Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

The quote is nowhere need as outrageous in the context of the topic. He is talking about the attitude of the British Press and some people towards Germany and it was written in the mist of a slew of articles about the Germany economy.

Therefore I would suggest the 'Put in our place' would mean to recognise that we could learn a lot from Germany and their economy rather than dismissing them. The two people that you were put in red were people who sued for constructive dismissal because of nazi songs/slogans/jokes directed at them for being German. That is the mindset he was referring too.

So his quote is understandable in that context.

---------- Post added at 11:04 ---------- Previous post was at 10:59 ----------

Well does his square with the amount of criticism Labour get's for smearing the Tories? We're either against spin, smears and "dirty" politics or we are for it when it's in our favour. Which is it?

The Lib Dems deserve to be investigated. Clegg's donations, lobbying past are part of this. However, The Mail and Sun's campaigns are no different to what Labour did,. only more intense.

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

I agree. While I mean no disrespect to anyone who has fought in a war (after all, without the efforts of the armed forces in WWII, we would be speaking german now), the war finished 60 odd years ago. Before most of the current population of both the UK and Germany were born. In a lot of cases, before their parents were born. It's also worth pointing out that the Germans I have met have been extremely polite, friendly people and are (if anything) more horrified by what the Nazis did than we are.

Germany now is NOT the same country it was then. We bang on about what a great country we are, and how bad the Germans are, but who is better off? We have mass unemployment and a debt that is greater than the GDP of a lot of countries. The Germans were similarly affected by the world wide recession, but were able to turn their economy around far quicker than we have been. We also have failing public transport systems, and while they are certainly not underfunded, thanks to privatisation, a lot of the money we give to the companies running them isn't actually being spent on improving or maintaining the networks. From what I have seen, German public transport is an order of magnitude better.

As Nick Clegg notes, the average German is also 6% better off than the average Brit. Why? Could it be that they actually worked to improve their lot rather than just bitch about how everyone else made it worse for them?

The war was 60 years ago. We do need to get over it, and work to improve things.

---------- Post added at 11:15 ---------- Previous post was at 11:05 ----------

Oh, and if anyone wants to find the Mail's origins, it was founded by (amongst others) the then Lord Rothermere, who was a friend of Adolf Hitler. It also apparently published articles criticising the repatriation of "stateless Jews" in Britain (no change there, then)..

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daily_Mail

Also, if that article is correct, then it seems that Lord Rothermere wrote to Hitler congratulating him on annexing Czechoslovakia, and urging him to invade Romania.

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

There is a new war and its over deck chairs and sun loungers :LOL:

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

Chris Huhne may regret making this statement The Times CV (from two years ago) for Nick Clegg states What that misses out is that Mr Clegg worked in 1991 as a Trainee at the European Commission, Brussels. DGI, G-24 Co-ordination Unit, and for GPlus (another lobbying firm) 2004-05, where he described his work as Besides a trainee journalist post for six months, and some part-time lecturing for under a year, what is this "career doing real work outside the political system" that Nick Huhne refers to?:confused:

(strangely enough, if it's "no secret", why is neither lobbying job mentioned on Nick's CV on the Lib Dem website....;) ).

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

:D:D:D

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

Yes odd that eh....:confused:

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

Thank you for that Damien, I was wondering about the context and how it was truly presented. But, sadly, I am in agreement about the fact that it will be greatly ignored by the gutter press and therefore the uninformed masses will just behave like sheep and believe what they are told to believe. :(

---------- Post added at 13:17 ---------- Previous post was at 13:12 ----------

But, as you well know, that paragraph is pointless when not taken into context the entire article. Or are you proud of a Britain that could sponsor such blatant racism? Something, which many need to be reminded, the war was fought to prevent.

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

Daily Mail Lib Dem headline generator: http://www.qwghlm.co.uk/toys/dailymail/

I think this is going to back fire on the Tories anyway, People aren't stupid and they will probably end up being turned off from the negative headlines. Even the valid ones (i.e Telegraph) will be lost/dismissed amongst the slime.

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

BNP facing Marmite legal injunction - BBC

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

Careful with the righteous indignation, you didn't seem to have this many objections when mud was flung elsewhere, for example this rather debatable Lib Dem poster:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/44845223@N02/4502514442/

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

It worked for the Tories in ninteen ninety-two.

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

Just as well it's 2010 really. I seriously doubt we want to start looking back to the past.

Things can only get better!

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

Well after 13 years of New Labour failure, hypocrisy, profligacy, mismanagement, lies and spin let's hope so!...

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

This said the Daily Mail's front page is laughable but not unexpected from said right-wing propaganda publication. I wouldn't say they are in any way related to the Tories though. I wouldn't say they're related to anything in the real world as far as 90% of their output goes. The only upside is they can publish things more PC publications don't want to but 90% of their output, the front page today included, it total gibberish.

