Cable Forum - Brexit (Old)

There is no majority in the house to bring down the Government. DUP will still support Tories and no current rebellious Tory MP would be stupid enough to vote against it's own government. This is why Jeremy Corbyn has not declared a full no confidence motion in the PM as of yet.

I am not saying it's going to happen only theoretically possible. It all depends what happens I think. Remember you wouldn't need much of a rebellion to bringing down the Government and some Tory MPs might conclude their careers are over anyway: Ken Clarke, Anna Soubry, Nick Boles, Dominic Grieve and Sarah Wollaston are all possibilities for stepping down or deselection anyway. All are against no deal too.

Mr K	11-01-2019 13:25

Re: Brexit

Quote:

Originally Posted by Damien (Post 35978815)

Parliament makes the law. If it wanted to, it could change it. It may have to bring down the government to do so obviously.

Exactly.

A few years ago the Public Sector Unions went to court as the Govt. had broken the law in downgrading their pensions. The Unions won the case, but then the Govt. just changed the law, went back to court and then obviously won !

Dave42

11-01-2019 13:28

Re: Brexit

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mick (Post 35978817)

And Downing Street today has ruled out extending or retracting Article 50.

---------- Post added at 13:18 ---------- Previous post was at 13:16 ----------

There is no majority in the house to bring down the Government. DUP will still support Tories and no current rebellious Tory MP would be stupid enough to vote against it's own government. This is why Jeremy Corbyn has not declared a full no confidence motion in the PM as of yet.

the thing is Mick parliament has took control of brexit we see what she comes up with when her deal loses vote on Tuesday

Chris

11-01-2019 13:41

Re: Brexit

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave42 (Post 35978816)

parliament can change law and retract article 50 as court said not saying they will just saying they can

Yes but pointing out what Parliament *theoretically* has the power to do is unhelpful. You’re suggesting that Parliament has the luxury of making its own choice on its own terms. That is not the case.

Parliament makes law, but does so according to a timetable mostly controlled by the Government, owing to its controlling majority of the House of Commons.

Parliament has the power to revoke Article 50, but because Parliament was ultimately required to enact Article 50 as primary legislation, it can only be repealed by Parliament in primary legislation. Gina Miller’s hard-won Supreme Court victory is a double-edged sword. Bills can be passed into law quite quickly, but only with cooperation of the Governing party that has control of the parliamentary timetable. Without that cooperation, there simply isn’t enough backbench or opposition time available to do it.

So it still comes back to the Government. Yes, Parliament has the power to actually do it, but due to the time constraints is unable to wield that power unless the Government lets it.

Mick	11-01-2019 13:46

Re: Brexit

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave42 (Post 35978821)

the thing is Mick parliament has took control of brexit we see what she comes up with when her deal loses vote on Tuesday

You misunderstand the powers totally.

Parliament is not the Executive, it cannot dictate Government policy. Sure it can vote down bills, amendments but the fundamental principle remains, noone can dictate to Theresa May to withdraw/delay/retract Article 50, no matter how many times they vote for a motion or amendment to a motion, they are not legally binding.

---------- Post added at 13:46 ---------- Previous post was at 13:43 ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris (Post 35978822)

So it still comes back to the Government. Yes, Parliament has the power to actually do it, but due to the time constraints is unable to wield that power unless the Government lets it.

Essentially what I was trying to say, buy you've said it in a nutshell.

heero_yuy

11-01-2019 14:26

Re: Brexit

Quote:

Quote from Business Insider:

Germany may be in recession, economists said, after they trawled through an unexpectedly horrible set of industrial and manufacturing data published on Wednesday's from the world's fourth-largest economy.

German industrial production fell by -1.9% in November.
Year over year, production hit a low of -4.6%, the biggest trough since the 2008 crisis.
Germany's exports fell -0.4% month over month in November, the government reported Wednesday.

Suddenly, Europe is faltering.

Germany is the largest European economy and its leaders have an outsized influence on the rest of the EU and the European Central Bank.

