Re: A Duty To Die?
 

I can give you the words from Roy Jenkins own mouth, life will mean life and David Blunkett said the same in 2003

It was intended as an example, as you well know there is no link other than 40 odd years ago the public were duped on a massive issue.

Not all laws

With respect quite possibly the only things the Baroness and your nan have in common is their ages, she isn't some old dear writting in complaining about stuff, this is a well respected Life Peer whose opinion has been saught in some of the most moral and philisophical areas of modern life, just because her views on this aren't vogue they could well be in the future and at some point they will almost certainly be wheeled out to help test the water.

Re: A Duty To Die?
 

But legislatively, there was nothing?
So if there was no legislation, then how can that non-existant legislation be watered down?

Why do you specifically think the law on assisted suicide will be watered down at some future time, to enable people to knock off their kinsmen for financial gain, then?

And as I've been saying, just because she says something does not automatically mean that at some point in the future it will become law.

Re: A Duty To Die?
 

Fact is it has been, people were never intended to be let out in 10 years after murdering some one and you know it, the mandatory life sentence was intended as Roy said to mean life.

Police chiefs and doctors have already expressed grave concerns, it isn't beyond the realms of fantasy to expect the worst, in fact where politicians are concerned the worst is generally my default expectation, I await to be pleasently surprised though, it has to happen if only by luck one day.

No and I never said it did, what I said was her words carry great weight and are bound to be used in the future to support any changes to the legislation.

Re: A Duty To Die?
 

Politicians words are not the law in this nation, acts of parliment are.
So unless there's an act which states that life must mean life for murder, the law has not been watered down.

Yes, and I've yet to hear one of them actually explain how their concerns would actually play out.
Mostly it's a case of "oh but someone could be pressurised into suicide or it could be a cover for murder" which frankly shows a lack of knowledge on the subject.

And I've said it doesn't matter because no one is listening. If she's still around when they may possibly perhaps more-chance-of-winning-the-lottery decide that making it easier to murder people or pressurise them into killing themselves, then they'll ask her opinion on the matter then, not say "it's ok luv, we know what you think, you said so way back in 2009"

Re: A Duty To Die?
 

As stated many times what we have now is not what was intended

These people deal with this sort of thing everyday so when it come to the crunch I'd rather side with them and their experience tbh and lets see where these laws have gone in other counrties, like Holland where you can be put down if feeling depressed or Switzerland if you are lonely, I wonder if those reasons were what they expected when they made assisted suicide legal

She will almost certainly be dead which is why I have said all along people will quote her as an authority on the subject

Re: A Duty To Die?
 

the stuff i have read and what i have seen seems to indicate that the person dieing and those helping are left alone to do what is to be done so there is room to say that the person is give cart blanche to decide as once aone there is no come back plus once given the person is free to put pressure on the other one to carry it through

if you have other info point me to it i read anything me ;)

as to the other articles they are more to show the mission creep that happens once you allow this.

as to the in pain its subjective plus ( i cant find the other article at the mo ) the same argument was being put for people in a vegetative state and even mentally impaired where they had had a chance to give consent before hand doctors were wanting to be allowed to assume they would give consent

once on that road it will be almost impossible to stop

and for the life of me ( pun intended even if its a bed one ;) ) i cant see the problem with the law as it is as long as you sort your finances properly

and there are many ways to end your life peacefully with out going to Switzerland or getting your relatives in trouble already just takes a bit of planning

Re: A Duty To Die?
 

Surely this isn't what living wills were intended for either

It is believed to be the first time a so-called "living will" has been used to legally aid someone's suicide.

Kerrie Wooltorton, who suffered depression over an inability to have children, was rushed to hospital by ambulance from her flat in Norwich after swallowing car anti-freeze fluid.

http://news.sky.com/skynews/Home/UK-...15396677?f=rss

Re: A Duty To Die?
 

I wouldn't have thought so and now its been publicised I can see a few more people trying it on.

Surely her previous history of mental health problems would have counted towards her being sectioned though?

Re: A Duty To Die?
 

no just another way things tend to get away from what the original intention was

plus i find what she did very selfish if we are going to say she was of sound enough mind to make that decision as if she was capable of that she should have been able to take her own life with out putting the hospital staff through that ordeal by doing it quietly at home

Re: A Duty To Die?
 

I feel so sorry for the mother, who wouldn't

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/8470572.stm

Re: A Duty To Die?
 

i feel sorry for the family

but think the sentence was fairly fair

if she wasnt thinking straight the family should have taken greater care of her to protect her from doing this

and if she was of sound mind then she should have thought much more carefully if she truly didnt believe the DR's and was convinced he stood no chance of recovering and wouldn't want to live as he was ( remember we only have thier view on that ) and chosen a quieter less public way on both occasions of doing the deed

not going into it here for various reasons but even a novice could just by going toa library even with out the net find quick and given that he would be given several drugs way of ending life that would be put down unless some one had been telling everyone they were gong to kill him to natural causes

what she did may have helped him though it seems to me it as more about easing her perception of the situation but at the same time put the rest of the family through even more of an ordeal than they needed to have

Re: A Duty To Die?
 

Agreed

Re: A Duty To Die?
 

I think this is fair and balanced, unusual for guidelines these days, still I am sure it won't be long before some one says that it doesn't go far enough.


New guidelines over whether people would face prosecution over assisting suicide place closer scrutiny on a suspect's motivation.
Director of Public Prosecutions, Keir Starmer, said whether a person acted "wholly compassionately" and not for financial reasons was important.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/8536231.stm

Re: A Duty To Die?
 

i expect so :)

Re: A Duty To Die?
 

Well... Those new guidelines seem as clear as mud....

Let's face facts, most people will stand to gain financially from the death of a loved one. Be they an aged uncle, parent or partner/spouse. No matter what way you slice this particular hot cake. If the assister gains from the death, then you can bet your ass you can expect them to come after you wearing rubber gloves and carrying torches.

On the flip side.... Whats to stop a religious person, who happens to work for the DPP from pushing for prosecutions based of their religious beliefs ?