Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

And looking at my bill its per account. It really depends who you speak to and when. This should be really easy to clarify but it isn't:roll eyes:


Regards

John

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

So why have l got 2 £3 tivo charges on my bill then.

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

I have two £3 tivo charges but they have been discounted out. Heres my contract

http://www.cableforum.co.uk/board/35280946-post23.html

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

No its not discounted out on my bill.

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

MY LONG REVIEW.

INTRODUCTION

Yesterday I received a 500GB TiVo unit from Virgin Media, after having negotiated a "no install/HD activation charge" waiver from a fine gentleman who works in the CEO's office. I was on the waiting list for a month which I was willing to accept, especially since monthly rental for the device is a mere £3.

Sadly I have not found it to be all that they promise in the admittedly very impressive ad campaigns they have been running, but despite some irritating flaws there is potential here for a Sky+ HD killer, if Virgin Media are smart enough to get it together and fix the firmware sooner rather than later of course.

https://www.cableforum.co.uk/images/...2011/09/32.jpg
A tech device beauty queen this ain't.

In my opinion it's hideously ugly, but I haven't factored that into the list of things to love and shove because I really don't care. I'm about functionality over style in my technology, especially in cases where it makes a product cheaper than the leading competitor, and I'm not going to be staring directly at it for more than a few seconds at a time. (If almost everything you own is made by Apple, it will probably make you throw up in your mouth a little bit though.)

The lack of an LCD could be a minus point for some, but personally I hate obnoxiously bright LCD info panels on set-top boxes (well, set-bottom boxes in this era of slim LCD/LED/plasma panels) that distract you from the TV screen so it's not an issue and doesn't count against the device at all.

On with the review, anyway. I've stuck to a fairly standard good/bad list format here and decided to forego any attempts at humour. Regardless, it does have my usual unwieldly length (Word clocks it in at a shade over 3,000 of them) so if going into almost excruciating levels of detail will bore you senseless, read the CNET review instead. It's a shade less technical but still covers the important points well.


PROS

Most of this is standard TiVo stuff that’s been there since the beginning, but as I’ve never really used one (until the last few years, I’d guess they were too nerdy or esoteric even for those who didn’t mind the expense) I suppose I’m more impressed than someone who has had them before.

• Pause, rewind, fast forward live TV. Yeah, let’s start with the most basic and obvious feature, the backbone of the TiVo device. Still pretty neat though. I like recording a show on a channel that has adverts then starting to watch it fifteen minutes later. Then I can fast forward through the breaks and catch up with the live broadcast at the end, more or less, which solves one of my complaints with almost any non-BBC show: annoying, over-produced LOUD adverts. I love this idea of having a “channel cacheâ€� as soon as you switch over: if you start watching something that you aren’t sure on and suddenly really like it, the TiVo will take the “channel cacheâ€� you already have and add to it, then store when the program has finished. And when you have one of those “what the **** did he just say?â€� moments you can use the BACK button to go back about five seconds – more than once – to decipher it. People with noisy kids must LOVE this feature.
• Record three things at once while watching an on-demand/pre-recorded feature. On the first day I got it I decided to pick up some shows and movies I like, but not enough to stick on my NAS/HTPC (4.5TB at the time of writing, with only 300GB left). So I had it record two TV shows (one with the lovely Summer Glau, The World’s Most Popular Nerd Crushâ„¢) and a movie while watching a documentary recorded earlier. Not something I’d do all the time, but useful. Oh, and MASSIVE bonus points for being able to change the end time while on each recording without stopping or causing errors… sometimes programs start late, or sporting events run long – good to be covered in those cases.
• Great handling of SD upscaling and HD in general. Let’s be honest: even 720p is a massive improvement over the old 576i PAL standard. Having content upscaled to 1080i or already in that format (deinterlaced so well on my particular LCD TV that it looks like 1080p) really helps the immersion, and looks sharp because I’m running in my panel’s native resolution. For my money, the VM TiVo does a slightly better job of handling it than the previous V HD and V+ HD boxes: could well be my imagination though.
• The “finishedâ€� OSD HD parts. Yes, this same praised feature will turn up in the “I don’t like thisâ€� column, but although those gripes centre around the interface the parts that appear complete are slick. Let’s be fair – some might not like the very red colour scheme (I’d prefer blue, or perhaps a more muted dark grey) but overall I think the layout and typography makes up for it. A little less of the VM logo in the foreground would be nice – for example, the use of it on the Info OSD on the left while watching something is unnecessary and could be used for the channel’s logo rather than it being smaller on the right – but this is a big step up from the clunky, poorly anti-aliased presentations seen on VM’s previous STBs.
• Fast EPG. Apparently this has been a source of weakness in the past, but it’s also a massive strength. Daily, the EPG is downloaded and cached on the TiVo itself, so rather than downloading the schedules each time you access the EPG - which is slow and puts a strain on VM’s network no doubt – it’s ready to go and is practically instantaneous. A “mini EPGâ€�, accessed by pressing OK while in full-screen TV mode, is a nice touch too.
• Better organisation of recorded content. Normally being able to sort by name or date wouldn’t be seen as a big deal, but as the earlier versions of the VM TiVo firmware lacked this feature I’m happy to say it’s here now and makes organisation so much easier. Even things still recording appear at their proper position on the list in alphabetised mode.
• “I like this guy/girl. I want EVERYTHING they’re in recorded as it airs.â€� Explore a show; see an actor/actress you like. Now click on their thumbnail and observe all the things they’ve been in recently, organised by date and type (show/movie). Why not record all of it or at least put it on the WishList for when it’s next on the broadcast schedule? This feature is a standout, but isn’t at the top of the list because it’s probably only a stand out to me. I regularly discover new shows or movies by keeping track of performers or directors whose work I’ve enjoyed in the past (for example, I got into Suits because it features Gina Torres from Firefly and the music is composed by Christopher Tyng who also scored Futurama. Stop reading now and go watch the pilot for Suits because it’s a great comedy/drama) so to have this achievable with a few clicks is lovely, if not instantaneous… yet.
• Basic control of other devices. My main audio output for anything connected to the TV is an old LG 5.1 surround system which I lost the remote for five years ago. Even my newer universal remote used for controlling TV, Xbox and HiFi doesn't have the codes to control the volume, yet the newer VM TiVo remote does. I had to search through the database to find it, but it's in there. Not bad considering most universal remotes short of the Logitech Harmony don't even have listings for LG receivers.
• Near-silent running. I'm nuts about having as little background noise as possible from various devices, so it's a pleasure to report you can't even hear the TiVo running until you're a foot or so away from it. It appears they've used a heatsink and laptop HDD, rather than a small fan and 3.5" HDD. Good move.

