Re: Coronavirus
 

:D
Chris set that goal up for you nicely!

Re: Coronavirus
 

https://www.cableforum.uk/board/atta...9&d=1617443408

Remember what you said a year ago...

Re: Coronavirus
 

On the one hand if a large section of the population have a mechanism(ie vaccination) that would allow them to travel more freely, including abroad, why shouldn't that happen? On the other it may take so long to set up, by that time most people should have been vaccinated by that time.


An issue will be fake documentation, whatever method is used. Too many selfish idiots will want to get around the safety precautions.

Re: Coronavirus
 

I think the term "Nazi State" & "Tin-foil hat" is highly offensive.


To me it seems the only people who use this object to the rules that are in place and want freedom without a care for anyone.


I, for one, could happily say fuff the rules and hug my family, but as my niece works in Asda and most people ignore social distancing is at high risk, so hugging her could put my dad at risk, and I've lost one parent this year don't wish to lose another.

Re: Coronavirus
 

I hope they aren't relying on the blue vaccination cards to prove vaccination for foreign holidays. They don't exactly look unforgeable/untradeable.

Don't know why people are so desperate to go abroad anyway. Surely we've got the 'bestest' country in the world !

We should alow the chavsters to go anyway, and leave the UK to those that appreciate it in summer. Just don't let them back in ;)

Re: Coronavirus
 

Well I, for one, would shop in businesses that require some kind of vaccine passport, over anyone that doesn't.



This would make shops about £2,500 in the last year rather than Amazon.


Without Amazon I would have struggled.

Re: Coronavirus
 

Not going to Italy this year then;)

Re: Coronavirus
 

Deck chair in the allotment I'd guess . . . he's probably already got 3 knots done in the hanky (that's not nautical knots papa) ;) :D


https://www.cableforum.uk/images/local/2021/04/1.jpg

Re: Coronavirus
 

That's for culture ! ;) Not a sunbed and lager, which is as far a lot of Brits get.

Re: Coronavirus
 

Yes, we do, but with the shittiest weather!

Re: Coronavirus
 

I wasn’t wrong, it may not have been “the” flu, which in itself if a vague term as the flu changes annually, but it was, and is “a” flu.

So what’s your point?

---------- Post added at 20:54 ---------- Previous post was at 20:51 ----------

Fine, be offended.

No, just proportionality.

And? I don’t see what that position adds to the discussion.

---------- Post added at 20:57 ---------- Previous post was at 20:54 ----------

It’s not going abroad that is the issue, vaccination certificates could quite easily be a requirement for foreign travel, no issue there.

Domestically, though it is a non-starter.

---------- Post added at 20:58 ---------- Previous post was at 20:57 ----------

The new world order salutes you.

Re: Coronavirus
 

You need to relocate to a warmer part of Blighty. 15 degrees in London tomorrow! :Sun::Sun::Sun:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/weather/2643743

Re: Coronavirus
 

17 in cleethorpes:Sun:

Re: Coronavirus
 

It’s a lot of money if you aggregate it. :)

I’d spend more time and money in venues that aim to filter the crowd. Otherwise I’ll spend more time and money in the garden.

Re: Coronavirus
 

Enjoy. :tu:

Re: Coronavirus
 

I guess you'll have to be offended then.

Tut, such an offensive statement and assumption. :dozey:

Re: Coronavirus
 

https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...ovid-passports

They’re inevitable.

Re: Coronavirus
 

And have public support.

https://news.sky.com/story/covid-19-...urvey-12261755

Re: Coronavirus
 

They don't have mine.

Re: Coronavirus
 

Perhaps people would prefer the rules and situation in France?
Link

Re: Coronavirus
 

Just think of the shorter queues in the pubs without those young people with their hard seltzers and pricey craft beers standing between you and the bar. :beer:

Re: Coronavirus
 

Re: Coronavirus
 

Another black mark against Boris and disappointing u-turn and over reaction, if only there was an opposition with an alternative strategy I could get behind.

