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-   -   TV Licence “Unenforceable”? (https://www.cableforum.uk/board/showthread.php?t=33713304)

Mythica 28-04-2025 09:19
Re: TV Licence “Unenforceable”?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by pip08456 (Post 36195575)
The BBC does a marvelous job of protecting children from those who wish to pray on them. Jimmy Saville et al.

---------- Post added at 21:54 ---------- Previous post was at 21:51 ----------



No,you don't need a license for any equipment or installing it.

I have a 32" TV as a monitor, I don't watch TV on it.
I didn't say you did. I said to watch, I didn't think I'd need to clarify what was being watched on such a forum considering its been done to death.

---------- Post added at 09:19 ---------- Previous post was at 09:15 ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jaymoss (Post 36195577)
Rubbish

You can install TV equipment to watch on demand through a service just not iplayer and you can not watch live tv


Now here is another crux . You can have sky and never watch or record live TV only ever on demand but if you are silly enough to let the Capita "Enforcement" officers in they will want to access your TV and the very fact your Sky puck or whatever can receive Live TV they assume you actually watch it and will prosecute you . Just having it does not mean you watch. Any PC Laptop Tablet or phone can access live tv but does it mean it use it too? It is a joke. They never getting in my house without a warrant a police officer and a signed document from a judge . An ink signature too
It's not rubbish in the slightest. It's I just didn't clarify on such a forum that I meant 'live' tv considering its been done to death already.

You'll find it's a breach of contract to have Sky TV with no TV licence.

The reply was to someone saying TV licence evasion isn't a criminal offence, which I disagree with.

pip08456 28-04-2025 09:35
Re: TV Licence “Unenforceable”?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mythica (Post 36195590)
I didn't say you did. I said to watch, I didn't think I'd need to clarify what was being watched on such a forum considering its been done to death.

---------- Post added at 09:19 ---------- Previous post was at 09:15 ----------



It's not rubbish in the slightest. It's I just didn't clarify on such a forum that I meant 'live' tv considering its been done to death already.

You'll find it's a breach of contract to have Sky TV with no TV licence.

The reply was to someone saying TV licence evasion isn't a criminal offence, which I disagree with.
There is no offence of installing TV equipment no matter what its used for. The offence is not having a license if you wiish to watch live TV.

Chris 28-04-2025 11:13
Re: TV Licence “Unenforceable”?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mythica (Post 36195590)
You'll find it's a breach of contract to have Sky TV with no TV licence.
Unlike the business of using TV receiving equipment without a licence, which as we know is a criminal matter, breach of contract is a civil issue between Sky and the customer, and one that is vanishingly unlikely to be discovered, much less acted on.

Mythica 28-04-2025 12:52
Re: TV Licence “Unenforceable”?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by pip08456 (Post 36195592)
There is no offence of installing TV equipment no matter what its used for. The offence is not having a license if you wiish to watch live TV.
Yes there is.

"363Licence required for use of TV receiver

(1)A television receiver must not be installed or used unless the installation and use of the receiver is authorised by a licence under this Part.

(2)A person who installs or uses a television receiver in contravention of subsection (1) is guilty of an offence.

(3)A person with a television receiver in his possession or under his control who—

(a)intends to install or use it in contravention of subsection (1), or

(b)knows, or has reasonable grounds for believing, that another person intends to install or use it in contravention of that subsection,

is guilty of an offence."

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2003/21/part/4

---------- Post added at 12:52 ---------- Previous post was at 12:50 ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris (Post 36195593)
Unlike the business of using TV receiving equipment without a licence, which as we know is a criminal matter, breach of contract is a civil issue between Sky and the customer, and one that is vanishingly unlikely to be discovered, much less acted on.
But some people don't know that as can be seen on this post and was the point of my post, yet everyone jumped on me.

That wasn't my point. I was simply stating you would be in breach of contract for having Sky TV as per the example.

Jaymoss 28-04-2025 14:43
Re: TV Licence “Unenforceable”?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mythica (Post 36195594)
Yes there is.

"363Licence required for use of TV receiver

(1)A television receiver must not be installed or used unless the installation and use of the receiver is authorised by a licence under this Part.

(2)A person who installs or uses a television receiver in contravention of subsection (1) is guilty of an offence.

(3)A person with a television receiver in his possession or under his control who—

(a)intends to install or use it in contravention of subsection (1), or

(b)knows, or has reasonable grounds for believing, that another person intends to install or use it in contravention of that subsection,

is guilty of an offence."

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2003/21/part/4

---------- Post added at 12:52 ---------- Previous post was at 12:50 ----------



But some people don't know that as can be seen on this post and was the point of my post, yet everyone jumped on me.

That wasn't my point. I was simply stating you would be in breach of contract for having Sky TV as per the example.
Because it is not a criminal offense to breach a contract with Sky so my post about sky and the TVL is correct.