CONS

I’m sure a great deal of these wouldn’t bother a standard user, but I do like to nitpick. Always bear in mind though, some of these mostly minor gripes pale in comparison to the fewer but more powerful positive points I’ve touched on.

• Key confusion. Various different parts of the UI use different keymaps: there’s often little to no continuity between them. For example, some menus or OSDs don’t respond to the BACK key, which should always take you back one level when pushed and all levels when held for a second. Likewise, you can use SMS-style alphabet entry for searches on the iPlayer app, but not on the VM frontend of iPlayer which has a different UI. Using the navigation keys to enter letters is VERY tedious. There needs be a uniform keymap to streamline the process and prevent annoying slip-ups – so many times I’ve flicked from playing a recording back to live TV on a different channel because of the inconsistency.
• EPG bugs. If you see a special © style icon beside certain shows, it means it is available as a “catchupâ€� show from BBC iPlayer, itv Player, 4oD or Virgin’s proprietary streaming service. Sadly, there’s no “press GREEN to watch this on catchup immediatelyâ€� (or similar) option… you have to manually go to the Catchup menu and find that show all over again, which combined with the lack of SMS-style text entry and the overall sluggishness is irritating. It’d be better not to have the © style icon if this is the case. Also, whenever you open the EPG it starts at the top of the channel list. Much more useful it if centred on the channel currently playing. Annoyingly there is no basic option to hide ghosted (i.e. not in your package) channels by default. This can be mitigated by making a favourites list which doesn’t include the channels not in your package: the TiVo helps you out here by not allowing you to add ghosted channels to the list, so it’s not all bad, but overall the partially broken functionality of the EPG detracts from the presentation.
• OSD performance issues. Menus are sometimes lightning speed, sometimes sluggish. For a device with three tuners this is disappointing… surely there’s enough power to keep the UI nice and quick? Yeah, I know architecturally it probably doesn’t work that way, but if you can record three shows and watch a forth there must be enough CPU grunt to manage slick performance. Also, going from Home to Guide or vice versa results in not a smooth transition, but a messy toggle back to full screen, then the other one loads. Recording just ONE HD channel can make the UI even slower. Some parts of the UI look more polished than others… for example the EPG/Home screen look HD, but the Recordings Scheduled menu looks blurry and is clearly presented in a poorly upscaled standard definition format with wrong aspect ratio when using a widescreen TV. It looks like some bits are finished, full HD and some are earlier SD menus they didn’t have time to make HD versions of. Maybe VM ran out of money to pay their developers?
• Twitter app (and presumably others) require a separate Web Apps account, and are useless anyway. Load the Twitter app, watch the small top-right picture disappear. No point using it if you can’t PiP, to be fair. YouTube app is sluggish and annoying… it’s better on my Xbox running XBMC, and that thing has 64MB of RAM and 733mhz single core processor! (No SMS-style text entry on YouTube too, really?!) A laptop or tablet replacement this is not, especially since you can't add apps to your TiVo via some kind of store like you can on almost anything else that has apps these days.
• The “Peanutâ€� Remote. The up/down/left/right navigation buttons are above the play controls. In my experience, this is plain wrong: play controls (less used) should be at the top above navigation, volume and channel controls (often used). The back button is in the wrong place too: should be where the navigation is. It’s unfortunate that the UI sometimes requires use of the thumbs up/down buttons and is programmed for separate play/pause, otherwise I’d use the one for the regular V HD Box (all Virgin STBs from past eight years or so use same remote codes). The peanut shape is nice and ergonomic, but overall the remote is cluttered, partly because the play/pause/rewind/forward are disproportionately sized compared to the rest.
• Banner bar “RECOMMENDED BECAUSE…â€�. If you select TV show/movie items in the banner bar and see this sign under the description, you’ll probably also see “We love it, we hope you do too!â€� under every single one. By all means keep the banner, but let the viewer decide for themselves why it has been recommended. The point of TiVo is choice, so too much handholding looks conspicuous. Bin it and instead make the plot description longer than two VERY short lines: don’t bring “VM’s professional opinionâ€� into viewing selection.
• On Demand/Catchup can be inconsistent. On VM’s banner bar there was a show called The Prisoner. It has Ian McKellan, aka Gandalf from LOTR. “He’s a fine actor and VM are pushing this show, so why not watch the first episode?â€� I thought. Except I couldn’t. I clicked through several menus and the only option I got was BACK; no way to play it whatsoever. This happened on a show VM were making highly visible, for goodness sake. It occurs more regularly than it should, it’s not just “settling inâ€� jitters as I first thought. Also, it’s not always clear that some On Demand content has a price. I don’t like clicking through half a dozen menus to watch an SD movie from 2006 (in this case X-Men United) which appears to have no charge to then be told it’s £2.50 to rent for 2 days just before I click play. Especially when it’s showing FREE in HD the next day on one of my pre-existing package channels. Things like this really let the device down and make it frustrating.