A recession in Germany could easily drag down France and Italy — the latter is already likely in a recession of its own.

Looks like we're getting out just in time as the house of cards collapses.

Carth

11-01-2019 15:01

Re: Brexit

To be fair, I think the whole world economy is in a state of 'unpredictability' . . and I'd like to think we (the UK) would rid ourselves of any shackles that *may* end up dragging us into a scenario where we rely on the rise or fall of others.

If the EU is going through . . or heading towards . . some kind of failure in its economic certainty, I'd hope we could escape some of the fallout by distancing ourselves from it.

probably not explained very well, but you should get the gist . . . :)

denphone

11-01-2019 15:06

Re: Brexit

Even if we were not in the EU my views are if America and China start sneezing the rest of the world tend to catch their cold.

Dave42

11-01-2019 15:09

Re: Brexit

Quote:

Originally Posted by denphone (Post 35978828)

Even if we were not in the EU my views are if America and China start sneezing the rest of the world tend to catch their cold.

exactly the financial crisis started in America then world caught the cold

mrmistoffelees

11-01-2019 17:05

Re: Brexit

https://apple.news/A5RyY8KceQPqDfft7XsW_Vw

Hugh	11-01-2019 18:03

Re: Brexit

Quote:

Originally Posted by mrmistoffelees (Post 35978833)

https://apple.news/A5RyY8KceQPqDfft7XsW_Vw

Last paragraph in the link

Quote:

Another vocal Brexiteer Tim Martin, the chairman of British pub chain JD Wetherspoon, who donated 212,000 pounds to the 2016 campaign, said he was refusing to contemplate a second vote.

He is touring his pubs giving talks to customers about the merits of leaving the EU without a deal and aims to have visited 100 of his sites by the end of January.

A second referendum would be “a nightmare,” Martin said.

“It’s like saying: ‘Do you think we should have another world war?’ or ‘What do you think about being struck by lightning?’” he said.

Sounds a bit "Project Fear"...

Mr K	11-01-2019 18:49

Re: Brexit

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hugh (Post 35978836)

Last paragraph in the link

Sounds a bit "Project Fear"...

Cripes, I like a cheap pint, but that doesn't sound like a fun night out at Wetherspoons !

1andrew1

11-01-2019 20:01

Re: Brexit

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hugh (Post 35978836)

Last paragraph in the link

Sounds a bit "Project Fear"...

Just an extension of Original Project Fear which included imminent projections of the likes of Turkey joining the EU, Britain the Euro and the United States of EU being formed.

Meanwhile, The Standard is talking of the strong possibility of an extension.
Delay to EU exit ahead as Leave donors say they have 'given up' and Jean-Claude Juncker warns there will be no more negotiation

---------- Post added at 20:01 ---------- Previous post was at 19:58 ----------

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr K (Post 35978838)

Cripes, I like a cheap pint, but that doesn't sound like a fun night out at Wetherspoons !

Whichever way they voted, I think most people visit the pub to get away from the Brexit omnishambles, not to be lectured one way or the other on it!

Mick	11-01-2019 20:14

Re: Brexit

Quote:

Originally Posted by mrmistoffelees (Post 35978833)

https://apple.news/A5RyY8KceQPqDfft7XsW_Vw

Please post a little explanation with your link or first paragraph to the link, I know Hugh has since done this. Don’t just post a link that has no indicator, to where it’s going. Thanks.

Just a polite reminder to everyone else, we are heading away from the digs at each side and the flippant remarks. Paul’s warning was a means to move on from the petty arguments.

1andrew1

11-01-2019 20:38

Re: Brexit

Has Juncker blinked?

Quote:

Jean-Claude Juncker, European Commission president, is making a last-ditch effort to save Theresa May’s stricken Brexit deal, including promises to try to limit the contentious Irish backstop to no more than a year.
Mr Juncker and Mrs May are co-ordinating an exchange of letters ahead of next Tuesday’s vote in the UK parliament on the Brexit deal.

https://www.ft.com/content/979bf172-...1-4ff78404524e

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