---------- Post added at 10:40 ---------- Previous post was at 10:38 ----------

The country has been fear mongered into submission and are now compliant, well done HMG

Re: Coronavirus
 

And what alternative strategy would that be? Make everybody wait, when it isn't necessary for all of them to do so?

Re: Coronavirus
 

Just don’t have Covid passports, that’ll work for me.

Re: Coronavirus
 

And me.


I'm a little worried about what happens when the gov create 2nd class citizens and what their reactions might be.

Re: Coronavirus
 

So people who can safely travel abroad or go to events should be prevented from doing so? That is discrimination.
Needing a vaccine passport, won't impact me personally either way, but that doesn't mean I should hold back others who wish to do those activities.

Re: Coronavirus
 

Count me in.

Oh, and I smoke, drink, and drive an oldish 1.8 petrol car so I've been a second class citizen for years while paying heavily into the Govt. coffers . . . my reaction usually involves two fingers and a jerky hand motion :D

Re: Coronavirus
 

Well other countries may well decide that anyone wishing to visit will need some sort of proof of vaccination. It's happened in the past.

Re: Coronavirus
 

Science, and the medical profession, disagree...

https://www.jhsph.edu/covid-19/artic...t-the-flu.html https://www.labnews.co.uk/article/20...-a-type-of-flu https://www.thelancet.com/journals/l...577-4/fulltext

Re: Coronavirus
 

France is looking hard into this, as they have "proof" that people crossing EU internal boarders have been carrying the virus.

Re: Coronavirus
 

No more lockdowns: UK will treat Covid like seasonal flu, says Chris Whitty

Lockdowns will likely become a thing of the past once England emerges from restrictions in June, Professor Chris Whitty has said, as he suggested Britain will treat coronavirus like the flu in the future.

England’s chief medical officer said the UK would have to learn to live with the virus, noting that up to 25,000 people can die in a bad flu year without the figure hitting the headlines.

https://www.cityam.com/no-more-lockd...-chris-whitty/

Re: Coronavirus
 

https://news.sky.com/story/covid-19-...iants-12263319

Re: Coronavirus
 

Duh! Congratulations you have managed To completely miss my point.

Firstly, I have already accepted proof of vaccination may be required for foreign travel several times on this thread, that it may be required by the country you are going to more than a U.K. requirement.

I am saying that vaccine passports should not be required by anyone to attend anything in the U.K.

---------- Post added at 14:29 ---------- Previous post was at 14:26 ----------

It’s a coronavirus. Same horse different Jockey

Re: Coronavirus
 

Whether people want vaccine passports or not the choice is between opening up with them or not opening up at all.

The Steve Bakers and IDSs of this world have been consistently on the wrong (and losing) side of this every Covid debate since the first lockdown and there is no reason to expect otherwise now.

Re: Coronavirus
 

That’s the wrong choice, and it doesn’t or shouldn’t have to be that.

Re: Coronavirus
 

The alternative is to delay reopening huge swathes of the economy and keep distancing measures in place which will cost businesses.

There’s no “just reopen anyway and take our chances”.

Re: Coronavirus
 

I find those terms more ignorant than offensive, perhaps if they had lived under an authoritarian dictatorship they'd recognise the difference, possibly in the same way they'd view the pandemic differently if they lost someone close to them or they themselves spent months on a ventilator, as with most things in life your opinion on something is based on your experiences with it

Re: Coronavirus
 

Re: Coronavirus
 

Everyone should have been offered their first jab by July/August anyway. The only people in the long run who have to worry about not having proof of a vaccine are the anti vaxxers or deniers. As far as I am concerned they can go to hell anyway

Re: Coronavirus
 

Not really - you’ve just done a complete 180.

You repeatedly said "it’s a flu" - it isn’t; some coronaviruses cause colds, but not flu.

Influenza is in the Orthomyxoviridae family of viruses, not Coronaviridae...

Re: Coronavirus
 

IMO they are pushing the boundaries to see how far they can go.

Re: Coronavirus
 

The party of law and order is in charge, you voted for them. Be grateful.
Don't want any of those nasty liberals do we ? ;)

Re: Coronavirus
 

i was talking about the police not the government.

Re: Coronavirus
 

Who makes the laws for the police to enforce? Answers on a postcard....