Mythica 28-04-2025 15:00
Re: TV Licence “Unenforceable”?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jaymoss (Post 36195598)
Because it is not a criminal offense to breach a contract with Sky so my post about sky and the TVL is correct.
I never said your post was incorrect nor did I say it was a criminal offence to breach a contract. I was simply adding to your post about it breaching the contract.

Paul 28-04-2025 17:26
Re: TV Licence “Unenforceable”?
 
Good grief.

From the TVL site ;

Quote:
You are breaking the law if you:

watch TV channels, like BBC, ITV, Channel 4, U&Dave and international channels
watch TV on pay TV services, like Sky, Virgin Media and EE TV
watch live TV on streaming services, like YouTube and Amazon Prime Video
use BBC iPlayer*

This includes recording and downloading. On any device.

*A licence is not needed to watch S4C programmes on demand.
https://www.tvlicensing.co.uk/check-...penalties-top5

Sirius 28-04-2025 17:39
Re: TV Licence “Unenforceable”?
 
Ok some one explain why this is a thing. I have to have a licence because i like to watch live Rugby league on Sky sports. The BBC has had no involvement in the production or broadcasting of that content and yet the BBC are earning money from it via the TV tax, SO WHY

The BBC is just a leach and now some want the streaming services to pay a tax to the BBC so they can continue to leach off even more providers.


https://youtu.be/fQmSSbBIWes?t=540 is an interesting section to listen too from the Black Belt Lawyer.

downquark1 28-04-2025 19:13
Re: TV Licence “Unenforceable”?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sirius (Post 36195619)
Ok some one explain why this is a thing. I have to have a licence because i like to watch live Rugby league on Sky sports. The BBC has had no involvement in the production or broadcasting of that content and yet the BBC are earning money from it via the TV tax, SO WHY

The BBC is just a leach and now some want the streaming services to pay a tax to the BBC so they can continue to leach off even more providers.


https://youtu.be/fQmSSbBIWes?t=540 is an interesting section to listen too from the Black Belt Lawyer.
Because it's a government system to promote broadcasting they prefer. There is no logic to it but that.

Mr K 28-04-2025 19:17
Re: TV Licence “Unenforceable”?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sirius (Post 36195619)
Ok some one explain why this is a thing. I have to have a licence because i like to watch live Rugby league on Sky sports. The BBC has had no involvement in the production or broadcasting of that content and yet the BBC are earning money from it via the TV tax, SO WHY
It's a public service broadcaster. The same reason you pay taxes for all public services even though you might not personally use them all. Others subsidise you for the ones you use, and they don’t.

Itshim 28-04-2025 19:39
Re: TV Licence “Unenforceable”?
 
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TV LicenceLink for TV Licence / Do I need a TV Licence?Link for Do I need a TV Licence? / TV Licensing topicsLink for TV Licensing topics / What can I do without a TV Licence?
What can I do without a TV Licence?
Your TV Licence lets you enjoy a huge range of TV. It covers you for all TV channels, pay TV services like Sky, and live TV on streaming services like Amazon Prime Video, Youtube, Netflix and Freely. As well as everything on BBC iPlayer. On any device.

What can I watch without a TV Licence?
If you don't have a TV Licence, you can legally watch:

Catch up programmes on services other than BBC iPlayer, such as ITVX, All4 and My5
On demand films or TV shows that you watch, rent or buy online from providers like Netflix, Amazon Prime, Sky, EE TV, Sky, Apple TV+, Disney+ or Now
S4C programmes on demand
DVDs or Blu-rays
YouTube streamers' videos or clips live or recorded
If you do have a TV Licence you can watch all of the above, as well as:

Live TV on all free channels, including BBC One, ITV2 and Sky News
Live TV on any channels included in a package you pay for, like Virgin, EE TV or Sky
Everything on BBC iPlayer, including award-winning British TV dramas and thousands of other boxsets exclusive to BBC iPlayer
Live sporting events, like the Rugby World Cup, UEFA Euros and the Olympics
Other memorable live events, like the King's speech, Royal weddings, Glastonbury and the Eurovision Song Contest
Live streams of programmes, news or sport on services like ITVX, Sky, YouTube or Netflix
With a TV Licence, you can watch all of the above on any device.


Buy a TV Licence


What channels can I watch without a TV Licence?
You can watch on demand programmes on all catch up services excluding BBC iPlayer, like ITVX and All 4, without a TV Licence. You need a TV Licence to watch or stream live TV on any streaming platform, channel or device.


Can I watch BBC catch up without a TV Licence?
No, you cannot watch any catch up programmes on BBC iPlayer without a TV Licence. You can watch BBC programmes that are available to stream on other platforms, like Netflix.


Can I watch ITV without a TV Licence?
No, you cannot watch any live TV channels without a TV Licence, including ITV. You can watch on demand programmes on ITVX without a TV Licence.