• PiP fail. I don’t know what’s going on, but some channels won’t display in the top-right when you’re in menus etc. Other menus, VM put up an annoying TiVo promo. Hey VM, I already have the TiVo; I don’t need to be told about it over again. Also, when moving quickly between parts of the OSD, sometimes there are stutters (i.e. sound/picture pause for a second) for no good reason, even on SD channels. I often think “you can make a device that records three shows at once, but it can’t display one thumbnail sized window consistently between menus even when nothing is recording?!â€� Maybe it’s a case of giving the PiP window a higher priority and not using it for promos on certain menus.
• No true 1080p mode usable at all times. Now I can forgive my ten year old games consoles - the Xbox 1 and PS2 – for not managing better than 1080i. It’s amazing they can run at that resolution at all. A newish device like this not giving 1080p at all times though? Very disappointing. Additionally the auto-detect thought my TV wasn’t capable of 720x576i. No of course, my British bought Samsung LCD TV made in 2010 can’t display a PAL format that’s been a broadcast standard for more than fifty years and is still used on the integrated Freeview DVB tuner. That must be it.
• Recording problems. Click on a show you already have scheduled to record within the EPG and which options do you get? “Record as plannedâ€� and “Series Link & other optionsâ€�. WHERE THE HELL IS THE “DO NOT RECORDâ€� SELECTION? There isn’t one. You have to go into Home then My Recordings then another two menus to delete the thing, which is often cumbersome. There is a specific recording problem that is severe enough to require it's own point, which is...
• “This channel is not authorised. Contact Virgin Media for more information.â€� While recording a HD channel movie (The Departed on 4HD) there was a problem: I decided to watch some of the start of the movie just for test purposes, and as it turns out the tuner handling the channel had got stuck, throwing up the aforementioned error. So the recording was b0rked, and tuner remained completely stuck even after stopping it. Yet when consulting the recording submenu of the Info OSD on a different channel it had registered as recording correctly (channel/time info), but when on the channel it was recording from it registered as something completely different and random. Playing back the incomplete file led to some MPEG-2 glitching and a hang of the file. Now this could undermine the whole point of having a PVR: if you’re not sure your selected content is going to be correctly stored, why not just download it instead? Or don’t miss it at broadcast time. Clearly this needs to be fixed, and soon.
• Seek functions aren't precise enough. On XBMC you have many options when skipping or seeking through a streamed file: locally stored (i.e. internal HDD), on the LAN or across the WAN. One of the nicest features is being able to skip up/down by ten minutes and to use the keyboard numpad (or numbers on the remote) to input a precise time to jump to. Having three levels of rew/ff on the TiVo is not enough: even going from minute one to minute fifty of a one hour show is slow as it seeks through rather than jumping to a set point. Jumping to a set point in a media file is much easier on a harddrive than having it constantly access data at faster-than-playback speeds, too. The BBC iPlayer app can do it, but not the standard TiVo interface.
• Lack of a programme reminder feature. Just because TiVo can record a trio of things at once, that doesn’t mean I don’t want reminders to watch things live rather than silently recording them (other than the “channel cacheâ€� feature I already discussed, of course). In fact, being reminded something is going to broadcast live might stop me wasting HDD space recording it because I’m not being told it’s starting. Perhaps have a reminder with options – “yes, switch tv channel and watchâ€�, “both record and watchâ€� and “don’t watch, just recordâ€� – obviously with the option to toggle this on an overall or show-by-show basis. Seems pretty logical and clear cut to me, especially when you bear in mind that every other VM cable TV box currently in use - even the gray Samsung one from a decade ago – has a basic programme reminder. (Note to device/game developers: NEVER remove old features because you assume users don’t need them. Leave them in – no exceptions.)
• No UPnP support for streaming TiVo content to LAN devices or vice versa. This is really a minor thing overall, due to copyright issues and such, but being able to stream from the TiVo HDD to other devices via UPnP, SMB or even FTP would be a great feature, as would using the 1080p-capable TiVo hardware to stream your own HD collection - assuming it has MPEG-4 H.264 support of course. More realistically and uncopyright-violatingy, being able to stream from the TiVo to regular V HD or V+ HD boxes (or indeed other TiVos) would be an excellent feature which is apparently in the pipeline. When streaming from the TiVo I mean completed programs of course: it’s unreasonable to expect to stream unfinished recordings.