Re: Coronavirus
 

Re: Coronavirus
 

The police are even more state apparatus than the BBC.

Re: Coronavirus
 

The problem is the police don't follow the law they exceed it's boundaries and see what they can get away with.

Re: Coronavirus
 

And nobody holds the police to account.

The politicians know the police are their useful idiots, for beating up women and coal miners.

Re: Coronavirus
 

Biden's administration getting remarkably hands on in response to a remarkable error.
https://www.nytimes.com/2021/04/03/u...n-johnson.html

Re: Coronavirus
 

https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...-boris-johnson

Moonshot is back.

Dido Harding’s bank manager and former drinking buddies of Matt Hancock will be rubbing their hands at the prospect of a slice of £100bn for rubbish lateral flow tests.

Re: Coronavirus
 

Pointless money down the drain on something that's regarded by some 'experts' as around 50% accurate . . .

quote from the above linked article:

Anecdotal I know, but I hear reports of school kids testing positive with these tests, and then being confirmed negative on a hospital test :rolleyes:

Re: Coronavirus
 

Re: Coronavirus
 

If true, this is ridiculous. We don't want any of these variants taking foot in the UK. As an island nation, we should be well placed to prevent this.

Re: Coronavirus
 

As we are a world financial centre, a world cultural centre, one of the world’s biggest economies, donor of the world’s most widely spoken language and former capital of the biggest empire the world has ever seen, our level of connectivity to the rest of the world pretty much eclipses our theoretical ability to control the entry points into the country. Our highly beneficial levels of connectivity to the rest of the world was one of the key arguments against the imperative of close ties to the EU.

Simply shutting our borders is not possible except in the very short term. It would cause immeasurable damage to our economy and our position in the world. The only way through this is by developing much more sophisticated ways of controlling access and keeping track of who comes in and where they go, but there are a whole lot of complications inherent in that process too. Much thought, time and money will be required.

Re: Coronavirus
 

That’s a fancy way of saying the politicians don’t want to take the hard decisions.

If we are in lockdown again in the Autumn it’ll be for this reason. We ignored the evidence because we thought we could take the cheap/easy way out. As we have done throughout the pandemic.

Re: Coronavirus
 

60 or 70 years ago you'd be right, but the massive technology leaps since then in International travel have opened our borders to many things, some good, some not so good, but it's here to stay.

Attitudes and expectancies have changed too, so don't you dare tell Ms Smith that her and her 5 kids can't go to Magaluf this week :p:

Re: Coronavirus
 

How is that a valid reason? 8,000 tourists EACH DAY.
When I've caught glimpses of TV programmes with Border Force in action, they appear absolutely desperate to let all and sundry in, no matter what.
Eg "Here to visit my brother, who's here illegally", no problem. Not enough money to stay anywhere, obviously just visiting and not here to stay illegally. Found with "cheat sheets" to get past customs and no documents to support id etc, gets told if they're under 18, they have to be let in. Guess what happens next, he announces he's under age, and is taken into care. Guess what happens next, of course he skips.:mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad: Just pathetic and CORRUPT.

Re: Coronavirus
 

Re: Coronavirus
 

I'm sure there are lots of over 70's just itching to get down the pub and local footy ground with their mates n chums, or jet off to a wild week in Benidorm . . .

. . . otherwise what's the point in printing that?

Re: Coronavirus
 

Re: Coronavirus
 

But they will have to jump through a series of hoops to do that. That is the essential difference.

Are people that deluded that they actually think the guy from Peru is just a visitor.

Re: Coronavirus
 

I am a member of a FB group in which loads of French people are posting that they are nipping over to France for a few days to see family, or are coming here for an extended holiday and are looking for shared homes to rent. Or even moving here looking for work!

And none appear to have any problems crossing the borders in either direction.

Re: Coronavirus
 

OK so how are these twice weekly home tests going to work?

Are they going to be sent out with 2 test a week per person per household, or are we going to have to request them every week, or get them from our pharmacy?

I can see chaos if the Royal Mail is going to have to deliver all those tests.

