 2mbps leased lines cost the best part of a grand a month, so that's what you should be expecting to pay for that level of service. You pay nowhere near that, you pay for a SHARED service. So get used to SHAREING it, and stop moaning.

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Ok...

Let's say four hundred thousand disagreed with me?

What about the other six hundred thousand BB customers that ntl have!? ;)

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Can't sit idly by on this one.

Are you going to produce any evidence to back this up, other than your own experience (admittedly poor, but unrepresentative)? Here's a clue for you - your personal experience cannot be scaled up to a network of 1.3m users and remain accurate - you have to have the information and view that people like Ignition and I have to get near that.

You've been told frequently that large amounts of investment has gone in, I can detail it for you if you like. There's vastly more capacity than there was this time last year even, there's a greater understanding of UBR congestion and imbalance issues (the latter was more of a problem than the former) and resegmentation is a weekly event - this is because we can predict and track incipient problems and fix them before they become apparent to users.

There's nothing bad about frequent maintenance, quite the reverse, what you shouldn't do is leave the thing untouched till it starts to struggle. Regular maintenance is better than irregular maintenance is better than no maintenance. Basic rule of network management.

Pur-lease. MC28Us and new UBR chassis obviously grow on trees, something I hadn't realised.

BB (who found *six* new UBRs on his network scan last night)

Bah - Ig got in while I was typing this.

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I'm sure I read somewhere that the change from nthellworld to cable forum was to get away from it being an NTL-bashing site?

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Your right. Now sits back and waits for it to get out of hand :mad:

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don't remember that - I thought the change was so we could bash MORE than JUST NTL...

I could be wrong (It does happen :( )

I hope not - because then we will have gone wayyyyyy off topic ;)

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Sorry, I'm keeping an eye on my thread, it won't get out of hand ;)