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

CONCLUSION

The Virgin Media TiVo shows enormous potential, and already has a plethora of useful features that can transform your viewing habits and minimise the annoyances of having to catch a program at a certain day and time, which certain people (myself included) are now loathe to do as we have better options available. Unfortunately, as good as the Cisco-provided hardware obviously is, clear deficiencies, inconsistencies, oversights, errors and so forth in the firmware lead to a product that veers dangerously between “polished, professional and fun to use” and “slapdash, amateurish and rage-inducing”.

Sadly it seems that VM haven’t learned lessons from their bug-ridden, practically crippled Super Hub product and are still releasing devices with customised UIs that are not beta-tested properly so suffer horribly when rolled out to customers. As a beta-tester for the Super Hub I can say with some authority the testing is neglected and leads to expensive headaches later (everything I reported on the device was ignored).

Fortunately though, the TiVo is nowhere near as bad and is usable on a day-to-day basis, even in light of VM’s advice to reboot it every three days or so. It’s just hard to escape the feeling that you’re stuck with a product that’s merely good, when it could be great, but that is somehow acceptable because the rental charge for one or more TiVos in a house is merely £3/month and the feeling that within six months most of the problems will be solved or mitigated.

Would I recommend one to you? Yes... just barely.

Rating: 69%

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

Great review Zeke. It's a combination of bugs and lack of red button that is stopping me from upgrading to TiVo. Once the red button facility arrives and the various bugs have been ironed out I'll seriously consider making the switch.

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

For any one that wants to see what could be coming to us soon? Here is the pages for the new TiVo in the USA?

http://www.tivo.com/products/tivo-pr...index.html#tab

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

Yes very interesting Devil.

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

Has there been a software update ( minor ) as my TiVo seems a bit quicker?

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

No as far as l know there has been no update yet.

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

If it has a 'C' next to it you should be able to watch it directly from the backwards EPG without having to search for it again by pressing 'OK' on the programme and 'Watch from Catchup on Demand'

The only live channnels that don't display in the PiP screen are the Sky ones. This is due to a previous commercial agreement. Good news is that Sky have now agreed to let Virgin show their channels in the mini screen. I think it will change as part of the next update

The 1080p option is hangover from the US TiVo and is designed to 'pass through' 1080p content from an external source. It's not an upscaling option. Virgin don't broadcast any 1080P content anyway, so 1080i is the highest quality option

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

When are we going to get the proper app like this one?

http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/tivo/...3976?mt=8&ls=1

It looks really slick.

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

Very soon, for iPad.

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

Very soon. It works on iPad and iPhone/iPod touch.

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

Pay Per View failure hits Virgin Media’s TiVo


http://www.seenit.co.uk/pay-per-view...-tivo/0915393/

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

A bit of a harsh assessment imho.

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

Yes l think so as you are always going to have little problems here and there and l suspect Sky are no different to Virgin in that respect as not everything runs smoothly in life.

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

Perhaps, but then I still have to find the program I want in the backwards EPG after having noticed in the regular EPG that the show has a catchup icon. My contention is, perhaps the regular EPG shouldn't have the catchup icon if you can't jump to a list of previous showings available on catchup straight away, instead having to find it again either in the backwards EPG or via On Demand search.

Come to think of it there are just too many menus... for example, with Apps & Games, you press right and there's another Apps & Games submenu so you have to press right again. Why not just one menu?

Also, with my previously mentioned "some menus are HD, some are SD" thing, I tend to find that when you schedule a series link recording or similar after finding out about a show through the banner bar rather than the EPG, you stay in the HD menu with the PiP at the top right. This proves that the HD interface code exists, but yet when you do a series link via the EPG or look at planned recordings you are shunted to a blurry-looking SD menu which can't display a lot of info: you see a lot of "..." because the text can't fit. Seems like poor programming, to be honest.