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

does anyone know where i can watch tonights debate live stream on my laptop .I watched it last week on itv player (on lappy)and the stream was absolute rubbish constant out of sync sound and buffering

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

Here perhaps.......

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

thanks a lot Daddy :tu::tu:

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

great post! Being a Scotsman raised in Germany ( with a german accent :D )
I have to agree with Clegg.
Britain lives much too much in the past.It's easy to slag off the germans,but how does that make us any better,or superior?Germany has done so much better than we have,so no reason for smugness there.
However,I do have to say I prefer living here. :) Britain has a much more open and tolerant way of living,and the possibilities for social ascension or much better.

So: Halt's Maul England!! :p:

oh,also: I LOVE YOU GREAT BRITAIN!!

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

What "roll over & give in" attitude?

Still also curious as to why the Lib Dems are "tree huggers" (they're not the Green Party! ;) )... Is it simply because the party's name contains the word "Liberal"? :confused: (I know that many people still for some reason consider the word "Liberal" to be A Bad Thing, or use it as an insult).


LOL!

Awesome! :D

"IS NICK CLEGG TURNING BRITISH SOVEREIGNTY GAY?"

"WILL NICK CLEGG GIVE COMMON SENSE AND DECENCY CANCER?"



Oh, and "#nickcleggsfault" has been trending on Twitter today (top hashtag in the UK today, & the 2nd most used hashtag today worldwide)....

http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology...ewspaper-swipe

I love the Internet!

I remember the last time we heard that... Oh, how the joy soon turned to bitter disappointment... :(

----------------------------

Very interesting article: "Will Murdoch lose Britain?"

----------------------------

Guardian "Comment is free" by Jonathan Freedland: "Nick Clegg will survive Fleet Street broadside"

----------------------------

"Election 2010: heading for battle on defence spending"

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

COULD NICK CLEGG TURN CLIFF RICHARD GAY?

:rofl:

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

Allegedly, the BNP plan to rerun the ad replacing the jar of marmite with a tub of lard.

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

Good. Party Election Broadcasts should feature their leaders anyway.

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

Someone really should tell Nick Clegg the phrase 'old parties' is getting, well, old.

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

Clegg is not as polished tonight and Brown is still sucking up to clegg

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

Especially since the Liberal Party was founded in 1858, before the Labour Party :D (yes, I know the Libs merged with the SDP in 1988).

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

Brown is doing much better though. Cameron better but not enough I don't think. Clegg not as great. Draw so far i reakon, or Brown edging it...

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

Agreed

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

Brown's opportunism, sound bites even if they're nothing to do with the question and taking pot shots is irritating. Cameron is much more impressive and aggressive this time.

---------- Post added at 21:02 ---------- Previous post was at 21:01 ----------

I actually find Brown's pot shots quite irritating points scoring.

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

Cameron did well to smash Brown's leaflets and calling them lairs, and Brown couldn't counter. Tried to weakly suggest that he didn't authorise them, well of course not, they give that responsibility to someone else so they seem clean. Cameron didn't tell The Sun to go smash the Liberal Democrates but he knew they would on their behalf.

---------- Post added at 21:07 ---------- Previous post was at 21:05 ----------

Channel 4 poll as Clegg ahead, he has done ok. Cameron did really well on Europe, Clegg as got better. Brown is up and down but I thought he was ahead. Guardian poll tracker (much more informal though) has Lib Dems ahead but then we expect that from the Guardian don't we :D

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

What, John Prescott??..... :confused:

:D


Re the debates, Brown has one massive disadvantage to overcome that doesn't apply to the other leaders. Those of us who aren't fully paid up members of the selective amnesia, "it's all Thatcher's fault", rose tinted specs brigade know that what he and his miserable party have said, done, promised and actually delivered over more than a decade have all too often been entirely different things!

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

We had this question last week!!? What idiot decided three, one and a half hour debates was a good idea?

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

Cameron is such a wuss. Gordon Brown banging on about taking 6 billion out of the economy there are two really simple responses:

1) Gordon, reducing VAT by 2.5% at the cost of over 20bn was considered stimulating, why would increasing taxes be considered stimulating?
2) Gordon, taxation is taking money out of the economy. The state is not the economy, the private sector is.

Repeating myself, and in the words of Barack Obama, what a lightweight.

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

at least with a imigration amnesty you would have a better idea how many illegals are in the country ,the other 2 dismiss the idea that there are any illegals

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

Think longer term. Family class immigration applications based on amnestied relatives, more illegals turning up in hope of getting amnesty. Sound good?

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

You would need to secure the borders better as well, we're obviously already a desired destination so I think the issue of people being encouraged to come here has already been lost.

Cleggs rebuttal to Brown's 'deport them' answer with 'You can't deport them, you don't know where the live" was good.