Re: Coronavirus
 

Still looking for your point?

Re: Coronavirus
 

The point is you keep saying it’s flu - it’s not flu.

I can’t put it any clearer than that.

I can explain it to you (repeatedly), but I can’t understand it for you... ;)

Re: Coronavirus
 

How difficult is it for you to find out yourself? Would've taken longer to create your post.

Re: Coronavirus
 

About the same amount of time it took you to post this instead of something helpful

Info here see I can reply and help at the same time

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-56632084

Re: Coronavirus
 

Offering them is one thing, people actually using them twice a week, thats something else entirely.

I doubt how many will, and even those that do at the start probably wont keep it up for long - those things are a pain, and I think people will soon get fed up.

TBH, now the majority are vaccinated, I do really see the point, it seems a little late in the day.

Re: Coronavirus
 

I didn’t keep saying it’s the flu. I said it a year ago, that you quoted at back at me a year later for some reason?

I’m still holding out for a point over this.

Re: Coronavirus
 

well you were wrong for a start

Re: Coronavirus
 

When I said it, over a year ago, it was an unknown coronavirus, that caused respiratory issues and flu like symptoms.

So I was wrong a year ago, so what?

Re: Coronavirus
 

You say that but a quick search shows you compare it to the flu and use the flu in your arguments on this subject a lot more recently than a year ago

Re: Coronavirus
 

Only in the last few pages after Hugh quoted me from over a year ago.

What’s wrong in comparing it to the flu?

Re: Coronavirus
 

There are posts in December, January and February.

It is ok I get your stance on it and have seen plenty with the same view. I wholeheartedly disagree with you but I do not have anything to say that has not been said 100 times before

Re: Coronavirus
 

2019/2020. Which is over a year ago.

Which is.

About what?

That’s a bit unimaginative.

Re: Coronavirus
 

Dec 2020 is not a year ago.

Re: Coronavirus
 

Where in December 2020 did I refer to COVID 19 as the flu?

Re: Coronavirus
 

Some information as to how tests can be obtained.

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/t...one-in-england

Re: Coronavirus
 

You said it two days ago...

You didn’t compare it to a flu, you said it was, and is, a flu...

https://www.cableforum.uk/board/show...u#post36076103 The point is, once again, that it isn’t a flu...

Re: Coronavirus
 

Prior to you reposting what I said a year ago, a couple of days ago, how many times in the intervening year had I referred to COVID 19 as the flu.?

You brought this up after a year, which begs the question why?

I’m still waiting for your point.

Re: Coronavirus
 

Whatever his point you still called it the flu which is wrong, so you were wrong 2 days ago.

Re: Coronavirus
 

OK, you obviously didn’t find any, you can leave now, you’re excused.

Re: Coronavirus
 

let me look back and find out where someone made you boss of me

Re: Coronavirus
 

Interesting take in the reasons for the campaign to rubbish the AZ vaccine, on Quora.

https://qr.ae/pG1T5V

He did give a tinfoil hat caveat before proposing his theory, but I can see the logic.

---------- Post added at 19:01 ---------- Previous post was at 19:01 ----------

You did.

Re: Coronavirus
 

What logic? Capitalists are undermining the cheaper products so they can spend more on vaccines in the long run? That’s, er... compelling.

Re: Coronavirus
 

That’s not how I read it. I read it as undermining the cheaper vaccine because.

A. Other vaccine producers, many of which are domestic pharmaceutical companies within the EU and other nations o/s of it, are way behind the curve. So any delay that they can put on the use of the AZ vaccine will help them catch up and get a slice of the pie.

B. The AZ vaccine costs far less than other vaccines, for now at least, so again the need to discredit it.

C. Other countries may have backed and funded the development of other vaccines not yet materialised, the taxpayers of which may question the funding if their vaccine is not needed or widely used.

Have you been drinking again?

Re: Coronavirus
 

The point is your history of underestimating the impact of COVID - you said There isn't enough information to fully assess the impact of Long COVID, but you appear to be (just like you did with COVID) defaulting to "it's not that bad"...

Hope this helps

Re: Coronavirus
 

it is pretty obvious he will not concede he just wants the back and forth.