I think I know why the interface is sluggish at times, especially when your series link/wish lists start growing: it's programmed in Flash, isn't it? Flash wastes massive amount of CPU power on pretty much every platform it runs on, so no wonder there are obvious problems like screen tearing or PiP stuttering when changing between menus. This whole thing could be done better in Java or Javascript: a company belonging to a member of my family has had superb results with MooTools even on underpowered embedded systems. The VM TiVo being a well-heeled fairly modern PVR design would be lightning fast, but presumably it's far too late to attempt that kind of revamp. Shame really, because it means some parts of this particular VM TiVo will always be slow.

This is a fairly minor one, I'd say, but it'll be nice to see it fixed. Must be some weird clause that means VM can display Sky channels in full-screen but not when in the menu via PiP.

The VM TiVo does have a 1080p option, but only for 25hz which makes 50hz channels (i.e. most of them) drop frames... any more information on what this was originally used for in the US versions would be appreciated.

I know VM don't broadcast any 1080p content... it's either 720p or 1080i from what I can tell. MPEG-2 streams in 1920x1080p @ 50hz would be enormous, presumably it's a case of waiting until the TiVo units are transitioned to higher quality MPEG-4 H.264/AVC streams. I assume they're making plans for overlapping services in much the same way they have overlay and legacy on the broadband side. Perhaps they could have MPEG-4 streams via the integrated cable modem?

---

I'd like to see the fourth tuner activated, but not as another recorder that can be scheduled, just one that is dedicated to whatever live channel you're watching. I respect the fact that when all three current tuners are in use you can continue to watch anything that TiVo buffered for you on whatever channel you were watching before all three tuners began recording - good design there - but not being able to watch live TV without sacrificing one of the lower priority recordings is disappointing. Only a little bit though!

I'm so gripey about the TiVo because there's a lot of potential untapped and it isn't quite as finished as it should be, but thank goodness it's not the abortion that the Super Hub was. It's a much better PVR than the Humax FoxSat HDR I was considering and it's already proved it's worth, but I know it can be pushed much further.

It's my usual "I complain because I care, dammit!" stance. :D

Presumably the iPad/iPhone edition will be a red version of that with the VM logo on all screens. ;)

I suppose Android users are out in the cold though. Or, laptop users who want that same interface (i.e. being able the browse the EPG and schedule recordings) without logging into the web app thingy.

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb...d.php?t=444083

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

Oh, just discovered another bug.

If I turn the subtitles on for any channel using the Subtitles button on the remote, as soon as I change to another one or go to EPG/other menu there is a thin vertical line of graphical trash (i.e stray pixels) on the right hand side. This persists across channels. This is only visible when the HDMI setting on the TV is set to Screen Fit, i.e. 0% overscan, so it occurs to me this bug wasn't discovered because whoever codes/tests the firmware had their TVs overscanned at least slightly. It disappears only when the unit is hard rebooted, i.e. switched off via the back panel not standby with the remote. Simply turning off the subtitles doesn't banish it.

Here's a few pictures of my 32" Samsung LCD TV demonstrating the bug.

https://www.cableforum.co.uk/images/...2011/09/23.jpg

https://www.cableforum.co.uk/images/...2011/09/24.jpg

<cheesy> Just call me Zeke Pliskin, Unpaid Virgin Media Field Testerâ„¢. </cheesy>

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

its not on my TV.

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

Sorry but why do you choose the fit to screen option on your Samsung HDTV? I do believe that by using this setting you'll notice a lot of odd errors displayed on the edge of the screen that usually would go unseen. I tried the setting some time ago and noticed all sorts of crap when watching the BBC's news channel. I also have a Samsung HDTV although mines a 42 inch plasma.

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

Because when watching HD you get the full picture

It's only SD channels that are designed with overscan in mind (due to the way CRT TVs work). Watch an HD channel without it set to 'Screen Fit' and you are cutting off picture designed to be seen

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

Thanks Ben I didn't realise that so might try again as we only tend to watch HD channels these days.

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

Good to know. Shame that it can't stream from other devices on the LAN, because the passthrough feature would then be useful. Guess it's blocked off on the VM TiVo though.

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

Noticed that the EPG only goes forward about 12 days.
I thought that it would show forward programming for the full 14 days
Any ideas chaps ???

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

Some channels only have data going 11 or 12 days forward as far as l know and that has nothing to do with Tivo.

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

Showoff. :P Seriously though, Samsung do some nice sets and I like their menu system a lot better than the Xross Media Bar thing on a lot of Sony TVs.

I like having no overscan where possible so I can see the full-frame, even the mistakes. It's amazing how many errors are turning up especially on the BBC News channel especially these days, like placing on-screen display boxes well outside the title safe area. I paid for those extra pixels, I damn well better see 'em. :D

Exactly. I'd rather have slight windowboxing on a source rather than slight overscan, especially on games consoles. Screen Fit usually gives you maximum clarity when running in native panel resolution... it's what you bought the TV for, right?