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

The solution to that would be to make us a less desirable destination, which of course can't be done while we are obliged to follow laws set in Brussels.

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

Its down to the libs or the tories its as simple as that.

Labour are dead in the water and they know it..

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

How do you make it less desirable? Economic strength, tolerant multi-cultural society are two of the things which attract people here. Two things that benefit us, essentially the better we are as a country the more attractive we are to the rest of the world.

---------- Post added at 21:35 ---------- Previous post was at 21:34 ----------

Brown was better than last week. Cameron about the same to be honest. Clegg as bit worse.

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

So GB accuses Clegg of being anti-american. Is that supposed to be an insult?

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

Welfare state. We want people who can contribute, and be welcoming to them. People turning up hoping to sponge off us must have it made very clear they'll get nothing.

Cameron was weak apart from one segment which was when I commented. Lightweight who needs to get some cajones, some substance and wake up before next week. So many very simple counters he failed to supply.

Perhaps I'm being too harsh on him but I was so frustrated with him.

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

before we start any new action on immigration we need to know how many illegals are here ,nobody expects it to be a permanent amnesty it only needs to be for maybe 1 yr any illegal that can prove they have been here longer than 12 months can choose to work and pay into the system ,or if they can't find work then community service or they can choose to be deported .I'm afraid that as distastefull as it would be to a lot of people i think it's the only way to go

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

My point is that Labour for the first time are on the back foot and they have become the third party behind the Tories and the Libs. That is something i could not have guessed 6 weeks ago. It refreshing to see the election take this course.

I could even be turned to the libs if it was not for the trident issue. I just cannot trust them on defence

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

I think the debate has just started actually..

Former Lib leader Paddy Ashdown rowing with David Milliband on Sky news right now...

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

The evidence based on other countries that have done amnesties says otherwise in a huge way. What I gave weren't my opinions, they were the experience of the USA after amnesty.

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

Cameron has won according to the Ugov poll... on Sky news right now....

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

According you YouGov Cameron won :confused: I think he started well...

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

How? The amnesty would apply only to those who've been here for 10 years IIRC.

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

I don't believe that YouGov poll will be reflected elsewhere.

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

Lets see ?

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

Can someone put a big plaster over that gobby Alastair Campbell..... Useless idiot.

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

I am very surprised they put Cameron ahead. I guess it's not by much but I would have put Brown or Clegg ahead because as the debate went on Cameron seemed more and more marginal and quiet.

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

YouGov: David Cameron 36%, Nick Clegg 32%, Gordon Brown 29%

Guardian live blog poll: Clegg 63.8%, Brown 28.4%, Cameron: 7.7% (although obviously, as they admit themselves, "it's a self-selecting audience" ;) )

Channel 4 live blog poll: Nick Clegg 52%, Gordon Brown 31%, David Cameron 17%

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

Ignore the Guardian poll because, it's the Guardian :D (I am a reader though).

Channel 4 is interesting. I wouldn't put Cameron that far behind.

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

Yup, 10 years & no criminal record (apart from being, well, an illegal immigrant of course).

That's actually longer than the cut-off in the amnesty proposed by Boris: 5 years.

---------- Post added at 21:55 ---------- Previous post was at 21:54 ----------

Well, as they said "self selecting audience". Not going to find too many people who support Cameron using the Guardian website! :D

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

I disagree. Cameron was more focused and didn't really get entwined with the bickering between Clegg and Brown.

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

ITV.com Fun Poll: Nick Clegg 47%; Gordon Brown 41%; David Cameron 12% :)

ITV Comres poll: Clegg 33%; Brown 30%; Cameron 30%

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

COMRES out in a min.

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

Are these polls worth anything :erm: i just cant believe some of them. well any of them

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

But it's a debate, he is meant to interact. He did what he did last week, it took the format of a political speech and looked unnatural. The debate might be a stupid format though, but his best moment what calling Brown out on the leaflets.

---------- Post added at 21:59 ---------- Previous post was at 21:59 ----------

COMRES

Clegg: 33%. Brown and Cameron on 30%.

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

Funny how this week we had Cameron saying "I agree with Gordon" (twice?), instead of Brown saying "I agree with Nick".

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

The winner gets some momentum in the news cycle that follows. Clegg did well but the 24 hours of "Clegg wins the debate" stories would have had a bigger impact than the debate itself IMO.

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

Well I suppose we'd at least be able to show just how ineffectual the immigration system has been in recent years by finding out just how many people have lived here illegally for a decade or more.... Perhaps that's why Brown doesn't want one - it'd expose all the rhetoric and ineptitude of his pathetic party.

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

Dam i missed it again :D

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2
 

The Times has Clegg on 45%, Cameron on 34% and Brown on 18%. Personally I thought I expected that to be closer, but with Clegg ahead.

Re: The 2010 General Election Thread: Week 2