Can I listen to BBC radio without a TV Licence?
Yes, you can listen to BBC radio without a TV Licence.


Can I listen to BBC Sounds without a TV Licence?
Yes, you can listen to and download audio programmes from BBC Sounds without a TV Licence.


Can I watch BBC on YouTube without a TV Licence?
Yes, you can watch clips and short videos on BBC's YouTube channel without a TV Licence. However, you need a TV Licence to stream any live TV, sports or news programmes on YouTube.


Can I watch and read BBC news online without a TV Licence?
You don't need a TV Licence to read anything or watch news clips online on the BBC website. However, if you want to stream live news via the BBC news website, you do need a TV Licence.

You can read BBC news online on the BBC news app or website without a TV Licence.


Do I need a TV Licence if I don't watch the BBC?
A TV Licence doesn't exclusively cover the BBC. You need a TV Licence to watch all live TV channels. Therefore, if you don't watch the BBC but you do watch any other live TV channel on any pay TV or streaming service, you must be covered by a TV Licence.



If you still have questions take a look at TV Licensing FAQs where you can find all the answers in one place.

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OLD BOY 28-04-2025 20:27
Re: TV Licence “Unenforceable”?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr K (Post 36195571)
There must have been 156 different versions of this thread whilst I've been on CF !

The BBC is continuing and needed. Even the last inept Govt agreed on that. Just a matter of how to fund it. The licence fee might be not be the fairest way any longer.

Advertising and subscription are non starters, it would lose all the things that make it essential and unique as a public service broadcaster ( and take it downmarket like the hundreds of other channels repeating crap and producing nothing new/unique). Making programmes that only attract advertisers is a downward spiral.

We'll pay one way or another just like we do for everything else. Some might pay more, others less , if that's done fairly then its an improvement on the licence fee. General taxation, and/or taxing the extra streaming services. You don't get something for nothing.

(And those that say they never use any BBC services:- tv channels, national radio, local radio, news, weather, apps, iplayer , website - I don't believe you !)
The BBC is not needed by everybody, that is the point. You may need it, and you can pay for it but leave those who don’t watch it out of the bubble.

I agree that advertising is not the appropriate option for BBC TV but a voluntary subscription is perfectly acceptable. It would ensure that the Beeb paid more attention to what people actually want from them, such as less wokery.

---------- Post added at 20:27 ---------- Previous post was at 20:23 ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr K (Post 36195631)
It's a public service broadcaster. The same reason you pay taxes for all public services even though you might not personally use them all. Others subsidise you for the ones you use, and they don’t.
It’s not an essential service like education or defence, Mr K, so that is not a strong argument at all.

ITV, Channel 4 and Channel 5 are also public service broadcasters, but we don’t even pay for them.

Mr K 28-04-2025 20:46
Re: TV Licence “Unenforceable”?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by OLD BOY (Post 36195634)
The BBC is not needed by everybody, that is the point. You may need it, and you can pay for it but leave those who don’t watch it out of the bubble.

I agree that advertising is not the appropriate option for BBC TV but a voluntary subscription is perfectly acceptable. It would ensure that the Beeb paid more attention to what people actually want from them, such as less wokery.

---------- Post added at 20:27 ---------- Previous post was at 20:23 ----------



It’s not an essential service like education or defence, Mr K, so that is not a strong argument at all.

ITV, Channel 4 and Channel 5 are also public service broadcasters, but we don’t even pay for them.
News, weather, local radio are essential in times of emergency. Commercial channels won't provide anything that doesnt make a profit. They also won't make any high quality niche programmes, or take risks with new content, for the same reason.

100s channels of the same repeated crap, or a few channels of quality programming no one else will do. Be careful what you wish for.

Sephiroth 28-04-2025 20:59
Re: TV Licence “Unenforceable”?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr K (Post 36195638)
News, weather, local radio are essential in times of emergency. Commercial channels won't provide anything that doesnt make a profit. They also won't make any high quality niche programmes, or take risks with new content, for the same reason.

100s channels of the same repeated crap, or a few channels of quality programming no one else will do. Be careful what you wish for.
In times of emergency, the government can commandeer broadcasting resources.

Btw, this "repeated crap" isn't all crap. The Sci-Fi channel, for example.
Lots of repeats are excellent and go round and round - such as Dad's Army, Sharpe, 'Allo, 'Allo. In any case, those "repeated crap" channels don't need a TV licence.

Something needs to be done about the BBC (and its arrogance) if the licence fee is to be retained.

Jaymoss 28-04-2025 21:17
Re: TV Licence “Unenforceable”?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul (Post 36195613)
But then also from the TVL Site

Quote:
On demand films or TV shows that you watch, rent or buy online from providers like Netflix, Amazon Prime, Sky, EE TV, Sky, Apple TV+, Disney+ or Now

With a TV Licence, you can watch all of the above on any device.
https://www.tvlicensing.co.uk/check-...t-a-tv-licence


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