Um... wait two days and try again? ;)

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

Thanks Den
I'm away on hols later this week, and wanted to set up series links for Merlin on BBC on Saturday 1st and Terra Nova on Sky 1 on October 3rd.

Nothing scheduled on either yet......

I've set up on wish lists, but don't trust this feature yet, as it has let me down in the past
:rolleyes:

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

I have a Samsung LCD 40" and I've noticed the issue with artefacts from subtitles. I was watching a recording with subs on and it left a horizontal grey bar on the picture.

This remained on all channels and would only go away by rebooting the Tivo. I guess it's some kind of compatibility issue with the Samsung TV.

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

No it is just not with the Samsung as it has been mentioned about other TV's as well. .

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

Interesting that I'm not the only one with the subtitles thing. Maybe we should compile a list of known bugs (even the small ones) and post 'em over at the VM Community forum.

I like this box a lot, it's good, but I want to help make it great. The hardware is high-quality Cisco, it's just a case of getting that custom VM firmware to make the most of it.

Come to think of it, what VM need is to use the Trac system so users can submit bugs to the developers directly rather than this "proxy by forum support staff" model they're using now. I have no problem doing beta testing and reporting back if I know it's being heeded.

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

I got an email today, as an employee, of the new TiVo update which has been confirmed to be released before Christmas. I will post full details soon but the universal recordings padding as well as other missing crucial features will be added.

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

Thanks for this, let's hope the crucial features include the 2 red button services (BBC and Sky Sports)

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

Unfortunately not. No red button services but lots more features. I will post the full list this Friday as I am only on my BlackBerry until then and cannot copy and paste my emailsm

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

If you have got the BB 9800 Torch you can copy and paste:D

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

up coming tivo fixes.

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

Figured something out, might have come up before.

When using the full EPG in reverse to view shows there is no green button "play catchup now" option, however when using the mini EPG (OK in full-screen TV mode) in reverse, the green button can work BUT it has to be a show that aired more than roughly 2 hours ago, to allow for it to appear on iPlayer otherwise you just get bumped to the main Catch Up/On Demand menu because that stream doesn't exist yet therefore the link is broken.

Bear in mind, the mini EPG will allow three-digit entry to jump to a specific channel just like the full EPG but using <</>> won't make it jump back/foward one day unlike the full EPG.

---

Having done more homework on the roots of VM's TiVo (the US TiVo Premiere HD) I must say, it looks like at least some of the criticisms the box is getting are the result of the maker, not VM. It seems like VM's TiVo is slightly slicker than the original release Premiere HD, which is more than twice as sluggish by comparison.

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

My mini EPG jumps back or forward a day with >> or <<.

I have never used the green button to play back something from catch didn't even know that was a option.

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

New Features Coming to Tivo

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

Seems point less if proves to be the case, if Virgin Media don't get their fingers out they'll end up losing TiVo customers never mind gaining them, the BBC Red button as a minimum should have been there from the start, every other provider can manage it so why not VM for there TiVo box? :mad:

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

They could have but that would have meant delaying the product. I'd much rather we have TiVo minus red button then not at all. If red button services are that important hold of getting it.

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

The majority of those fixes are essential though Multi tap entry , quicker series links , HDMI connection reliability fixed , better PQ will all improve the functionality of the box. Red button maybe added in further small releases.

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

Here's my pennies worth. This update could very well have the building blocks needed for the red button services. However it is content providers like BBC, itv and sky to write their red button services just like they have done on the old software platform.

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

http://community.virginmedia.com/t5/...ht/true#M17402

http://community.virginmedia.com/t5/.../369143/page/4

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

Hope that includes cutting the padding off when have back to back recordings like V+ does.

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

As far as I can tell any padding and clipping will work exactly as it does now. The change is adding the ability to set your preference globally rather than per recording/series link

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

That had better be optional. And hopefully they've made padding work in the same way as the V+.

---------- Post added at 21:56 ---------- Previous post was at 21:52 ----------

Then they've failed to make the Tivo as good as the V+ in that aspect.

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

I certainly would not want padding to be handled like the V+, I don't want the end of a show to appear at the beginning of another recording thats just madness.

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

According to a post by a VM employee at the Help & Support Forums, it defaults to 1 minute before and 4 after, there's (currently) no way to change the global padding defaults, like V+ HD.

If you want no padding, you'll have to remove it when creating every recording/series link/wishlist. I think that may cause more problems then it solves, due to TiVo using 2 tuners to recording back-to-back programmes on the same channel.

---------- Post added at 22:42 ---------- Previous post was at 22:38 ----------

We know that the major update is a dependency for the updates that will follow....I'm guessing (wildly?) that the major update contains red button support and the following updates will actually deliver that functionality for the users......or I could be talking out of my bottom again. :p:

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

The new updates look nice, but are they going to up the speed of the damn thing? I want it faster, and annoying things like pressing up in the menus and I suddenly find myself back to the tv!