Unfortunately Covid has been under estimated by far to many and imo the deniers are the ones who have forced the death rate so high and kept the lockdown running so long. I have no time and less respect for them

Re: Coronavirus
 

It might not be how you read it, but when you follow through the “logic” that’s exactly what it says.

Capitalists (politicians) would prefer to spend more money on other vaccines than the cheaper AZ vaccine because of the “hundreds of millions” spent backing the development of other products.

For point A) you’re assuming there’s AstraZeneca product unused, discarded or not being produced as a result of these decisions. I highly doubt this is the case - manufacturing of all vaccines will be at maximum capacity for some time. We are already talking about an Autumn booster - that’ll presumably be higher priority than customers further down the AZ order books.

For point B) discredit it to who?

For point C) what you’ve not grasped, and nor did tin foil hat man, is that ending lockdowns and restrictions is worth tens of billions to global economies. The relative buttons spent in vaccine development in the US, EU and UK on products that might never see the light of day is neither here nor there by comparison. No taxpayer is likely to feel that strongly about unsuccessful developments or a short term price premium being paid. Relative to our test and trace system that didn’t work, or dodgy lateral flow tests that are no more reliable than a coin toss, it’s small beer.

Re: Coronavirus
 

It does help Hugh, for once you have lucidly put across your point, why you didn’t do that in the first place. Who knows.

You’re right, I think “Long Covid” is real, is an issue, but for a very unfortunate few. Hopefully in the coming months we’ll understand more about it.

---------- Post added at 20:09 ---------- Previous post was at 20:00 ----------

Firstly, I am not, and have never been, a denier.

Secondly, Hugh is old and wise but he likes to play games. Sometimes you need to be reminded that the best way to make a point, is to just make the point.

Thirdly, in regards to you it’s mainly just forth to you, the back isn’t really that interesting.

Re: Coronavirus
 

I was not talking to you

Re: Coronavirus
 

Re: Coronavirus
 

Pierre isn’t a denier in that he recognises Covid exists, he just doesn’t think it’s as serious as almost every country in the world is treating it.

He did give me my personal highlight of this thread when he was adamant that the schools wouldn’t close to most pupils in January as he assumed a degree of consistency and competency in Government.

Re: Coronavirus
 

so he is denying the reality of the situation then

---------- Post added at 19:19 ---------- Previous post was at 19:18 ----------

well I did say I had nothing to add but that was not good enough for him

Re: Coronavirus
 

I think it’s a matter of record that thousands of doses of the AZ vaccine, are going unused in Germany/ France and elsewhere.

As vaccine use will be an ongoing process, it makes sense for other developers to try and stall a successful rollout of a dominant product so they get their product out there and try and get a foothold going forward, and be able to say that they don’t have issues and chequered history the AZ product had.

the consumer. If your population refuse to use the AZ vaccine due to discrediting mis-information, well here is a “safe” vaccine backed by the French/German* governments ( *delete as a applicable), manufactured in France/Germany etc.....use this instead.

You have a point here. That said even with vaccines , presently, the appetite for coming out of lockdown across europe is still low.

---------- Post added at 20:32 ---------- Previous post was at 20:30 ----------

I was talking to you.

---------- Post added at 20:37 ---------- Previous post was at 20:32 ----------

True, on all points.

---------- Post added at 20:39 ---------- Previous post was at 20:37 ----------

Nope.


To have something to add, presupposes that you had something to start with.

Re: Coronavirus
 

There’s unused vaccine everywhere, simply because it doesn’t go from plant to arm in a seamless process. They’ve bought and paid for them. For the “strategy” to work it has to be manufactured by but not purchased in favour of other vaccines despite widespread availability.

Other developers perhaps, but the accusation was levelled at politicians.

So we are back at rational capitalists wanting to delay and spend more on vaccines in the long run. :confused:

Again this isn’t a rational position for capitalists to hold, regardless of which vaccines are or aren’t available at present.

Re: Coronavirus
 

Re: Coronavirus
 

Now there’s a proper Covid denier.

Re: Coronavirus