I say get the UI running slick, and add features later. Oh and hurry up and get the flip out keypad remote. I think it is unforgivable not having this as a default ship for a box that needs so much text input to get the best out of it!

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

If that is the case, then the design team are complete idiots.

How can the padding implementation, after they've had it modified, be worse than the V+?

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Personally that should have been one of the first things they should put on there and if you are right well l cannot see us getting that until April at the earliest now.

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

Sounds like a minimal implementation then. If this doesn't have padding cut-off with back to back channels as well then this is actually going to make Tivo worse not better, bad news!

I regularly have tiumes when we are watching live TV with 2 other programmes (say 9-10pm) recording and a 10am start recording is due with 1 minute padding. So a few minutes before it is goong to start, I am presented with the issue of stop what I am watching on live TV (which means the end of something you are watching which is the key part you don't want to miss), or give up on a recording.

V+ had padding design so right, VM just need to copy it for Tivo, is that so hard for the designers?

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

I don't think anyone really expected a massive fix all update in one hit did they? To my mind, improved searching with the remote, better picture quality, info from the mini epg and more content from the bbc and youtube are massive plusses. Add to that a few fixes for problems that I don't have but appear widespread, like the hdmi issue, and I think its fair to say virgin are really doing a decent job of supporting what is already a really good box.

---------- Post added at 10:19 ---------- Previous post was at 10:13 ----------

By the way, does anyone know if there's anyway to get my tivo to record suggestions in hd if its available? Its picking up some really excellent stuff, and I'm by no means an hd junky, but if a programme is on an sd channel and its hd equivalent at the same time I'd rather have it record the hd one.

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

Considering how long they have had to work on it yes I do expect a massive fix. I'd be sacked if I had this long to write software changes and not have the list of changes ticked by now

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

Great list of updates, that info issue has been annoying me since the day I got it, pleased to see that its been fixed.

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

I think that's more TiVo's fault than VM's. The equivalent Premiere HD unit in the USA shipped before the slide out keyboard remote was ready, and comes as an extra that also requires a bluetooth dongle, which in turn would require the USB ports on the VM TiVo to be activated, I would assume. (Although the USB ports do work if you want to charge something, so it's not like they're completely switched off.)

Personally I'd be happy with consistent SMS-style entry on the numeric remote buttons because I don't use the search much. It's possible on the iPlayer app, but not on the regular TiVo menus.

Ideally the TiVo firmware should compensate for padding if recording two programs back to back on the same channel: I'd say program it to keep recording and ignore padding settings, then split the file later. But of course I don't know the way TiVo handles recordings, just guessing at a solution based on the simplest, most logical (and therefore most likely to work) option.

This raises an excellent point. Currently the VM TiVo will allow separate series links for the exact same show on different channels, rather than being smart enough to say "why don't I just record all non-repeat instances of this program across channels?". I think this runs contrary to what TiVo usually does, and could be considered a weakness of this VM version of the firmware.

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

One thing that annoys me about TIVO is when it records suggestions for me it always seems to be in SD not HD, I have all the HD channels as well. Is there a way of stopping this a setting maybe?

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

Not so sure about that though. I thought it the US most programmes stay on the same channel until they reach 'syndication'. Therefore it's less likely to have multiple series of the same thing on different channels compared with UK?

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That's called a wishlist recording :D

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It's not on my Sony LED.

http://img31.imageshack.us/img31/5126/img0389vh.jpg

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

Just for the purpose of balance, I'd like to step up with a big NO to this (unless of course if becomes an option that you can toggle).

Even though I have a 40" LCD I can hardly notice any difference between watching the SD or the HD version of a channel (am I the only one!! lol).

As such, If i'm watching live TV I usually watch the HD version, just because 'I can' :p: But I ALWAYS schedule any recordings to record the SD version, as I would rather have the extra recording capacity than a virtually un-noticable picture quality difference.

Not trying to be argumentative - just have a difference of opinion :)

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

I know what you mean, but as far as I'm aware a program can be syndicated to multiple networks and over separate channels, and I figured US TiVo would compensate for that.

I agree, the wishlist feature is great (I have mine on Summer Glau watch among other things), but it often picks up other shows with similar keywords which aren't what you want. I figure if the TiVo knows the specific show it can record only that across channels. It's more of a nitpick than a big deal, but the aim of my game here is suggesting any and all potential improvements in the hope the better ones will be implemented in a future firmware update.

That's because your TV is overscanning - less than some sets, but definitely by a couple of percent which is enough to hide the graphical trash. Compare the size of the red/black/red border edge of the headline ticker on my TV with the smaller size of it on yours to see what I mean:

https://www.cableforum.co.uk/images/...2011/09/22.jpg

It's most noticeable on the increased distance between the edge of the screen and the BBC logo on my TV. Even a tiny bit of overscan is enough to hide that one vertical line of non-relevant pixels. Personally I don't care about that one because like the red button service I never use subtitles, but it's clearly a bug.

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

Go into the picture settings and under the 'Screen' menu set the picture to 'full pixel'. Apart from anything you'll get a better picture on HD channels as it won't be scaling the picture.

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

It seems to be that once the trashy line appears down the right - press menu and then tv and its gone. Seems to stay gone for a long time too - maybe the next reboot.

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

Agreed, and I hadn't realised it works with i player so thanks!

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

I have just thought about this and all you need to do when this happens is:
Press Home (to go in to the menu) and the Thumbs down- Thumbs up and then Play Play Play. It will reset the UI and also get rid of the lines.

Hope this helps you :)

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

Does the same on my Sammy now and then, a channel change clears it for it.

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

I don't understand, what on my Sony tv or TIVO box?

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

I have an LG 42" LCD TV.

Is there an option to do the same for no overscan ?

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

Yes. I think it's 'Just Scan' on the LGs. I think it's in the Aspect Ratio bit

---------- Post added at 22:41 ---------- Previous post was at 22:41 ----------

On your TV

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

How do you do it?

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Found the 'Just Scan' option.

What does this mean tho (as i'm guessing 16:9 will be 16:9 and 4:3 will be 4:3) ?

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

It varies depending on the model. On mine I press the Menu button then go to Settings->Display. Then I select Screen and under Display Area I select Full Pixel.

If you get stuck post the model number of your TV.

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

Being slightly more technical as an HD picture is exactly 1920x1080 pixes (if 1080i) and a HD TV is 1920x1080 (if a 1080 tv) then 'Just Scan' means each pixel of the picture matches exactly with each pixel of the TV. This means you get the best quality HD picture possible

Otherwise your TV is Digitally zooming into the HD picture slightly, and an extreme example of how that can mess with a picture is the digital zoom you get on cameras

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

Sony 55" EX723 LED

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

Ah ok.

My TV is 1080p, tho TiVo is using 1080i, as 1080p (pass-thru) is enabled along with 1080i (on TiVo), but seems to like 1080 (as it says it's the preferred format for my TV).

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

It will be. 1080i is the highest broadcast resolution available on TiVo. Seemy post on this earlier in the thread http://www.cableforum.co.uk/board/35...-post4920.html

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

My TV has HDMI dynamic range and hdmi 1 is set to auto. I only use one HDMI port on my TV I run my devices through my av receiver.

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On my LG I select 1:1 pixel instead of 16:9

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

OK, I just looked up the manual and it's not too helpful so try following the instructions in my previous post.

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

I found screen format is that it? It's set to Full, the options are Wide Zoom, Normal, Full, Zoom, Captions.

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

Possibly under settings where you set 4:3 / 16:9 etc

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

Probably 'Full'

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

That's the zoom mode/aspect correction. The thing I'm talking about is buried in the settings menus.

---------- Post added at 23:47 ---------- Previous post was at 23:43 ----------

OK, press the Home button and select 'Settings'

https://www.cableforum.co.uk/images/...2011/09/21.jpg

Select 'Display'

Select 'Screen'

Under 'Display Area' select 'Full Pixel'

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

Just a thought but would it now pay for engineers to advise customers during the install to review TV settings after an installation to experiment with these features to get the best possible HD picture. Then maybe people will see more of the wow factor and not an overscanned lesser quality picture?

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

An interesting thought, however what would be better would be for TV makers and/or sellers to tell customers that adjustments to their TV setup when first installed will almost certainly be needed.

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

I'm surprised to see some of the update details leaked!

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

Yeah, that and setting up the remote to work with the customers own TV or audio receiver, but as the engineer that installed mine explained, they're literally jumping from job to job trying to keep up with TiVo demand.

The main reason you need an engineer in the first place appears to be that when the TiVo is first connected it's not actually ready to use. I recall him setting up frequencies and a few other things on a dark blue technical screen with white text. Wish I'd paid a little more attention so I could do it myself when the household wants a couple more TiVos, assuming it doesn't require that palm pilot thing the engineers carry... looked like he was using the TiVo remote for most of it.

As for some TV manufacturers making it difficult to see calibration settings, well, shame on them. It should be easy to get to 1:1 pixel mode without going through menus... on my Samsung it's merely a case of pressing the aspect ratio button a few times until Screen Fit ◄▲▼► Move is shown.

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

Yes it does seem very strange as I thought the the peeps on the test were bound by a NDA?

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They are but, I guess some staff think they are above the law, lol.

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They will not be if they get caught?

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They could actually get fired over it!

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Just tried rigging up the HDMI and SCART outputs simultaneously expecting only one or the other to work, but both do. Have to say I'm very impressed: could be handy for watching some recorded shows on a smaller set while the main TV is tied up with, say, games console output or something.

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

I've done that now, I had to turn Auto Display Area off.

Thanks a lot. :)

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No problem. You should now find that HD channels look slightly sharper as they're not being rescaled.

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

If they are staff wouldn't they know the full list of updates? There is at least one biggy not in that list.

Re: General TiVo Discussion Part 2
 

Which is?